Real Source of Republican Ire?

this: http://pajamasmedia.com/blog/krugman-king-blow-and-rich-blinded-by-hatred-of-tea-partiers/?singlepage=true

Krugman, King, Blow, and Rich: Blinded by Hatred of Tea Partiers

Posted By Bob Owens On April 1, 2010 @ 8:33 am In . Feature 01, US News | 4 Comments

The anger all but boiled off the page, and one marveled at the frustration, desperation, and primal rage so barely contained.

He remembered a frantic Autherine Lucy, as she was pelted with eggs and slurs as she dared become the first black student at the University of Alabama. The echoes of jeers hurled at the Little Rock Nine [1] haunt his fevered memory and come alive as his poisoned pen seeks revenge. He recalls â?? much more recently â?? the sullen, dim-witted fury of Klansmen listening to David Duke shriek about white power in Metaire, Louisiana, as he ran for the governorâ??s office (and captured 55% of the white vote) in 1991.

Colbert I. King, Washington Post columnist, looks out his window and sees Klansmen again â?¦ in the faces of SUV-driving mothers, cherubic children, in the pained gait of Korea and Vietnam veterans who once again see a need to serve their country, and in homemade signs that read â??Iâ??m only 11â?¦why am I paying your mortgage? [2]â??

In Kingâ??s March 27 column â?? â??In the faces of tea party shouters, images of hate and history [3],â?? â?? the former deputy assistant editorial page editor of the Post is consumed by the very intense and visceral hate he would project on others.

Cherry-picking solitary slogans he finds offensive out of thousands of posters and blindly accepting charges of racism without a shred of evidence, King indulges in his own bigotry and basks in the hatred of a caricature he has created about an Other he refuses to know.

For not sharing his desire to spend someone elseâ??s money, King libels your friends and neighbors as heirs to a craven ideology.

Kingâ??s cowardly refusal to engage anything more substantial than a strawman is a common shortcoming among the would-be intelligentsia. A day earlier in the New York Times, columnist Paul Krugman labeled the majority [4] of Americans opposed to ObamaCare as â??right-wingersâ?? and â??extremistsâ?? dedicated to â??eliminationistâ?? rhetoric, obliquely asserting that the controversial legislation was only opposed by would-be terrorists.

Quite purposefully and without shame, he turns a deaf ear to the cacophony of assassination fantasies [5] his compatriots fetishized during the previous eight years.

The very next day, another Times columnist took up the gauntlet, smashing fury upon the unassuming mothers and grandparents that form the core of a grassroots effort to stand up against an overreaching government. Charles Blow echoed King and Krugman before him, asserting that the tea party rage must come from the deep-seated insecurities of â??extremists.â?? Blow must have smirked with glee as he conjured up a comforting stereotype, which led him to blurt: â??Itâ??s enough to make a good old boy go crazy [6].â??

A day later and deeper down in the muck, Frank Rich took up the cry, equating those who stand against the massive debt that would be created by a deeply flawed health care entitlement program with those who championed racial segregation [7]. Like King, Krugman, and Blow before him, and like lesser talent Mike Lupica [8], looking to break into the â??me, too!â?? club, Rich thrusts and parries against a creature called forth from his own imagination.

Their shared stereotypes are easily thwarted, ponderous, and predictable beasts.

Closeted and aging Klansmen. Gap-toothed hillbillies and incestuous bayou-dwellers. Barely literate and self-absorbed red-state hicks. These are the images that the left-wing pundits of coastal enclaves and lower-tier cable television news have convinced themselves to be the â??real America.â?? It isnâ??t an America they can respect, but then, no recognizable iteration of America could be. We all wish it was otherwise, but the disdain is palpable in print, online, on television, and over the airwaves (though judging by ratings, few are cognizant of the latter two).

But the America rallying on Facebook, Twitter, websites, and message boards are blind to the color of oneâ??s skin, unswayed by the twang of oneâ??s voice, and dismissive of the infirmities of age. Age, color, creed â?? it all washed away in the pixels, and only the power of the mind and the gift of communication remains.

Perhaps it is because of the influence of todayâ??s social media that communication skills, and not political connections, are the organizing force behind the tea party movement. The most active members in this grassroots effort are those worried about their familyâ??s futures, especially those of their young children being shackled to the load generated by ideologues that cannot understand the futility of trying to spend your way out of debt.

Unsurprisingly, mothers form the backbone of a movement dedicated to preserving the nationâ??s future for the benefit of their children and grandchildren. Women make up the bulk of the tea party leadership at every level of organization, and it is not surprising to discover that the movement may be as much as 55% to 60% women [9].

â??Angry white menâ?? is the comforting fallacy of old-line liberal bigotry.

The reality of our times is that the backbones of the tea party movement are charming, self-policing women, and they lead not a fringe, but a majority of Americans [10].

Krugman, King, and their allies are forced to dredge up the imagery of the past in an effort to slander our friends and neighbors. Attempting to libel the real movement by attacking those who form its base would resort in a rising tide of anger against a group of elitists rhetorically engaged in beating down women (as opposed to some of their followers, who do so literally [11]).

We would be well-served by a media that would discuss the merits and flaws of the tea party movement based upon what they actually represent and who they actually are, instead of retreating to do battle with worn-through caricatures. We would be well-served by a media interested in presenting the flaws and shortcomings of the progressive argument as well.

Sadly, this is not to be. We are saddled by ideologues mired in partisanship, practiced in deception, and blinded by their own hatred.

[quote]DBCooper wrote:

[quote]LankyMofo wrote:

[quote]DBCooper wrote:

[quote]Vegita wrote:
Did we just WIN an argument in PWI? Does the silence mean they Understand? I mean I KNOW there aren’t going to come back here and say, "Ok Ok you guys are right, some people (and the media) are being a little too sensetive and labeling ANYTHING that shows obama in a bad light as racism, when in actuality, there is very little racism being shown and the very few instances that were reported are pretty much hearsay at this point, your movement then after all, is not about hating black people, but it really is about smaller government.

Now we are ready to get BACK to the discussion of why we think BIG government is better, we will cease and desist this derailment of the discussion."

They wouldn’t do that much right?

V[/quote]

You haven’t “won”. I haven’t responded in a while because I see no sense in responding to people who outright deny the existence of a racist element within the Tea Party when I have seen it with my own eyes. I’ve NEVER called the Tea Party inherently racist and I have NEVER referred to those who support the TP as racist, especially given that I believe in many of those same things. But this does not negate the fact that there is a small but very vocal element within the TP that is racist. I’ve been to the first TP event in California and I saw all sorts of racist signs. Not ambiguously or dubiously racist signs; signs calling Obama a nigger, signs calling for him to be lynched, people waving nooses, etc, etc.

Just yesterday I saw a woman waving a TP sign on the street corner. I approached her and began to talk with her and within two minutes of talking with me, she referred to Obama as a “Muslim nigger”.

So when people on here continually say that there is no racism within the TP or that it is misconstrued as racism by people who oppose the TP and are looking for any way possible to tear it down, I stop responding to those people. They deserve absolutely zero credibility as far as I’m concerned. If you’re going to deny the existence of a racist element and misconstrue my references to this obvious element as a condemnation of ALL TPers as racists, fine. But don’t think you’ve won because I refuse to respond any further to your asinine denials. If the game you’re trying to win is to see who can bury their head in sand the deepest, then yes you have won. [/quote]

This is why I hate the internet. You can claim you’ve seen anything you want and who are we to call you a liar?

The idea that a perfect stranger called Obama a “muslim nigger” within 2 minutes of talking to you is almost absurd. Reasonably, rational people simply don’t act that way, and I can’t believe you happen to run into many more of these people than I do to have so many examples.

Honestly it sounds like you’re just making shit up to back up your side of the argument. Where is the PROOF?[/quote]

For you and your narrow way of looking at things, there is no proof. If I produced a video or pictures, no matter how many, you would decry these as fabrications on my part or simply turn the issue around and say that liberals did the same stuff with Bush. There’s no way to rationalize with you, so I give up. If you want to call that a “win”, then so be it. In your warped little world where there is no racism whatsoever in the TP, you win.[/quote]

If you refer to logically dismantalling your “evidence” as calling them fabrications, then yes you are right.

We have offered completely logical and rational rebuttals to every statement you have made and evidence you’ve presented. You have refused to engage the logic and reasons of our arguments. Now suddenly we are the ones that can’t be reasoned with? We are the irrational ones?

You might want to take a look back over the thread and re-evaluate who is making the rational arguments and who is refusing to engage those arguments.

I’ve met people like this too. I was talking to a guy in line at the store one day, and we started talking about politics, and he said he “couldn’t believe people voted for that nigger.” It actually happens quite a lot. The Economist magazine even remarked on it.

[quote]Ryan P. McCarter wrote:

I’ve met people like this too. I was talking to a guy in line at the store one day, and we started talking about politics, and he said he “couldn’t believe people voted for that nigger.” It actually happens quite a lot. The Economist magazine even remarked on it.
[/quote]

I’m inclined to agree. It’s entirely possible with some people especially in certain areas of the country.

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]Ryan P. McCarter wrote:

I’ve met people like this too. I was talking to a guy in line at the store one day, and we started talking about politics, and he said he “couldn’t believe people voted for that nigger.” It actually happens quite a lot. The Economist magazine even remarked on it.
[/quote]

I’m inclined to agree. It’s entirely possible with some people especially in certain areas of the country.[/quote]

That’s why I said almost absurd. It’s completely absurd to think these people are all over the place and DBcooper happens to see them everywhere, while, for everyone else it’s a very rare occurrence.

I’m not even saying there are not any racist people involved with the tea party. But to claim it as a racist movement is completely ridiculous. They’re no more racist than any other political party.

[quote]LankyMofo wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]Ryan P. McCarter wrote:

I’ve met people like this too. I was talking to a guy in line at the store one day, and we started talking about politics, and he said he “couldn’t believe people voted for that nigger.” It actually happens quite a lot. The Economist magazine even remarked on it.
[/quote]

I’m inclined to agree. It’s entirely possible with some people especially in certain areas of the country.[/quote]

That’s why I said almost absurd. It’s completely absurd to think these people are all over the place and DBcooper happens to see them everywhere, while, for everyone else it’s a very rare occurrence.

I’m not even saying there are not any racist people involved with the tea party. But to claim it as a racist movement is completely ridiculous. They’re no more racist than any other political party.[/quote]

I’ve had whites use racist black slurs and blacks use racist white slurs in casual conversation with me. It is the norm in some places. With me it generally just leads to some awkward moments.

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]Ryan P. McCarter wrote:

I’ve met people like this too. I was talking to a guy in line at the store one day, and we started talking about politics, and he said he “couldn’t believe people voted for that nigger.” It actually happens quite a lot. The Economist magazine even remarked on it.
[/quote]

I’m inclined to agree. It’s entirely possible with some people especially in certain areas of the country.[/quote]
And I bet many of the people who would call Obama a nigger probably wouldn’t if he had different policies. Like liberals who wouldn’t call a Texan they liked the names they called Bush.

As for this racist element thing. The Detroit Red Wings have one of the most loyal fan bases in all of major sports. If a game is in Toronto even there will be enough Detroit fans there so that you can hear the cheers when they score. Does this mean that Toronto fans have a Detroit element? Try to tell them that. No, it means there are Wings fans in their building.

What are these tea party people supposed to do? Forcibly remove them? I have a feeling people with that kind of attitude will tell them to eat shit and go right on waving their signs and yelling what ever they want.

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]Ryan P. McCarter wrote:

I’ve met people like this too. I was talking to a guy in line at the store one day, and we started talking about politics, and he said he “couldn’t believe people voted for that nigger.” It actually happens quite a lot. The Economist magazine even remarked on it.
[/quote]

I’m inclined to agree. It’s entirely possible with some people especially in certain areas of the country.[/quote]
And I bet many of the people who would call Obama a nigger probably wouldn’t if he had different policies. Like liberals who wouldn’t call a Texan they liked the names they called Bush.

As for this racist element thing. The Detroit Red Wings have one of the most loyal fan bases in all of major sports. If a game is in Toronto even there will be enough Detroit fans there so that you can hear the cheers when they score. Does this mean that Toronto fans have a Detroit element? Try to tell them that. No, it means there are Wings fans in their building.

What are these tea party people supposed to do? Forcibly remove them? I have a feeling people with that kind of attitude will tell them to eat shit and go right on waving their signs and yelling what ever they want.

[/quote]

This is exactly the point, if you have one or two or ten people who have enough hate and big enough balls to repeatedly yell the word nigger in a crowd, do people think anything short of physically removing them is going to get them to shut up? “Hey buddy you want to cool it with the nigger yelling? Thats not what we stand for and you are hurting our movement by letting the media paint us all as racists.” -response “Fuck You ”

V

Imagine the media salivation over that?

Then comes the 1st amendment lawsuits and who made you king of DC? We have every right to be here and say whatever we want just like you. AND THEN comes the reporting on that.

They have no choice but to put up with these people. These are free public outdoor demonstrations with no workable way to control who shows up or not. I will say though that having recognized competent leadership who’s denunciation would go a long way toward putting this crap to rest would help but would also sorta defeat the personality of the movement. This isn’t as easy as pushing a magic button.

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
Imagine the media salivation over that?

Then comes the 1st amendment lawsuits and who made you king of DC? We have every right to be here and say whatever we want just like you. AND THEN comes the reporting on that.

They have no choice but to put up with these people. These are free public outdoor demonstrations with no workable way to control who shows up or not. I will say though that having recognized competent leadership who’s denunciation would go a long way toward putting this crap to rest would help but would also sorta defeat the personality of the movement. This isn’t as easy as pushing a magic button.

[/quote]

I am thinking of attending an April 15 Tax Day Tea Party demonstration with my 19 month old son. I was wanting to see what was going on for myself, and maybe join up with this movement. I want to make up my own mind about this movement. Would you all say taking my son into this type of environment be iladvised? The last thing I want to happen is some violence break out because some SOB will not keep his mouth closed. I will be restrained because my son will be with me, but if he was not I would probably help remove the SOB myself. I pick up my son everyday from daycare, and will not have time to go home to drop him off before going to the demonstration. I have two choices. Take him with me or not go at all.

There were quite a few children at every single one I’ve been to. They’re extremely peaceful.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/04/15/AR2010041504582.html

Hm…Shuler is now denying he ever heard the n-word at the protest.

I went to a rally last night, and it was really laid back. People brought out their lawn chairs and hung out. I took my 19 month old and he had a good time. Some were being capitalists by selling flags, and buttons, and other things. Some handed out bumper stickers. This is only going to get louder. The voices are getting stronger. I went home watched the 10 o’clock news and they said 15 seconds about the rallies. It made me really mad.

I listen to a guy on the radio named Michael Berry, and he was saying that when someone tells you, “you are a racist because you are part of the Tea Party.” Your come back should be to start laughing and then call them Gay. Unless the person is truely gay. If they are gay call them a pedophile or some other baseless name. I am no longer going to argue a point that has nothing to do with the issues. Both name callings are baseless and there is no way to argue whether you are or are not for either claim. I found that very funny, but true.

"When it comes to major issues confronting the nation, 48% of voters now say the average Tea Party member is closer to their views than Obama is. Forty-four percent (44%) hold the opposite view and believe the presidentâ??s views are closer to their own.

Fifty-two percent (52%) believe the average member of the Tea Party movement has a better understanding of the issues facing America today than the average member of Congress."

I’m not in touch with the tea parties much but I do know quite a few conservatives and most of them will never display any racial animus. There do exist people who are conservative on principle, or libertarian on principle.

On the other hand, Tea Party sympathizers are more likely than other whites to have negative views of immigrants, African Americans, and gays.
http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2010/04/new-data-on-tea-party-sympathizers.html
Now whether you call that racism is a judgment call. Racism is an incredibly charged word. However, there is this population of Tea Party supporters who certainly have negative opinions about blacks generally, want fewer immigrants, and don’t want laws to protect gays.

Tea Partiers are more likely than the general public, or than Republicans, to say that “Too much has been made” of the problems facing black people, and that the administration favors blacks over whites. Again, is that racist? Answering those questions in the affirmative doesn’t imply that you’re a Klansman, but it does imply that your sympathies are against blacks.

The other thing to keep in mind is that support for social programs, especially for the poor, is linked to racial attitudes.
http://www.jstor.org/stable/2960399
Among whites, negative attitudes about blacks (“less hardworking”) is a better predictor of opposition to welfare than factors such as self-interest or individualism.

This is an interesting article.
http://www.themonkeycage.org/2009/02/post_159.html
Salient points:
Large percentages of people (nearly a third of whites in 1991, for instance) continue to believe that blacks are lazier than whites. Media portrayals of poverty and welfare focus overwhelmingly on blacks. There is a strong and significant correlation between having a negative opinion of blacks’ work ethics, and opposition to welfare.

There are numerous studies coming to the same conclusion. It is a fact that non-whites are more likely to be poor in the US. Not liking non-whites is correlated with not liking redistribution to the poor. That doesn’t mean every anti-redistributionist is racist; but a significant percent of them are, because the percentages who will agree with statements like “blacks are lazier than whites” is fairly high. It’s hard to predict causality in statistical studies, but there is undeniably correlation.

I don’t like namecalling either. Most people I know who don’t like redistribution have not shown me any evidence of racism. But there is a population – and not a tiny one, but a significant one – who have negative attitudes about blacks and immigrants, and also don’t like redistribution. Maybe no T-Nationers are in that population, but it exists.

I want to be clear on one other point. These “racists” I’ve been talking about are not people who want to reinstitute slavery or Jim Crow or who want to do violence to anybody. There are not very many crazies like that in the US. There are a lot of Americans who have negative opinions about black people, who want less immigration, and who don’t want legislation that favors gays. I don’t know any neo-Nazi nutjobs. I know quite a few otherwise normal people who will say that black people are less intelligent, less hardworking, or more criminal. They simply think it’s true. If you don’t want to call that racist, or if you think it’s justified, fine. But it’s a common viewpoint in the US, and it correlates quite strongly with opposing redistribution.

[quote]AlisaV wrote:
I’m not in touch with the tea parties much but I do know quite a few conservatives and most of them will never display any racial animus. There do exist people who are conservative on principle, or libertarian on principle.

On the other hand, Tea Party sympathizers are more likely than other whites to have negative views of immigrants, African Americans, and gays.
http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2010/04/new-data-on-tea-party-sympathizers.html
Now whether you call that racism is a judgment call. Racism is an incredibly charged word. However, there is this population of Tea Party supporters who certainly have negative opinions about blacks generally, want fewer immigrants, and don’t want laws to protect gays.

Tea Partiers are more likely than the general public, or than Republicans, to say that “Too much has been made” of the problems facing black people, and that the administration favors blacks over whites. Again, is that racist? Answering those questions in the affirmative doesn’t imply that you’re a Klansman, but it does imply that your sympathies are against blacks.

The other thing to keep in mind is that support for social programs, especially for the poor, is linked to racial attitudes.
http://www.jstor.org/stable/2960399
Among whites, negative attitudes about blacks (“less hardworking”) is a better predictor of opposition to welfare than factors such as self-interest or individualism.

This is an interesting article.
http://www.themonkeycage.org/2009/02/post_159.html
Salient points:
Large percentages of people (nearly a third of whites in 1991, for instance) continue to believe that blacks are lazier than whites. Media portrayals of poverty and welfare focus overwhelmingly on blacks. There is a strong and significant correlation between having a negative opinion of blacks’ work ethics, and opposition to welfare.

There are numerous studies coming to the same conclusion. It is a fact that non-whites are more likely to be poor in the US. Not liking non-whites is correlated with not liking redistribution to the poor. That doesn’t mean every anti-redistributionist is racist; but a significant percent of them are, because the percentages who will agree with statements like “blacks are lazier than whites” is fairly high. It’s hard to predict causality in statistical studies, but there is undeniably correlation.

I don’t like namecalling either. Most people I know who don’t like redistribution have not shown me any evidence of racism. But there is a population – and not a tiny one, but a significant one – who have negative attitudes about blacks and immigrants, and also don’t like redistribution. Maybe no T-Nationers are in that population, but it exists.

I want to be clear on one other point. These “racists” I’ve been talking about are not people who want to reinstitute slavery or Jim Crow or who want to do violence to anybody. There are not very many crazies like that in the US. There are a lot of Americans who have negative opinions about black people, who want less immigration, and who don’t want legislation that favors gays. I don’t know any neo-Nazi nutjobs. I know quite a few otherwise normal people who will say that black people are less intelligent, less hardworking, or more criminal. They simply think it’s true. If you don’t want to call that racist, or if you think it’s justified, fine. But it’s a common viewpoint in the US, and it correlates quite strongly with opposing redistribution.[/quote]

That first link you posted is so biased its ridiculous. Those polls are set up to create an image of bias in the movement.

If you ask someone if they agree or disagree that blacks are hardworking, how you’d you answer? Either saying yes or no is racist. How do you answer a question that requires a racist answer? That’s just about the worst poll question I’ve ever heard.

They then go on to relate not wanting illegal immigrants here to discrimination. Oh freaking please. If you agree that immigration should be increased, does that make you discriminatory to natives? Once again dumb question requiring an incriminating answer.

So, do you agree or disagree that whites are intelligent hardworking and trustworthy?

If you agree, you’re a white supremacist, and if you disagree you hate white people.

Oh, and it seems that they didn’t label their graphs very well.

Well, we’re working with different definitions here. Sounds like you think racism means making generalizations about races. I’m not sure these days what racism means. I think it’s more useful to talk about negative opinions of groups.

There are people who have poor opinions of black people, as opposed to good opinions of them. I suppose some people have no opinion at all; polls don’t allow you to pick “no opinion.” I think “no opinion” is probably the truest answer. The assumption in polling is that you always have an opinion, a gut reaction of some kind. That’s an inherent component of polling. Regardless, if you force people to come up with a gut reaction, some of them will have a poor opinion of black people. Why a poor opinion instead of a good one? It must be because on some level that’s what they think. Maybe they’d hedge it with caveats in real life, but they apparently think “not hardworking” is a better description than “hardworking.”

[quote]AlisaV wrote:
<<< I know quite a few otherwise normal people who will say that black people are less intelligent, >>>
[/quote]
If we’re talking about innate intelligence I disagree and have met very few people in my entire life who believe this.

[quote]AlisaV wrote:
<<< less hardworking,>>>[/quote]
This would be the case with any people who were aggressively, indeed practically force fed other people’s money for a few decades. I’ve gone into great detail on this in the past.

[quote]AlisaV wrote:
<<< or more criminal.>>>[/quote]
This is a simple statistical reality. We can debate causes all day, but the mere fact is not debatable. I contend that the cause is only incidentally related to race in that, once again, any people who’s families have been decimated by disastrous social programs will produce unstructured, undisciplined specimens at best and unloved, practically abandoned or even abused ones at worst. That whole scale of social decay is a fertile volcanically erupting environment for developing criminal behavior.

I once quoted the FBI statistics for NYC to a black workmate that mathematically demonstrated the fact that 78% of all violent crime there was black on black. I was living on Long Island at the time. His face turned very sour and he sneered at me “so ya hate niggers huh?” So help me, true story. We have degenerated to the point where simply stating a fact earns you a haters badge. There are some stark undeniable realities concerning blacks and illegal immigrants that will never be solved while merely acknowledging their existence can have no other explanation than racial hatred.

Here’s a stunning postulation. WHAT IF, some white people actually cared enough about all people, including black ones, to push their face into the truth of their situation whether they liked it or not.

Not necessarily pointed at Alisa in particular BTW.

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:

[quote]AlisaV wrote:
<<< I know quite a few otherwise normal people who will say that black people are less intelligent, >>>
[/quote]
If we’re talking about innate intelligence I disagree and have met very few people in my entire life who believe this.

[quote]AlisaV wrote:
<<< less hardworking,>>>[/quote]
This would be the case with any people who were aggressively, indeed practically force fed other people’s money for a few decades. I’ve gone into great detail on this in the past.

[quote]AlisaV wrote:
<<< or more criminal.>>>[/quote]
This is a simple statistical reality. We can debate causes all day, but the mere fact is not debatable. I contend that the cause is only incidentally related to race in that, once again, any people who’s families have been decimated by disastrous social programs will produce unstructured, undisciplined specimens at best and unloved, practically abandoned or even abused ones at worst. That whole scale of social decay is a fertile volcanically erupting environment for developing criminal behavior.

I once quoted the FBI statistics for NYC to a black workmate that mathematically demonstrated the fact that 78% of all violent crime there was black on black. I was living on Long Island at the time. His face turned very sour and he sneered at me “so ya hate niggers huh?” So help me, true story. We have degenerated to the point where simply stating a fact earns you a haters badge. There are some stark undeniable realities concerning blacks and illegal immigrants that will never be solved while merely acknowledging their existence can have no other explanation than racial hatred.

Here’s a stunning postulation. WHAT IF, some white people actually cared enough about all people, including black ones, to push their face into the truth of their situation whether they liked it or not.

Not necessarily pointed at Alisa in particular BTW.[/quote]

You propose no solutions.

That actually wasn’t my point.

The truth or falsehood of those claims is a whole other issue. (The crime statistic, by the way, is not in dispute as far as I know – you’re right that most crime is black on black.)

The point I am trying to make is this:

  1. Significant numbers of people do make negative claims about the characteristics of blacks.
  2. Those people also tend to oppose redistribution, and there are many of them among those who oppose redistribution.

You made the link yourself. You said “that would be the case with any people who were aggressively, indeed practically force fed other people’s money for a few decades.” You don’t like redistribution, you think black people have a negative characteristic, and those two opinions are linked in your mind. (In fact, if I understand you correctly, you think the redistribution causes the negative characteristic.)

The data shows, and you yourself only further indicate, that these two types of opinions are linked.