[quote]SkyzykS wrote:
[quote]Chushin wrote:
You could always teach that new baby how to squat. Time will pass quickly (says the old man)!
[/quote]
Oh, he squats! And bridges, rows and does pull ups too!
It’s probably something I’ve just never noticed with infants, but his traps, lats, and delts are actually pretty well developed.
Thats probably fodder for a whole other thread though.
[/quote]
You should try to get him a license as an IFBaby Pro.
yes definately. we need more guys like Stu, Bonez, maruader_meat, Bill Roberts.
intelligent pursuit of muscle means just that, and it does not include bitching, attacking or posting memes.
[quote]Smashingweights wrote:
I just find it ironic that people jump in here to scale Stu sensitive and tell people they should just ignore X if they don’t like what he says since they are doing the exact same thing they are doing the same thing that they hate lol
Prof X CAN add value but IMO hasn’t done so in the training and nutrition forums in a long time.
Virtually every post is some variation “genetics” and/or “find what works for you.”
While these are both valid points what good does that do anyone?
Everyone knows genetics play a huge role and that doing something that isn’t working well, isn’t going to work lol
A bit of specific advice or tips is what adds value here.
Along with bringing the lulz to keep the mood light.
Disagreeing with every post that doesn’t fit with your mantra or philosophy doesn’t add value.
Anyway, I’m here to joke around a bit, kill some time while work is slow, get the occasional tip for lifting/diet and learn something occasionally when an actual intelligent discussion happens.[/quote]
x2 !!
I thought I was the only person with this opinion. guys like Bonez, MODOK, Cephalic carnage, Bonez, and ZRAw have personally made specific diets, routines, workout plans and tips for INDIVIDUAL people on this site. X just repeats himself “don’t bother if you don’t have good genetics” “im not fat” “eat big” “hammer strength trumps barbell bench” blanket statements dont help people. so why the popularity? im not talking shit we us need more individual intelligent posters around here (and not chase them off)
[quote]CircaThursday wrote:
x2 !!
I thought I was the only person with this opinion. guys like Bonez, MODOK, Cephalic carnage, Bonez, and ZRAw have personally made specific diets, routines, workout plans and tips for INDIVIDUAL people on this site. X just repeats himself “don’t bother if you don’t have good genetics” “im not fat” “eat big” “hammer strength trumps barbell bench” blanket statements dont help people. so why the popularity? im not talking shit we us need more individual intelligent posters around here (and not chase them off)[/quote]
Good point, we need to cultivate an environment where we keep the intelligent and helpful forum members and cease the crap that runs these people away. We all have our favorite posters that have either abandoned ship, or simply stopped having any interest in sharing and bestowing knowledge at all for fear of what every thread inevitably gets turned into… and who can blame them?
Now whether it has been specific actions, or more likely the unchecked behavior of certain people, it’s needed to be addressed for some time. From what I took away from one of my conversations with Jared the other day, the folks running this site are well aware of how things have gotten, and to be honest, apparently a lot of the mods and editors feel very similarly to a lot of the posters (they do read through every thread after all).
That being the case, with everyone being on the same page in terms of curtailing BS behavior and fostering the intelligent and civil discussion of topics we all share a deep appreciation for, howzabout we move ahead and stop lobbing blame on one specific poster. Not that I don’t agree for the most part, but rehashing and rehashing the same opinions doesn’t change actions and behaviors that tarnished this site’s reputation in a lot of people’s eyes.
S
[quote]The Mighty Stu wrote:
[quote]CircaThursday wrote:
x2 !!
I thought I was the only person with this opinion. guys like Bonez, MODOK, Cephalic carnage, Bonez, and ZRAw have personally made specific diets, routines, workout plans and tips for INDIVIDUAL people on this site. X just repeats himself “don’t bother if you don’t have good genetics” “im not fat” “eat big” “hammer strength trumps barbell bench” blanket statements dont help people. so why the popularity? im not talking shit we us need more individual intelligent posters around here (and not chase them off)[/quote]
Good point, we need to cultivate an environment where we keep the intelligent and helpful forum members and cease the crap that runs these people away. We all have our favorite posters that have either abandoned ship, or simply stopped having any interest in sharing and bestowing knowledge at all for fear of what every thread inevitably gets turned into… and who can blame them?
Now whether it has been specific actions, or more likely the unchecked behavior of certain people, it’s needed to be addressed for some time. From what I took away from one of my conversations with Jared the other day, the folks running this site are well aware of how things have gotten, and to be honest, apparently a lot of the mods and editors feel very similarly to a lot of the posters (they do read through every thread after all).
That being the case, with everyone being on the same page in terms of curtailing BS behavior and fostering the intelligent and civil discussion of topics we all share a deep appreciation for, howzabout we move ahead and stop lobbing blame on one specific poster. Not that I don’t agree for the most part, but rehashing and rehashing the same opinions doesn’t change actions and behaviors that tarnished this site’s reputation in a lot of people’s eyes.
S[/quote]
Past is the past. Learn from it and move on. The dead horse has been beaten enough
1st- I hope you stick around Stu, you’ve been motivational over the years.
2nd-
[quote]Smashingweights wrote:
Anyway, I’m here to joke around a bit, kill some time while work is slow, get the occasional tip for lifting/diet and learn something occasionally when an actual intelligent discussion happens.[/quote]
This… and…
[quote]AnytimeJake wrote:
Jim Wendler says, Arguing over anything on the internet is gay ! The point is I still recomend this site to kids just starting out in the game. I tell them to stop going to other sites, and stop buying, mags, and get their info from T Nation, Starting strength, strong lifts, Jim Wendler, or purchasing books. I feel there is still alot of fundemental lifting info here. At some point you realize from a lifting stand point there’s been nothing new in 30yrs, so it’s the same old thing, rewriten over and over.
Atleast T Nation dosen’t buy into or recomend glitsy fads, routines and products, that are confusing and time wasting for newbs, like BBing.com and others do. I have thought of leaving this site myself, after a troll attack or two, but the first year of lifting is so important for beginers, to settle in with a good program, and get the right info.
To realize this is a life long journey, and not 8 weeks to the new you, and I like to help with that. It’s sad to see so maney great writters and posters leave here recently, and I’d hate to see the mighty Stu become part of the list. 2cents[/quote]
This.
I’ve probably recommended Vrooms “are you a beginner” to 50+ people …and I am NOT a trainer or anything. This site has great information.
Thanks for those who are trying to make it better(/bring it back to where it was).
hmmm… I just went over to the beginners forum and Vroom’s thread isn’t a sticky anymore… I respectfully suggest it be brought back (or simply made into an article I guess).
I think the site took a turn for the worse in the last year or two in an attempt to “clean up” it’s image. Being “unapologetically hardcore ™” and banning anyone who had anything resembling a controversial opinion isn’t exactly congruent. I’ve spent THOUSANDS of dollars on Biotest supps over the years. I believe they are the among the best in the industry.
I used to recommend this site to anyone with an interest in lifting weights or looking good nekkid. But then they turn around and moderate every post I make and disable my PM’s? Those kinds of actions add up and hurt a website’s “street cred”. It’s simple human nature that if you censure people then it dumbs down the dialog.
I would LOVE to have the T-Nation from 2007-2009 back. Back then Prof X still gave good advice and MODOK, Bonez, CC, Meat, etc… were around mentoring folks. TC would actually write an article every so often. Actual amateurs who gave a shit, learned a lot and wanted to give back. Trolling was original and often an entertaining exception, not a boring “norm”.
It was almost like a locker room/bar/boys club all rolled up into one with the added bonus of sexy chicks - it was a cool place to hang out. SAMA could have been kept around and “downplayed” kinda like the way they kept the Steroid forum. Remember the awesomeness that Sen, Cowboy, Merlin, BG, Push, LEW, and yours truly used to drop? But decisions were made and they have suffered as a result. It’s not too late to turn it around, though.
My hope is that, instead of deleting or moderating this post, someone up there grows a set and says, “hey, what we’re doing isn’t working. Let’s go back and do what we KNOW we’re good at: being unapologetically hardcore”. That would kick ass, boost traffic, improve the site’s reputation, and ultimately sell more supplements which is what they are here to do.
[quote]The Mighty Stu wrote:
[quote]CircaThursday wrote:
x2 !!
I thought I was the only person with this opinion. guys like Bonez, MODOK, Cephalic carnage, Bonez, and ZRAw have personally made specific diets, routines, workout plans and tips for INDIVIDUAL people on this site. X just repeats himself “don’t bother if you don’t have good genetics” “im not fat” “eat big” “hammer strength trumps barbell bench” blanket statements dont help people. so why the popularity? im not talking shit we us need more individual intelligent posters around here (and not chase them off)[/quote]
Good point, we need to cultivate an environment where we keep the intelligent and helpful forum members and cease the crap that runs these people away. We all have our favorite posters that have either abandoned ship, or simply stopped having any interest in sharing and bestowing knowledge at all for fear of what every thread inevitably gets turned into… and who can blame them?
Now whether it has been specific actions, or more likely the unchecked behavior of certain people, it’s needed to be addressed for some time. From what I took away from one of my conversations with Jared the other day, the folks running this site are well aware of how things have gotten, and to be honest, apparently a lot of the mods and editors feel very similarly to a lot of the posters (they do read through every thread after all).
That being the case, with everyone being on the same page in terms of curtailing BS behavior and fostering the intelligent and civil discussion of topics we all share a deep appreciation for, howzabout we move ahead and stop lobbing blame on one specific poster. Not that I don’t agree for the most part, but rehashing and rehashing the same opinions doesn’t change actions and behaviors that tarnished this site’s reputation in a lot of people’s eyes.
S[/quote]
I just came upon this thread and agree with most of the post’s here.I’m a newer poster but have been reading TN for many year’s and a good 3 year’s before I even became a member.I miss the vet’s that have left and the good info they shared.I think there’s still a good amount of people that share and discuss some good Info and I’d hate to lose any more for sure.I don’t like the shit storm thread’s and don’t get involved In them.I’ve learned a lot over the year’s from like minded people that share my love of this sport,hobby whatever you want to call it.I use the supp’s,like the coaches and article’s on TN as well.It’s nice to be able to come to a place and discuss topic’s that I’m passionate about and support the people that are trying to change their live’s for the better.I agree It would be nice If all the BS didn’t have to come along with It.
[quote]Chushin wrote:
[quote]angry chicken wrote:
I think the site took a turn for the worse in the last year or two in an attempt to “clean up” it’s image. Being “unapologetically hardcore ™” and banning anyone who had anything resembling a controversial opinion isn’t exactly congruent. I’ve spent THOUSANDS of dollars on Biotest supps over the years. I believe they are the among the best in the industry.
I used to recommend this site to anyone with an interest in lifting weights or looking good nekkid. But then they turn around and moderate every post I make and disable my PM’s? Those kinds of actions add up and hurt a website’s “street cred”. It’s simple human nature that if you censure people then it dumbs down the dialog.
I would LOVE to have the T-Nation from 2007-2009 back. Back then Prof X still gave good advice and MODOK, Bonez, CC, Meat, etc… were around mentoring folks. TC would actually write an article every so often. Actual amateurs who gave a shit, learned a lot and wanted to give back. Trolling was original and often an entertaining exception, not a boring “norm”.
It was almost like a locker room/bar/boys club all rolled up into one with the added bonus of sexy chicks - it was a cool place to hang out. SAMA could have been kept around and “downplayed” kinda like the way they kept the Steroid forum. Remember the awesomeness that Sen, Cowboy, Merlin, BG, Push, LEW, and yours truly used to drop? But decisions were made and they have suffered as a result. It’s not too late to turn it around, though.
My hope is that, instead of deleting or moderating this post, someone up there grows a set and says, “hey, what we’re doing isn’t working. Let’s go back and do what we KNOW we’re good at: being unapologetically hardcore”. That would kick ass, boost traffic, improve the site’s reputation, and ultimately sell more supplements which is what they are here to do.[/quote]
Man, no kidding. Very well said, and very much in concordance with my own thoughts.
And I spend even more money here than you do. ;-)[/quote]
Oh God please yes.
What the world does not need is one more PC place where everyone is coddled.
People who want to be coddled are not here anyway for the most part.
[quote]angry chicken wrote:
I think the site took a turn for the worse in the last year or two in an attempt to “clean up” it’s image. Being “unapologetically hardcore ™” and banning anyone who had anything resembling a controversial opinion isn’t exactly congruent. I’ve spent THOUSANDS of dollars on Biotest supps over the years. I believe they are the among the best in the industry.
I used to recommend this site to anyone with an interest in lifting weights or looking good nekkid. But then they turn around and moderate every post I make and disable my PM’s? Those kinds of actions add up and hurt a website’s “street cred”. It’s simple human nature that if you censure people then it dumbs down the dialog.
I would LOVE to have the T-Nation from 2007-2009 back. Back then Prof X still gave good advice and MODOK, Bonez, CC, Meat, etc… were around mentoring folks. TC would actually write an article every so often. Actual amateurs who gave a shit, learned a lot and wanted to give back. Trolling was original and often an entertaining exception, not a boring “norm”.
It was almost like a locker room/bar/boys club all rolled up into one with the added bonus of sexy chicks - it was a cool place to hang out. SAMA could have been kept around and “downplayed” kinda like the way they kept the Steroid forum. Remember the awesomeness that Sen, Cowboy, Merlin, BG, Push, LEW, and yours truly used to drop? But decisions were made and they have suffered as a result. It’s not too late to turn it around, though.
My hope is that, instead of deleting or moderating this post, someone up there grows a set and says, “hey, what we’re doing isn’t working. Let’s go back and do what we KNOW we’re good at: being unapologetically hardcore”. That would kick ass, boost traffic, improve the site’s reputation, and ultimately sell more supplements which is what they are here to do.[/quote]
exactly why i “loved” this site, note the past tense.
love the concept, it was free it was fun, the time you spend reading, learning, sharing serious and thoughtful things iron related was great, you could read, learn and share from folks who had already been in your shoes, aspire to look like and achieve what they had done or where doing…
there where hot and opinionated women who loved the training.
T- levels were high, fun was had…i surfed and posted here pre and post workout, it was all i wanted in a bodybuilding, strength site + the fun other stuff- a fun one stop shop.
NOW- people insulting each other, disrespecting the elders, no titties or tight asses.
THE SITE has become kinda bland and w/out insight from accomplished lifters posting and the thoughtful discussion…shit. i’m off to look at youtube vids before i train.
went to T-Cell, shit is dusty in there…
Can deb or veggiestrong at least post an ass shot on here for the 4th of july holiday…christ.
[quote]angry chicken wrote:
I think the site took a turn for the worse in the last year or two in an attempt to “clean up” it’s image. Being “unapologetically hardcore ™” and banning anyone who had anything resembling a controversial opinion isn’t exactly congruent. I’ve spent THOUSANDS of dollars on Biotest supps over the years. I believe they are the among the best in the industry.
I used to recommend this site to anyone with an interest in lifting weights or looking good nekkid. But then they turn around and moderate every post I make and disable my PM’s? Those kinds of actions add up and hurt a website’s “street cred”. It’s simple human nature that if you censure people then it dumbs down the dialog.
I would LOVE to have the T-Nation from 2007-2009 back. Back then Prof X still gave good advice and MODOK, Bonez, CC, Meat, etc… were around mentoring folks. TC would actually write an article every so often. Actual amateurs who gave a shit, learned a lot and wanted to give back. Trolling was original and often an entertaining exception, not a boring “norm”.
It was almost like a locker room/bar/boys club all rolled up into one with the added bonus of sexy chicks - it was a cool place to hang out. SAMA could have been kept around and “downplayed” kinda like the way they kept the Steroid forum. Remember the awesomeness that Sen, Cowboy, Merlin, BG, Push, LEW, and yours truly used to drop? But decisions were made and they have suffered as a result. It’s not too late to turn it around, though.
My hope is that, instead of deleting or moderating this post, someone up there grows a set and says, “hey, what we’re doing isn’t working. Let’s go back and do what we KNOW we’re good at: being unapologetically hardcore”. That would kick ass, boost traffic, improve the site’s reputation, and ultimately sell more supplements which is what they are here to do.[/quote]
This site attracted hardcore, badass lifters cause thats who it was aimed at. This is no longer the case. I used to look forward to reading every new article on a daily basis, now i cant remember the last one i felt compelled to do more than skim through.
I recently logged in for the first in a long time and things have gotten pretty pathetic and as usual it was the same old contributor fanning the flames and ruining decent discussions, baiting other posters who retaliate until things just get batshit crazy. I have seen this from day one but the quality of posts contributed by other members always overshadowed this. However since a lot of these guys are gone Bonez, MODOK, CC, Waylander, BBB, Maraudermeat etc this shit stands out like a sore thumb.
I used to frequent this site all the time for the quality articles and discussions and also for the laughs, I also used to recommend this site to everyone but now…
I admire Stu for his maturity in the face of so much negativity. He is one of the many contributors you automatically click on to see what he has to say because you know it will be clear, intelligent and above all free from negativity and I agree wholeheartedly with his current sentiment.
I would love to see a forum where people are expected to act in a courteous manner, to respect others views and opinions without a tirade of shite being heaped upon one another. A forum etiquette if you will, how that would be policed fuck knows?
Anyhow I hope this is the watershed moment that instigates change around here for the better
Fair play Stu for taking a stand!
[quote]SLAINGE wrote:
I recently logged in for the first in a long time and things have gotten pretty pathetic and as usual it was the same old contributor fanning the flames and ruining decent discussions, baiting other posters who retaliate until things just get batshit crazy. I have seen this from day one but the quality of posts contributed by other members always overshadowed this. However since a lot of these guys are gone Bonez, MODOK, CC, Waylander, BBB, Maraudermeat etc this shit stands out like a sore thumb.
I used to frequent this site all the time for the quality articles and discussions and also for the laughs, I also used to recommend this site to everyone but now…
I admire Stu for his maturity in the face of so much negativity. He is one of the many contributors you automatically click on to see what he has to say because you know it will be clear, intelligent and above all free from negativity and I agree wholeheartedly with his current sentiment.
I would love to see a forum where people are expected to act in a courteous manner, to respect others views and opinions without a tirade of shite being heaped upon one another. A forum etiquette if you will, how that would be policed fuck knows?
Anyhow I hope this is the watershed moment that instigates change around here for the better
Fair play Stu for taking a stand!
[/quote]
A lot of shit went down in the past two to three years
Well gentlemen, I read the first page, and then I skipped to this one to read this. My intent was to examine whether the tone of the thread had changed significantly and devolved or not. I has not. However, everything that needs to be said has probably been said many times over by now as well so there is no real use to rehashing. I would thoroughly like to reinforce I hope you don’t end up leaving Stu, because I have certainly learned a ton of things from your posts even though I have a different overall approach in many ways :).
I would particularly like to ask people to stop mentioning certain posters by name now–I believe it invites more confrontation, if not necessarily on this particular thread, and I also believe most people already know more or less what the issues have been and who is who; thus there is no need to mention names.
Anyone who knows already knows and anybody who doesn’t know doesn’t need to be made aware by reading the thread…That’s how you put the past in the past, by not allowing news to spread. It is also important because there’s more than one issue here and it focuses all on one or a few posters, which I believe is not proper per se.
So–my suggestions are the following: In order to do what we can to band together and (re)create the site we all know or remember–I was there with Stu as well from the beginning of the forums in '01 as well.
Leave the past in the past.
Leave the ego at the door–I know the futility of saying this, but man somebody has to. PWI is for shitstorms, making the lifting forums great is going to require a lot of people to “be the bigger man” and forego having the last word. Specifically with previously mentioned people but not only them.
We need to get the Alpha Cell up and kicking again. Damn I’d forgotten how little activity has been going on there with my current busy life and preoccupation with PWI (oops!). Anybody with access to that forum needs to think up a couple thread ideas, or even roundtable questions. That’s one of our “refuges” from most trolls, and it is also an area that people who CAN’T post there look for insight and inspiration. Needs to be resurrected ASAFP
[quote]Steel Nation wrote:
I just realized I’ve been coming to this website for 15 years (since May 98). It is literally one of the first websites I ever found.
I don’t know whether to laugh or cry about that.
[/quote]
Me too. I found this site my second year of college.
[quote]angry chicken wrote:
I think the site took a turn for the worse in the last year or two in an attempt to “clean up” it’s image. Being “unapologetically hardcore ™” and banning anyone who had anything resembling a controversial opinion isn’t exactly congruent. I’ve spent THOUSANDS of dollars on Biotest supps over the years. I believe they are the among the best in the industry.
I used to recommend this site to anyone with an interest in lifting weights or looking good nekkid. But then they turn around and moderate every post I make and disable my PM’s? Those kinds of actions add up and hurt a website’s “street cred”. It’s simple human nature that if you censure people then it dumbs down the dialog.
I would LOVE to have the T-Nation from 2007-2009 back. Back then Prof X still gave good advice and MODOK, Bonez, CC, Meat, etc… were around mentoring folks. TC would actually write an article every so often. Actual amateurs who gave a shit, learned a lot and wanted to give back. Trolling was original and often an entertaining exception, not a boring “norm”.
It was almost like a locker room/bar/boys club all rolled up into one with the added bonus of sexy chicks - it was a cool place to hang out. SAMA could have been kept around and “downplayed” kinda like the way they kept the Steroid forum. Remember the awesomeness that Sen, Cowboy, Merlin, BG, Push, LEW, and yours truly used to drop? But decisions were made and they have suffered as a result. It’s not too late to turn it around, though.
My hope is that, instead of deleting or moderating this post, someone up there grows a set and says, “hey, what we’re doing isn’t working. Let’s go back and do what we KNOW we’re good at: being unapologetically hardcore”. That would kick ass, boost traffic, improve the site’s reputation, and ultimately sell more supplements which is what they are here to do.[/quote]
Agree, especially regarding the censorship. I can understand why they won’t let random folks run down their stuff. But I’ve had posts censored when discussing Biotest supplements, I’ve been on the forums since 2003 and I’ve spent a lot of money on Biotest supplements! Definitely rubs me the wrong way.
Lets not forget that the bb, over 35, beginners, gal, rmp and pwi all run along fine and the others are all a bit slow
But bsl is somewhat problematic; esp the tension which generated those threads that seemed designed to create a fight
Theres not only room but a great role for the big guy who cuts through some trainees confusion with a two line post that essentially reminds them to keep it simple, thats how it was before and it worked great. It would be a great shame to lose that
Maybe another forum structure review is a good idea, everyone can find regular subforums suited to them and the cool factor can be reawakened if the structure was simplified a little again
I think it could work in support of all the posters and the company without needing to lose anyone
[quote]Aragorn wrote:
That I would very much like to see.
And I would like the Unmentionable, dun, dun, duuuuuun, to be a part of it.
If there are disagrements on how to go about it, make it official so that we get to see where you disagree, why you disagree and how it fits into your overall regimen.
Pretty please?
[quote]Aragorn wrote:
Well gentlemen, I read the first page, and then I skipped to this one to read this. My intent was to examine whether the tone of the thread had changed significantly and devolved or not. I has not. However, everything that needs to be said has probably been said many times over by now as well so there is no real use to rehashing. I would thoroughly like to reinforce I hope you don’t end up leaving Stu, because I have certainly learned a ton of things from your posts even though I have a different overall approach in many ways :).
I would particularly like to ask people to stop mentioning certain posters by name now–I believe it invites more confrontation, if not necessarily on this particular thread, and I also believe most people already know more or less what the issues have been and who is who; thus there is no need to mention names.
Anyone who knows already knows and anybody who doesn’t know doesn’t need to be made aware by reading the thread…That’s how you put the past in the past, by not allowing news to spread. It is also important because there’s more than one issue here and it focuses all on one or a few posters, which I believe is not proper per se.
So–my suggestions are the following: In order to do what we can to band together and (re)create the site we all know or remember–I was there with Stu as well from the beginning of the forums in '01 as well.
Leave the past in the past.
Leave the ego at the door–I know the futility of saying this, but man somebody has to. PWI is for shitstorms, making the lifting forums great is going to require a lot of people to “be the bigger man” and forego having the last word. Specifically with previously mentioned people but not only them.
We need to get the Alpha Cell up and kicking again. Damn I’d forgotten how little activity has been going on there with my current busy life and preoccupation with PWI (oops!). Anybody with access to that forum needs to think up a couple thread ideas, or even roundtable questions. That’s one of our “refuges” from most trolls, and it is also an area that people who CAN’T post there look for insight and inspiration. Needs to be resurrected ASAFP
[/quote]
True Speak Aragorn, Angry Chicken is spot on as well.
FTR Aragorn and AC should post alot more to get this fucked forum back on track