Religulous: The Movie

Off Topic Politics & World Issues
81

[quote]MeinHerzBrennt wrote:

Christians have been doing it far longer. It’s about time someone spoke up in opposition. I’m glad they are being more vocal.
[/quote]

It doesn’t really matter who has been doing it longer. I don’t go around trying to force my beliefs on other people. I also don’t speak as if everyone who believes differently than I do as far as religion is a moron who is devoid of “free thought”, but we seem to get that attitude quite a bit whenever these discussions come up from those who claim to despise religion. Much of it is passive aggressive…like a previous poster’s use of “your precious God”…as if “precious” were standing in for “petty”.

I too am unhappy with organized religion. I believe in a higher power but dressing up in my best clothes and driving to church just to show off the brand new wax job on my Suburban isn’t what I call getting closer to spiritual concepts.

Religion isn’t perfect. Nothing in this world is. Pointing out the people who don’t even know why they believe what they do doesn’t make it any less potent.

Also, another thing to think about…The Bible is not written like a text book to be picked apart and criticized. Over the last two thousand years, how many people could have understood the message if it were written like a present day college level physics book? It is written allegorically for a reason. You never needed a PhD to understand it.

82

If something seems down right silly to you, why not comment on it. I find most religions very facinating but they are down right silly to anyone that is ruled by logic and reason.

I don’t have a problem with people’s faith, much like I don’t have a problem with women painting their faces. Both just don’t make any sense to me. My wife doesn’t take either opinion personally.

What baffles me is people of a particular faith that think other religions are silly. To me, mormonism, Scientology, Greek mythology, or praying to the sun god are equal on the logic scale.

83

[quote]dhickey wrote:
If something seems down right silly to you, why not comment on it. I find most religions very facinating but they are down right silly to anyone that is ruled by logic and reason.

I don’t have a problem with people’s faith, much like I don’t have a problem with women painting their faces. Both just don’t make any sense to me. My wife doesn’t take either opinion personally.

What baffles me is people of a particular faith that think other religions are silly. To me, mormonism, Scientology, Greek mythology, or praying to the sun god are equal on the logic scale.[/quote]

My thoughts exactly.

As for commenting on other people’s religion, I do it once they feel the need to push their beliefs onto the rest of the population. It’s common sense to foresee criticism when one starts becoming extremely vocal about their beliefs, religious or not.

84

[quote]MeinHerzBrennt wrote:
GDollars37 wrote:
Professor X wrote:
ephrem wrote:
Professor X wrote:
Lonnie123 wrote:
Professor X wrote:
“There are no atheists in foxholes”

http://www.ffrf.org/foxholes/

There are PLENTY of military personnel and officers who lack belief in God.

That quote isn’t referencing whether atheists exist or not in the military. Also, that website you linked is AMAZING. How does being an atheist make one a “free thinker”? Someone firm in their belief that there is no higher intelligence in the entire universe beyond human potential isn’t doing any more “free” thinking outside of that possibility.

If anything, agnostics would earn that title.

…it’s a general misconception that an atheist has an active belief that [a] god does not exist. Atheists lack the belief that god exists, nothing more. Believing in a negative is nonsense…

“Lacking the belief” that the earth is flat is the same as believing it isn’t flat.

We can play with semantics some more if you would like.

One thing that website linked made very clear is that some atheists believe their “lack of belief” makes them “free thinkers”.

One can assume this means they hold the thought that people who do believe in a higher intelligence are not free thinkers or, at some extreme end, are less intelligent/thoughtful than atheists.

You make it seem like there are no atheists who have an extreme DISbelief in God that rivals religion.

Yup, and the worst thing about the “new atheists” is that they proselytize more than almost any Christians I can think of.

Christians have been doing it far longer. It’s about time someone spoke up in opposition. I’m glad they are being more vocal.
[/quote]

…yes, we should form the Atheïst Alliance and get back at them for 2000 years of oppression and persecution!

85

[quote]dhickey wrote:
If something seems down right silly to you, why not comment on it. I find most religions very facinating but they are down right silly to anyone that is ruled by logic and reason.

I don’t have a problem with people’s faith, much like I don’t have a problem with women painting their faces. Both just don’t make any sense to me. My wife doesn’t take either opinion personally.

What baffles me is people of a particular faith that think other religions are silly. To me, mormonism, Scientology, Greek mythology, or praying to the sun god are equal on the logic scale.[/quote]

What bothers me is non-geniuses acting like they are ruled by logic and that others are “silly” for believing in God.

86

[quote]Professor X wrote:
dhickey wrote:
If something seems down right silly to you, why not comment on it. I find most religions very facinating but they are down right silly to anyone that is ruled by logic and reason.

I don’t have a problem with people’s faith, much like I don’t have a problem with women painting their faces. Both just don’t make any sense to me. My wife doesn’t take either opinion personally.

What baffles me is people of a particular faith that think other religions are silly. To me, mormonism, Scientology, Greek mythology, or praying to the sun god are equal on the logic scale.

What bothers me is non-geniuses acting like they are ruled by logic and that others are “silly” for believing in God.[/quote]

…you have the right to believe what you want. You even have the right to believe there’s a pink unicorn in my backyard that created the universe and everything in it. Just like i have every right to think and say you’re a fool for believing that, or in god…

87

[quote]ephrem wrote:
Professor X wrote:
dhickey wrote:
If something seems down right silly to you, why not comment on it. I find most religions very facinating but they are down right silly to anyone that is ruled by logic and reason.

I don’t have a problem with people’s faith, much like I don’t have a problem with women painting their faces. Both just don’t make any sense to me. My wife doesn’t take either opinion personally.

What baffles me is people of a particular faith that think other religions are silly. To me, mormonism, Scientology, Greek mythology, or praying to the sun god are equal on the logic scale.

What bothers me is non-geniuses acting like they are ruled by logic and that others are “silly” for believing in God.

…you have the right to believe what you want. You even have the right to believe there’s a pink unicorn in my backyard that created the universe and everything in it. Just like i have every right to think and say you’re a fool for believing that, or in god…

[/quote]

Oh, that’s true, but when the person calling me silly hasn’t achieved anywhere near what I have educationally, I hope they know they are getting laughed at right back.

Many of you seem to get off on calling people morons and silly when the truth is, many you are speaking to are far from it.

If someone speaks of logic, as if everyone in a certain religion lacks it, I expect to see some credentials that back up the mouth.

Amazingly, they are very rarely carrying any.

88

[quote]Professor X wrote:
dhickey wrote:
If something seems down right silly to you, why not comment on it. I find most religions very facinating but they are down right silly to anyone that is ruled by logic and reason.

I don’t have a problem with people’s faith, much like I don’t have a problem with women painting their faces. Both just don’t make any sense to me. My wife doesn’t take either opinion personally.

What baffles me is people of a particular faith that think other religions are silly. To me, mormonism, Scientology, Greek mythology, or praying to the sun god are equal on the logic scale.

What bothers me is non-geniuses acting like they are ruled by logic and that others are “silly” for believing in God.
[/quote]
I think people are silly for doing a lot of things. I am sure others find things I do silly. I can say that it really bothers me one way or the other.

I have no illusions about being a genius and I am not commenting on whether or not is better to be ruled by faith, logic, or some magical mixture of both. My brain is wired to accept things I can comprehend and question things I cannot.

To me, beleiving in God is the same as someone claiming there are life forces all around us that we cannot detect. Whole galaxies of other life forms more advanced than our own. They may both be true, but I see little evidense of how this effects me or why I should care.

No need to take it personal.

89

[quote]Professor X wrote:…you have the right to believe what you want. You even have the right to believe there’s a pink unicorn in my backyard that created the universe and everything in it. Just like i have every right to think and say you’re a fool for believing that, or in god…

Oh, that’s true, but when the person calling me silly hasn’t achieved anywhere near what I have educationally, I hope they know they are getting laughed at right back.

Many of you seem to get off on calling people morons and silly when the truth is, many you are speaking to are far from it.

If someone speaks of logic, as if everyone in a certain religion lacks it, I expect to see some credentials that back up the mouth.

Amazingly, they are very rarely carrying any.[/quote]

…if an education does not stop you from believing in [a] god, then why should a [higher] education be a prerequisite for being logical or atheïst?

90

[quote]dhickey wrote:
Professor X wrote:
dhickey wrote:
If something seems down right silly to you, why not comment on it. I find most religions very facinating but they are down right silly to anyone that is ruled by logic and reason.

I don’t have a problem with people’s faith, much like I don’t have a problem with women painting their faces. Both just don’t make any sense to me. My wife doesn’t take either opinion personally.

What baffles me is people of a particular faith that think other religions are silly. To me, mormonism, Scientology, Greek mythology, or praying to the sun god are equal on the logic scale.

What bothers me is non-geniuses acting like they are ruled by logic and that others are “silly” for believing in God.

I think people are silly for doing a lot of things. I am sure others find things I do silly. I can say that it really bothers me one way or the other.

I have no illusions about being a genius and I am not commenting on whether or not is better to be ruled by faith, logic, or some magical mixture of both. My brain is wired to accept things I can comprehend and question things I cannot.

To me, beleiving in God is the same as someone claiming there are life forces all around us that we cannot detect. Whole galaxies of other life forms more advanced than our own. They may both be true, but I see little evidense of how this effects me or why I should care.

No need to take it personal.
[/quote]

This is a discussion. You will know if it gets personal. At this point, it hasn’t gotten that way.

However, maybe you can’t see yourselves. Throwing words like “silly” and “illogical” might have a place…if you were speaking to a room filled with high school drop outs.

I am not one of those and I believe what I do for very specific reasons. When someone much less accomplished claims they are somehow better than me in terms of thought processes, what response do you really expect?

I am willing to bet my average day is filled with more “logic” than many here. So why the insults coming from your direction?

91

[quote]ephrem wrote:

…if an education does not stop you from believing in [a] god, then why should a [higher] education be a prerequisite for being logical or atheïst?

[/quote]

If someone with that education believes in God, what makes you think the decision was made haphazardly and without reason?

Religion isn’t about who can be the most logical…and again, if none of you are making any marks in the field of science or advancing human kind in any way…why do you think you have “logic” on lock down?

92

[quote]Professor X wrote:

Oh, that’s true, but when the person calling me silly hasn’t achieved anywhere near what I have educationally, I hope they know they are getting laughed at right back.
[/quote]
I didn’t call you silly but you certainly are being silly here.

How do you know what my education is? What specific education do you think is relavent to holding an opinion on religion?

I think it is moronic to read too much into what was posted. That education doesn’t seem to helping you in this respect.

“lacks logic” is a pretty loose term. Some people are quite logical when it comes to certain things while disregarding it concerning something else. I would dare say we are all guilty of this to some degree. Again, you seem to be reading into post here a bit too much. Definately a lack of logic with respect to this thread.

Any what?

93

[quote]dhickey wrote:
Professor X wrote:

Oh, that’s true, but when the person calling me silly hasn’t achieved anywhere near what I have educationally, I hope they know they are getting laughed at right back.

I didn’t call you silly but you certainly are being silly here.

How do you know what my education is? What specific education do you think is relavent to holding an opinion on religion?

Many of you seem to get off on calling people morons and silly when the truth is, many you are speaking to are far from it.

I think it is moronic to read too much into what was posted. That education doesn’t seem to helping you in this respect.

If someone speaks of logic, as if everyone in a certain religion lacks it, I expect to see some credentials that back up the mouth.

“lacks logic” is a pretty loose term. Some people are quite logical when it comes to certain things while disregarding it concerning something else. I would dare say we are all guilty of this to some degree. Again, you seem to be reading into post here a bit too much. Definately a lack of logic with respect to this thread.

Amazingly, they are very rarely carrying any.

Any what?
[/quote]

You seem to be missing the point. That doesn’t surprise me, but coming from people who are experts in “logic”, I was hoping for more.

Religion is based on faith. It is not based on logic. Some concepts in science that have not been proven are also based, in a way, on faith. Faith itself does not remove someone from the field of logic. Likewise, one could claim an entirely scientific approach to the concept of higher intelligence which would remove your argument completely as long as they didn’t claim a specific religion.

This isn’t about what specific education allows someone to speak on religion, however, if you or anyone else is going to insult the intelligence of those who claim to believe in God by calling it petty, silly, magical or any other term that shows outright disrespect/intolerance for the beliefs of others, how can you possibly expect to not be called on it at all by those who are not “dumber than you”?

I haven’t seen anyone in this thread call atheists stupid, silly or moronic…yet insults abound from you.

94

[quote]Professor X wrote:
dhickey wrote:
Professor X wrote:
dhickey wrote:
If something seems down right silly to you, why not comment on it. I find most religions very facinating but they are down right silly to anyone that is ruled by logic and reason.

I don’t have a problem with people’s faith, much like I don’t have a problem with women painting their faces. Both just don’t make any sense to me. My wife doesn’t take either opinion personally.

What baffles me is people of a particular faith that think other religions are silly. To me, mormonism, Scientology, Greek mythology, or praying to the sun god are equal on the logic scale.

What bothers me is non-geniuses acting like they are ruled by logic and that others are “silly” for believing in God.

I think people are silly for doing a lot of things. I am sure others find things I do silly. I can say that it really bothers me one way or the other.

I have no illusions about being a genius and I am not commenting on whether or not is better to be ruled by faith, logic, or some magical mixture of both. My brain is wired to accept things I can comprehend and question things I cannot.

To me, beleiving in God is the same as someone claiming there are life forces all around us that we cannot detect. Whole galaxies of other life forms more advanced than our own. They may both be true, but I see little evidense of how this effects me or why I should care.

No need to take it personal.

This is a discussion. You will know if it gets personal. At this point, it hasn’t gotten that way.

However, maybe you can’t see yourselves. Throwing words like “silly” and “illogical” might have a place…if you were speaking to a room filled with high school drop outs.
[/quote]
What does any of this have to do with formal education? I would contend that formal education retards logic and reasoning skills.

If you are as sharp as you claim to be, I expect you would be able to read and comprehend what I wrote before commenting on it. Expecting too much?

[quote]
I am willing to bet my average day is filled with more “logic” than many here. So why the insults coming from your direction?[/quote]
Quite possible. I really have no idea. I don’t concern myself with insulting someone on an anonymous message board. Someone could be insulted by anything I say. I comment on things I care to comment on. Maybe even for no logical reason.

If you are insulted by something a stranger says to you on an anonymous message board, that’s a personal issue for you and of little concern to me. I can promise you I will not be insulted by anything you care to comment on. That would be illogical.

I find that faith is a replacement for logic and that the two do not coexist. Does this mean that one must be devoid of all logic concerning all things in order to have faith? Of course not. I am sure if I thought about it long enough I could come up with many things I do that are illogical and quite silly. I certainly wouldn’t get my panties in a bunch if someone commented on it.

95

Just watched the movie today.

Didn’t think it was that good. He should have either gone 100% comedy or 100% serious. His mixture of seriousness and comedy just didn’t go down too well in my opinion.

If he wanted to stay funny he would have just kept interviewing the nut-jobs and then it would have been great. But he mixed in some just awkward interviews that were difficult and not enjoyable to watch.

I will say that I find it pointless to argue religion with a religious person. The movie showed that much as well. Debate and religion just don’t go well together, unfortunately.

I liked the part in the movie that mentioned Thomas Jefferson taking all the divinity and miracles out of the gospels and writing a book. I’m convinced Thomas Jefferson was one of the smartest people of the 18th century.

96

[quote]dhickey wrote:

What does any of this have to do with formal education? I would contend that formal education retards logic and reasoning skills.

[/quote]

Wait, was this an exhibition of your superior logical skills?

97

[quote]wushu_1984 wrote:
Just watched the movie today.

Didn’t think it was that good. He should have either gone 100% comedy or 100% serious. His mixture of seriousness and comedy just didn’t go down too well in my opinion.

If he wanted to stay funny he would have just kept interviewing the nut-jobs and then it would have been great. But he mixed in some just awkward interviews that were difficult and not enjoyable to watch.

I will say that I find it pointless to argue religion with a religious person. The movie showed that much as well. Debate and religion just don’t go well together, unfortunately.

I liked the part in the movie that mentioned Thomas Jefferson taking all the divinity and miracles out of the gospels and writing a book. I’m convinced Thomas Jefferson was one of the smartest people of the 18th century.[/quote]

TJ was one of the smartest people period…His contention was that it wasn’t necessary for faith. Which technically is true. Logic and reason are sufficient. He failed to realize that most people aren’t brainiacs like himself and that depth of reason just aren’t going to be realized by the average working stiff. But look at the company he kept…

98

too bad none of you will be welcome at Valhalla.

what ever more meat and beer for me.

99

[quote]PB-Crawl wrote:
too bad none of you will be welcome at Valhalla.[/quote]

Neither will you, unless you die heroically in battle.

Slim chance of that, I’ll wager.

100

[quote]Professor X wrote:
ephrem wrote:

…if an education does not stop you from believing in [a] god, then why should a [higher] education be a prerequisite for being logical or atheïst?

If someone with that education believes in God, what makes you think the decision was made haphazardly and without reason?[/quote]

…i don’t think that, but it also does not say anything about anything. Are you trying to say that if highly educated people believe in god then there must be something to it? Or are you suggesting that educated people are somehow better at understanding themselves and their motivations for doing things?

…what are you trying to say?

…it does appear as if you think that educated people, or people who have somehow made a difference in this world, are better equiped at understanding life and reality? Perhaps that’s true for [some] scientists, but you’ll find few religious believers amongst those people. No, education does not matter that much in relation to having, or not having, religious beliefs…

…i will say that, for many believer i’ve encounter in the last 10 years on the web, intellectual laziness and the fear of ones inner demons makes them turn to an imaginary friend like god/allah/elohim, or whatever you want to call whatever it is you care to believe in. Pressure from family, society and culture playes a big role obviously. As Maher puts it: i get it, i really do but… come on already!