[quote]Miserere wrote:
harhar wrote:
He often won when he had no business winning.
How does that happen? Surely he either made the lift or he didn’t. :-)[/quote]
The sequence is as follows:
1.power clean - front squat - 2 jerks
power clean - front squat - 2 jerks
power clean (miss) -hang clean - front squat 2 jerks.
TNT
[quote]TNT-CDN wrote:
Miserere wrote:
harhar wrote:
He often won when he had no business winning.
How does that happen? Surely he either made the lift or he didn’t. 
He misses the clean and brings the weight back to his waist and does an immediate hang clean. It’s so smooth you won’t notice it except it doesn’t fit into the routine he was doing.
TNT
[/quote]
I am not sure how that was a missed power clean, when he stood up straight with it. Wouldn’t it be kind of weird for him to miss a 140 power clean and then on the next set PC 160kg and then 170kg?
[quote]Miserere wrote:
harhar wrote:
He often won when he had no business winning.
How does that happen? Surely he either made the lift or he didn’t. :-)[/quote]
Read the rest of my post will ya? He’s good under pressure. But he was definately not the strongest guy in many of the competitions he was in.
[quote]CU AeroStallion wrote:
IL Cazzo wrote:
Odd to see him Split Jerking.
that’s OLD school son![/quote]
Help me out here, i’m new to Dimmas. Why is it odd to see him split-jerk? Does he prefer the power jerk or something?
[quote]harhar wrote:
Read the rest of my post will ya? He’s good under pressure. But he was definately not the strongest guy in many of the competitions he was in.[/quote]
Dude, take it easy! I did read the rest of your post, but this is O lifting we’re talking about, not football. He might not be as strong as other competitors, but if on the day of the meet he puts up more weight than them…then I’m sorry, but that means he is stronger than them. How else can you define strength?
[quote]nolecat wrote:
CU AeroStallion wrote:
IL Cazzo wrote:
Odd to see him Split Jerking.
that’s OLD school son!
Help me out here, i’m new to Dimmas. Why is it odd to see him split-jerk? Does he prefer the power jerk or something? [/quote]
Yes, in competition Dimas was a power jerker.
[quote]Miserere wrote:
harhar wrote:
Read the rest of my post will ya? He’s good under pressure. But he was definately not the strongest guy in many of the competitions he was in.
Dude, take it easy! I did read the rest of your post, but this is O lifting we’re talking about, not football. He might not be as strong as other competitors, but if on the day of the meet he puts up more weight than them…then I’m sorry, but that means he is stronger than them. How else can you define strength?[/quote]
Yipes. Dimas is cool! If he won the comp. than he’s the best, even if he wasn’t always the strongest in the gym.
[quote]TNT-CDN wrote:
Miserere wrote:
harhar wrote:
He often won when he had no business winning.
How does that happen? Surely he either made the lift or he didn’t.
The sequence is as follows:
1.power clean - front squat - 2 jerks
power clean - front squat - 2 jerks
power clean (miss) -hang clean - front squat 2 jerks.
TNT
[/quote]
He doesn’t miss, he had the first power clean. He just decided do a hang clean after he’d racked it. I know it doesn’t fit the sequence but a good weightlifter will train intuitively, rather than stick to an exact plan.
Harhar is more than right. His first Olympic win was weird. All three guys totaled the same, and the first two even weighed the same, Dimas got the gold only because he lifted the weight first. Is he a strong guy? Yes. Is he fast? Yes. Is he a great technician? No. Don’t let his speed fool you, he swings his torso back way too much on his extension and swings the bar out in front like a novice, he is not one to emulate when trying to learn the lifts.
I personally feel he gets more credit than is due him. He never snatched over 400lbs like Zlatev or Vardanyan did, nor totaled 400kgs. or more like these two and Purvy and I think Khrapaty have done (in the same or equivilant weight class). Hell, the guy’s best C&J in any meet is 215kg., this is less than the world record in the old 75kg category. He won his golds in a downtime period of the sport, but had he lifted against any of the guys I mentioned before he would’ve gotten spanked.
And don’t whine about the drug scene being different, I know what Dimas’s best training lifts were when in the off-season and freely doped and even then he still couldn’t have cut it. He was in the right place in the right time.
[quote]Galvatron wrote:
Harhar is more than right. His first Olympic win was weird. All three guys totaled the same, and the first two even weighed the same, Dimas got the gold only because he lifted the weight first. Is he a strong guy? Yes. Is he fast? Yes. Is he a great technician? No. Don’t let his speed fool you, he swings his torso back way too much on his extension and swings the bar out in front like a novice, he is not one to emulate when trying to learn the lifts.
I personally feel he gets more credit than is due him. He never snatched over 400lbs like Zlatev or Vardanyan did, nor totaled 400kgs. or more like these two and Purvy and I think Khrapaty have done (in the same or equivilant weight class). Hell, the guy’s best C&J in any meet is 215kg., this is less than the world record in the old 75kg category. He won his golds in a downtime period of the sport, but had he lifted against any of the guys I mentioned before he would’ve gotten spanked.
And don’t whine about the drug scene being different, I know what Dimas’s best training lifts were when in the off-season and freely doped and even then he still couldn’t have cut it. He was in the right place in the right time.[/quote]
Clearly you know a lot more about Olympic weightlifting than I do but geez, give the guy (Dimas) some credit. He’s won three Olympic gold medals and a bronze in four Olympic games… that can’t be a fluke. Longevity and persistence count a lot even if others have better all-time lifts. Where were the Bulgarians when Dimas won his three golds? He wasn’t competing against a bunch of schleps.
Galvatron,
From this and your other posts, it seems like you know quite a lot about competitive oly lifting.
Would you be willing to go into greater depth about the flaws in Dimas’s technique?
A more general question: In the Ironmind videos I have watched recently (the '94 and '95 worlds), there seems to be a lot of variation between lifters, even at the highest levels of competition.
Another of putting this is:
[quote]Galvatron wrote:
Harhar is more than right. His first Olympic win was weird. All three guys totaled the same, and the first two even weighed the same, Dimas got the gold only because he lifted the weight first. Is he a strong guy? Yes. Is he fast? Yes. Is he a great technician? No. Don’t let his speed fool you, he swings his torso back way too much on his extension and swings the bar out in front like a novice, he is not one to emulate when trying to learn the lifts.
[/quote]
Are you sure he won because he lifted the weight first? I thought if there was a tie in the weight lifted, the lifter with the lower bodyweight wins.
Does it really matter if he swings his torso back? Taner Sagir comes to mind when I think of leaning way back. You may be familiar with him, but here is a vid for those who may not be.
http://s37.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=1T7RC434QMKXU147RO1295H89W
I never really paid attention to him swinging the bar out front. Any chance this was at competition? Form during a competition isn’t usually the best time for form.
Rezazedah definitely doesn’t have the best technique, but is a damn freak anyway. I agree that when learning technique it isn’t always best to mimic a professional, but we can learn a lot from them. On the other hand, we really aren’t in a position to critique an elite lifter and their accomplishments.
[quote]Ross Hunt wrote:
Galvatron,
From this and your other posts, it seems like you know quite a lot about competitive oly lifting.
Would you be willing to go into greater depth about the flaws in Dimas’s technique?
A more general question: In the Ironmind videos I have watched recently (the '94 and '95 worlds), there seems to be a lot of variation between lifters, even at the highest levels of competition.
Another of putting this is:
There is an article in one of the Ironmind books that talks about the different starting positions for a clean/snatch for a lifter with a short torso and with a long torso. Pretty good read.
Actually, I have it right here.
September 2005, Volume 13, number 2. P.89
I can’t believe this is turning into a thread saying a 3 time gold medalist isn’t all that. One reason why the Dimas thread is so popular is that there aren’t many training vids for OL floating around the internet. If other lifter’s training vids circulated the same way, we would be in awe of them as well.
So, if you have some, share with us! hahahahah
[quote]Ross Hunt wrote:
Galvatron,
From this and your other posts, it seems like you know quite a lot about competitive oly lifting.
Would you be willing to go into greater depth about the flaws in Dimas’s technique?
A more general question: In the Ironmind videos I have watched recently (the '94 and '95 worlds), there seems to be a lot of variation between lifters, even at the highest levels of competition.
It’s safe to say that different tech’s are capable of making great lifts, as no one is perfect, some are just more efficient than others.
Another of putting this is:
I think the clean and jerk has the most forgiveness for technique varyingness (spelling?). I myself can switch at will between pulling with the arms straight during the explosive phase and bending the arms to allow the bar to hit the hips like in the snatch. Not a lot of people do this, and I don’t even do it a lot. I used to do this mainly to break through a plataue.
[quote]Clearly you know a lot more about Olympic weightlifting than I do but geez, give the guy (Dimas) some credit. He’s won three Olympic gold medals and a bronze in four Olympic games… that can’t be a fluke. Longevity and persistence count a lot even if others have better all-time lifts. Where were the Bulgarians when Dimas won his three golds? He wasn’t competing against a bunch of schleps.
[/quote]
I did give him credit. He’s strong and fast. No, he wasn’t competing against a bunch of schleps, just sub-par lifters. I don’t know but have my suspicions as to why there were no Bulgars capable of defeating him.
Galvatron,
Thanks. I never heard of that method before; maybe I will have occasion to use it someday.
Krollmonster,
Thanks.
[quote]Are you sure he won because he lifted the weight first? I thought if there was a tie in the weight lifted, the lifter with the lower bodyweight wins.
That is the case, but in this instance Dimas and the fellow who took silver both weighed the same and totaled the same, so Dimas won because he made the final total first.
Does it really matter if he swings his torso back?
Well, when you do chances are the bar is going to swing away from you, then you get play stop the radial momentum on top of catching it anyway. It is just making more work for yourself than need be, keeping the bar close is always more efficient.
I never really paid attention to him swinging the bar out front. Any chance this was at competition? Form during a competition isn’t usually the best time for form.
Again, his speed covers it to the untrained eye. Most guys don’t change form from practice to competition.
Rezazedah definitely doesn’t have the best technique, but is a damn freak anyway. I agree that when learning technique it isn’t always best to mimic a professional, but we can learn a lot from them. On the other hand, we really aren’t in a position to critique an elite lifter and their accomplishments.[/quote]
Reza Zedah is a freak and a half, one of the few modern-day lifters who could really give some of the all-time greats a run for the money. Critiqueing a lifters accomplishments is something that is fair to do. How many have wondered how Ali would fair against Tyson if both were in their primes? Is a team that barely wins time and time again really great when the whole league is composed of a lower-level of talent? This is how I see Dimas, I am just not as impressed as everyone else seems to be.
Well, both Chakarov and Khakiachvili are on that same tape, as well as Nerlinger powercleaning 200kg like a toy, and Weller snatching in increments of 50, 100, 150, 160, 170, 180, and lastly 190kg in the time of about ten minutes, but out of these only Chakarov’s legendary no-no-no squat is ever mentioned (I assume we are talking about the 1993 World Champs training hall tape).
Also, Dimas was split-jerking at that time due to an injury.
[quote]Krollmonster wrote:
I can’t believe this is turning into a thread saying a 3 time gold medalist isn’t all that. One reason why the Dimas thread is so popular is that there aren’t many training vids for OL floating around the internet. If other lifter’s training vids circulated the same way, we would be in awe of them as well.
So, if you have some, share with us! hahahahah[/quote]
Well who out of modern (1990+) olympic lifters would have records even in the old weight classes (why did they change them anyway?) Pirros Dimas is amazing. You say he didn’t have the best technique? Well for me that makes him even more amazing, 3 golds and a bronze despite that.
Naim S?leymano?lu is my favourite lifter. I definately think Bulgaria has produced the best male lifters especially in terms of its size as a country, Naim being probably the best (even though he lifted for Turkey). He should have won four golds but there was a boycott in one of them I think? 1984 games Soviet boycott.