Pulse Feast / LeanGains Principles

Mateus: I ate a bit more on the workout days (4) and a bit less on non-workout days (3). This comes naturally as I am hungrier on workout days.

Let me say that the advantages of IF lie mostly in eating convenience. (I discovered this myself on busy mornings.) I have no objections to someone saying this method enables an easier lifestyle or better long-term compliance. However:

Toohard: I agree with your observations. I do not believe that IF confers any advantages regarding body comp not otherwise attainable–equally–by more traditional caloric or macronutrient manipulation. Discipline is the thing in any approach–and has always been.

There is a lot of talk about eating more stuff post-workout. I don’t think that matters much either. People putting up photos with claims attached, mean nothing to me-- for many reasons.

Regarding peri-nutrition, I am no longer sure that this matters much either. Heresy, I know. Now, I still do my post-workout protein drink out of preference. BUT, my opinion is that if one consumed all the peri-workout nutrition (extra calories plus protein) at some other time of day, the resulting bodycomp would be identical. Why? because the same calories and nutrients were taken in. And food takes many hours to digest.

99% of what happens comes down to basic stuff. Problem is that is not a ‘new’ or therefore marketable notion. For example, Rippetoe’s article, even in its edited form, would lead to similar conclusions about the basics: train hard with barbells; sleep; recover; eat extra protein, and calories to support recovery. Use whole foods to do that. Done. Wendler stresses the same thing with his approach. Most of the detail peripherals is what folks write articles about, and argue about, but all that fiddly stuff is as nothing compared with the ‘boring basics’. That should be good news–liberating even-- but folks keep looking for miracles in the fiddly stuff.

[quote]Roygion wrote:
Mateus: I ate a bit more on the workout days (4) and a bit less on non-workout days (3). This comes naturally as I am hungrier on workout days.

Let me say that the advantages of IF lie mostly in eating convenience. (I discovered this myself on busy mornings.) I have no objections to someone saying this method enables an easier lifestyle or better long-term compliance. However:

Toohard: I agree with your observations. I do not believe that IF confers any advantages regarding body comp not otherwise attainable–equally–by more traditional caloric or macronutrient manipulation. Discipline is the thing in any approach–and has always been.

There is a lot of talk about eating more stuff post-workout. I don’t think that matters much either. People putting up photos with claims attached, mean nothing to me-- for many reasons.

Regarding peri-nutrition, I am no longer sure that this matters much either. Heresy, I know. Now, I still do my post-workout protein drink out of preference. BUT, my opinion is that if one consumed all the peri-workout nutrition (extra calories plus protein) at some other time of day, the resulting bodycomp would be identical. Why? because the same calories and nutrients were taken in. And food takes many hours to digest.

99% of what happens comes down to basic stuff. Problem is that is not a ‘new’ or therefore marketable notion. For example, Rippetoe’s article, even in its edited form, would lead to similar conclusions about the basics: train hard with barbells; sleep; recover; eat extra protein, and calories to support recovery. Use whole foods to do that. Done. Wendler stresses the same thing with his approach. Most of the detail peripherals is what folks write articles about, and argue about, but all that fiddly stuff is as nothing compared with the ‘boring basics’. That should be good news–liberating even-- but folks keep looking for miracles in the fiddly stuff.[/quote]

Extremely well put.

I also find the 16/8 approach easier to stay with for a few reasons:

Don’t like most breakfast foods.
Busy as hell in the morning.
Get to eat bigger meals with family.

I am under no impressions that it leads to better nutrient partitioning or will extend my life.

[quote]ADvanced TS wrote:

I also find the 16/8 approach easier to stay with for a few reasons:

Don’t like most breakfast foods.
Busy as hell in the morning.
Get to eat bigger meals with family.

I am under no impressions that it leads to better nutrient partitioning or will extend my life. [/quote]

It is always a relief to hear rational thinking like this.

[quote]ADvanced TS wrote:

[quote]Roygion wrote:
Mateus: I ate a bit more on the workout days (4) and a bit less on non-workout days (3). This comes naturally as I am hungrier on workout days.

Let me say that the advantages of IF lie mostly in eating convenience. (I discovered this myself on busy mornings.) I have no objections to someone saying this method enables an easier lifestyle or better long-term compliance. However:

Toohard: I agree with your observations. I do not believe that IF confers any advantages regarding body comp not otherwise attainable–equally–by more traditional caloric or macronutrient manipulation. Discipline is the thing in any approach–and has always been.

There is a lot of talk about eating more stuff post-workout. I don’t think that matters much either. People putting up photos with claims attached, mean nothing to me-- for many reasons.

Regarding peri-nutrition, I am no longer sure that this matters much either. Heresy, I know. Now, I still do my post-workout protein drink out of preference. BUT, my opinion is that if one consumed all the peri-workout nutrition (extra calories plus protein) at some other time of day, the resulting bodycomp would be identical. Why? because the same calories and nutrients were taken in. And food takes many hours to digest.

99% of what happens comes down to basic stuff. Problem is that is not a ‘new’ or therefore marketable notion. For example, Rippetoe’s article, even in its edited form, would lead to similar conclusions about the basics: train hard with barbells; sleep; recover; eat extra protein, and calories to support recovery. Use whole foods to do that. Done. Wendler stresses the same thing with his approach. Most of the detail peripherals is what folks write articles about, and argue about, but all that fiddly stuff is as nothing compared with the ‘boring basics’. That should be good news–liberating even-- but folks keep looking for miracles in the fiddly stuff.[/quote]

Extremely well put.

I also find the 16/8 approach easier to stay with for a few reasons:

Don’t like most breakfast foods.
Busy as hell in the morning.
Get to eat bigger meals with family.

I am under no impressions that it leads to better nutrient partitioning or will extend my life. [/quote]

Great discussion guys, I was wondering what your thoughts are about the theory that IF (16/8)will give your insulin receptors a brake for 16 hour fasting period and thus mitigate burnout and possibly even increase insulin sensitivity during the 8 hour feeding window?

[quote]justinb19 wrote:
Great discussion guys, I was wondering what your thoughts are about the theory that IF (16/8)will give your insulin receptors a brake for 16 hour fasting period and thus mitigate burnout and possibly even increase insulin sensitivity during the 8 hour feeding window?[/quote]

Some of the research is as good as excersice/diet research gets. Fasting probably does have some benefits such as better blood glucose, insulin sensitivity, nutrient partioning like the studies suggest.

But as usual research is just a piece of paper and the big picture is more complicated than that. While it may improve some of those values it certainly wont do that if you eat complete shit all the time. So again I’d say other things (such as quality of your food) are more important than the diet approach itself.

After doing the warrior diet before, and currently being on pulse feasting; I’ve concluded that:

1.) The majority of the benefits of the diet in terms of fat loss are simply from a calorie deficit.

2.) The diet “re-programs” you to not be hungry every 3 hours which makes dieting easier.

3.) The diet is convenient for big eaters. Those who can easily put down 2-3K calories.

4.) You can still gain/maintain your weight on this style diet. (I’ve done it)

5.) This diet is more of a lifestyle change. It frees up a lot of time throughout the day, which makes me more productive.

(These are my opinions and observations backed by 0 scientific evidence)

James: Good points. For bodcomp changes, which is the reason why folks try these things, your #1 basically says it. The rest are all reasonable assumptions that would then guide one’s preference.

I’ve been following an IF diet for 5.5 weeks. I eat around 2200-2600 cal a day (40P/30C/30F) and take 2 pulses of MAG-10. I am also taking 4 HOT-ROX pills a day for the last 7 days. I started at 200 and am now 190. I am incredibly frustrated.

I work out 4 days a week following 5/3/1 and also run a sled and sprints 1-2 days a week.

I have lost a gratuitous amount of strength and size on this diet. I also don’t feel like I’m loosing much fat.

Any suggestions? Is it too early to notice significant fat loss? Am I just mental from being on a calorie restricted diet? Has anyone had similar experiences?

Thanks for input,
JK

[quote]James Keeton wrote:
I’ve been following an IF diet for 5.5 weeks. I eat around 2200-2600 cal a day (40P/30C/30F) and take 2 pulses of MAG-10. I am also taking 4 HOT-ROX pills a day for the last 7 days. I started at 200 and am now 190. I am incredibly frustrated.

I work out 4 days a week following 5/3/1 and also run a sled and sprints 1-2 days a week.

I have lost a gratuitous amount of strength and size on this diet. I also don’t feel like I’m loosing much fat.

Any suggestions? Is it too early to notice significant fat loss? Am I just mental from being on a calorie restricted diet? Has anyone had similar experiences?

Thanks for input,
JK
[/quote]

Whoa. you’re 6’ 3" doing 5/3/1 and sled/sprints on off days and ONLY eating 2200 - 2600 calories?!?!

Maybe you’re losing strength because your deficit is huge? Just for comparison, I work an office job and my activity is alternating upper / lower body workout Sun/tue/thurs usually. My “cardio” is sprinting up stairs in the mornings at work and some light walking. I’m HOLDING strength, getting leaner and managing to hold weight. I estimate that my maintenance level is 2600 calories (at just under 6’ and 175 lbs).

I think the key is to cycle your calories and not eat too far under maintenance on heavy training days. For example, on workout days, I target 2300 cals with at least 50% calories occuring post workout. On off days I target 1900 to 2100 cals. So my weekly deficit is around 3200 calories.

Take it easy. don’t rush, be a little patient. Better to go slower on fat loss and keep muscle. Also, what metrics are you using to determine fat loss? I got a little frustrated when my waist measurement and weight stuck, but then I realized that I was getting leaner in my legs and butt. I didn’t actually realize this till my wife commented about my “new leg muscles” even though my squat and deadlift numbers hadn’t gone up. You may be losing fat from areas that you weren’t expecting.

Also, maybe IF isn’t for you. For me, it works well because I’m at a desk most of the day.

[quote]ds1973 wrote:

[quote]James Keeton wrote:
I’ve been following an IF diet for 5.5 weeks. I eat around 2200-2600 cal a day (40P/30C/30F) and take 2 pulses of MAG-10. I am also taking 4 HOT-ROX pills a day for the last 7 days. I started at 200 and am now 190. I am incredibly frustrated.

I work out 4 days a week following 5/3/1 and also run a sled and sprints 1-2 days a week.

I have lost a gratuitous amount of strength and size on this diet. I also don’t feel like I’m loosing much fat.

Any suggestions? Is it too early to notice significant fat loss? Am I just mental from being on a calorie restricted diet? Has anyone had similar experiences?

Thanks for input,
JK
[/quote]

Whoa. you’re 6’ 3" doing 5/3/1 and sled/sprints on off days and ONLY eating 2200 - 2600 calories?!?!

Maybe you’re losing strength because your deficit is huge? Just for comparison, I work an office job and my activity is alternating upper / lower body workout Sun/tue/thurs usually. My “cardio” is sprinting up stairs in the mornings at work and some light walking. I’m HOLDING strength, getting leaner and managing to hold weight. I estimate that my maintenance level is 2600 calories (at just under 6’ and 175 lbs).

I think the key is to cycle your calories and not eat too far under maintenance on heavy training days. For example, on workout days, I target 2300 cals with at least 50% calories occuring post workout. On off days I target 1900 to 2100 cals. So my weekly deficit is around 3200 calories.

Take it easy. don’t rush, be a little patient. Better to go slower on fat loss and keep muscle. Also, what metrics are you using to determine fat loss? I got a little frustrated when my waist measurement and weight stuck, but then I realized that I was getting leaner in my legs and butt. I didn’t actually realize this till my wife commented about my “new leg muscles” even though my squat and deadlift numbers hadn’t gone up. You may be losing fat from areas that you weren’t expecting.

Also, maybe IF isn’t for you. For me, it works well because I’m at a desk most of the day.[/quote]

Good points man. Thanks for the reality check. You’re probably right, my calories are low. For the last 4 years, I’ve never been good at the cutting weight thing. Probably cause I dive in balls deep too fast.

The lifestyle of IF works great for me b/c I’m in classes all day. However, I lift in the morning and “Feast” at night, which could be resisting muscle retention.

I’ll take a breath and wait it out.

Thanks,
JK

[quote]James Keeton wrote:

The lifestyle of IF works great for me b/c I’m in classes all day. However, I lift in the morning and “Feast” at night, which could be resisting muscle retention.

I’ll take a breath and wait it out.

Thanks,
JK
[/quote]

I could see where this could be a problem. Go to martins leangains site and click on “Most Popular”, then select “The Leangains Guide”. He’s got various scenarios laid out. If you work out in the AM, the best you may get is to follow his “fasted” workout advice. Basically, for a 6 AM training session, consume 10 g BCAAs pre, and then 10 grams BCAA at 1 hour and 3 hour post workout, followed by a large meal at noon. You could use MAG-10 instead of BCAAs too.

[quote]ds1973 wrote:

[quote]James Keeton wrote:

The lifestyle of IF works great for me b/c I’m in classes all day. However, I lift in the morning and “Feast” at night, which could be resisting muscle retention.

I’ll take a breath and wait it out.

Thanks,
JK
[/quote]

I could see where this could be a problem. Go to martins leangains site and click on “Most Popular”, then select “The Leangains Guide”. He’s got various scenarios laid out. If you work out in the AM, the best you may get is to follow his “fasted” workout advice. Basically, for a 6 AM training session, consume 10 g BCAAs pre, and then 10 grams BCAA at 1 hour and 3 hour post workout, followed by a large meal at noon. You could use MAG-10 instead of BCAAs too.[/quote]

Would it be crazy to consume my large meal post workout at 8am? Then have the two BCAA/Mag-10s at 2pm and 7pm?

Extremely annoyed that someone coined “The Warrior Diet”. If so many people are doing this warrior shit, it means no one is getting killed. Good fail.

[quote]solidkhalid wrote:
Extremely annoyed that someone coined “The Warrior Diet”. If so many people are doing this warrior shit, it means no one is getting killed. Good fail.[/quote]

“Warrior Diet” simply means eating like a warrior supposedly would which is what the ebook lays out along with a workout to complement the diet. Specifically the ebook focuses on the supposed diet of a Roman warrior and how to apply it - I don’t think it’s fully accurate however it’s a great title.

I think you got the word “diet” mixed up with “training”. If the ebook were titled, “Warrior Training for Deadly Combat” then perhaps your comment may have made more sense and we’d be more understanding of why you’re extremely annoyed. After all, why would a book about diet involve having to kill or get killed whether the title includes warrior or not?

It implies its for warriors, and if there are so many warriors doing this warrior diet, they arent really warriors since they clearly aren’t killing eachother.

Yeah, Martin Berkhan isn’t exactly huge looking but looks damn impressive still.

No breakfast required


and last

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