I was just reading the paper mag, and noticed where Bill Roberts states that “in a serious steroid cycle, testicular testosterone production drops to zero (EVEN IF YOU USE CLOMID)”. A friend of mine was going to do a cycle of 500mg sust and 200mg deca/ week for 8-10 weeks, using 1/4 to 1/2 tab arimidex everyday as an anti-e. He WAS planning on using 25mg clomid everyday, so as to have nuts at the end of the cycle. However, according to bill’s article, this clomid is essentially worthless (or, more accurately, a waste of money), since he’s already using an anti-e, right?!? Would it be better to just wait on the clomid until the last week? Thanks.
Indeed I don’t think Clomid would make
any difference to the testicles in this
situation. Blood tests using substantial
amounts of androgen (but no testosterone)
always show testosterone levels dropped
to about 10% of normal even when Clomid
is used, so I don’t see evidence that it’s
doing anything for the testicles in that
regard. However, that doesn’t prove it
might not slow shrinkage anyhow even though
T production shutdown is not avoided. I don’t
think it makes a difference: haven’t seen it.
It could nonetheless have antigyno benefit,
benefit in terms of action on the muscles
(reduces exercised-induced injury), and some
may like its effect on mood, while most
will find that insignificant, and a few will
be bothered by it.
As for being a waste of money as an antiestrogen during the cycle, not so, because
it’s cheaper in that regard than Arimidex is.
Bill, thanks for your reply.
When I referred to clomid as a “waste of money” I only meant that in-so-far-as when arimidex is already being used, clomid provides little additional value.
Here’s my buddy’s stats and plan:
5’10", 175lbs. @ 13-14% bf. training for 3-4 years, seriously for the past 1.5.
Proposed cycle (10 weeks):
Injects: 500mg sust & 200mg deca / week (weeks 1-10)
Orals: d-bols 20mg / day (weeks 1-3.5)
Anti-e: Day 1- 1 Arimidex, then 1/4 tab / day (weeks 1-10); clomid: 50mg/day (weeks 9-13).
What do you think, both in terms of AAS dosage and anti-e? With that dosage of arimidex, would there be any benfit to 25mg/day of clomid for weeks 1-8?
Also, this is his first cycle. thanks for your help.
I think it’s a reasonable cycle in all respects.
The 25 mg/day Clomid (I’d use 50) would
at the usual prices be only 50 cents a day
I think. Or somewhere around there. Now if
one is very short of money then there is
a real question whether 50 cents per day
is “worth it,” whatever “it” is, but generally
when it’s only 50 cents, the question is,
is there a benefit or not.
Personally I think there is. If nothing
else, and this is a point I haven’t been
making often enough, I’ve realized, Clomid
in the blood tests I’ve seen has done a
good job, or at least there is the correlation,
of keeping blood lipid levels good in the
face of high androgens. It ought to be
worth the price just for that (unless quite
short of money.)
thanks for the advice bill, your help is much appreciated!