I sometimes do reverse and hammer curls, but it has nothing to do with peaking my biceps. I will agree that building all the muscles of the upper arm do indeed add to the overall size and give a powerful appearance, but the actual peak is genetically determined plain and simple which explains why Arnold’s right one was significantly more peaked than his left. If any body knew how to build arms he did. Don’t you think he would have found a way to get that peak on both if he could?
[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
which explains why Arnold’s right one was significantly more peaked than his left. If any body knew how to build arms he did. Don’t you think he would have found a way to get that peak on both if he could?[/quote]
Excellent case in point.
S
Yes very good point as usual Tiribulus, genetics are a hard card to sell to people but it’s really the answer to many of the questions. There are 100s of examples of pros with lagging bodyparts or uneven bodyparpts and it’s foolish to think they didn’t know how to train, it’s just the blueprint they were given at childbirth just like we all were.
Total bullshits!
Genetic hahahah Genetic…
First of all: Reverse works brachialis and biceps as well (may be biceps is in weak position for some guys but still works)…
Secound:Brachialis push the biceps up and you can create ilusion of really good biceps peak
Next: For ME - reverse grip and hammer grip works better than standart biceps curls (Biceps curls works good for me but I feel good contaction but less pump) !I get super pump and contraction with reverse!
Reverse grip for me is good for overall Biceps and Brachialis size!
Guys remember we all are very different and what work for me,may be not works for 100000 other bodybuilders!
IFBB Pro/NGA Pro… and other PRO’s just know enough how to train with right form,with feeling,and Pro’s know how to modify exercise for their body!Why Charles Glass is so popular trainer?
Many guys depent on genetic for their worse body parts…It’s totaly bullshit!
EveryBody i will say it again EveryBody can build enough good body without any genetics,but must find exercises and things whome works the best for him!
Just look at Ron Harris - poor genetic,natural bodybuilder,but hell he looks great!
Sorry for bad English!
Don’t play with genetic - Only Loosers do it!
Concentration and Spider Curls for example works Outer Biceps + Brachialis!
I think standart biceps exercises gives more size,but real biceps peak comes from Brachialis and from Outer Head (Hammer Curl works them both)!
People seem to miss the point of what undeadlift is saying. Okay Ronnie has genetics, but the that particular exercise brings out his peak more than the other exercises that he performs.
[quote]Airtruth wrote:
People seem to miss the point of what undeadlift is saying. Okay Ronnie has genetics, but the that particular exercise brings out his peak more than the other exercises that he performs. [/quote]
I know what he was trying to say, but that’s putting causality on something that’s not relevant. The video I saw him using that exercise he was using I believe he said 30 lbs and looked like he could fall asleep during his sets. If someone sees those 2-3 sets of him pumping his arms up after he already blasted himself with crushing weights on rows and curls and equates that to why his arms are shaped the way they are is missing the boat here.
[quote]scottiscool wrote:
Airtruth wrote:
People seem to miss the point of what undeadlift is saying. Okay Ronnie has genetics, but the that particular exercise brings out his peak more than the other exercises that he performs.
I know what he was trying to say, but that’s putting causality on something that’s not relevant. The video I saw him using that exercise he was using I believe he said 30 lbs and looked like he could fall asleep during his sets. If someone sees those 2-3 sets of him pumping his arms up after he already blasted himself with crushing weights on rows and curls and equates that to why his arms are shaped the way they are is missing the boat here. [/quote]
So considering he has the size he wants, and he already did the rows and other curls why do you think he was doing that particular exercise? for the pump? Do you think he does no exercises for the peak?
I did not see this video but if peak does not pop out on the barbell curl but the peak does pop out on the cable do you not think the peak will have more of a benefit from that particular exercise?
To me his biceps look the same each and everytime he does a curl. It peaked while he was doing preachers and it peaked during those cable curls because that’s what his biceps will look like no matter what he does.
[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
I sometimes do reverse and hammer curls, but it has nothing to do with peaking my biceps. I will agree that building all the muscles of the upper arm do indeed add to the overall size and give a powerful appearance, but the actual peak is genetically determined plain and simple which explains why Arnold’s right one was significantly more peaked than his left. If any body knew how to build arms he did. Don’t you think he would have found a way to get that peak on both if he could?[/quote]
QFT.
“peaks” if you’re referring to the upper split looking area on the bicep (see any pic of Robby Robinson) can’t be developed with a specific exercise if you don’t have the genetic factors already. The bicep is a dual “headed” muscle but it shares a common insertion (though different origins)so you can’t target the “upper” head any more than the lower. Rotating, turning, twisting or isolating the elbow and wrist won’t hurt but it doesn’t change the anatomy.
I haven’t read CW’s thoughts on it so I’m going to check that out now. He knows his stuff.
[quote]darkwolfa wrote:
Total bullshits!
Genetic hahahah Genetic…
First of all: Reverse works brachialis and biceps as well (may be biceps is in weak position for some guys but still works)…
Secound:Brachialis push the biceps up and you can create ilusion of really good biceps peak
Next: For ME - reverse grip and hammer grip works better than standart biceps curls (Biceps curls works good for me but I feel good contaction but less pump) !I get super pump and contraction with reverse!
Reverse grip for me is good for overall Biceps and Brachialis size!
Guys remember we all are very different and what work for me,may be not works for 100000 other bodybuilders!
IFBB Pro/NGA Pro… and other PRO’s just know enough how to train with right form,with feeling,and Pro’s know how to modify exercise for their body!Why Charles Glass is so popular trainer?
[/quote]
Uh, if you’re serious, Charles Glass is so popular because he actually knows what he’s doing. Also because most pros have absolutely no clue what they’re doing, they just have little regard for their own health and safety.
Uh, hate to burst another bubble, but Ron Harris is not natural. He may be off stuff NOW, but when he was a regular on this site, he documented his cycles for all to see. Ask another dude who, like me, hgas been around here for a long while.
I think you have no clue what works and what doesn’t until you’ve really put your time in. By time I mean train for longer than 5 years. Make mistakes, have your ass handed to you a few times by more knowledgeable people, and stumble upon what works for you and what doesn’t. Of course, understand that all the BS you read in FLEX is usually wrong, and by speaking to a fairly up to date Physical Therapist, or Strength Coach, you will realize that.
S
[quote]Sentoguy wrote:
FightingScott wrote:
*If you’re not doing some type of shrug and you’re trying to peak your bicep, may god have mercy on your soul.
Do deadlifts count? I’d say that deads place easily as much (more in fact) stress on the biceps as elbow stabilizers, as well as building traps as effectively (once again more actually) than shrugs. ;)[/quote]
If you’ve got the time to do isolation exercise like curls, then you’ve got the time to do shrugs.
Deadlifts are great for building traps. But you can do heavy shrugs more often than you can do heavy deadlifts.
If all you have time for is compound moves, that’s totally different.
But to answer your question
- Deadlifts are probably better for just making your traps stronger
- Shrugs are probably better for making your traps touch your ears
- If you’re curling, you better be shrugging even if you have deadlifts somewhere in your program.
[quote]FightingScott wrote:
But to answer your question
- Shrugs are probably better for making your traps touch your ears
[/quote]
I disagree with you here because everyone in the gym does shrugs. Everyone haha. But how many people really have huge traps in the gym, 10% maybe? If they really were the best for size then we’d see an epidemic of huge traps at least in my university gym, but we don’t.
[quote]scottiscool wrote:
FightingScott wrote:
But to answer your question
- Shrugs are probably better for making your traps touch your ears
I disagree with you here because everyone in the gym does shrugs. Everyone haha. But how many people really have huge traps in the gym, 10% maybe? If they really were the best for size then we’d see an epidemic of huge traps at least in my university gym, but we don’t. [/quote]
What is going to make your traps stick up to your ears: 315 lb shrugs (given the short range of motion most people use) or 500 lb rack pulls? That 500 lb rack pull is also going to thicken up the rest of your upper and lower back.
I have been doing rack pulls for the past couple of months and added about 100 lbs to my 5 rep max and there is a noticeable difference in my traps.
[quote]Stronghold wrote:
scottiscool wrote:
FightingScott wrote:
But to answer your question
- Shrugs are probably better for making your traps touch your ears
I disagree with you here because everyone in the gym does shrugs. Everyone haha. But how many people really have huge traps in the gym, 10% maybe? If they really were the best for size then we’d see an epidemic of huge traps at least in my university gym, but we don’t.
What is going to make your traps stick up to your ears: 315 lb shrugs (given the short range of motion most people use) or 500 lb rack pulls? That 500 lb rack pull is also going to thicken up the rest of your upper and lower back.
I have been doing rack pulls for the past couple of months and added about 100 lbs to my 5 rep max and there is a noticeable difference in my traps.[/quote]
Agreed.
Personally I have the time to do shrugs, I just feel that deads from the ground and rack deads build my traps more effectively.
Look at Jonnie Jackson, he may have the best traps in bodybuilding (at least the best in the LHW class), and he attributes those mainly to his powerlifting training.
I sometimes train a guy who’s got some of the best traps I’ve ever seen. And he has told me on several occasions that he “never does anything for his traps”. Oh, but I have seen him deadlift some decent weight. 
Honestly if you (FightingScott) find that you need to perform shrugs to build your traps then have at it. Just don’t mistake that to mean that everyone must do them to build their traps.
Good training,
Sentoguy
Haven’t done shrugs in ages, but ALWAYS do deads, whether BB, ROmanian, DBs, whatever. It’s amazing how many newbies would make better gains if they would seriously stick to the 3 basics, and not just the bench press.
S
i literally have to stop myself from deadlifting too much when i train, i cant get enough of it, and i don’t directly train my traps.
my upper back is my strongest body part somehow though.
traps are definitely another genetic thing, my dad has big traps too and wide shoulders, im likig the genetics i have so far, except maybe my chest takes more work and mwhen i flex my arm i can put 3 fingers between my bicep and my forarm
First not new to the lifting. I am posting a question about peak in the bi, not how to get big traps, i have those. Thanks.
Respectfully,
Ant
Yeah sorry we did get a bit sidetracked, but your answers are in the thread already, genetics determine shape you get to determine size.
[quote]scottiscool wrote:
your answers are in the thread already, genetics determine shape you get to determine size. [/quote]
This is a question has gets answered every day on some web site, or in some muscle rag. People just don’t like the answer. -lol
S
People that say “muscle shape is solely determined by genetics” remind me of the shockingly undereducated Pep Boys employee who, last month, told me that “the properties of liquids are all the same. you can use water - or any other liquid - in place of brake fluid.”
Using the model of elementary physiology and biomechanics that you understand your view is the only view that makes sense. But just look at the guys at the gym that focus on their arms and chest four or five days a week. By using a variety of exercises with adequate volume they seem to do a better job than you do - (with pull-ups, chin-ups, deadlift, and medium-grip bench day in and day out) - in reaching their goals… So you chalk it up to drugs and genetics.
Exercise variety and very high volume will always be optimal for hypertrophy gains in smaller muscle groups - like those of the upper body. These smaller muscles recover more quickly than the larger muscle groups of the lower body.