Once your strength and muscle gains are humming along, however much fat you’ve gained doesn’t have to be added to. In other words it’s not like you have to keep getting fatter while getting more muscular, but life will be a slavish bummer if you are not willing to forgo being really lean while trying to get bigger.
I keep about a one inch soft pinch in my midsection as my standard. Yous may be more, there’s no way to know beforehand. I gain fine while at that body fat level and don’t see any benefit from allowing myself to get any fatter. However I’m a lot older than you and have other considerations. If I were younger I may loosen that up some, maybe not I’ll never know.
I hope I didn’t just waste all this typing for the 200th time.[/quote]
What Im worried about happening to me is that i will just keep my flab and just build muscle underneath it, so yea the muscle will be there after a while, but so will this pudge. Im thinking my body will just naturally lean out (or at least appear to do so) with muscle gains but from what you and others have said you can’t build muscle without gaining at least a bit of fat. I probably seem way to discerning over this, I just want to make sure Im going about this properly.
ive read through your last long post like a hundred times, it makes a lot of sense to me, so no you didn’t waste your time. Thanks for the immense input:)
After you’ve made progress putting on muscle, you’ll find that cutting is a lot easier. Having more muscle on you helps you burn calories easier, since those muscles require more fuel than fat.
I learned this the hard way–I’m trying to “cut” after only 3-4 months of building muscle, and its not going too well.
Just go lift. You’ll be so happy about putting on muscle, you won’t worry about small amounts of fat.
[quote]El_Won_foolio wrote:
<<< What Im worried about happening to me is that i will just keep my flab and just build muscle underneath it, so yea the muscle will be there after a while, but so will this pudge. Im thinking my body will just naturally lean out (or at least appear to do so) with muscle gains but from what you and others have said you can’t build muscle without gaining at least a bit of fat. I probably seem way to discerning over this, I just want to make sure Im going about this properly.
ive read through your last long post like a hundred times, it makes a lot of sense to me, so no you didn’t waste your time. Thanks for the immense input:)[/quote]
You will not build any decent amount of muscle in the next 15 minutes. You’re gonna have to have some patience to make good gains. The guy above made a great point. Muscle is the engine that burns calories and the more of it you have the more of them you burn. Once it’s time to shed that pudge it’ll go much easier with a coupla few dozen more pounds of muscle to do it with.
How this physiological truism lost credibility is beyond me. People tend to think in extremes. Somebody says you need more food and people start posting Ripley’s pix of fat people as if that’s what you mean.
The truth is yes, you probably will keep that “pudge” while you’re getting bigger. It may or may not increase. Why don’t you just give yourself a chance to gain some strength and size and see how you feel then. When your lifts start growing along with your muscles it is sweet consolation for carrying some extra fat and when you turn your task to getting lean you’ll laugh at that compared to what it took to make those gains.
Food prep is your friend. Cook up say 2-3 days worth of proteins all on the grill/george foreman/oven I don’t care. Portion it out to how much you need in each meal and tupperware or ziplock bag it. You probably want some veggies prepared and the easiest way to do that would be to pick a couple you like(for me it’s broccoli and spinach raw) and cook/just grab out of the bag and portion that out as well. Maybe add in some things like nuts or drizzle some extra virgin olive oil over your veggies. Get a hold of a couple shaker bottles if you need quick meals and scoop out some protein into them, add any other dry ingredients you plan to add like maybe ground up oats. Simply add water or milk when it’s time to eat.
That, or become a McDonald’s dollar menuare(no, you likely don’t want to do this ha)
Just practice and plan ahead and you’ll figure out a way to get your meals in. I go to school full time and work 30-35 hours a week, my cooler is my friend and I won’t let things get in the way of me eating for my goals.
Food prep is your friend. Cook up say 2-3 days worth of proteins all on the grill/george foreman/oven I don’t care. Portion it out to how much you need in each meal and tupperware or ziplock bag it. You probably want some veggies prepared and the easiest way to do that would be to pick a couple you like(for me it’s broccoli and spinach raw) and cook/just grab out of the bag and portion that out as well. Maybe add in some things like nuts or drizzle some extra virgin olive oil over your veggies. Get a hold of a couple shaker bottles if you need quick meals and scoop out some protein into them, add any other dry ingredients you plan to add like maybe ground up oats. Simply add water or milk when it’s time to eat.
That, or become a McDonald’s dollar menuare(no, you likely don’t want to do this ha)
Just practice and plan ahead and you’ll figure out a way to get your meals in. I go to school full time and work 30-35 hours a week, my cooler is my friend and I won’t let things get in the way of me eating for my goals. [/quote]
It was foolish of me to figure it would be assumed as a matter of course that significant work will be required to overcome the many obstacles that have been erected to prevent anybody from being healthy.
I make the next day’s food every night, but there are other methods such as what you have said. This goes along with what you posted in the other thread about this being a 24/7 affair. No truer words were ever spoken. You want it or you don’t.
[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
El_Won_foolio wrote:
<<< What Im worried about happening to me is that i will just keep my flab and just build muscle underneath it, so yea the muscle will be there after a while, but so will this pudge. Im thinking my body will just naturally lean out (or at least appear to do so) with muscle gains but from what you and others have said you can’t build muscle without gaining at least a bit of fat. I probably seem way to discerning over this, I just want to make sure Im going about this properly.
ive read through your last long post like a hundred times, it makes a lot of sense to me, so no you didn’t waste your time. Thanks for the immense input:)
You will not build any decent amount of muscle in the next 15 minutes. You’re gonna have to have some patience to make good gains. The guy above made a great point. Muscle is the engine that burns calories and the more of it you have the more of them you burn. Once it’s time to shed that pudge it’ll go much easier with a coupla few dozen more pounds of muscle to do it with.
How this physiological truism lost credibility is beyond me. People tend to think in extremes. Somebody says you need more food and people start posting Ripley’s pix of fat people as if that’s what you mean.
The truth is yes, you probably will keep that “pudge” while you’re getting bigger. It may or may not increase. Why don’t you just give yourself a chance to gain some strength and size and see how you feel then. When your lifts start growing along with your muscles it is sweet consolation for carrying some extra fat and when you turn your task to getting lean you’ll laugh at that compared to what it took to make those gains.
[/quote]
Just to add, the less muscle someone is carrying, the more FAT they look with any amount of fat on them. Someone carrying a lot of muscle mass could walk around at a much higher percentage, and while he may not be “ripped”, he will still be impressive. That is why worrying about some small amount of body fat makes little sense.
Also, beginners are bad judges of progress. I have seen posts that indicate that because some little guy has a full stomach (and as a result it isn’t currently flat), he now thinks he’s fat and needs to diet.
Pick a short term goal and stick with that for SEVERAL months.
[quote]El_Won_foolio wrote:
so basically im getting this…don’t worry about getting to a low bf %, just hit the weights hard and eat enough to sustain my body weight. If i misunderstood this please correct me.
I will bump up my calories, 3000 seems like a number i see alot so i will try that, it just seems that in order to eat healthy I kind of have to eat a lot to reach that many calories, but Ill trust you guys cause apparently i have been screwing up, im gonna try to get some pics on here so you guys can see what im dealing with.[/quote]
That’s pretty much the case. 3000 isn’t all that hard. Now if you want to get to 5 or 6000 eating clean, that’s hard. Eating a lot every day whether you want to or not is the only way to gain muscle. Don’t wait 'til your hungry to eat. It’s a bit late then. Eat on a schedule. And I mean that quite literally. Take food in your backpack to class, or on road trips, or wherever. Always keep a couple protein bars in case of emergency.
Don’t sweat gaining fat if you’re eating healthy foods. It will happen much slower eating healthy even if you’re eating a surplus. Trans/Saturated fats, crap in the diet, they all lead to bad nutrient partitioning and faster fat gain compared to the same amount of calories from clean healthy foods and lots of protein. Now, I’m not saying you should freak out if your girl or buddies want to go get some pizza or barbeque. Just keep the big majority of calories clean and junk free.
And [u][b]KEEP A FOOD LOG.[/u][/b] That’s the only way to make sure don’t pull another “I think I’m eating 2000 calories a day” but really only eating 1000. If you keep a log, you KNOW you’re eating your goal. Then if you’re not gaining weight, you know what you have to do.
A final note, most people who are lanky or skinny look fat precisely because they have no muscle. That’s the definition of the term “skinny-fat”. Solution is easy–gain muscle and look like you got a pair. Cutting off the fat is easy.
As for why people are taking time with you…for one you seem to be listening and were really turned around. Someone like you will get all of the help they ask for.
[/quote]
That’s about right. But you might have to endure some harsh words on the way. Nobody sugar-coats stuff around here, which is why I came to the site in the first place years ago when I needed advice.
Not always what you want to hear (or what I wanted to hear then), and you always always have to do your own reading/self-education, but it’s what you need to do anyway. Worked for me. But you’ve survived this long without getting super-defensive, so yeah, you’ll get help. Consider it an initiation ritual :).
Well, my posts are largely superfluous now that Trib and others have given great advice on this 3rd page. Pay attention. Prof X has some great thoughts here–people with lots of muscle look better even if they’re not cut with a 6 pack, and newbs are notoriously bad at judging progress because they have no experience.
And especially because they are still filled with all the mis-information that the media and others spew. It takes time to “unlearn” what you thought you knew, and find the truth. Measure that time in years, not weeks.
On ways to make time with all this cooking–I echo essentially what everybody else is saying–cook 2-3 days ahead of time and portion them into tupperware, that way you can just stick them in the fridge or backpack and eat w/o cooking each meal. Or consider setting several hours aside on Sunday and cooking for your entire next week.
Trib–I know you said you can’t understand why some people are happy with that abercrombie look. I agree, but I know that most of us (not all, but a lot) started out with some sort of “well when I reach 170/180/200/some random number I’ll be happy” I know I did. But then you get there and you realize you don’t really look like you thought you would.
That’s when you really make the change to a life-long disciple of the iron. It’s a cusp–certain people get there and stop, and a lot of us get there and then go beyond in search of perfection.
Is there a food log that i can use online? or is there one i can download? Ive been searching for some but all seem to suck, just wondering if anyone knows of one that is easy to use or at least practical.
I didn’t mean for it to sound like i just want to get to that “abercrombie” look and quit, I was just trying to say that is my goal for now. When i get there Im sure i will continue to build more muscle (everyone I have talked to at my gym says its more addicting than heroine). I just don’t want to shoot for the stars right away and just be realistic with where I might end up in a year or so.
I don’t see why most beginners (if any) should be this analytical about their food intake. I still don’t count every calorie and only even take it into consideration when dieting.
Bodybuilding is fun for me. I don’t see how it could possibly be fun to those of you who do this.
I usually dont like doing it cuz I’m pretty laid back.
However, I just finished up 8 weeks of dieting and am transitioning out so I find it useful to make sure I dont back a bunch a fat back on real quick. It also helped me realize that after initially losing alot of weight last year that I was undereating after that. Protein included. It’s just a way to feel like you are controlling your progress. At least for me.
[quote]GetSwole wrote:
I think the counting has alot to do with control.
I usually dont like doing it cuz I’m pretty laid back.
However, I just finished up 8 weeks of dieting and am transitioning out so I find it useful to make sure I dont back a bunch a fat back on real quick. It also helped me realize that after initially losing alot of weight last year that I was undereating after that. Protein included. It’s just a way to feel like you are controlling your progress. At least for me.[/quote]
I don’t see this as being useful beyond the initial time it takes just to discover what you are actually eating. Once that is accomplished it doesn’t take much to keep in the optimal range by eye. Keeping track for a week or maybe 2 so that you know where you are makes some sense, but after that how difficult is it to adjust a bit here and there as long you’re diligent? Especially when gaining size.
I’m not downing you for doing what you like, but I agree with Professor X that it can quickly become burdensome which is why I warned against surgical precision above.
Every few months 1 week of counting is OK, but every day IMO is way too complicated and makes the whole dieting thing too burdensome to do every day.
Just plan ahead the amounts of meat/fish/fowl, fruits and vegetables and either rice or bread you will consume every day. Set a schedule and keep the amounts constant. If you start getting too fat then cut down on the rice or bread. If you are not getting stronger increase your meat/fish/fowl. Having constipation problems, increase your vegetables and fruits.
If you are training hard and focus on getting stronger this plan will keep you relatively lean. Add in cardio 2 or 3 times when you want to be extra lean and you are good to go. No need to be anal about life. Food is good, enjoy it. But make healthy choices about what you put into your body.
[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
GetSwole wrote:
I think the counting has alot to do with control.
I usually dont like doing it cuz I’m pretty laid back.
However, I just finished up 8 weeks of dieting and am transitioning out so I find it useful to make sure I dont back a bunch a fat back on real quick. It also helped me realize that after initially losing alot of weight last year that I was undereating after that. Protein included. It’s just a way to feel like you are controlling your progress. At least for me.
I don’t see this as being useful beyond the initial time it takes just to discover what you are actually eating. Once that is accomplished it doesn’t take much to keep in the optimal range by eye. Keeping track for a week or maybe 2 so that you know where you are makes some sense, but after that how difficult is it to adjust a bit here and there as long you’re diligent? Especially when gaining size.
I’m not downing you for doing what you like, but I agree with Professor X that it can quickly become burdensome which is why I warned against surgical precision above.[/quote]
No no you misunderstood. I was just stating why I think its done. Me personally, i figure it out once then mostly eye particularly since I eat basically the same stuff all the time. I was just saying I find it useful for dieting/transitioning in and out of dieting and just occasionally to get an idea. Other than that I agree it becomes burdensome. I usually just do it once a week and basically eat the same stuff the whole week. I deffinitely dont log day by day. If I did, suicide would look a lot more interesting than bodybuilding.