Questions About Training

[quote]MAF14 wrote:
Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
MAF14 wrote:
Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
MAF14 wrote:
CT,

How often do you reccomend training a muscle/muscle group while trying to lose body fat and maintain size/strength?

Thank you.

1 to 6 times a week. :wink:

It depends on the approach you use.

Touche… I usually do 5x5 or work up to 3 RM on my core lifts.

And how many days a week do you train?

I prefer to go more than not so usually 4 or 5 times a week. And i do steady state cardio a couple mornings a week.[/quote]

I would do:

DAY 1. Pulling muscles (back, biceps, traps)
DAY 2. Pushing muscles (chest, delts, triceps)
DAY 3. Legs
DAY 4. OFF
DAY 5. Pulling muscles
DAY 6. Pushing muscles
DAY 7. OFF

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
MAF14 wrote:
Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
MAF14 wrote:
Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
MAF14 wrote:
CT,

How often do you reccomend training a muscle/muscle group while trying to lose body fat and maintain size/strength?

Thank you.

1 to 6 times a week. :wink:

It depends on the approach you use.

Touche… I usually do 5x5 or work up to 3 RM on my core lifts.

And how many days a week do you train?

I prefer to go more than not so usually 4 or 5 times a week. And i do steady state cardio a couple mornings a week.

I would do:

DAY 1. Pulling muscles (back, biceps, traps)
DAY 2. Pushing muscles (chest, delts, triceps)
DAY 3. Legs
DAY 4. OFF
DAY 5. Pulling muscles
DAY 6. Pushing muscles
DAY 7. OFF

[/quote]

Thank you. I’ve been playing around with my routine to try to get it right for the last 2-3 weeks so this is very helpful.

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
MAF14 wrote:
Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
MAF14 wrote:
Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
MAF14 wrote:
CT,

How often do you reccomend training a muscle/muscle group while trying to lose body fat and maintain size/strength?

Thank you.

1 to 6 times a week. :wink:

It depends on the approach you use.

Touche… I usually do 5x5 or work up to 3 RM on my core lifts.

And how many days a week do you train?

I prefer to go more than not so usually 4 or 5 times a week. And i do steady state cardio a couple mornings a week.

I would do:

DAY 1. Pulling muscles (back, biceps, traps)
DAY 2. Pushing muscles (chest, delts, triceps)
DAY 3. Legs
DAY 4. OFF
DAY 5. Pulling muscles
DAY 6. Pushing muscles
DAY 7. OFF

[/quote]
If I may jump on this as well… Would that be heavy on all days? or lighter on days 5 & 6?
Also, I am currently doing a push pull but I am adding legs in on those days. Would doing the whole body in a pus/pull fashion lead to greater fatloss due to the greater muscle work? or lead to dismal efforts? Thanks so much.

Thib,

Are mechanical drop sets beneficial for strength only ?
For example when you work up to 3RM set of pull-up, but can’t get the last rep, then switch grip to chin-up and get this rep. Is it unnecessary fatigue when only max strength is the goal?

I was under the impression mechanical drop sets were used for a slightly higher rep range like 5 reps or so.

If you are doing an exercise for a 3rm…your mechanical drops will probably be like only 1 rep and I’m not sure how effective that will be

Guess I’m asking along with you since I’m not Thib.

Coach, I was wondering about your thoughts about your older program Renaissance Body Development. Do you still use it with athletes or other clients?

I know its not a bodybuilding system, but do you believe its still a good choice for building a great physique?

I ask because I know some people that want to develop a good looking, Brad Pitt-esque physique and they came to me and asked about a good program design to accomplish that, and I immediately thought of that program.

Thanks for your time :slight_smile:

Thib,

While it is obviously going to depend upon the trainee in question, what are your general thoughts of pull-ups versus chin-ups for lat development?

Now a mix is probably best to stimulate as many MU’s as possible and to hit the lats as shoulder extensors and shoulder adductors. But I’m just curious if one would have an ā€œedge,ā€ so to speak, over the other.

For example, so would say that chins have a larger ROM at the shoulder joint and give you a greater TUT at a given load. Others would counter that the biceps can’t contribute as much during pull-ups, and this would require the lats to work harder during the set.

CT,

I have two sports training related questions for you based upon things I’ve seen some coaches doing. I wanted to get your take on whether the following things have value or are just coaches trying to get too cute with training.

The first is vertical jumps with bungee chords or resistance bands attached (or, less often seen, using added weight via a weight vest). Are jumps better off being left alone and done strictly with bodyweight, or can the aforementioned modalities be used if the load is kept at a low enough percentage of bodyweight?

Secondly, I see some coaches trying to create drills that inject an air of unpredictability, since they say typical agility drills don’t mimic sports and that another approach is needed to decrease reaction time and improve the ability to decelerate quickly and change what you are doing. Is there merit to that approach or is it better to just get the athlete brutally strong in the gym in eccentric and isometric work (on top of the focus on concentric work), increase his ability to produce power, and then allow practice of the given sport to transfer the qualities developed in the gym? Reaction time itself seems largely innate, and having the necessary strength in the musculature to stop on a dime seems more critical than using a ā€œrandomizedā€ drill to simulate a sport and increase agility. But I am no expert, so your input would be excellent.

[quote]PodolskiPower wrote:
CT,

I have two sports training related questions for you based upon things I’ve seen some coaches doing. I wanted to get your take on whether the following things have value or are just coaches trying to get too cute with training.

The first is vertical jumps with bungee chords or resistance bands attached (or, less often seen, using added weight via a weight vest). Are jumps better off being left alone and done strictly with bodyweight, or can the aforementioned modalities be used if the load is kept at a low enough percentage of bodyweight?[/quote]

I actually don’t hate this. The problem would be when adding another source of resistance, e.g. depth jumps with bands or weight jump squat with bands. But if you only use the bands it can be effective as it will increase top-end power which is important in sports. Another added benefit is that the elastic will ā€˜throw you back down’ to the ground which will increase kinetic energy accumulation… the landing portion thus becomes a great force absorption drill.

BUT threat this exercise like you would high intensity plyo: stay with a low number of total reps (around 15-20 ground contacts once a week) to avoid joint problems and CNS burnout.[quote]PodolskiPower wrote:

[quote]PodolskiPower wrote:
Secondly, I see some coaches trying to create drills that inject an air of unpredictability, since they say typical agility drills don’t mimic sports and that another approach is needed to decrease reaction time and improve the ability to decelerate quickly and change what you are doing. Is there merit to that approach or is it better to just get the athlete brutally strong in the gym in eccentric and isometric work (on top of the focus on concentric work), increase his ability to produce power, and then allow practice of the given sport to transfer the qualities developed in the gym? Reaction time itself seems largely innate, and having the necessary strength in the musculature to stop on a dime seems more critical than using a ā€œrandomizedā€ drill to simulate a sport and increase agility. But I am no expert, so your input would be excellent. [/quote]

Reaction time is dictated mostly by 3 things:

  1. recognition of the situation
  2. decision making
  3. speed of movement/activation

Factor no.3 is the one that can be trained with strength and power exercises BUT you shouldn’t do them in an unpredictable environment… focus on building contraction speed.

Factor no.1 can be trained by using a wide variation of unpredictable drills … they teach you to be able to spot a situaton requiring adaptation. This CAN be done with agility drills where outside elements are thrown in OR where the coach suddenly tell you to change direction. But this only teaches to see a situation where adaptation is needed.

Factor no.2 can only be trained with sport specific drills, and even more so by practicing the sport. Factor no.2 is often the difference between ā€˜combine warriors’ and those with great ā€˜game’ speed.

Thib, do you see any need for aerobic training for a hockey player even if its like a mile once a week or so?

[quote]crod266 wrote:
Thib, do you see any need for aerobic training for a hockey player even if its like a mile once a week or so?[/quote]

An aerobic base is useful for hockey players, but not when the play… rather between shifts. Recovery between shifts uses the aerobic pathway.

a question from balle…

Dear CT, it has been suggested I post this in your section. I’d love to hear your opinion as an experienced coach and athlete.I know this is a bodybuiliding homepage but there have been quit a few articles discussing MMA for example and that is just one sport where cardio plays a huge role alongside strength. Other sports I can think of are rugby and rowing. In all of those strength is vital but it’s nothing without endurance. How are you supposed to train for that?In practice what happens is that especially rowers have a 90-200 minute cardio session followed by weight training… I wonder how much benefit there even is in a weight session after long cardio. Is there any point trying to get stronger while you do hours of cardio every day or should the increase come in offseason everything else being maintenance work?

I’m a rower but I’ve also played rugby to a reasonable level. When I played rugby I did a lot of extra weight training and my fitness was fine because I did all the standard team training on top.

The rowing training is a lot more frequent and longer hours, yet we do intense weight sessions. I always have various strength athletes at the back of my head saying that cardio will just decrease you strength or reduce gains if you do a significant amount. I’m basically wondering about the balance of weight training and ā€œlong aerobic sessionsā€ (cardio) and whether there is any point doing them all in the same training phase. I personally feel it just blows me to pieces but that’s probably caused by how I do weights…

Hey CT!

I’ve been searching around hoping to find the reason thick-bar pressing is so much easier on the shoulders compared to a thinner bar. The best info I’ve found was actually in one of your threads (funny how that is often the case!), but I was hoping to get a little more info.

It’s been a while, so correct me if I am remembering incorrectly, but it was said that thick-bar pressing is easier on the shoulders because the thick bar makes it more difficult to grip tightly. This looser grip eases tension in the shoulder and that is what makes pressing easier. Is that correct? And why is it that the looser grip eases shoulder tension?

Anyhow, I’ve noticed a huge difference once I started using thicker bars, so I was really curious exactly what was going on.

Thanks for everything you do!

-Mike

[quote]MJT wrote:
Hey CT!

I’ve been searching around hoping to find the reason thick-bar pressing is so much easier on the shoulders compared to a thinner bar. The best info I’ve found was actually in one of your threads (funny how that is often the case!), but I was hoping to get a little more info.

It’s been a while, so correct me if I am remembering incorrectly, but it was said that thick-bar pressing is easier on the shoulders because the thick bar makes it more difficult to grip tightly. This looser grip eases tension in the shoulder and that is what makes pressing easier. Is that correct? And why is it that the looser grip eases shoulder tension?

Anyhow, I’ve noticed a huge difference once I started using thicker bars, so I was really curious exactly what was going on.

Thanks for everything you do!

-Mike[/quote]

The fact is that we don’t know the exact answer at this point. But the fact is that it works! Sometimes, that is good enough for me :slight_smile:

Thib, how would you rate this video of Chinese lifters’ squat as to quad-dominance?

I’m asking because I find this technique the most comfortable to me , but I’m wondering if the pushing of knees outward and sitting between hips turn more focus on hips rather than quads? I would guessthat quads work more when thighs are more perpendicular to the ground ?

(I’m doing squats to improve quad strength specifically to help initial pull to knees in the deadlift, that’s why I’m interested in max quad stimulation)

And another thing - how the hell do they keep their torso almost completely upright ?!

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
PodolskiPower wrote:
CT,

I have two sports training related questions for you based upon things I’ve seen some coaches doing. I wanted to get your take on whether the following things have value or are just coaches trying to get too cute with training.

The first is vertical jumps with bungee chords or resistance bands attached (or, less often seen, using added weight via a weight vest). Are jumps better off being left alone and done strictly with bodyweight, or can the aforementioned modalities be used if the load is kept at a low enough percentage of bodyweight?

I actually don’t hate this. The problem would be when adding another source of resistance, e.g. depth jumps with bands or weight jump squat with bands. But if you only use the bands it can be effective as it will increase top-end power which is important in sports. Another added benefit is that the elastic will ā€˜throw you back down’ to the ground which will increase kinetic energy accumulation… the landing portion thus becomes a great force absorption drill.

BUT threat this exercise like you would high intensity plyo: stay with a low number of total reps (around 15-20 ground contacts once a week) to avoid joint problems and CNS burnout.PodolskiPower wrote:

PodolskiPower wrote:
Secondly, I see some coaches trying to create drills that inject an air of unpredictability, since they say typical agility drills don’t mimic sports and that another approach is needed to decrease reaction time and improve the ability to decelerate quickly and change what you are doing. Is there merit to that approach or is it better to just get the athlete brutally strong in the gym in eccentric and isometric work (on top of the focus on concentric work), increase his ability to produce power, and then allow practice of the given sport to transfer the qualities developed in the gym? Reaction time itself seems largely innate, and having the necessary strength in the musculature to stop on a dime seems more critical than using a ā€œrandomizedā€ drill to simulate a sport and increase agility. But I am no expert, so your input would be excellent.

Reaction time is dictated mostly by 3 things:

  1. recognition of the situation
  2. decision making
  3. speed of movement/activation

Factor no.3 is the one that can be trained with strength and power exercises BUT you shouldn’t do them in an unpredictable environment… focus on building contraction speed.

Factor no.1 can be trained by using a wide variation of unpredictable drills … they teach you to be able to spot a situation requiring adaptation. This CAN be done with agility drills where outside elements are thrown in OR where the coach suddenly tell you to change direction. But this only teaches to see a situation where adaptation is needed.

Factor no.2 can only be trained with sport specific drills, and even more so by practicing the sport. Factor no.2 is often the difference between ā€˜combine warriors’ and those with great ā€˜game’ speed.[/quote]

Thib,

If an athlete has factors 2 and 3 covered without doing anything that works on factor 1, would inclusion of this cause noticeable improvement or are 2 and 3 much more critical in the bigger picture? I don’t have a lot of experience coming up with drills that would cover factor 1 and was wondering if you had an example that might give me an idea of what to look for if trying to design appropriate drills for this. I definitely want to avoid doing anything that looks creative but ultimately doesn’t do much for the athletes. And if giving an example would not be appropriate here, even recommended resources for learning more about the topic would be appreciated.

Thanks again.

Thanks for the response, CT!

The snatch-grip dead is actually easier on the lower back than a proper Zercher.

If working on the dead twice a week, I would do one day for top end strength and one for bottom end strength.

Here is the deadlift workout of one of my client who increased his deadlift by 100lbs and power clean by 50lbs over a relatively short period of time

DAY 1 - TOP END STRENGTH
A1. Partial deadlifts in the power rack (pin pulls), in week one you start the bar just above the knees and every 3 weeks you lower the starting position
Work up to a 3RM then work up to a 1RM

A2. Power clean from high hang (mid-thigh)
3-5 reps

B1. Functional isometric top half deadlift (from just above the knees)
4 x 9 seconds

B2. Power clean from high hang
4 x 1-3 reps

C1. Depth jumps
3 x 10

C2. Leg extension
3 x 6-8

DAY 3 - LOW END STRENGTH
A1. Trap bar deadlift standing on a platform
Work up to a 5RM

A2. Power clean from blocks (1’’ above knees)
5 reps

B1. Snatch-grip deadlift
Work up to a 3RM

B2. Power clean from blocks
3 reps

C1. Eccentric-only deadlift
Work up to the heaviest weight you can lower to the ground under control

C2. Power clean from blocks
1 rep

D. Goodmorning 5 x 5

E. Tire flips
3 x 15[/quote]

CT,
2 questions. First, if you don’t have access to a tire, would there be another exercise you would suggest? Second, for other body parts, how often would u train throughtout the week other than the 2 deadlift days (which I see as leg days) so chest, shoulders, etc would essentially be the other trained parts. Would you just have another upper day where u hit them or split them up. Thank you for your help also on my bench press spec program. In 3 weeks, my bench was up nearly 30 pounds!

Thanks,

Evan

[quote]Thy. wrote:
Thib, how would you rate this video of Chinese lifters’ squat as to quad-dominance?

I’m asking because I find this technique the most comfortable to me , but I’m wondering if the pushing of knees outward and sitting between hips turn more focus on hips rather than quads? I would guessthat quads work more when thighs are more perpendicular to the ground ?

(I’m doing squats to improve quad strength specifically to help initial pull to knees in the deadlift, that’s why I’m interested in max quad stimulation)

And another thing - how the hell do they keep their torso almost completely upright ?![/quote]

That is a normal squat to me. I started out as an olympic lifter and always squatted that way and had my clients squat this way.

The more upright the torso, the more quad-dominant the squat.

How do they stay upright? Proper hip mobility and mechanical advantage: good olympic lifters tend to have relatively short legs and a longer torso… guys with longer legs tend not to be able to maintain an upright position when doing a full squat.

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
Thy. wrote:
Thib, how would you rate this video of Chinese lifters’ squat as to quad-dominance?

I’m asking because I find this technique the most comfortable to me , but I’m wondering if the pushing of knees outward and sitting between hips turn more focus on hips rather than quads? I would guessthat quads work more when thighs are more perpendicular to the ground ?

(I’m doing squats to improve quad strength specifically to help initial pull to knees in the deadlift, that’s why I’m interested in max quad stimulation)

And another thing - how the hell do they keep their torso almost completely upright ?!

That is a normal squat to me. I started out as an olympic lifter and always squatted that way and had my clients squat this way.

The more upright the torso, the more quad-dominant the squat.

How do they stay upright? Proper hip mobility and mechanical advantage: good olympic lifters tend to have relatively short legs and a longer torso… guys with longer legs tend not to be able to maintain an upright position when doing a full squat.[/quote]

Is this type of squat done from pins just above parallel a good assistance for initial pull of the deadlift to overload the quads? (from your article about sticking points you said that weakness from floor to knees often indicate weak quads) OR maybe even front squat from pins above parallel ?

P.S. A side question - did you have any knee or lower back problems during your Olympic lifting career ?