Q&A with Shadow Pro

Shadow_Pro · June 14, 2014, 6:26pm

[quote]MassEffect wrote:

[quote]Shadow Pro wrote:

[quote]MassEffect wrote:

[quote]Shadow Pro wrote:

[quote]MassEffect wrote:
Shadow Pro,

First of all - mad respect. I’ve been reading this thread since 1st post and I’m really enjoying learning from you. Thanks for doing this.

Background on me - 23y/o - Male- 220lbs - 6"1’ - under 15% bf - larger legs, moderate chest/uppers,. (leg day is forever the favorite)
I’ve been lifting for 6 years (on and off, more on than off). I’ve done a natural bodybuilding show (2) and I’ve even taken home a 1st place trophy (woo!).

Recently I’ve been all over the map with motivation after getting married and getting a hardcore deskjockey job. My wife got into fitness and has rekindled the fire I had for the sport when I was a teen. I’ve been toying around with the idea of trying for the physique class, most of those guys weight is around or under mine and I’m very symmetrical albeit leg heavy.

I have a bunch of questions, forgive me if I missed you answering some of these - I really did try to read everything you posted.

I’m stacking a ton of natty sups right now to boost test levels, Animal: Stak, M-Stak, Cellucor: P6 Red and P6 Black. I’m insanely strong on the right dose and its very noticable when I miss a dose. Along with damn near every animal supp in the line. I’ve gotten great results with them, but I feel like I’m hitting a wall and want to make more noticeable progress faster. Do you think these are a waste of money? In your experience has anyone ever benefited tremendously from using natty sups while on gear?

In addition to the test booster natty sups I’m taking Animal Cuts and Cellucors Super HD + CLK to help me drop weight.

I want to start rx to lean down aggressively and prep for a show without losing any size or strength. This will be my first cycle. I train 3x weekly (back/front/legs) +2 hours and cardio 3x weekly for roughly 500~1000kcal burned each time.
What kind of stack would you think could be a good way to help me achieve my goals (physique show) sometime late this year?

Thanks for taking time out of your day to contribute the knowledge you’ve gained over the years.
Mass[/quote]

Thank you for following, I’ll give you my ideas based on what you’ve told me. It would be great if you could post a photo so I can see where you’re at… It will make a difference otherwise I’m speculating on a starting point. Peoples ideas of REAL bf % are all over the map. Also, current diet please.

As for supplements. I’ve tried all of the big supplement brands products over the years and to be honest most of them are complete garbage… What concerns me the most about these is that the labels are very misleading in most cases. This brings me back to the point of why I am here in the first place… I discovered Biotest products long ago and it’s the only supplements I will ever spend my money on because they are actually working by themselves alone and even better when you combine them with prescription meds. For me and many clients & friends this has made a world of difference in my career. Obviously the site would never promote the use of steroids with product but I have experimented with all of the combinations and found crazy results and I will share my findings with you.

For adding lean muscle mass I like this new supplement called micro-pa, I gave it to a lot of my clients and over a 2 month period they got harder, stronger and gained a noticeable amount of muscle (some of them physique competitors) one of my female clients competes naturally and I honestly asked her if she was taking something behind my back because I never expected so much out of a supplement alone.
As for fat burners, I made a previous post about my favorites… Either go with an ECA stack, HOT-ROX, indigo. (clen & t3 for prescription choices). There is no product on the market like Indigo-3G,it just doesn’t exist and I find it extremely important especially pre contest to keep you full and allow you to keep your carb intake relatively high while still losing fat, I use it right up to the day of my show. For a natural test booster, I only use Alpha Male (during my pct). I don’t think supplements are a waste of money at all, you just need to pick and choose the right ones… The gear and the supps enhance eachother, I can’t imagine a prep without one or the other.

Now for the Rx questions:
For your first time cycle as a physique competitor (without seeing pics) I would suggest something like this:
Test-p 100mg EOD
Mast-p 100mg EOD
Anavar @60mg/day OR winstrol @ 50mg/day
Nolvadex 10mg/day
HCG 250iu every 3rd day

It’s very basic but as a first cycle it would work great for you. Please send pics first. It’s possible you can play around with Clen or t3 but for physique I don’t think you’ll have to go there, you can get hard and lean from non-rx supplements combined with your cycle.

[/quote]

Hey Shadow Pro,

Thanks again for replying! Thats very cool information and I am grateful to have it.
my diet looks like this (same thing every day)

6 egg white 2 yolks
1/2 cup oatmeal
10 almonds
teaspoon of honey
5oz lean ground beef

60g p shake

8oz chicken
1/2 cup veggies

60g p shake

10-8oz chicken or fish (fish on post workout days)
1cup white rice (post workout day)
1cup veggies

on workout days I add some carbs in before and after the workout. I don’t take any intra workout supplements and my pre is animal rage XL/Stak/MStak

I snapped a few pics and i have them uploaded to my onedrive - i shared them out for you here. http://1drv.ms/1lujW9O
just noticed I don’t have a chest shot lol, its not huge.

Thanks again for doing this. I really appreciate it.

[/quote]

First of all I need to say thank you for having the courage to post pictures here, not a lot of guys have done this yet. And for everyone reading please note that pictures are very important because I need to see with my own 2 eyes what I’m trying to work with.

I am not trying to be offensive what so ever but in order to help you I need to tell you the truth and what my thoughts are… Ok here go:

You mentioned that you are under 15% bodyfat. By looking at the pictures I have to say you are more like 15-20 and this is a problem when starting the cycle I suggested. First thing I want you to do is lower your bodyfat to around 10% naturally. A good way to see if you’re there is to be able to see somewhat clear definition throughout the whole body, and a more accurate way to do it would be with a DEXA/DXA scan and these are available in most major cities. The numbers won’t lie and you’ll see exactly where you’re at.

Wait on the cycle and invest in the supplements I suggested until your bodyfat is lowered and then we will reevaluate. Most importantly let’s get the indigo, ECA & HOT-ROX on the go. Change your cardio to 4-5 days/week to HIIT (sprints being my first choice) if you can get to a track, something like 80-100m sprint then 80-100m jog (repeat 8-10x) and obviously after a good warm up. It will not hurt leg size, if anything it will help. Do this for the next 8 weeks. If you want to get lean faster, eat your daily carbs ONLY in the workout from Plazma (for the 8 weeks before we reassess)

Meal 1 egg whites to 10, drop egg yolks, oatmeal and honey & drop ground beef to 4oz

Meal 2 lower protein to 1.5servings of MAG-10 (not regular protein shake)

Meal 3 replace chicken with white fish

Meal 4 1.5 servings of MAG-10

Meal 5 only 8 oz of chicken or fish (not 10)

Meal 6 will be your intraworkout Plazma (3 servings)

** keep the post workout white rice… So carbs will be coming from Plazma (114g), rice (50g), MAG-10(30g)

Take your fat burners pre-cardio…

Day you aren’t training, you can add one more protein meal(8oz steak) and 1tbsp mct oil and drop Plazma in those days so you’ll be low carbing on the off days.

When you get down to the desired bodyfat (minimum 10%) then we can talk about the cycle. Please keep me updated on how it goes.

[/quote]

Thanks for the critique, don’t worry my feels aren’t hurt to bad about the bf% thing, I’m terrible at guessing.

I’ll add in some more cardio (HIIT) and pick up those supplements.

Thanks for the diet, I’ll start up on that and let you know how it takes me.

MassE
[/quote]

Good call, I’m sure you’ll do great with the diet… Keep me posted and I’m here to help you along the way.

trenblood · June 14, 2014, 6:47pm

So even if you never had gyno, do you still recommend it to people or athlete to take nolvadex during cycle, or just the sensitive ones.

Ok let’s say i am on a cycle and suddenly i start getting gyno, what would be the best approach with out having to stop your cycle or lowering your dose, do you add nolvadex so it does not get worst and add a AI to fight it or there a other way?

thank you

Tweeder · June 14, 2014, 6:50pm

OK here we go…where do I start?

I believe I saw you mention taking orals pre workout and before bed. What are your thoughts behind taking them prior to bed?

NPP…what’s your opinion on it? Personally it is my favorite around 600mg but I will be trying more soon. If you dont have experience with it…I guess thoughts on deca will be ok but I’m hoping you have experience with NPP.

Pharma GH…how hard was it for you to secure a Pharma source? I have found some but I am shopping around.

Nolva dose…10mg on a bulk/offseason with approx a gram of test. Do you think that is too low to really be optimal?

SHBG and Proviron… first off what are your thoughts on Proviron? And if you were to try to knock down shbg to free up more test, would you choose something like Proviron @50mg or Winstrol @10 for a 12wk offseason. There are reports 10mg Winstrol knocks out shbg just as well as proviron. Add to that…its anabolic.

Dosing and down time. Lets say you were a fairly experienced user who cycled for 7 yrs…into your late 20s. 230lbs offseason 195 or so on stage. 1.5g of AAS were usually used and great results came from it. Then you take about 2.5yrs off…only cruising or being on nothing at all. When you start cycling again do you think you need less due to increased sensitivity? Do you start at 1.5g again? Do you up it a little?

Thanks

LMPCF · June 14, 2014, 7:28pm

[quote]Shadow Pro wrote:

[quote]LMPCF wrote:
Lol, immediatly after submitting my last post I have a new question for you.

I hear you saying a lot about Plazma, microPA and MAG-10 for the bodybuilders. I think that the plazma probably isnt a good idea for me because i do not want to get pumped during wods, thats death for every crossfit workout.

But what are you ideas on supplementation? Now I am taking:
Protein Isolate (throughout the day, just depends on how much protein I get from my meals)
Mixture of fast and slow release protein (dynamatize) (before bed)
Vitamine D3, (every morning 5000IU)
Multivitamins, Fish Oil (every morning and evening) (for the vitamins the regular dose is 3 pills a day, i take one morning, one evening)
ZMA (every evening)
I do have some pre workout but I only take this when I am during pure strength training, shit doesnt go well with endurance lol.

Any advice on this?

What you take on carbs or not. During my bodybuilding phase I ate over 800 grams of carbs a day (not 800 grams of rice, just 800 grams of pure carbs lol). This sounds crazy but I gained weight like crazy and dropped fat doing this (see image).

Since I am doing crossfit I have tried the paleo diet. Which means I can not have rice, pasta, outmeal or other carbsource except for fruit and vegetables. My calories constist mainly of fats and protein.

I havent really trained intensively on this diet so I dont know how I this diet effects me during that. I do however notice that I have gained some fat since (could also be because of the lower intensity training) even though I eat like 3000 calories less then i did. Carbs boost my already fast metabolism even more, especially because I time my meals perfectly each day.

Thanks bro![/quote]

You look great! I’m impressed with how lean you are and you are carrying a decent amount of muscle. For you to start a cycle right now would be a great idea, you will benefit very much from this especially considering your starting point. You will become much stronger, bigger, fuller and even harder than you already are.

These will be your new best friends regarding supplementation:
MAG-10 - the hydrolyzed casein is so much more effective than regular isolate protein, it’s making your body more responsive to protein and able to break down and absorb other types of protein more efficiently. It encourages muscle growth, prevents catabolism and seems to help the immune system. For a crossfitter who is doing a lot of endurance workout I would be sipping on this throughout the day and intra workout.
Micro-pa - improves strength and strength endurance. All of the benefits cater perfectly to a crossfit training program. 2 months after I started the micro-pa (only thing I changed) my deadlifts went from 405 for 8 reps to 405 for 15 reps. I felt improvement in my strength and endurance in most of my exercises. It allowed me to add extra reps on weights where I was previously stuck.

I would add a multimineral to my supplement stack, it’s another one of the best tools for recovery… I always do it post workout and keep the ZMA before bed. You can replace your multivitamin with superfood in the morning and for fish oil definitely keep it in there(Flameout is a good choice because it’s a good mix with excellent ratios)

Diet question: go back on high carbs, right now! If you were eating 800g of carbs and still gaining size and burning fat then your body’s insulin sensitivity is very good and your body type responds great to carbs. This is a great thing, most people would kill to have this trait. By the look of your picture and information you’ve given me I would say your diet should be high carbs and protein with low fat. Stay away from this paleo diet, it’s not for you… It will just hurt your training and your physique. Someone who is training with high intensity (like yourself) carbs are necessary especially when your body is reacting so well to them. Slowly bring your carbs back up and lower the fats. Have the majority of your carbs in the 6hour time frame around your workout. In your strength workouts where pump wouldn’t be an issue you can use a small serving amount of Plazma (1-2 servings) it will give you more fuel to lift heavier weights. You can also add indigo to help your body absorb all of the carbs and to stay very lean along with the cycle.

Your starting point is very good so I’m very interested to see the progress you make with the cycle combined with these supplements. Going back to a high carb diet will give you a huge jump in your performance and physique. Excited to see the results, keep us posted.
[/quote]

Thanks again or the quick reaction my man! Lots of respect for you and especially for the time you take to help not only me but everyone around here.

Thanks, I had been working really really hard on that physique. Only downside is that the picture was taking during my bodybuilding days over a year ago and since I have been rehabilitating and doing crossfit I have lost some of it. Have been getting back to intensity the past few weeks so I can see the shape coming back but it’ll definitely take me a while to get back completely. Only when I feel 100% again and start running into some plateus i think ill start the cycle you gave me.

Ill definitely start looking into the supplements you have adviced me. I hope they are available in the netherlands !

Thanks man, I reckoned carbs were the way to go for me for some time. Paleo is good for the stomach and the bloated feeling but I guess that feeling is not from the carbs themself but just from eating 100gr of (uncooked) rice every 2.5 hours (which is just too much).

Any advice on how to get loads of good carb calories in without having to munch down kilo’s of food. With kilo’s I litteraly mean KILOS. I had to up my calorie intake to the point of getting annoyed with how much I had to eat and I was still hungry. To give you an idea what I used to eat (all amounts are uncooked amounts):

07:30 100gr of some type of cereal (grain-based, low in sugar) with milk and 30gr of protein

10:00 100gr of brown rice, 100gr of chicken and some veggies(amount doesnt really matter to me as long as I get 300gr a day)

12:30 same as above

15:00 same as above

17:00 same as above

18:00 pre workout shake (with preworkout, protein and like 50-80 grams of short chain carbs, depending on my energy level)

WORKOUT like a god-damn crazy animal lol

20:30 post workout shake (100gr of oats, 40 grams of peanutbutter, 30 grams of protein and

23:00 pre-bed, dont remember if it was 75 grams of brinta (similar to oats, but not the same to keep it fun lol) and 40 grams of casein mix (fast and slow protein). Or if it was 50gr of peanutbutter and 40 grams of casein. Im doing peanutbutter right know because it keeps the hunger away at night.

(Just before getting injured I was even thinking about taking a shake at night lol)

I ate this way during bodybuilding style training (5-6 bb workouts per week and 2-3 times cardio) but now that I am crossfitting I guess ill be burning even more calories, which is gonna be hell to get them down.

Lots of thanks for your help and your positive attitude, I am now looking forward even more to restarting my crossfit career.

alvertos · June 14, 2014, 9:03pm

can you please rate my body?i will send more pics if you have the time!

doom44 · June 15, 2014, 12:08am

Hi Shadow, just want to ask your opinion. Do you think 4 weeks short cycle worth running ?

Shadow_Pro · June 15, 2014, 3:01am

[quote]trenblood wrote:
So even if you never had gyno, do you still recommend it to people or athlete to take nolvadex during cycle, or just the sensitive ones.

Ok let’s say i am on a cycle and suddenly i start getting gyno, what would be the best approach with out having to stop your cycle or lowering your dose, do you add nolvadex so it does not get worst and add a AI to fight it or there a other way?

thank you[/quote]

It depends on the dose you are using. Usually I would suggest to throw in 10mg as a precaution or 20mg if the dose is higher. If you suddenly notice symtoms of gyno there are a few things you can do: add another ai to the mix (such as arimidex) or increase the nolvadex. In a very bad case you can use femara.

Shadow_Pro · June 15, 2014, 3:30am

[quote]Tweeder wrote:
OK here we go…where do I start?

I believe I saw you mention taking orals pre workout and before bed. What are your thoughts behind taking them prior to bed?

NPP…what’s your opinion on it? Personally it is my favorite around 600mg but I will be trying more soon. If you dont have experience with it…I guess thoughts on deca will be ok but I’m hoping you have experience with NPP.

Pharma GH…how hard was it for you to secure a Pharma source? I have found some but I am shopping around.

Nolva dose…10mg on a bulk/offseason with approx a gram of test. Do you think that is too low to really be optimal?

SHBG and Proviron… first off what are your thoughts on Proviron? And if you were to try to knock down shbg to free up more test, would you choose something like Proviron @50mg or Winstrol @10 for a 12wk offseason. There are reports 10mg Winstrol knocks out shbg just as well as proviron. Add to that…its anabolic.

Dosing and down time. Lets say you were a fairly experienced user who cycled for 7 yrs…into your late 20s. 230lbs offseason 195 or so on stage. 1.5g of AAS were usually used and great results came from it. Then you take about 2.5yrs off…only cruising or being on nothing at all. When you start cycling again do you think you need less due to increased sensitivity? Do you start at 1.5g again? Do you up it a little?

Thanks[/quote]

-It’s not something you have to do, I just discovered over the years it feels the best for me to take it at these times and a lot or other friends and clients of mine do the same. I feel that it aids in my recovery and cases have shown some substances absorb better while the body is at rest. It’s also a good idea for forgetful people.

-NPP… I have used this a number of times and here my pros and cons. It’s decent for gaining mass, good for the joints, medium water retention and not very hard hard on the system. The downside of NPP and deca is the obvious one, it kills libido… The famous deca dick, it’s just not a side effect I enjoy. If I had a choice between this and eq, I’d always use EQ because it helps me with appetite, gives me more vascularity and doesn’t hurt libido. In my off season I’ll use one or the other and EQ usually wins the vote. In terms of strength gains, I don’t see a lot of improvement in the area. There are people who like it a lot and if this works for you then by all means do it as a secondary drug in a cycle.

took time to secure a source… I find it’s never readily available, so whenever it is the only trick I have is just to buy it all! You never know when it’s available again.
for 1g of test I would run 20mg of nolva from the start. I don’t think it will give you any negative effects and won’t hurt any gains but it will help to keep the unwanted sides away.
I LOVE PROVIRON … I’m actually surprised this is the first post about Proviron on this thread. I would definitely choose the Proviron @ 50mg over winstrol. In some cases I’ll go up to 100mg. Hany Rambod is a huge fan of it and most of his athletes are using it year round. I hear the reports that you speaking of regarding winstrol, I don’t think it makes that much of a difference… I always feel better on Proviron and it’s great for sex drive while winstrol is not. After trying them both for this purpose, I have to tell you that personal I’ll always choose Proviron.
after 2.5 years off/cruising… Start at a lower dose, I would say 1/2 of what you were doing. You will see great gains due to the increase in sensitivity. I just had a guy who went 2 years off gear (he used to do 2g/week) I put him back on 1g and now he’s the biggest and leanest he’s ever been. Save your money and your health and keep the high dosages for later.

Let me know if you have anymore questions.

trenblood · June 15, 2014, 3:32am

[quote]Shadow Pro wrote:

[quote]trenblood wrote:
So even if you never had gyno, do you still recommend it to people or athlete to take nolvadex during cycle, or just the sensitive ones.

Ok let’s say i am on a cycle and suddenly i start getting gyno, what would be the best approach with out having to stop your cycle or lowering your dose, do you add nolvadex so it does not get worst and add a AI to fight it or there a other way?

thank you[/quote]

It depends on the dose you are using. Usually I would suggest to throw in 10mg as a precaution or 20mg if the dose is higher. If you suddenly notice symtoms of gyno there are a few things you can do: add another ai to the mix (such as arimidex) or increase the nolvadex. In a very bad case you can use femara.
[/quote]

Sorry but what i am trying to say is if i am not using nolvadex or a AI and i start feeling gyno, what do you do jump on nolvadex to stop it from getting worst and add a AI or just add a AI.

Do most pro have there gyno removed or do the use the approach of nolvadex ?

thank you.

Shadow_Pro · June 15, 2014, 3:52am

[quote]LMPCF wrote: