Not to worry BBB I have also ordered Selegiline from the source you suggested 
In regards to the lethargy, I am already feeling it lol! Will see if this is bearable till the Selegiline gets here, might switch over to that depending on results.
[quote]bushidobadboy wrote:
Ouch! Good luck with the parlodel. I sincerely hope it doesn’t make you feel as lethargic, nauseous and genrally shitty as it did me.
Honestly, I’m not trying to mess with your hormones here, more just advising you of a compound that is fairly mild and benign in its actions (selegeline) that may make you feel better and have an improved libido without drastically altering blood hormone levels, whilst you wait for actual blood figures.
Several people who had trouble with libido, post deca and/or tren cycles seemed to do remarkably well on the stuff at 5mg EOD for a few days then 2.5mg EOD after that.
It just seems to provide that little tweak on brain chemistry that may be needed by some.
And I’m sorry to massiveguns but if you are lactating then what other hormone than prolactin might you suggest as the culprit?
BBB[/quote]
No apology needed bushy, I agree lactation is most likely caused by elevated prolactin. When it comes to actually treating something as sensitive as a failed recovery, I think its always best not to make assumptions. If you start treatment, THEN get bloodwork done, you can have no idea if the meds lowered your prolactin or if it was fine to begin with. Also, you don’t want to go too far with prolactin meds, since prolactin is required for sex steroid synthesis.
With the bromo, try and break the dosages up. 5mg is quite a high dose and could bring on sides. I’d start with 1mg if you can and see how it goes.
No can do, as I mentioned above the bromo is in capsules of 5mg, not tablets, cant be broken up.
[quote]Singhbuilder wrote:
No can do, as I mentioned above the bromo is in capsules of 5mg, not tablets, cant be broken up.[/quote]
Empty capsule.
Dissolve in 5mL vodka.
Shake.
1mL = 1mg.
BBB, nutrition is poor-ish. Being in uni studying medicine (you of all people should know this) things do get hectic. But I suppose thats no excuse. Just recently while I have been off-cycle I upped my protein intake to ~250g. Prior to this I was eating anything (on-cycle).
I try to shoot for as much protein as possible, dont count carbs before bed or anything. Stay away from fried food and fast food.
Do you mean I should be shredded to the bone BECAUSE of my 13week cycle of tren or in general?
I have a strong feeling the tri-tren used from week 1-7 was fake or underdosed, coz come on I went up to 900mg/wk of tren alongside 750mg/wk of tri-test with no sides! So we can say I was “on” for 6 weeks.
Massiveguns, I dont drink alcohol, but I thought of your idea too to open the capsules. Im guessing they wont dissolve in water, any other suggestions? Also, storage once mixed?
That pic was actually taken in full flow of my cycle aswell 
Not sure about not using vodka. Water might be ok with bromo, but vodka is a pretty standard solvent mixture for this kind thing. 1mL of vodka isn’t exactly alcohol consumption in the normal sense.
As for the cycle, I think we discussed your diet before. You need to consume a serious number of calories when your trying to bulk up. You need to eat so much that you start to get fat. I know there’s a ton of conflicting advice out there, but this is the easiest way in my opinion. You don’t have to keep piling the fat on, but you need to know what number of calories makes you gain weight. There are formulas out there to calculate your needs etc. but I think these are a waste of time, so much about metabolism is individual, the only way to know what makes YOU gain weight is to test it and see.
Once you know what level of intake starts to make you fat, all you have to do is count your protein, and make sure its enough, and lift heavy and often, and the muscle will come. Its the same whether you are natural or assisted. Its just if you use steroids, you will add muscular bodyweight faster and put on less fat than if you were doing it natural.
You have to put some effort into your diet to see the results you desire from steroids, I also think its a shame you mentioned you only upped your protein intake to 250g whilst off cycle. I think that should be the MINIMUM and I’m just guessing your bodyweight from your pics.
I think its quite likely that when you realise how much food you need to eat to grow, you will find it takes EFFORT to actually eat it. Most of us have a natural set point for our appetite and bodyweight. For some this is high and they get fat, for others its the other way around. Based on how lean you are I’d say you fall into catagory number two. That’s why I suggested pouring olive oil on EVERYTHING you eat, it makes it easier to get in the calories without stretching your stomach. Adding a gallon of milk isn’t a bad idea either. If I also remember correctly, you were eating low carb? Again, some people can gain well on a low carb diet, but I think most people do better with reasonable levels of carbs, and if you can handle the fat gain, the higher side is better.
Having crap gear doesn’t help either. Focus on your recovery, and use the time to really learn how to eat so the next time you do this you do it properly.
[quote]MassiveGuns wrote:
Not sure about not using vodka. Water might be ok with bromo, but vodka is a pretty standard solvent mixture for this kind thing. 1mL of vodka isn’t exactly alcohol consumption in the normal sense.
As for the cycle, I think we discussed your diet before. You need to consume a serious number of calories when your trying to bulk up. You need to eat so much that you start to get fat. I know there’s a ton of conflicting advice out there, but this is the easiest way in my opinion. You don’t have to keep piling the fat on, but you need to know what number of calories makes you gain weight. There are formulas out there to calculate your needs etc. but I think these are a waste of time, so much about metabolism is individual, the only way to know what makes YOU gain weight is to test it and see.
Once you know what level of intake starts to make you fat, all you have to do is count your protein, and make sure its enough, and lift heavy and often, and the muscle will come. Its the same whether you are natural or assisted. Its just if you use steroids, you will add muscular bodyweight faster and put on less fat than if you were doing it natural.
You have to put some effort into your diet to see the results you desire from steroids, I also think its a shame you mentioned you only upped your protein intake to 250g whilst off cycle. I think that should be the MINIMUM and I’m just guessing your bodyweight from your pics.
I think its quite likely that when you realise how much food you need to eat to grow, you will find it takes EFFORT to actually eat it. Most of us have a natural set point for our appetite and bodyweight. For some this is high and they get fat, for others its the other way around. Based on how lean you are I’d say you fall into catagory number two. That’s why I suggested pouring olive oil on EVERYTHING you eat, it makes it easier to get in the calories without stretching your stomach. Adding a gallon of milk isn’t a bad idea either. If I also remember correctly, you were eating low carb? Again, some people can gain well on a low carb diet, but I think most people do better with reasonable levels of carbs, and if you can handle the fat gain, the higher side is better.
Having crap gear doesn’t help either. Focus on your recovery, and use the time to really learn how to eat so the next time you do this you do it properly.[/quote]
There is no reason in the world why anyone should try to put on fat. This is retarded.
This is even more retarded in the realm of AAS. It is significantly easier to gain large amounts of muscle with minimal fat gain while using AAS than while gaining naturally. Someone who gets fat while using AAS is simply lazy.
[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:
[quote]MassiveGuns wrote:
Not sure about not using vodka. Water might be ok with bromo, but vodka is a pretty standard solvent mixture for this kind thing. 1mL of vodka isn’t exactly alcohol consumption in the normal sense.
As for the cycle, I think we discussed your diet before. You need to consume a serious number of calories when your trying to bulk up. You need to eat so much that you start to get fat. I know there’s a ton of conflicting advice out there, but this is the easiest way in my opinion. You don’t have to keep piling the fat on, but you need to know what number of calories makes you gain weight. There are formulas out there to calculate your needs etc. but I think these are a waste of time, so much about metabolism is individual, the only way to know what makes YOU gain weight is to test it and see.
Once you know what level of intake starts to make you fat, all you have to do is count your protein, and make sure its enough, and lift heavy and often, and the muscle will come. Its the same whether you are natural or assisted. Its just if you use steroids, you will add muscular bodyweight faster and put on less fat than if you were doing it natural.
You have to put some effort into your diet to see the results you desire from steroids, I also think its a shame you mentioned you only upped your protein intake to 250g whilst off cycle. I think that should be the MINIMUM and I’m just guessing your bodyweight from your pics.
I think its quite likely that when you realise how much food you need to eat to grow, you will find it takes EFFORT to actually eat it. Most of us have a natural set point for our appetite and bodyweight. For some this is high and they get fat, for others its the other way around. Based on how lean you are I’d say you fall into catagory number two. That’s why I suggested pouring olive oil on EVERYTHING you eat, it makes it easier to get in the calories without stretching your stomach. Adding a gallon of milk isn’t a bad idea either. If I also remember correctly, you were eating low carb? Again, some people can gain well on a low carb diet, but I think most people do better with reasonable levels of carbs, and if you can handle the fat gain, the higher side is better.
Having crap gear doesn’t help either. Focus on your recovery, and use the time to really learn how to eat so the next time you do this you do it properly.[/quote]
There is no reason in the world why anyone should try to put on fat. This is retarded.
This is even more retarded in the realm of AAS. It is significantly easier to gain large amounts of muscle with minimal fat gain while using AAS than while gaining naturally. Someone who gets fat while using AAS is simply lazy. [/quote]
I wasn’t suggesting that he aim to get fat. The point is that the best way of finding the upper level of calories that you can tolerate is by pushing to find that limit yourself. Once you know that limit you have something you can work with. Its silly to rely on formulas that don’t apply to an individual’s unique circumstances and metabolism.
I agree totally that it is possible to gain good quality weight with minimal fat gain. This requires discipline, a good deal of experience, self regulation and knowledge of training. For your average newbie who has failed to gain significant weight after two heavy-ish steroid cycles, however, I think its a much safer bet to hit the top end of calorie requirements than risk wasting another 16 weeks treading water next time he hits the gear.
I understand where you are coming from MG, however I have tried the “get fat” approach, as in eat till you feel sick. Although I gained alot of muscle, I gained alot of fat too. I looked like crap for the most part and hitting the crap end of genetics for chest fat I just looked fat all around. I seem to put fat on my chest very quickly which doesnt help. I see people on here with higher bodyfat than me but with rounded-chests, jealous! But neway, I agree with BONEZ that there is no need to get fat but I think I know what you meant. However he is right that fat gain shouldnt be the AIM, which your post seemed to hint at although this is not what you meant.
And no I am not on low-carb, I was initially but then switched to the 250g protein and high carb.
Did you use gear when you tried the “get fat” approach? Just wondering, I am still not reccomending you do that again, unless it was completely natural.
I know that when you get a little soft, you won’t look as good as you could. There are ways to mitigate this though. You can add GPP to your hearts content to help keep the fat at bay on steroids, and increase the volume in your workouts. Its better to do more volume and eat more.
Look at it this way though. If you set yourself a goal of gaining 30 pounds of FAT in 12 weeks, how would you eat? You’d stuff your face every chance you get right? Gaining muscle needs even more calories since its metabolically costly tissue, so why do you need to do any different than if you were trying to get fat, other than eat more protein. The biggest problem, and the most prevalent is people undereating. The number of people who post in a similar situation than yourself is much higher than those that post who have managed to bloat themselves up from eating too much in attempt to get big.
If you are not at the upper limit of the calories you can handle on gear, you are short changing yourself.
[quote]MassiveGuns wrote:
I agree totally that it is possible to gain good quality weight with minimal fat gain. This requires discipline, a good deal of experience, self regulation and knowledge of training.
[/quote]
All prerequisites for steroid use
[quote]
For your average newbie who has failed to gain significant weight after two heavy-ish steroid cycles, however, I think its a much safer bet to hit the top end of calorie requirements than risk wasting another 16 weeks treading water next time he hits the gear.[/quote]
Not a person who should be using steroids. So the advice is irrelevant as well misguided.
The most obvious reason why the advice is simply stupid is because you can easily dirty up the diet and do less physical acitivty and find your self getting fatter. This does not mean that you are in the ideal situation to gain muscle.
Fat gain is not indicative of progress. Plain and simple. There is no justification for your method as a measure of progress. The best way to ensure progress is to know how much food (and what kind) it takes to gain MUSCLE at the fastest rate.
I have at no point said that fat gain is a measure of progress. It is a measure of whether or not you are exceeding your calorie requirements, and therefore a reliable real world indicator of whether or not those 3562 calories that the “mass gain formula” told you is what you need to gain muscle, is actually enough for YOU to gain muscle.
The method I have mentioned is actually a quick and easier way than accurately measuring your average metabolic rate. This is done using essentially the same method, increase your calories till you start gaining weight, the only difference is that you count exactly your calories and keep a log of what you eat.
Why you think even a small amount of fat gain is unacceptable is beyond me.
Have you heard of the study on sumo wrestlers that showed they held on average more muscle mass than bodybuilders? There’s also a good reason why powerlifters everywhere pig out and get fat. Yes they take it too far, but the gains in strength and muscle they achieve as a result can’t be denied.
And since the guy is already using, what good is it for me to tell him to stop. He’s going to do it again, might as well help him do it properly.
^ Is that a joke? How far are you going to stretch this out?
[quote]MassiveGuns wrote:
I have at no point said that fat gain is a measure of progress. It is a measure of whether or not you are exceeding your calorie requirements, and therefore a reliable real world indicator of whether or not those 3562 calories that the “mass gain formula” told you is what you need to gain muscle, is actually enough for YOU to gain muscle.
The method I have mentioned is actually a quick and easier way than accurately measuring your average metabolic rate. This is done using essentially the same method, increase your calories till you start gaining weight, the only difference is that you count exactly your calories and keep a log of what you eat.
Why you think even a small amount of fat gain is unacceptable is beyond me.
Have you heard of the study on sumo wrestlers that showed they held on average more muscle mass than bodybuilders? There’s also a good reason why powerlifters everywhere pig out and get fat. Yes they take it too far, but the gains in strength and muscle they achieve as a result can’t be denied.
And since the guy is already using, what good is it for me to tell him to stop. He’s going to do it again, might as well help him do it properly.[/quote]
Agree.
Always best to push the upper limit of your mass gains if looking to bulk. As i see my abs dissapear - i readjust.
It’s the best gauge adapting to my body like this, as shredding fat is EASY but packing muscles is HARD.
With or without AAS
And Bonez, this is a personal choice/decision - how quilcky you want to gain and/or how patient you want to be.
There’s no point being a nit-picking dick about it.
[quote]WyldFlower wrote:
And Bonez, this is a personal choice/decision - how quilcky you want to gain and/or how patient you want to be.
There’s no point being a nit-picking dick about it.[/quote]
How bout measuring muscle gain to see what the best way to gain muscle is, instead of measuring fat gain. Crazy. I know. Why someone would make a personal choice to aim to put on fat is beyond my comprehension. ESPECIALLY WHEN AAS ARE IN THE MIX
It’s not a “personal choice to put on fat”. Jesus. Stop trying to paint peple in a corner.
You consume calories until you see your fat going up and you readjust. Watching your own bodyfat changes is a quick and efficient way to measure overall growth. You shouldn’t be totally averse to adding some fat either as its EASY to shred - especialyl with AAS, and frankly, is NOT my primary concern.
This is why people “bulk” and “cut” with varying cycles.
It’s a tried and tested method of muscle gain.
Now stop arguing.