Professor X: A Request

Training Bodybuilding
723

[quote]kardon wrote:
Chi-Towns-Finest wrote:
TheBigV wrote:
Hey Professor, you think it’s possible to cram down enough food in the day to fulfill the protein requirements of a 200 lb., 5’9" dude without using protein supplements?

I eat tuna, chicken, steak, or any other kind of protein source at every meal. I’m eating out of the college cafeteria right now, so I’m limited to what I can eat… only in the sense that I don’t know what I’ll be eating from day to day (except for tuna, raw veggies, fruit, and some form of red meat), because otherwise I have a technically unlimited amount of food.

You think hitting 300 to 400 grams of protein in a day is reasonable without protein supplements?

Hey I am not the professor, but I can tell you offhand that will come down to intention. If you make it your business to eat enough meat, you can. Second, while protein is important, I firmly believe that carbohydrates will play just as big a role - if not bigger - in your recovery and muscle growth.

I’m not sure if I am in the minority here, but I take in 1-1.25g protein/over 2g of carbs per pound of bw each day. That works for me, any T-men have a similar diet? Anyways, I’m sure you have plenty o’ oat bran available at your cafeteria. Personally, I would pay more attention to my carb intake.

Just some food for thought.

I am also not X, but if all you care about is protein then I’ve gotten close to 400g of protein in a day from nothing but chicken breasts. However, nutrition for building muscle takes more than just protein, you’ll also need to exceed your caloric requirements.

Summary:
Calories in > calories out = weight gain.
Protein in > protein out/degradation = most of your weight gain should be muscle. This is assuming you train hard and have met requirement number one: calories in > calories out. You can end up losing weight/muscle from high protein diets if your caloric intake is too low.[/quote]

400g/day with ONLY chicken breasts? So you were eating over 3lb. of chicken per day?

I’m at college now and due to limited options I’m eating about 16-18oz./day. I wouldn’t mind eating more and would actually prefer it over eating protein powder which I have to pay for but I was/am worried about digestion/allergen issues from too much of the same meat. How long did you do that for and did you experience any issues?

724

[quote]pumped340 wrote:
400g/day with ONLY chicken breasts? So you were eating over 3lb. of chicken per day?

I’m at college now and due to limited options I’m eating about 16-18oz./day. I wouldn’t mind eating more and would actually prefer it over eating protein powder which I have to pay for but I was/am worried about digestion/allergen issues from too much of the same meat. How long did you do that for and did you experience any issues?
[/quote]
I’m in college too, but I did this over August of the summer break. It was an attempt at leaning out a little since my bulk phase the previous school year left me with a small gut.

You should know that I am not advanced by any means, and am only 195 - 200 lbs at 5’10. And I mean a TRUE 5’10, since most people who are slightly shorter than me have claimed 5’10 which I know is bullshit, especially when they accuse me of being 6’0 so that they could still claim they’re 5’10.

I did this for the first 25 days of August to see what would happen. I should’ve done it throughout all of summer, but I had unresolved issues with where I was going for my professional studies that weren’t resolved until August. While my actual protein consumption varied from as low as 181 g/day on my worst day and up to 421 g/day on my best day, my caloric intake ranged from 1478 calories/day to 2767 calories/day. The latter number did not correspond to my max protein day of 421 g/day, but to my 373 g/day due to the fried chicken I had.

I DID lose weight, but most if not all was muscle. My waist line stayed more or less the same, but I dropped 10 lbs. My lifts were all a little weaker. Perhaps my calories were too low overall, since most days my caloric intake was roughly 2000 and I need 4000 to gain weight.

I hate chicken breasts. No flavor, and I can’t cook. My issues were being able to choke that shit down w/o throwing up. I appear to have no allergen issues, since I can eat chicken thighs just fine. It was the lack of flavor of chicken breasts which were my problem. Chicken thighs are easy to cook. Chop it up, throw it in a pan and let it cook in its own juices. And they taste better than chicken breasts. Should drain the fat after cooking though, way too greasy.

Regarding your lack of options, there are work study jobs on campus where you can just sit there and study while getting paid for it. I am a “computer lab monitor.” I just sit there and study for 3 hours, for the most part. If you don’t have free time to “work” for money to buy food, get a work study job as a “monitor” of some kind. You basically sit there and study mostly.

725

[quote]kardon wrote:
pumped340 wrote:
400g/day with ONLY chicken breasts? So you were eating over 3lb. of chicken per day?

I’m at college now and due to limited options I’m eating about 16-18oz./day. I wouldn’t mind eating more and would actually prefer it over eating protein powder which I have to pay for but I was/am worried about digestion/allergen issues from too much of the same meat. How long did you do that for and did you experience any issues?

I’m in college too, but I did this over August of the summer break. It was an attempt at leaning out a little since my bulk phase the previous school year left me with a small gut.

You should know that I am not advanced by any means, and am only 195 - 200 lbs at 5’10. And I mean a TRUE 5’10, since most people who are slightly shorter than me have claimed 5’10 which I know is bullshit, especially when they accuse me of being 6’0 so that they could still claim they’re 5’10.

I did this for the first 25 days of August to see what would happen. I should’ve done it throughout all of summer, but I had unresolved issues with where I was going for my professional studies that weren’t resolved until August. While my actual protein consumption varied from as low as 181 g/day on my worst day and up to 421 g/day on my best day, my caloric intake ranged from 1478 calories/day to 2767 calories/day. The latter number did not correspond to my max protein day of 421 g/day, but to my 373 g/day due to the fried chicken I had.

I DID lose weight, but most if not all was muscle. My waist line stayed more or less the same, but I dropped 10 lbs. My lifts were all a little weaker. Perhaps my calories were too low overall, since most days my caloric intake was roughly 2000 and I need 4000 to gain weight.

I hate chicken breasts. No flavor, and I can’t cook. My issues were being able to choke that shit down w/o throwing up. I appear to have no allergen issues, since I can eat chicken thighs just fine. It was the lack of flavor of chicken breasts which were my problem. Chicken thighs are easy to cook. Chop it up, throw it in a pan and let it cook in its own juices. And they taste better than chicken breasts. Should drain the fat after cooking though, way too greasy.

Regarding your lack of options, there are work study jobs on campus where you can just sit there and study while getting paid for it. I am a “computer lab monitor.” I just sit there and study for 3 hours, for the most part. If you don’t have free time to “work” for money to buy food, get a work study job as a “monitor” of some kind. You basically sit there and study mostly.[/quote]

well I’m not going to spend money for food when it’s free lol and my school is a little weird in that we have to have a meal plan until senior year or so, so I’d like to take advantage of all the “free food” :slight_smile:

I would think if you lost almost all muscle maybe protein was just too high and you didn’t have enough energy macros so you were using up muscle. Mainly I was wondering about allergen/digestion issues but that doesn’t seem to have been a problem. My only concern is having a problem arise without me knowing it’s due to too much chicken but I guess I’ll just see how things go.

726

Ditto on hard work.
I’ve trained with goofy methods, poor (probably average) nutrition, too much/too little recovery/volume. The only this that has ever entirely stopped progress is not working hard enough (some would use the term intensity).

[quote]Professor X wrote:
davidcox1 wrote:
Professor X wrote:

There is innate athleticism involved here just like in any sport.

Innate athleticism is right. Although I wouldn’t consider myself innately athletic (I’ve never played anything other than Little League baseball and golf), I am motivated and dedicated, and those things too are innate, and closely linked to athleticism.

…so is the mind muscle connection…or the ability to feel when you are giving it everything you have.

The problem most of these people have isn’t a lack of info but the inability to even understand what hard work is…something that just comes naturally to some of us.

I just got back from the gym training biceps and triceps. I literally got stared at while training and while I know some of that is just because of size, the rest is because none of them were putting as much into it.

I am out of breath and screaming inside from the lactic acid burn after my heaviest set and most of them just casually put the weights down and act like the set didn’t even affect them…then they wonder why they look the same year after year while blaming everything from supplements to changing their entire routine around when the problem was ALWAYS them.[/quote]

727

X, I haven’t read anything about your opinion on powerlifting.
I know you plan to compete as a bodybuilder, but you must have an opinion anyway, right?

Do you think many powerlifters would be better off training like you have and just getting as big as they could, before training for max strength? Or do you think powerlifters should just do what they are doing?

Also, what is your opinion on small guys drinking lots of soft drinks to get those carb calories in?

728

[quote]forevernade wrote:
X, I haven’t read anything about your opinion on powerlifting.
I know you plan to compete as a bodybuilder, but you must have an opinion anyway, right?

Do you think many powerlifters would be better off training like you have and just getting as big as they could, before training for max strength? Or do you think powerlifters should just do what they are doing?

Also, what is your opinion on small guys drinking lots of soft drinks to get those carb calories in?[/quote]

Why would a powerlifter train like a bodybuilder and vice verse? 2 different goals. One is training to gain the most muscle and the other is training to gain the most strength.

729

[quote]forevernade wrote:
X, I haven’t read anything about your opinion on powerlifting.
I know you plan to compete as a bodybuilder, but you must have an opinion anyway, right?

Do you think many powerlifters would be better off training like you have and just getting as big as they could, before training for max strength? Or do you think powerlifters should just do what they are doing?

Also, what is your opinion on small guys drinking lots of soft drinks to get those carb calories in?[/quote]

An opinion on powerlifting? I have nothing against powerlifters. I used to train like one and lifted around quite a number of them (including that short huge Hawaiian guy who died years back whose name I keep forgetting when he came through Houston). First, there is no one way to train and short of doing max single lifts, there really wasn’t much of a difference in how we trained.

As far as drinking sodas for carbs, that is the worst idea I have heard even though if that is all you have access to after training, then it is better than absolutely nothing assuming that isn’t all you are eating that day.

I am a little bothered that you would even ask that which leads me to believe you will read what I just wrote as “yep, drink all of the sodas you want”…which is ridiculous.

730

I think you are referring to Anthony Clark. I had the opportunity to lift with him one time in Denton, TX. We were both geting ready for a meet. He was a super nice guy and just a little strong!!

731

[quote]jaj wrote:
I think you are referring to Anthony Clark. I had the opportunity to lift with him one time in Denton, TX. We were both geting ready for a meet. He was a super nice guy and just a little strong!![/quote]

He was an awesome guy to be around and he did not lift that much different than us aside from when he was working on his one rep max. I got a chance to spot him once (along with 2 other people) as he did what must have been close to 800lbs with a suit on. I had heard stories of him bleeding from the eyes and nose when training.

The keys to getting big are shared by both. That is why those who act like strength is some completely separate entity from muscle growth don’t seem to even understand the basics.

732

[quote]johnson575 wrote:
Why would a powerlifter train like a bodybuilder and vice verse? 2 different goals. One is training to gain the most muscle and the other is training to gain the most strength.[/quote]

Even though I’m not X, I think bodybuilding and powerlifting training parallels more often than not.

733

http://asp.elitefts.com/qa/default.asp?qid=92565&tid=

This answer from Justin Harris to a similar question is exactly what people need to hear, however, they don’t want to.

734

[quote]ChesterCopperpot wrote:
http://asp.elitefts.com/qa/default.asp?qid=92565&tid=

This answer from Justin Harris to a similar question is exactly what people need to hear, however, they don’t want to.[/quote]

Well said. There used to be very little distinction.

In fact, I think lines were only drawn when people who are NOT very serious began to get involved. People like that focus on minutia and expand it until it hinders their own progress. There is no other reason for lines to be drawn in the sand when everyone trained so fucking similarly in the same gyms at the same times just a decade previous.

Both have to eat big and lift big to get results.

Only now, you have newbs who literally need to be told that they still have to lift heavy and simply performing some exact number of reps is NOT the goal.

735

A lot of people seem to major in the minor.

I understand the concept of following a program, especially for beginners, as a decent program can give them proper exercises, split, and even a good base volume to start with. Basically takes the thinking out of things.

But the underlying factors, like really hard work, consistency, and nutrition, will always win out. Regardless of the minute details.

736

I remember when the first Golds in the Kansas City area opened when I was in high school. The bodybuilders and powerlifters trained together in the off season. We had several bodybuilders who competed in power meets and one of the powerlifters who ended up winning the Mr. Kansas with just minor tweaks to his training.

737

[quote]Professor X wrote:
ChesterCopperpot wrote:
http://asp.elitefts.com/qa/default.asp?qid=92565&tid=

This answer from Justin Harris to a similar question is exactly what people need to hear, however, they don’t want to.

Well said. There used to be very little distinction.

In fact, I think lines were only drawn when people who are NOT very serious began to get involved. People like that focus on minutia and expand it until it hinders their own progress. There is no other reason for lines to be drawn in the sand when everyone trained so fucking similarly in the same gyms at the same times just a decade previous.

Both have to eat big and lift big to get results.

Only now, you have newbs who literally need to be told that they still have to lift heavy and simply performing some exact number of reps is NOT the goal.[/quote]

Prof I’m curious to get your opinion on this, for someone starting out and planning solely to bodybuild, would you recommend that they do Starting Strength or stick to a split?

738

[quote]nik133 wrote:
Professor X wrote:
ChesterCopperpot wrote:
http://asp.elitefts.com/qa/default.asp?qid=92565&tid=

This answer from Justin Harris to a similar question is exactly what people need to hear, however, they don’t want to.

Well said. There used to be very little distinction.

In fact, I think lines were only drawn when people who are NOT very serious began to get involved. People like that focus on minutia and expand it until it hinders their own progress. There is no other reason for lines to be drawn in the sand when everyone trained so fucking similarly in the same gyms at the same times just a decade previous.

Both have to eat big and lift big to get results.

Only now, you have newbs who literally need to be told that they still have to lift heavy and simply performing some exact number of reps is NOT the goal.

Prof I’m curious to get your opinion on this, for someone starting out and planning solely to bodybuild, would you recommend that they do Starting Strength or stick to a split?[/quote]

Good question, I don’t think he’s answered that one before.

/sarcasm.

739

[quote]LankyMofo wrote:
nik133 wrote:
Professor X wrote:
ChesterCopperpot wrote:
http://asp.elitefts.com/qa/default.asp?qid=92565&tid=

This answer from Justin Harris to a similar question is exactly what people need to hear, however, they don’t want to.

Well said. There used to be very little distinction.

In fact, I think lines were only drawn when people who are NOT very serious began to get involved. People like that focus on minutia and expand it until it hinders their own progress. There is no other reason for lines to be drawn in the sand when everyone trained so fucking similarly in the same gyms at the same times just a decade previous.

Both have to eat big and lift big to get results.

Only now, you have newbs who literally need to be told that they still have to lift heavy and simply performing some exact number of reps is NOT the goal.

Prof I’m curious to get your opinion on this, for someone starting out and planning solely to bodybuild, would you recommend that they do Starting Strength or stick to a split?

Good question, I don’t think he’s answered that one before.

/sarcasm.[/quote]

I like how you put the little /sarcasm in the post, clearly you are much more clever then me to make such subtle jokes that an imbecile like me wouldn’t dream of coming up with if I was locked in a room with CK Louis and Dave Chappelle. Please do PM me the creative process which you use to come up with these verbal jousts, as one day I would like to be able to use smug douchebaggary on other members. Attached is a pic of me being an UB3R 1337 NUBZOR and not simply scrolling through 30000 posts that prof has come up with.

740

[quote]nik133 wrote:
Professor X wrote:
ChesterCopperpot wrote:
http://asp.elitefts.com/qa/default.asp?qid=92565&tid=

This answer from Justin Harris to a similar question is exactly what people need to hear, however, they don’t want to.

Well said. There used to be very little distinction.

In fact, I think lines were only drawn when people who are NOT very serious began to get involved. People like that focus on minutia and expand it until it hinders their own progress. There is no other reason for lines to be drawn in the sand when everyone trained so fucking similarly in the same gyms at the same times just a decade previous.

Both have to eat big and lift big to get results.

Only now, you have newbs who literally need to be told that they still have to lift heavy and simply performing some exact number of reps is NOT the goal.

Prof I’m curious to get your opinion on this, for someone starting out and planning solely to bodybuild, would you recommend that they do Starting Strength or stick to a split?[/quote]

First, you assume I even follow or know what “starting strength” is. I don’t. It means nothing to me. I still don’t get why anyone has made this so complicated…as if you don’t get strong by training chest and triceps on one day.

As soon as I see any of those guys that worried about “starting strength” bypass the progress made by serious lifters who simply understand the basics, then I’ll worry about it.

The most impressive people I know have never given a shit about 90% of the crap many of you worry about on this site.

I trained 2-3 body parts a day as a beginner. I train on average one body part a day now. Do people really think I held myself back by doing that?

741

[quote]austin_bicep wrote:
johnson575 wrote:
Why would a powerlifter train like a bodybuilder and vice verse? 2 different goals. One is training to gain the most muscle and the other is training to gain the most strength.

Even though I’m not X, I think bodybuilding and powerlifting training parallels more often than not.[/quote]

This is what I was thinking, I was just wondering if X distinguished between the two.

[quote]Professor X wrote:
As far as drinking sodas for carbs, that is the worst idea I have heard even though if that is all you have access to after training, then it is better than absolutely nothing assuming that isn’t all you are eating that day.

I am a little bothered that you would even ask that which leads me to believe you will read what I just wrote as “yep, drink all of the sodas you want”…which is ridiculous.[/quote]

Heh, of course not, at the moment most of my liquid calories come from milk, but sometimes I get sick of milk, or I get some problems digesting it in copious amounts. Sometimes I like to drink 2 liters of Solo or something post workout just because its so cheap (80 cents next to the gym.) I get a little guilty consuming so much, but I only do it about once a week or so.

742

[quote]nik133 wrote:
LankyMofo wrote:
nik133 wrote:
Professor X wrote:
ChesterCopperpot wrote:
http://asp.elitefts.com/qa/default.asp?qid=92565&tid=

This answer from Justin Harris to a similar question is exactly what people need to hear, however, they don’t want to.

Well said. There used to be very little distinction.

In fact, I think lines were only drawn when people who are NOT very serious began to get involved. People like that focus on minutia and expand it until it hinders their own progress. There is no other reason for lines to be drawn in the sand when everyone trained so fucking similarly in the same gyms at the same times just a decade previous.

Both have to eat big and lift big to get results.

Only now, you have newbs who literally need to be told that they still have to lift heavy and simply performing some exact number of reps is NOT the goal.

Prof I’m curious to get your opinion on this, for someone starting out and planning solely to bodybuild, would you recommend that they do Starting Strength or stick to a split?

Good question, I don’t think he’s answered that one before.

/sarcasm.

I like how you put the little /sarcasm in the post, clearly you are much more clever then me to make such subtle jokes that an imbecile like me wouldn’t dream of coming up with if I was locked in a room with CK Louis and Dave Chappelle. Please do PM me the creative process which you use to come up with these verbal jousts, as one day I would like to be able to use smug douchebaggary on other members. Attached is a pic of me being an UB3R 1337 NUBZOR and not simply scrolling through 30000 posts that prof has come up with.[/quote]

I’m not directing this specifically at you, but all members.

If you care about Professor X’s opinion on something (which is completely understandable) there is no need to read through all of his posts. Take 1 hour and read this entire thread. No one who takes the time to read this thread (in its entirety) regrets it. You’ll learn a lot more than his opinion on starting strength vs full body vs splits, etc. and you’ll be happy you read it when you’re done.

/nuthuggery