Profiling

[UtahLama]

[quote]lucasa wrote:

[quote]UtahLama wrote:

That’s ONE HISPANIC gang among 1000’s

Just using them as an example.[/quote]

You got me. I’m entirely unaware of the beakdown, by race, of the tens of thousands of gangs in this country. What portion of the Hispanic population criminally violent and/or actively gang affiliated? 10%? 20%? 60%?. Are there more hispanic gang members or officers ‘of the peace’? Any evidence that racial profiling prevents more crimes/problems than it causes (Henry Louis Gates arrest controversy - Wikipedia)?

I do know that the FBI is concerned about preppers, nationalists, and constitutionalists with regard to domestic terrorism. Given the misguided, ham-handed, and ineffective profiling being done in this regard; I can only believe that they are or have been no more effective in the past. Do Malvo and Muhammed, being serial killers, count as part of the white community for which the white folks are responsible? Should Chuck Moose have excused himself because he was black?

I know from the overwhelmingly white neighborhoods that I grew up in, plenty of what is/was written off as ‘boys will be boys’ would be gang-related and/or domestic terrorism in more modern society.[/quote]

I see your point, I grew up in a 80% Hispanic neighborhood in Fresno CA…home to the Bulldog gang, one of the most violent in the state.

Fresno Bulldogs

The police actively profiled people who they thought might be members…did some outliers get harassed? Maybe, but if they did not take aggressive action that gang would be running the damn city.

I did not really care, I was too busy trying not to get beat the fuck up for being white.

[SkyzykS]

[quote]Chushin wrote:
I’m curious about something, X.

Do you believe that the (real and accurate) per capita crime rate is higher among blacks than among whites in the US, or that that question is unanswerable?[/quote]

This is an interesting one that I’ll venture a guess to.

I think that the actual per capita is higher among whites, but for a variety of reasons, they are either not caught or not convicted.

I avoided a bust once by being tipped off indirectly by the chief of the task force. There was a lot of activity that was being observed by the police at my house. One of my friends fathers was good friends/fishing buddies with the chief. The chief tells his buddy to tell his son not to be at my house on Wednesday or he’s going to be in a lot of trouble. So buddy tells son, who promptly heads over and tells me. I clear everything out and the bust is averted.

Now I know that is just one example but there are tons more that I’ve heard of that are similar. It’s like a built in social function and privilege to protect the “good kids” that no one wants to see anything bad happen to.

Can’t really speak to how it may go down for other races though. I’ve only ever been this one.

[Professor_X]

[quote]SkyzykS wrote:

[quote]Chushin wrote:
I’m curious about something, X.

Do you believe that the (real and accurate) per capita crime rate is higher among blacks than among whites in the US, or that that question is unanswerable?[/quote]

This is an interesting one that I’ll venture a guess to.

I think that the actual per capita is higher among whites, but for a variety of reasons, they are either not caught or not convicted.

I avoided a bust once by being tipped off indirectly by the chief of the task force. There was a lot of activity that was being observed by the police at my house. One of my friends fathers was good friends/fishing buddies with the chief. The chief tells his buddy to tell his son not to be at my house on Wednesday or he’s going to be in a lot of trouble. So buddy tells son, who promptly heads over and tells me. I clear everything out and the bust is averted.

Now I know that is just one example but there are tons more that I’ve heard of that are similar. It’s like a built in social function and privilege to protect the “good kids” that no one wants to see anything bad happen to.

Can’t really speak to how it may go down for other races though. I’ve only ever been this one.
[/quote]

It is things like this which are a part of what is “institutional racism”…something that society created over many generations.

Unless he is saying that skin color makes one more prone for certain activities like crime, relating skin color to crime rates alone is not looking at the real situation.

It is scape-goating and finger pointing with a racial undertone.

[drunkpig]

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]SkyzykS wrote:

[quote]Chushin wrote:
I’m curious about something, X.

Do you believe that the (real and accurate) per capita crime rate is higher among blacks than among whites in the US, or that that question is unanswerable?[/quote]

This is an interesting one that I’ll venture a guess to.

I think that the actual per capita is higher among whites, but for a variety of reasons, they are either not caught or not convicted.

I avoided a bust once by being tipped off indirectly by the chief of the task force. There was a lot of activity that was being observed by the police at my house. One of my friends fathers was good friends/fishing buddies with the chief. The chief tells his buddy to tell his son not to be at my house on Wednesday or he’s going to be in a lot of trouble. So buddy tells son, who promptly heads over and tells me. I clear everything out and the bust is averted.

Now I know that is just one example but there are tons more that I’ve heard of that are similar. It’s like a built in social function and privilege to protect the “good kids” that no one wants to see anything bad happen to.

Can’t really speak to how it may go down for other races though. I’ve only ever been this one.
[/quote]

It is things like this which are a part of what is “institutional racism”…something that society created over many generations.

Unless he is saying that skin color makes one more prone for certain activities like crime, relating skin color to crime rates alone is not looking at the real situation.

It is scape-goating and finger pointing with a racial undertone.[/quote]

Institutional racism - much like institutional poverty - is a government construct. Most particularly, LBJ’s Great Society of the mid-60’s.

We didn’t need a war on crime or a war on drugs before LBJ, did we? Because of the Great Society, we have more crimes on the books, and more ‘criminals’ in prison than ever before. It was the slickest trade of money-for-freedom in history.

Before the federal government removed any need for the black male - or any other lower class male for that matter - in society, the racial disparity in prison population versus general population was largely non-existent compared to today. I would venture to say that the socio-economic representation in prisons are almost void of upper-class offenders.

[Professor_X]

[quote]drunkpig wrote:

Institutional racism - much like institutional poverty - is a government construct. Most particularly, LBJ’s Great Society of the mid-60’s.
[/quote]

No, it is a social construct…determined by human interaction and bias.

One man is not responsible for the mindset of a country.

Human beings hate…it is what we do.

An enlightened society acknowledges that bias exists but does not condone it.

[MaximusB]

Pitbull,

The war on drugs is not racist.

It’s about $$$.

If you wanted to “declare war” on something in the attempts of cleaning up society, when the truth is it’s more about funding the prison industrial complex, as well as the judicial system, you declare war on the most commonly used/abused act known to man…pot.

If you declared war on rape, or child molestation, our prisons would be filled with only a fraction of the number we currently have incarcerated.

In the Feds, maybe 65% of those locked up are for non-violent drug offenses, of which are usually associated with pot. Then you have rehab programs, probation, counselors, and other minutia that requires more funding.

The prison/judicial machine is FAR too large of a lobby and industry to try to reduce. WAY too much money for many involved, and it will never end.

[pittbulll]

[quote]MaximusB wrote:
Pitbull,

The war on drugs is not racist.

It’s about $$$.
[/quote]

WE agree on the second part but how do explain that the same amount of people per capita of white and black smoke pot but 4 times as many black people get arrested per capita than do whites ?

[drunkpig]

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]drunkpig wrote:

Institutional racism - much like institutional poverty - is a government construct. Most particularly, LBJ’s Great Society of the mid-60’s.
[/quote]

No, it is a social construct…determined by human interaction and bias.

One man is not responsible for the mindset of a country.

Human beings hate…it is what we do.

An enlightened society acknowledges that bias exists but does not condone it.
[/quote]

Racism is a social construct - I agree. But institutional racism can only be a government construct.

There’s a difference. If it were truly a social construct, we would be much further down the road to enlightenment. Being that the government and the people willingly exchange freedom for money on a monthly basis - we are not.

[drunkpig]

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]MaximusB wrote:
Pitbull,

The war on drugs is not racist.

It’s about $$$.
[/quote]

WE agree on the second part but how do explain that the same amount of people per capita of white and black smoke pot but 4 times as many black people get arrested per capita than do whites ?
[/quote]

Take the color out of it, and ask how many rich folk are in prison on pot charges versus the number of poor people in prison for the same reason.

[maverick88]

[quote]drunkpig wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]MaximusB wrote:
Pitbull,

The war on drugs is not racist.

It’s about $$$.
[/quote]

WE agree on the second part but how do explain that the same amount of people per capita of white and black smoke pot but 4 times as many black people get arrested per capita than do whites ?
[/quote]

Take the color out of it, and ask how many rich folk are in prison on pot charges versus the number of poor people in prison for the same reason.
[/quote]

Most drug arrests are for possession not distribution. How many people in the burbs are being randomly searched in the first place? Even if they were holding do you think they would be prosecuted the same way?

This is why statistics are bullshit. If you place cops in a certain neighborhood patrolling for every violation they are going to find something. Housewives could be growing and getting high in their homes everyday but, who gives a shit no cop is knocking on their doors.

[drunkpig]

[quote]maverick88 wrote:

[quote]drunkpig wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]MaximusB wrote:
Pitbull,

The war on drugs is not racist.

It’s about $$$.
[/quote]

WE agree on the second part but how do explain that the same amount of people per capita of white and black smoke pot but 4 times as many black people get arrested per capita than do whites ?
[/quote]

Take the color out of it, and ask how many rich folk are in prison on pot charges versus the number of poor people in prison for the same reason.
[/quote]

Most drug arrests are for possession not distribution. How many people in the burbs are being randomly searched in the first place? Even if they were holding do you think they would be prosecuted the same way?

This is why statistics are bullshit. If you place cops in a certain neighborhood patrolling for every violation they are going to find something. Housewives could be growing and getting high in their homes everyday but, who gives a shit no cop is knocking on their doors.[/quote]

Because most crime - from assaults to drug dealing - is committed in low income areas.

That’s why the police patrol those areas more closely, and why there are more busts for possession.

[pittbulll]

[quote]drunkpig wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]MaximusB wrote:
Pitbull,

The war on drugs is not racist.

It’s about $$$.
[/quote]

WE agree on the second part but how do explain that the same amount of people per capita of white and black smoke pot but 4 times as many black people get arrested per capita than do whites ?
[/quote]

Take the color out of it, and ask how many rich folk are in prison on pot charges versus the number of poor people in prison for the same reason.
[/quote]

You can take the color out just as easy as you can take the money out of , It would require a study that checks for any disparity among a specific social class.

An argument could be made the same that the reason more blacks are poor than whites is in it’s self racist . You have to admit it is convoluted

[drunkpig]

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]drunkpig wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]MaximusB wrote:
Pitbull,

The war on drugs is not racist.

It’s about $$$.
[/quote]

WE agree on the second part but how do explain that the same amount of people per capita of white and black smoke pot but 4 times as many black people get arrested per capita than do whites ?
[/quote]

Take the color out of it, and ask how many rich folk are in prison on pot charges versus the number of poor people in prison for the same reason.
[/quote]

You can take the color out just as easy as you can take the money out of , It would require a study that checks for any disparity among a specific social class.

An argument could be made the same that the reason more blacks are poor than whites is in it’s self racist . You have to admit it is convoluted
[/quote]

There are more poor whites than poor blacks.

[pittbulll]

[quote]drunkpig wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]drunkpig wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]MaximusB wrote:
Pitbull,

The war on drugs is not racist.

It’s about $$$.
[/quote]

WE agree on the second part but how do explain that the same amount of people per capita of white and black smoke pot but 4 times as many black people get arrested per capita than do whites ?
[/quote]

Take the color out of it, and ask how many rich folk are in prison on pot charges versus the number of poor people in prison for the same reason.
[/quote]

You can take the color out just as easy as you can take the money out of , It would require a study that checks for any disparity among a specific social class.

An argument could be made the same that the reason more blacks are poor than whites is in it’s self racist . You have to admit it is convoluted
[/quote]

There are more poor whites than poor blacks.

[/quote]

Per capita?

[maverick88]

[quote]drunkpig wrote:

[quote]maverick88 wrote:

[quote]drunkpig wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]MaximusB wrote:
Pitbull,

The war on drugs is not racist.

It’s about $$$.
[/quote]

WE agree on the second part but how do explain that the same amount of people per capita of white and black smoke pot but 4 times as many black people get arrested per capita than do whites ?
[/quote]

Take the color out of it, and ask how many rich folk are in prison on pot charges versus the number of poor people in prison for the same reason.
[/quote]

Most drug arrests are for possession not distribution. How many people in the burbs are being randomly searched in the first place? Even if they were holding do you think they would be prosecuted the same way?

This is why statistics are bullshit. If you place cops in a certain neighborhood patrolling for every violation they are going to find something. Housewives could be growing and getting high in their homes everyday but, who gives a shit no cop is knocking on their doors.[/quote]

Because most crime - from assaults to drug dealing - is committed in low income areas.

That’s why the police patrol those areas more closely, and why there are more busts for possession.
[/quote]

But is causes unwarranted fear of minorities. You see statistics saying blacks are 10x more likely to commit crimes or be arrested and people assume they were violent in nature when in fact most were drug related not for trafficking but, possession for personal use (most of the time weed). Patrolling is upped based on arrests. There could be just as many arrests in richer neighborhoods but, no one is looking to catch them. That is not to say that violet crime is not committed but, even those are mainly caused by the bullshit “War on Drugs”.

[drunkpig]

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]drunkpig wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]drunkpig wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]MaximusB wrote:
Pitbull,

The war on drugs is not racist.

It’s about $$$.
[/quote]

WE agree on the second part but how do explain that the same amount of people per capita of white and black smoke pot but 4 times as many black people get arrested per capita than do whites ?
[/quote]

Take the color out of it, and ask how many rich folk are in prison on pot charges versus the number of poor people in prison for the same reason.
[/quote]

You can take the color out just as easy as you can take the money out of , It would require a study that checks for any disparity among a specific social class.

An argument could be made the same that the reason more blacks are poor than whites is in it’s self racist . You have to admit it is convoluted
[/quote]

There are more poor whites than poor blacks.

[/quote]

Per capita?
[/quote]

You did not specify. I know what you meant - but that’s not what you said.

[pittbulll]

http://www.nclej.org/poverty-in-the-us.php

[pittbulll]

[quote]drunkpig wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]drunkpig wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]drunkpig wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]MaximusB wrote:
Pitbull,

The war on drugs is not racist.

It’s about $$$.
[/quote]

WE agree on the second part but how do explain that the same amount of people per capita of white and black smoke pot but 4 times as many black people get arrested per capita than do whites ?
[/quote]

Take the color out of it, and ask how many rich folk are in prison on pot charges versus the number of poor people in prison for the same reason.
[/quote]

You can take the color out just as easy as you can take the money out of , It would require a study that checks for any disparity among a specific social class.

An argument could be made the same that the reason more blacks are poor than whites is in it’s self racist . You have to admit it is convoluted
[/quote]

There are more poor whites than poor blacks.

[/quote]

Per capita?
[/quote]

You did not specify. I know what you meant - but that’s not what you said.
[/quote]

what do you think I said ?

[drunkpig]

[quote]pittbulll wrote:
what do you think I said ?
[/quote]

Exactly what you wrote:

[b]An argument could be made the same that the reason more blacks are poor than whites is in it’s self racist[/b]

[drunkpig]

[quote]maverick88 wrote:

But is causes unwarranted fear of minorities. You see statistics saying blacks are 10x more likely to commit crimes or be arrested and people assume they were violent in nature when in fact most were drug related not for trafficking but, possession for personal use (most of the time weed). Patrolling is upped based on arrests. There could be just as many arrests in richer neighborhoods but, no one is looking to catch them. That is not to say that violet crime is not committed but, even those are mainly caused by the bullshit “War on Drugs”.[/quote]

You’re all over the place. Statistics are bullshit, so you come up with some subjective, unsupportable position.

I am totally against the war on drugs - but to say that statistics are bullshit and prisons are full of blacks because of some phobia the white man has…well…I’m not buying.