Questions About Fat Loss

[iheartlamps]

Hey I recently read your article Refines physique training Strength Training, Bodybuilding & Online Supplement Store - T NATION

I am currently cutting and have been doing 5/3/1 and making some strength gains even in a deficit. The article by you and poliquin really made me want to try lactic acid training. I am 162 lbs, and somewhere close to 15% BF I am guessing, I want to get down to 10ish% so I can finally bulk(Former Fat Bastard).

I am sorry if this is a noobie post and I tried searching, but couldn’t find these questions.

1. Does this routine look ok? or did I fuck it up?
2. On lactic acid WO days do you take a PWO shake right after you lifting/before cardio
3. Can the LISS cardio post Lac Acid WO be done up to 45 min? Will lengthening time make a difference?

Day 1: Heavy lifting chest/back + alactic work
Day 2: Lactate-inducing workout 1+ LISS(30-45 min)
Day 3: Heavy Shoulders/Arms + [pm]Sled Drag (20 min)
Day 4: Off
Day 5: Heavy lifting Quads/Hams + [pm]Sled Drag (20 min)
Day 6: Lactate-inducing workout 2 + LISS(30-45 min)
Day 7:

Heavy Chest/Back Day
A1. Inc DB Press 1x4
(no rest)
A2. DB Flies 1x8
(2 min rest)
B1. Pullups 1x5
(no rest)
B2. One arm row 1x8
(2 min rest)
Repeat x5

Quad/Ham day
A1. Front Squat 1x4
(no rest)
A2. ATG Back Squat 1x8
(2 min rest)
B1. Romanian Deadlifts 1x5
(no rest)
B2. Band Goodmornings 1x8
(2 min rest)
Repeat x5

Shoulder/Arms day
A1. OHP 1x5
(no rest)
A2. Cleans 1x8
(2 min rest)
B1. Bicep Curls 1x5
(no rest)
B2. Dips 1x8
(2 min rest)
Repeat x5

Lactic WOs
CIRCUIT A (15 reps)
A1. DB Bench
A2. Goblet Squat
A3. DB Rows
A4. RDLs
A5. Crunches

CIRCUIT B (20 reps)
B1. Overhead Press
B2. Overhead Squat
B3. Chin-ups
B4. Deadlift
B5. Seated Russian Twists

CIRCUIT C [OPTIONAL] (15reps)
C1. Curls
C2. Calf Raise
C3. Triceps Extension
C4. Knee Raises
C5. Lateral Delt Raises
Repeat x3

Any advice would be very appreciated

[Aphamos]

Coach,

Hope you are doing well. I have a question regarding my energy levels during my workouts–I’m currently on a cutting diet (with almost all of my carbs being eaten around 30 minutes before my workout and right afterward) and I’ve noticed a decrease in intensity and just an overall tired feeling during my workouts. Would you recommend taking some sort of pre-workout supplement or something during the workout itself to remedy this?

Thanks for your time.

[Christian_Thibaudeau]

[quote]pumped340 wrote:
Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
sarah1 wrote:
CT, if you eat a large amount of calories in 1 sitting (like 1/3 of your daily calories) and then don’t eat again for 4 hours or so do you store more fat than if you had split that meal into two meals?

No. If the total intake is the same you will likely have the same result. That’s what current studies show.

Interesting, definitely contradicting some standard advice. So what if someone, on an off day, just had 2 big 1500 calories meals…that would be about the same in the end, result-wise, as six 500 calorie meals?

I’m wondering how this would workout with macros as well. If someone is eating 300g of carbs and 100g of fat would it really be good to have 150g of carbs and 50g of fat twice a day (with whatever protein you’re eating) rather than spreading this out?[/quote]

The most recent studies have shown that the only advantage of frequent feedings is appetite control. That having been said, I’m not necessarily advocating eating only twice a day (although I sometimes do that) but rather to be flexible with your eating patterns.

If anything, not following a precise eating routine (changing meal time and frequency day to day) might actually be good for body composition purposes.

[Belle_Curvy]

Hello CT,

With the very overweight (5.4, 190lbs) would you still have your client eat carbs? Also I was reading that now it is more effective to eat carbs prior to working out. If I don’t have Surge, do you have whole food options that you suggest?

Should I eat based on what I weigh or what I should weigh?

Have you ever seen a very overweight woman get down to a figure athlete level? That is my goal.

Thank you CT!

[system]

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
pumped340 wrote:
Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
sarah1 wrote:
CT, if you eat a large amount of calories in 1 sitting (like 1/3 of your daily calories) and then don’t eat again for 4 hours or so do you store more fat than if you had split that meal into two meals?

No. If the total intake is the same you will likely have the same result. That’s what current studies show.

Interesting, definitely contradicting some standard advice. So what if someone, on an off day, just had 2 big 1500 calories meals…that would be about the same in the end, result-wise, as six 500 calorie meals?

I’m wondering how this would workout with macros as well. If someone is eating 300g of carbs and 100g of fat would it really be good to have 150g of carbs and 50g of fat twice a day (with whatever protein you’re eating) rather than spreading this out?

The most recent studies have shown that the only advantage of frequent feedings is appetite control. That having been said, I’m not necessarily advocating eating only twice a day (although I sometimes do that) but rather to be flexible with your eating patterns.

If anything, not following a precise eating routine (changing meal time and frequency day to day) might actually be good for body composition purposes.[/quote]

So in the end, there’s no need to bring food with us when going out for a few hours and we could just eat a little more in our before after meals? Seems like something I could live with

[MAF14]

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
pumped340 wrote:
Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
sarah1 wrote:
CT, if you eat a large amount of calories in 1 sitting (like 1/3 of your daily calories) and then don’t eat again for 4 hours or so do you store more fat than if you had split that meal into two meals?

No. If the total intake is the same you will likely have the same result. That’s what current studies show.

Interesting, definitely contradicting some standard advice. So what if someone, on an off day, just had 2 big 1500 calories meals…that would be about the same in the end, result-wise, as six 500 calorie meals?

I’m wondering how this would workout with macros as well. If someone is eating 300g of carbs and 100g of fat would it really be good to have 150g of carbs and 50g of fat twice a day (with whatever protein you’re eating) rather than spreading this out?

The most recent studies have shown that the only advantage of frequent feedings is appetite control. That having been said, I’m not necessarily advocating eating only twice a day (although I sometimes do that) but rather to be flexible with your eating patterns.

If anything, not following a precise eating routine (changing meal time and frequency day to day) might actually be good for body composition purposes.[/quote]

Sorry, I know this is a forum about fat-loss but with all the “eat protein every three hours or your gains will suffer” stuff going around, does the same concept apply to muscle building or do most bodybuilders just eat so many times throughout the day in order to make the large quantity of foods do-able? thank you.

[Christian_Thibaudeau]

[quote]MAF14 wrote:
Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
pumped340 wrote:
Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
sarah1 wrote:
CT, if you eat a large amount of calories in 1 sitting (like 1/3 of your daily calories) and then don’t eat again for 4 hours or so do you store more fat than if you had split that meal into two meals?

No. If the total intake is the same you will likely have the same result. That’s what current studies show.

Interesting, definitely contradicting some standard advice. So what if someone, on an off day, just had 2 big 1500 calories meals…that would be about the same in the end, result-wise, as six 500 calorie meals?

I’m wondering how this would workout with macros as well. If someone is eating 300g of carbs and 100g of fat would it really be good to have 150g of carbs and 50g of fat twice a day (with whatever protein you’re eating) rather than spreading this out?

The most recent studies have shown that the only advantage of frequent feedings is appetite control. That having been said, I’m not necessarily advocating eating only twice a day (although I sometimes do that) but rather to be flexible with your eating patterns.

If anything, not following a precise eating routine (changing meal time and frequency day to day) might actually be good for body composition purposes.

Sorry, I know this is a forum about fat-loss but with all the “eat protein every three hours or your gains will suffer” stuff going around, does the same concept apply to muscle building or do most bodybuilders just eat so many times throughout the day in order to make the large quantity of foods do-able? thank you.[/quote]

I think that it has as much to do with tradition as with anything.

Research on protein pulse feeding shows that the anabolic response is better when there are very high and rapid peaks in blood amino acid levels (hyperaminoacidemia) preceded and followed by a period of very low blood amino acid levels (hypoaminoacidemia).

Stable blood AA levels actually desensitize the body to protein and the anabolic response decreases over time and you require more and more protein just to maintain the same effect. Which might be the reason why super high levels of protein per day is advocated.

[Christian_Thibaudeau]

[quote]pumped340 wrote:
Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
pumped340 wrote:
Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
sarah1 wrote:
CT, if you eat a large amount of calories in 1 sitting (like 1/3 of your daily calories) and then don’t eat again for 4 hours or so do you store more fat than if you had split that meal into two meals?

No. If the total intake is the same you will likely have the same result. That’s what current studies show.

Interesting, definitely contradicting some standard advice. So what if someone, on an off day, just had 2 big 1500 calories meals…that would be about the same in the end, result-wise, as six 500 calorie meals?

I’m wondering how this would workout with macros as well. If someone is eating 300g of carbs and 100g of fat would it really be good to have 150g of carbs and 50g of fat twice a day (with whatever protein you’re eating) rather than spreading this out?

The most recent studies have shown that the only advantage of frequent feedings is appetite control. That having been said, I’m not necessarily advocating eating only twice a day (although I sometimes do that) but rather to be flexible with your eating patterns.

If anything, not following a precise eating routine (changing meal time and frequency day to day) might actually be good for body composition purposes.

So in the end, there’s no need to bring food with us when going out for a few hours and we could just eat a little more in our before after meals? Seems like something I could live with :)[/quote]

There is nothing dumber than someone who eats by the clock and refuse to go out to the movie (or something) just because they’ll have to wait an extra hour to eat.

Bodybuilders who eat by the clock are often coached by trainers and these trainers simply want to make themselves look more important than they really are.

Listen, in the past I’ve been on 2 weeks vacations to places like Cuba, Mexico and Aruba. Those vacations where all-included trips (meaning that the food was included in the price and you could eat whatever you wanted). The thing is that the buffet was opened only from 7am to 9am, then from noon to 2pm, then from 5pm to 7pm. So really, you could only eat three times a day.

And on top of all this the protein food selection is below average, to say the least. So while on vacation I only ate 2 or 3 times a day and my protein intake wasn’t as high as usual. Yet, I always came back a bit leaner and just as strong and big.

I think that worrying about missing a meal might be more catabolic than actually missing the meal!

[Christian_Thibaudeau]

[quote]Belle Curvy wrote:
Hello CT,

With the very overweight (5.4, 190lbs) would you still have your client eat carbs? Also I was reading that now it is more effective to eat carbs prior to working out. If I don’t have Surge, do you have whole food options that you suggest?

Should I eat based on what I weigh or what I should weigh?

Have you ever seen a very overweight woman get down to a figure athlete level? That is my goal.

Thank you CT![/quote]

I would have carbs only immediately prior to a strength workout, around 50g. The rest of the day would be green veggies and chicken, turkey, fish and extra lean meat.

Yes, I have seen it several times. But it can’t be done overnight and requires ironclad discipline both in the gym and at the kitchen table.

[nickj_777]

Hey CT

For general health purposes how many capsules of Flameout and the new fatty acid product FA3 do you need and how many times per day should you have that dosage?

Thank you

[Christian_Thibaudeau]

[quote]nickj_777 wrote:
Hey CT

For general health purposes how many capsules of Flameout and the new fatty acid product FA3 do you need and how many times per day should you have that dosage?

Thank you[/quote]

I recommend 2 Flameouts and 3 FA3 taken three times per day.

[ThetfordMiner]

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
pumped340 wrote:
Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
pumped340 wrote:
Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
sarah1 wrote:
CT, if you eat a large amount of calories in 1 sitting (like 1/3 of your daily calories) and then don’t eat again for 4 hours or so do you store more fat than if you had split that meal into two meals?

No. If the total intake is the same you will likely have the same result. That’s what current studies show.

Interesting, definitely contradicting some standard advice. So what if someone, on an off day, just had 2 big 1500 calories meals…that would be about the same in the end, result-wise, as six 500 calorie meals?

I’m wondering how this would workout with macros as well. If someone is eating 300g of carbs and 100g of fat would it really be good to have 150g of carbs and 50g of fat twice a day (with whatever protein you’re eating) rather than spreading this out?

The most recent studies have shown that the only advantage of frequent feedings is appetite control. That having been said, I’m not necessarily advocating eating only twice a day (although I sometimes do that) but rather to be flexible with your eating patterns.

If anything, not following a precise eating routine (changing meal time and frequency day to day) might actually be good for body composition purposes.

So in the end, there’s no need to bring food with us when going out for a few hours and we could just eat a little more in our before after meals? Seems like something I could live with

There is nothing dumber than someone who eats by the clock and refuse to go out to the movie (or something) just because they’ll have to wait an extra hour to eat.

Bodybuilders who eat by the clock are often coached by trainers and these trainers simply want to make themselves look more important than they really are.

Listen, in the past I’ve been on 2 weeks vacations to places like Cuba, Mexico and Aruba. Those vacations where all-included trips (meaning that the food was included in the price and you could eat whatever you wanted). The thing is that the buffet was opened only from 7am to 9am, then from noon to 2pm, then from 5pm to 7pm. So really, you could only eat three times a day.

And on top of all this the protein food selection is below average, to say the least. So while on vacation I only ate 2 or 3 times a day and my protein intake wasn’t as high as usual. Yet, I always came back a bit leaner and just as strong and big.

I think that worrying about missing a meal might be more catabolic than actually missing the meal![/quote]

Thib,

With your vacation example, is it more a case of people letting “less-than-optimal” habits creep in and become consistent over months and beyond that is the real danger with major backslides in physique? The vacation examples that you gave, as well as periodically going for longer stretches during any given day without a meal, seem to pose no risk at all, since significant changes would take “significant” time, so to speak.

People often speak of metabolic slow down and muscle loss, but isn’t it true that even with short-term fasting (e.g. 72 hours or less) that metabolic rate would actually increase and the amount of potential muscle loss would be low, at worst? From an evolutionary standpoint, a short-term spike in metabolic rate would make sense, since you’d actually need to go out and search for food.

And on top of this all (and as I think you’ve noted at various times), any short-term backslides/negative changes would likely lead to positive rebound gains once training and nutrition get back to whatever qualifies as an optimal level for your own physiology and lifestyle.

I would suspect that one of the crucial factors is being sure to hit a specific range of nutrient intake (that supports your current goals) on any given day as opposed to worrying as much about meal number/frequency, but I may be off the mark here.

[MaximusB]

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
pumped340 wrote:
Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
sarah1 wrote:
CT, if you eat a large amount of calories in 1 sitting (like 1/3 of your daily calories) and then don’t eat again for 4 hours or so do you store more fat than if you had split that meal into two meals?

No. If the total intake is the same you will likely have the same result. That’s what current studies show.

Interesting, definitely contradicting some standard advice. So what if someone, on an off day, just had 2 big 1500 calories meals…that would be about the same in the end, result-wise, as six 500 calorie meals?

I’m wondering how this would workout with macros as well. If someone is eating 300g of carbs and 100g of fat would it really be good to have 150g of carbs and 50g of fat twice a day (with whatever protein you’re eating) rather than spreading this out?

The most recent studies have shown that the only advantage of frequent feedings is appetite control. That having been said, I’m not necessarily advocating eating only twice a day (although I sometimes do that) but rather to be flexible with your eating patterns.

If anything, not following a precise eating routine (changing meal time and frequency day to day) might actually be good for body composition purposes.[/quote]

Coach I am glad to see you say this, I know for years it has been the mantra to eat every 2-3 hrs, but in reality that is just so hard to manage with a busy schedule. I guess if you are keeping your caloric and nutritional requirements you are still ok.

[system]

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:

There is nothing dumber than someone who eats by the clock and refuse to go out to the movie (or something) just because they’ll have to wait an extra hour to eat.

Bodybuilders who eat by the clock are often coached by trainers and these trainers simply want to make themselves look more important than they really are.

Listen, in the past I’ve been on 2 weeks vacations to places like Cuba, Mexico and Aruba. Those vacations where all-included trips (meaning that the food was included in the price and you could eat whatever you wanted). The thing is that the buffet was opened only from 7am to 9am, then from noon to 2pm, then from 5pm to 7pm. So really, you could only eat three times a day.

And on top of all this the protein food selection is below average, to say the least. So while on vacation I only ate 2 or 3 times a day and my protein intake wasn’t as high as usual. Yet, I always came back a bit leaner and just as strong and big.

I think that worrying about missing a meal might be more catabolic than actually missing the meal![/quote]

I wish I would have realized how ridiculous I could be about that sort of thing in high school lol

I’m still wondering how this would apply to 2 situations

1. Protein pulsing. You’ve stayed how pulsing some types of protein a certain amount of hours after a meal will increase protein synthesis. Is this an exception to the “new” rule?
2. If you normally eat at say 3pm, 6pm, and 9pm but for some reason are out from 1 to 9pm it would be fine to eat all 3 meals worth of food in one sitting an hour or 2 before going to sleep? Sorry if this seems redundant, that type of situation just stands out to me with this “new” finding.

[dphillips]

Coach Thib,

Two quick questions:

(1) I know that you had success w/ a body comp. client before using two strength days (chest & back and Shoulders and traps) and two metabolic pairing days. Do you still recommend this set up for body comp. purposes? If not, how you would the program differ?
&
(2) I know that you have separated your metabolic pairing workouts into different levels depending upon their difficulty. Could you list what your difficult metabolic pairings would consist of when using only dumbbells (I workout at home w/ powerblock dbs)?

THANKS IN ADVANCE, IT IS MUCH APPRECIATED!!!

[milktruck]

CT, how do you feel about topical fat burners these days? Do you use them any more or use them with clients? Any compounds you like in these besides Yohimbine? I know caffiene is a diuretic in many of them, but do you think there is any benefit on fat loss from topical application when one is taking in plenty systemically for about 6-8 hours of the day?

Would you say cortisol reduction or yohimbine supps have the biggest effect on abdominal fat loss? They seem somewhat mutually exclusive methods.

Thx

[acelement]

CT,

I’ve read in your past Thib Zones that whichever part of the fat calipers test reported the highest numbers might indicate different reasons for fat gain. For example, high readings in the subscapular relative to other readings indicates poor insulin sensitivity.

So my question is, if I’m at approx. 12.8% body fat with caliper readings at 13mm for thigh, 23mm abdominal, 8mm chest…the abdominal is the highest, which would indicate (based on your findings) long-term cortisol issues. But is it disproportionately high enough that this is actually true? That it warrants needing something like supplementing with Glycine?

In general, how do you know when a caliper reading is much higher relative to the other sites on your body?

[optheta]

Hey CT I was wondering what approaches need to do a sucessful Body Comp? I have lost weight before but That required me to cut down my calories quite a bit and add in Cardio. What is the approach to doing a Recomp? Sorry if this is a to vague of a question

[dycemanx]

Hey Coach,

I have spent a great deal of time reading from this site and several others. I have found about 5 different ways to calculate the amount of calories for me to take in and I want to reach a conclusion.

First, I am 27 6’4 and currently weight 346lbs. I started eating clean, lifting 4x per week and doing cardio about 1 month ago. During that stretch I have lost only 2-3 lbs but have lost about 2 inches on my waist, thighs, chest (Fat) and increased my lifts and gained some muscle. I must add, during that stretch I was eating 2900 to 3100 calories per day based off of the Harris Benedict Formula, considering my activity level. That was also using a 33/33/33 split of good carbs, good fats, and protein.

I do understand that my lifting, supplementing protein PWO and taking creatine has increased my muscle so that might offset some of the weight loss. I also understand that what the scale says isnt the bible, but I feel that it should have come down at least 2 lbs per week by now instead of 2-3 total. I only weigh myself every 2 weeks as I have made a lifestyle change. I am in it to win it, but only losing 2-3 lbs per month seems VERY LOW so there must be something that can change.

So, you might ask why do I care so much about altering my total calories if I am making progress… Because I want to maximize my fat loss. I was told by 2 different trainers and 1 doctor that 2500 or 2600 calories a day is a perfect number for me. However that would fall about 1500 below what the Harris Benedict formula says (And almost every other calculator)

To sum up, I need a guideline on how many carbs and protein (1g per lb for me would be 346!! sounds high). I am using he lifting as a way to help lose weight and I am NOT focused on getting huge yet, more focused on losing fat.

Thanks!

[tuchavito]

hi there coach, my question will be about refeeding.

i’ve been on a deficit diet and lifting weights plus boxing for almost 4 months, i’ve lost a total of 35.2 pounds since i started.

the problem is that last saturday i had a boxing match, and i weighted 228.8pounds (i didn’t do anything special before the fight to lose water weight). Then on sunday i had a cheat day (lots of carbs)a long with lots of water, i also had some cheat meals on monday, but when i weighted my self on tuesday i weighted 232.2pounds!!!, is that normal?? it never happened to me ever, and i kinda got worried, i’ve seriously put a lot of effort.

what should i expect??

i’m 5’9" , been losing weiight consistenly for 15 weeks (2-3 pounds per week). i exercise 12+ hours a week.