Push-Ups Best For Chest?

Training
81

[quote]Schwarzfahrer wrote:
Jack,
The lats definitely get targeted when doing pushups. Ask anyone who has a profound academical knowledge regarding muscular physiology and sport. Do you really know what the lats are actually for, how they function?

A
[/quote]

The lats insert at the upper end of the humerus, so by design when the muscle contracts it pulls the humerus in a downward motion, much like a chinup, lat pulldown, etc movement.

I fail to see how they’re involved much if at all during a pushup.

82

FightingIrish 26 thanks for the info!

Mr Pushover, i mean Mr pushups i checked your stats 5’11 180lbs
and 6% bodyfat they’re quite impressive
for someone like you and it’s bull.
that would be saying you are in great shape looking like caveman…
this is a fun thread the most fun i had
since the MAG-10 troll thread.
keep up the good work!

83

Put two medicine balls about shoulder length apart. Start on the far left one and put your right hand on it with your left hand off. Do one and then move both hand on it and do a close gtip push up. Then move over and have your left hand on it and do one and then take both off of it, then do the same for the other medicine ball and after you do the left on right off, go back the other way.

84

[quote]Mr. Push Ups wrote:
Massif wrote:

For the actual question on this thread, yes, push ups and their variants are decent exercises, but for gaining mass and strength, the bench press and its variants are superior.

horseshit!

not for hypertrophy its not superior.
max loading and strength its superior
[/quote]

I have to agree somewhat. I have benched 370 now, but I would either use deep pushups or dumbell presses, or even a good machine, or crossovers to target the pecs if that were my goal. After using the bench as a power move for so many years, I don’t think I could just flip back to making it a pec exercise.

Also, I agree that pushups can be done to hit the lats somewhat. Lats are internal rotators, and also can be involved in a kind of shrugging motion at the end of a pushup, or press.

Now in all honesty you come off sounding like my 175 pound martial arts friend who swore to me that he could run a 4:30 mile, and deadlift 500, and it turned out he was running 1600 yards and he thought his 45s were 100 pounds each.

85

[quote]Jack Strummer wrote:
Headhunter wrote:

If you want to have pure power and only need to throw a few punches (such as in a bar fight), then benching is fine. However, realize that if you bench only, your body will not know how to best use this strength.

Best use it? What the fuck does that mean? I sense another “functional strength” war starting again. I use my bench strength EVERY time I bench. So unless you plan on bench pressing a UFC fighter to death, fuck off.

Your punches will be sloppy and uncoordinated. You must include pushups as a whole-body exercise. (Even better in this regard would be Burpees.)

Benching makes you sloppy and uncoordinated? Really? And push-ups, on the floor, the same motion as the bench, do differently? You’re idiot functional muscle theory makes me laugh. Punching skill and coordination comes from practice of the technique, not push-ups. If you concider push-ups a whole body exercise, you’re on the wrong site.

Another crossfit chump… How sad.

If your only goal is to ‘look tough’ and intimidating, then bench only. But don’t expect those pretty muscles to save you against a trained fighter.

Who the fuck “benches only” when they weight train? And when the fuck did this become UFC? This is a BB site pal, not some UFC crossfit hangout. We train to get bigger and stronger, not to do a few extra push-ups. You little fucks are pissing me off. I can’t believe your posts even get approved, all this damn nonsense should be setting off red flags everywhere.

You need to understand where the fuck you are. T-Nation, bodybuilding’s think-tank, NOT Bruce Lee’s asshole.
[/quote]

You are obviously a troll.
Go back to your fucking cave.
I can spot a fucktard a mile away…
Hmmm. I’ll bet I know where your cave
is. You think that you are so fucking subtle that no-one recognises you for who you are? I know you…sweet dreams.
Did you have fun?

Get a life.

86

[quote]grey wrote:
Jack Strummer wrote:
Headhunter wrote:

If you want to have pure power and only need to throw a few punches (such as in a bar fight), then benching is fine. However, realize that if you bench only, your body will not know how to best use this strength.

Best use it? What the fuck does that mean? I sense another “functional strength” war starting again. I use my bench strength EVERY time I bench. So unless you plan on bench pressing a UFC fighter to death, fuck off.

Your punches will be sloppy and uncoordinated. You must include pushups as a whole-body exercise. (Even better in this regard would be Burpees.)

Benching makes you sloppy and uncoordinated? Really? And push-ups, on the floor, the same motion as the bench, do differently? You’re idiot functional muscle theory makes me laugh. Punching skill and coordination comes from practice of the technique, not push-ups. If you concider push-ups a whole body exercise, you’re on the wrong site.

Another crossfit chump… How sad.

If your only goal is to ‘look tough’ and intimidating, then bench only. But don’t expect those pretty muscles to save you against a trained fighter.

Who the fuck “benches only” when they weight train? And when the fuck did this become UFC? This is a BB site pal, not some UFC crossfit hangout. We train to get bigger and stronger, not to do a few extra push-ups. You little fucks are pissing me off. I can’t believe your posts even get approved, all this damn nonsense should be setting off red flags everywhere.

You need to understand where the fuck you are. T-Nation, bodybuilding’s think-tank, NOT Bruce Lee’s asshole.

You are obviously a troll.
Go back to your fucking cave.
I can spot a fucktard a mile away…
Hmmm. I’ll bet I know where your cave
is. You think that you are so fucking subtle that no-one recognises you for who you are? I know you…sweet dreams.
Did you have fun?

Get a life.

[/quote]

Mr Push Ups???

87

[quote]Jack Strummer wrote:
Headhunter wrote:

If you want to have pure power and only need to throw a few punches (such as in a bar fight), then benching is fine. However, realize that if you bench only, your body will not know how to best use this strength.

Best use it? What the fuck does that mean? I sense another “functional strength” war starting again. I use my bench strength EVERY time I bench. So unless you plan on bench pressing a UFC fighter to death, fuck off.

Your punches will be sloppy and uncoordinated. You must include pushups as a whole-body exercise. (Even better in this regard would be Burpees.)

Benching makes you sloppy and uncoordinated? Really? And push-ups, on the floor, the same motion as the bench, do differently? You’re idiot functional muscle theory makes me laugh. Punching skill and coordination comes from practice of the technique, not push-ups. If you concider push-ups a whole body exercise, you’re on the wrong site.

Another crossfit chump… How sad.

If your only goal is to ‘look tough’ and intimidating, then bench only. But don’t expect those pretty muscles to save you against a trained fighter.

Who the fuck “benches only” when they weight train? And when the fuck did this become UFC? This is a BB site pal, not some UFC crossfit hangout. We train to get bigger and stronger, not to do a few extra push-ups. You little fucks are pissing me off. I can’t believe your posts even get approved, all this damn nonsense should be setting off red flags everywhere.

You need to understand where the fuck you are. T-Nation, bodybuilding’s think-tank, NOT Bruce Lee’s asshole.
[/quote]

We are on the same page. Reading some of these guy’s post you would think every gym in the world would be out of business because everyone would be turning into ultimate badass fighting machines by doing pushups at home.

They are a great supplement exercise, but to build mass, you need heavier weights that only come from benching. I’m sure some 8th grader is going to flame me for posting this.

88

get someone to sit on you shoulders when you do them, you’ll get bigger.

89

[quote]Jack Strummer wrote:
Headhunter wrote:

If you want to have pure power and only need to throw a few punches (such as in a bar fight), then benching is fine. However, realize that if you bench only, your body will not know how to best use this strength.

Best use it? What the fuck does that mean? I sense another “functional strength” war starting again. I use my bench strength EVERY time I bench. So unless you plan on bench pressing a UFC fighter to death, fuck off.

Your punches will be sloppy and uncoordinated. You must include pushups as a whole-body exercise. (Even better in this regard would be Burpees.)

Benching makes you sloppy and uncoordinated? Really? And push-ups, on the floor, the same motion as the bench, do differently? You’re idiot functional muscle theory makes me laugh. Punching skill and coordination comes from practice of the technique, not push-ups. If you concider push-ups a whole body exercise, you’re on the wrong site.

Another crossfit chump… How sad.

If your only goal is to ‘look tough’ and intimidating, then bench only. But don’t expect those pretty muscles to save you against a trained fighter.

Who the fuck “benches only” when they weight train? And when the fuck did this become UFC? This is a BB site pal, not some UFC crossfit hangout. We train to get bigger and stronger, not to do a few extra push-ups. You little fucks are pissing me off. I can’t believe your posts even get approved, all this damn nonsense should be setting off red flags everywhere.

You need to understand where the fuck you are. T-Nation, bodybuilding’s think-tank, NOT Bruce Lee’s asshole.
[/quote]

Man, you have got one bad attitude. This is an open discussion about the value of pushups. Who the fuck are you to tell anyone what to say? Where are the mods, dealing with slimeslingers like you, dirtbag?

Little? You twerp! I’m a 4th deg BB, 6’6", about 285. I’d mop the ring with you – guys like you are real good with the mouth, in the anonymity of the internet.

So, fuck off yourself, douchebag. I’ve read the rest of your posts and you are a true douche.

90

Anyone who thinks benching and pushups are the same is just completely wrong. The pushup works just about every muscle on the front of your body. Benching, when done correctly, adds mass to your upper body. But when you isolate your muscles, they will not learn how to function together. WTF’s the point of having a big, disfuctional chest? To get maximal development, whether for sport or whatever, you need the pushup. Otherwise, you’ve got just a big chest. Whoop-de-fuckin-do.

Didn’t someone write an article for T-Nation about how they could lift very heavy weights, but couldn’t help move furniture? A T-Man should not be ‘just’ a ‘pretty’ man, IMO.

If the goal of this site is to just be a big, dysfunctional oaf, then YES, I’m on the wrong site.

91

[quote]jehovasfitness wrote:
Schwarzfahrer wrote:
Jack,
The lats definitely get targeted when doing pushups. Ask anyone who has a profound academical knowledge regarding muscular physiology and sport. Do you really know what the lats are actually for, how they function?
[/quote]
A

If you don’t know how to do a real pushup and just drop to the floor, then no, the lats are not very involved.

When you do a pushup, try turning your fingertips away from each other as you push up. You won’t be able to do it, of course, but that twist will involve the lats.

[quote]
The lats insert at the upper end of the humerus, so by design when the muscle contracts it pulls the humerus in a downward motion, much like a chinup, lat pulldown, etc movement.

I fail to see how they’re involved much if at all during a pushup.[/quote]

92

[quote]Headhunter wrote:
Anyone who thinks benching and pushups are the same is just completely wrong. The pushup works just about every muscle on the front of your body. Benching, when done correctly, adds mass to your upper body. But when you isolate your muscles, they will not learn how to function together. WTF’s the point of having a big, disfuctional chest? To get maximal development, whether for sport or whatever, you need the pushup. Otherwise, you’ve got just a big chest. Whoop-de-fuckin-do.

Didn’t someone write an article for T-Nation about how they could lift very heavy weights, but couldn’t help move furniture? A T-Man should not be ‘just’ a ‘pretty’ man, IMO.

If the goal of this site is to just be a big, dysfunctional oaf, then YES, I’m on the wrong site.[/quote]

Watch it, HH. That dummy you just spat could take out someone’s eye:)

I don’t believe anyone here said only bench and ignore everything else.

Deadlifts would be better for moving furniture.

If someone is training to fight, then they should be using weight training for getting stronger (ie bench), and should be using actual fight training for fight training. The point would be to get stronger (weight training) and then learn how to use this in a fight (fight training).

Does all that make sense?

93

[quote]Headhunter wrote:
Anyone who thinks benching and pushups are the same is just completely wrong. The pushup works just about every muscle on the front of your body. Benching, when done correctly, adds mass to your upper body. But when you isolate your muscles, they will not learn how to function together. WTF’s the point of having a big, disfuctional chest? To get maximal development, whether for sport or whatever, you need the pushup. Otherwise, you’ve got just a big chest. Whoop-de-fuckin-do.

Didn’t someone write an article for T-Nation about how they could lift very heavy weights, but couldn’t help move furniture? A T-Man should not be ‘just’ a ‘pretty’ man, IMO.

If the goal of this site is to just be a big, dysfunctional oaf, then YES, I’m on the wrong site.[/quote]

Careful with that “functional strength” stuff. You stray into the world of bullshit advertising when those words get put together.

I agree that pushups and bench press are very different. I dig doing pushups, of course, but I don’t understand, and may never understand, why a pushup makes you more “functional” then a bench press.

Honestly, I very rarely, if ever, have to do a serious pressing movement in real life.

Like Massif said, deadlifts are far more “functional” than either pushups or a bench press. The “strongest” guys I’ve seen in everyday life are the guys who just have thick ass legs (this goes back to what I said on another thread about blue collar workingman strength. Its in the legs and the ass). Good mornings also would seem to be more functioal also.

Its rare that I have to push something that is giving me 250 lbs of pressure back. However, I have to lift more shit that ways upwards of 300 pounds than I can tell you. Pushups, bench, curls, and military presses don’t help me there. Deadlifts, good mornings, and squats are far more “functional”.

94

I wanted to add this:

Latissimus Dorsi
Other Names
Back (Outer)
Lats
Heads
Latissimus Dorsi
Movement
Shoulder

Adduction
Extension
Internal Rotation
Transverse Extension

Scapula (Assists)
Depression
Downward Rotation
Adduction
Attachments
Origin

Ilium
Posterior Crest
Sacrum (Posterior)
Vertebral Column (Lateral Surface)
Lumbar Vetebrae (L1-5)
Thoracic Vetebrae (T7-12)
Ribs (Posterior)
Lower 3 or 4 ribs
Insertion

Humerus (Proximal Anterior/Medial)
Intertubercular Groove (Medial Side)

There are actually 4 ways that the lats are involved in bench pressing, in my opinion.

  1. Adduction of the scapula through the shoulder joint. If you really bench heavy, you need to keep your elbows in tight, but they have a natural tendancy to move apart with a heavy load. In other words, the lats keep the scapula from flaring out under a heavy weight. They also depress and cause downward scapular rotation keeping your shoulders “wedged” under the bar properly.

  2. They directly adduct the humerus, ie pulling the humeri together.

  3. They help maintain a tight arch in the upper back by extending (slightly hyperextending) the spine.

4)They actively push the humeri up (forward) at the start of the bench press because when they flex, they put direct pressure on the triceps which rest, in part, on the “lat shelf”

It may not seem like much, but I think that the direct pressure effect can push the bar up the first 2-3 inches, and when your power stroke is only 6-7 inches, that is a lot-especially if they give you speed to spare at that point.

95

I’m having trouble believing the notion that people magically become uncoordinated because they are benching.

96

I don’t really care for all that functional strength talk either, but I firmly believe that I could gain more pure mass with pushups, dips, pullups, inverted rows, bulgarian squats, glute ham raises and pikes all with bodyweight, than by doing strictly PLs. I would certainly have to add weight after 4-5 workouts, but that’s the way I would go. I may be wrong but that is what I would do.

Also, I remember reading several articles that showed that there is more muscle activation/less inhibition when using lifts in which the body actually moves through space.

Oh, and I don’t curl or directly train biceps, but talk to strongmen and you find out that curls are very useful for lifting heavy things.

97

Please be part of the majority AND CONTRIBUTE TO THE THREAD TOPIC.

This will make the thread much more valuable for information.

Thank You!

98

This thread is hilarious. First, Mr Push Ups goes overboard on a rampage like he usually does. Then, he mysteriously leaves and Jack takes his place being the psycho. And now, Push Ups is back, but strangely more mellow. This Mr Push Ups doesn’t seem to be acting like a troll anymore, so I’m going to go ahead and follow his advice.

I routinely add explosive push-ups in between sets of my bench or standing press work… this all was inspired by Dan John’s One Lift a Day article ( http://www.T-Nation.com/readTopic.do?id=483048 ). I do the same sort of thing with squats (10 high knees jumps) and deadlifts or other back work (5 pull-ups, varying grips between workouts). I do it more to keep intensity up than the idea that this in itself will add muscle, but I definitely believe that the push-ups are one of many useful tools you can use to keep a workout interesting and at a high intensity. In fact, the main thing I took away from CrossFit was that the standard bodybuilding routine is way too low intensity, and this can easily be remedied with a little creativity. And that just might mean using ‘pussy’ exercises like push-ups.

99

Wow, I feel like I started a war.haha. I think most people took my post the wrong way. I am in no way only planning on doing push ups. I am only adding push ups to my training by doing them every few hours throughout the day, and doing my normal work outs as well. I remember an article on here, I forget the name but it specifically talked about doing certain bodyweight or other exercises like that throughout the day along with your training. I did this same thing with pull-ups and got great results. I’m just looking to do the same thing with push-ups, get some exta capilaries invloved and all that good stuff.

100

[quote]Brain Monster wrote:
Wow, I feel like I started a war.haha. I think most people took my post the wrong way. I am in no way only planning on doing push ups. I am only adding push ups to my training by doing them every few hours throughout the day, and doing my normal work outs as well. I remember an article on here, I forget the name but it specifically talked about doing certain bodyweight or other exercises like that throughout the day along with your training. I did this same thing with pull-ups and got great results. I’m just looking to do the same thing with push-ups, get some exta capilaries invloved and all that good stuff.[/quote]

I’ve heard this called GTG (Grease the Groove). Basically, you just crank out push-ups (or whatever) throughout the day, often to achieve a specific total(ie: 1000). I used to do this kind of stuff back when I was like 14, and, hey, it’s better than sitting on the couch. A lot of people do the same thing with pull-up bars or doorways in their home for pull-ups, so I don’t see why anyone should object to doing this as long as push-ups aren’t your primary fitness program.