[quote]Master Amino wrote:
What would you suggest for people who can’t gluten or dairy? Apologies if this has been asked.[/quote]
pea protein
rice protein
hemp protein
We’ve seen Thibs protocol listed here ad nauseum…but I’m pretty sure this is his MASS protocol. I haven’t seen what his protocol would be if it were fat loss…because most of his fat loss articles recommend 50-100g carbs depending on your body fat % and weight…and this protocol is over 150g carbs on its own!
Any ideas how this would be modified for fat loss?
[quote]acelement wrote:
We’ve seen Thibs protocol listed here ad nauseum…but I’m pretty sure this is his MASS protocol. I haven’t seen what his protocol would be if it were fat loss…because most of his fat loss articles recommend 50-100g carbs depending on your body fat % and weight…and this protocol is over 150g carbs on its own!
Any ideas how this would be modified for fat loss?[/quote]
do the protocol, zero carbs the rest of the day. benefits will outweigh the “cost”.
What type of peri-workout nutrition would you recommend for rock climbing?
It’s not aerobic and doesn’t lead to much hypertrophy beyond the grip to some degree.
So far I’ve been doing, for indoors (usually 90 min): 20g CH, 25g Whey Iso, 10g BCAA. Outdoors (so up to 5-6 hours, but with lots of breaks) I take 80g of CH over four pulses.
I think taking any carbs would be unnecessary for climbing and I tend to gain fat easily so haven’t been taking them
[quote]dez6485 wrote:
acelement wrote:
We’ve seen Thibs protocol listed here ad nauseum…but I’m pretty sure this is his MASS protocol. I haven’t seen what his protocol would be if it were fat loss…because most of his fat loss articles recommend 50-100g carbs depending on your body fat % and weight…and this protocol is over 150g carbs on its own!
Any ideas how this would be modified for fat loss?
do the protocol, zero carbs the rest of the day. benefits will outweigh the “cost”.[/quote]
by zero carbs, im assuming you’re allowing for green veggies like broccoli, spinach, zucchini, asparagus, etc…
Coach,
As an athlete, more specifically a baseball player(pitcher), what would this protocol look like on a day of competition? (note: i’m a starter who averages 6 innings, 80-100 pitches, which could take anywhere from 1.5-2 hours)
Also when following your protocol what would you say your water intake looks like in a given day? Increased given new protocol? Due to new program? Anything big changes in hydration approach?
[quote]acelement wrote:
dez6485 wrote:
acelement wrote:
We’ve seen Thibs protocol listed here ad nauseum…but I’m pretty sure this is his MASS protocol. I haven’t seen what his protocol would be if it were fat loss…because most of his fat loss articles recommend 50-100g carbs depending on your body fat % and weight…and this protocol is over 150g carbs on its own!
Any ideas how this would be modified for fat loss?
do the protocol, zero carbs the rest of the day. benefits will outweigh the “cost”.
by zero carbs, im assuming you’re allowing for green veggies like broccoli, spinach, zucchini, asparagus, etc…
[/quote]
Correct. As far as I know, green, leafy veggies wouldn’t count towards carbs. I can’t speak for zucchini though, as I don’t eat it therefore have never bothered to look into its carb content- although I feel like it may have more sugars in it
For fat loss, I believe the protocol is 1 of everything instead of 2-3, except for the Alpha-gpc I would think. Then minimal to no carbs the rest of the day depending on the person. So,
-90 2 caps Alpha-GPC
-45 1 FINiBAR
-30 1 Scoop Surge Workout Fuel
-15 1 Scoop Surge Recovery (still not sure if this is 2 scoops or 2 servings)
-During Workout sip on 20g CH
+60 12g CH
+90 Solid meal
[quote]Italiano wrote:
For fat loss, I believe the protocol is 1 of everything instead of 2-3, except for the Alpha-gpc I would think. Then minimal to no carbs the rest of the day depending on the person. So,
-90 2 caps Alpha-GPC
-45 1 FINiBAR
-30 1 Scoop Surge Workout Fuel
-15 1 Scoop Surge Recovery (still not sure if this is 2 scoops or 2 servings)
-During Workout sip on 20g CH
+60 12g CH
+90 Solid meal
[/quote]
I don’t understand why people are confused as to whether the Recovery is 2 servings or scoops. CT has always said “scoops.” He has never once used the word “servings.” Ergo, the protocol calls for 2 scoops of SR.
Ooops thats my bad, I know it is supposed to be scoops! I had that copy and pasted from a previous post and forgot to erase it. sorry
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
jstines wrote:
Professor Chaos wrote:
Quote from a Post-Workout nutrition interview with John Berardi in 2003:
“Another mistake is drinking a big serving of Surge immediately prior to working out. As I demonstrated earlier, Surge has a powerful hypoglycemic effect in the non-exercise state. Therefore, if one were to drink Surge about 15 to 20 minutes prior to exercise, they’d probably have a blood sugar crash.” - John Berardi
In this old article, Dr. Berardi explains how the elevated insulin levels from Surge take glucose levels way down extremely quickly (15-30 min post ingestion) and goes on to suggest sipping Surge Recovery throughout the workout.
I am sure I am missing something, but it seems as if the Surge pre-workout followed by protein only (Anaconda/CH) during the workout would lead to this hypoglycemic state? Do you not need continually elevated insulin levels during this period rather than just a quick spike at the beginning of the workout?
Thank you very much,
Doug
I would think the slower-absorbing carbs in the SWOF and Finibars would keep you from crashing as they would keep your blood sugar from bottoming out.
That’s one part of the answer. The other one is that once the workout starts and catecholamines are released, the actually impact of insulin is largely blunted and aminos/carbs uptake by the muscles become largely due to non-insulin mediated means.
So what you have is the initial insulin spike which drives a ton of aminos and carbs into the muscles right from the start AND TURN ON PROTEIN SYNTHESIS GENES (it’s not just about nutrients transport) then midway through the workout you continue to get delivery that is non-insulinodependant. However, insulin, albeit somewhat inhibited, remains present.
As the workout progresses GH is being produced. When GH and insulin are both present at the same time it leads to the production of both hepatic and intramuscular IGF-1, which also stimulates protein synthesis.
And this is the simpler version. As you can see, there is much more to the system than simply loading up on carbs and aminos.[/quote]
awesome
i have been reading a lot about this and am really interested. I have one problem with it though. I am allergic to nuts, especially hazelnuts, and they are an ingredient in a lot of the Biotest products. am i just shit out of luck? are there any other types of bars or supplements i can substitute in to make sort of a similar periworkout program?
[quote]Big_Phil wrote:
what do you think about the peri-workout supplement of Poliquin that he talked about in the vinkofest?
He said that carbs postworkout are good to lower the cortisol and that the carbs that he use will deal well, even with the catecholamine released after the workout.
sorry for my poor english, i hope you’ll understand[/quote]
Actually, I believe charles said carbs weren’t well absorbed in the end after a workout…which makes a lot of sense since it’s been found that heavy eccentrics cause insulin resistance in muscle…both Charles and Christian’s programs (especiallly his HTH program) produce a lot of eccentric dammage on the muscle.
I believe Charles mentionned that Vitamin C was the best way to reduce catecholamine output post workout. Correct me if i’m wrong on this, anyone.
I’ve been following this protocol -
- 90 2 caps Alpha-GPC
- 60 1 FINiBAR
- 30 2 Scoops Surge Workout Fuel
- 15 2 Scoops Surge Recovery
Problem is, as of now, I can only afford a couple items on this protocol AND I have to start training in the morning where I’m pinched for time.
I wake up at 6:00 am and have to train at 6:30 am. What is going to be my best option here? I’ve been eating 1 FINiBAR right when I wake up and then 2 scoops of Surge Recovery as I’m warming up.
Oh shit, scratch that, didn’t know the price on Surge Workout Fuel went down. Turns out I can afford it all, except the question remains. How the hell do I fit the protocol into a half an hour before training?
I’ve recently been training with the Peri-Workout Protocol and decided to do a reverse experiment on how effective it is by NOT using the protocol for a training session.
I did not use the protocol yesterday and simply had 2 scoops Surge recovery after my workout and am INSANELY sore today.
I will not go without the protocol in the near future if recovery is valued.
[quote]KeepAwaySheeple wrote:
Oh shit, scratch that, didn’t know the price on Surge Workout Fuel went down. Turns out I can afford it all, except the question remains. How the hell do I fit the protocol into a half an hour before training?[/quote]
You could wake up earlier
[quote]GusBus07 wrote:
KeepAwaySheeple wrote:
Oh shit, scratch that, didn’t know the price on Surge Workout Fuel went down. Turns out I can afford it all, except the question remains. How the hell do I fit the protocol into a half an hour before training?
You could wake up earlier[/quote]
Ya I could, but then I wouldn’t be getting enough sleep.
Anybody else who trains in the morning who is pinched on time?
[quote]KeepAwaySheeple wrote:
GusBus07 wrote:
KeepAwaySheeple wrote:
Oh shit, scratch that, didn’t know the price on Surge Workout Fuel went down. Turns out I can afford it all, except the question remains. How the hell do I fit the protocol into a half an hour before training?
You could wake up earlier
Ya I could, but then I wouldn’t be getting enough sleep.
Anybody else who trains in the morning who is pinched on time?
[/quote]
Honestly man there’s no way around it…wake up 30m-1hour earlier and go to bed that much earlier as well.
That’s what I would do anyway.
[quote]KeepAwaySheeple wrote:
GusBus07 wrote:
KeepAwaySheeple wrote:
Oh shit, scratch that, didn’t know the price on Surge Workout Fuel went down. Turns out I can afford it all, except the question remains. How the hell do I fit the protocol into a half an hour before training?
You could wake up earlier
Ya I could, but then I wouldn’t be getting enough sleep.
Anybody else who trains in the morning who is pinched on time?
[/quote]
I have to cut my sleep short on workout days to fit it in. Just make up for it on your off days. It seems to balance out well for me.