I would guess this is because men are more likely to commit sexual assaults than women, which is exactly why I’m against the idea of introducing them to women’s locker rooms.
I would also suggest that being nude in front of a woman without consent, or sneaking a peek is criminal exposure, and essentially cornering women (and girls) to be subject to exposure is a fundamentally flawed policy.
They are not women.
So you are basically saying its ok for a man in a dress to flaunt his cock and balls to women or girls in a ladies restroom or womens locker room as long as its non threatening???
Did you read my post?
Yes, and i am asking a legit question
trans woman and a dude in a dress is the same thing…
lockers rooms and rest rooms are for disposing bodily waste and/or changing clothes…that is inappropriate to do in front women and girls
In locker rooms people shower with varying levels of privacy barriers available, they change clothes and are inherently nude or near nude frequently.
In what scenario would a male being nude in a women’s locker room be acceptable, or not?
I’ll say that changing / being naked in front of women with male genitalia crosses the line. Using a stall to go to the bathroom I see as different, and acceptable as long as behavior is what would be considered normal (not peeking through cracks, leaving the stall door open to pee standing up, etc…).
I also view bathrooms as a basic thing people need access to. I don’t view locker rooms the same. I’ve been at gyms that didn’t have a locker room, and everyone was just fine. It isn’t required to shower immediately after a workout, or to change in a locker room. One can also just change in a bathroom stall if need be.
Is your mother, grandmother, aunt, sister, daughter, niece, female cousin, female friend, girlfriend, wife, mother-in-law, ex-wife ok with that philosophy…i would tend to think not
From my observations, men are far more bothered by it than women.
I don’t feel like you are grasping nuance here. There are trans women that look nothing like a man. It would also be dangerous for them to use the men’s bathroom. Their safety should be considered too, and safest thing would be to use the women’s room.
I am saying that behavior matters. The example posted on the first post is clearly a man just saying he is trans woman so he can be a creep. He has no behaviors that indicate he is trans. Dude has a beard even. It’s clear that he is a predator. I don’t think black and white policy works for something like this.
One thing overlooked here is the number men who are predatory (rapists, pedos, etc.) or at least perverted.
For example, exhibitionism is a type of paraphilic disorder where someone experiences sexual arousal from exposing his genitals to an unsuspecting person. It’s partly sexual and partly a weird power move (he gets off on making women uncomfortable). The old term is flasher.
Then there’s the secret photo-takers and filmers, which is apparently big business on the dark web and private chat groups.
I have to think that all of those creeps are high-fiving right now due to the open-restrooms trend.
So the choice is between making a trans person comfortable with its choice of bathroom or exposing women and girls to all of these weirdos above. What’s more “fair?”
Those siding with the trans movement should answer a simple question: How many bad incidences are acceptable? I don’t think too many people would accept the “There’s only been a few rapes/gropes/pubic-masturbation/secret-photos!” argument.
FTR, I am not for trans women in women’s sports, teaching young kids about sexuality, puberty blockers… I am not very woke at all.
However, the pro trans side could also ask the question of how many trans women being sexually or physically assaulted in the men’s room is acceptable?
IIRC, the amount of trans women assaulted in men’s rooms outnumbers the amount of women being assaulted by trans women in the women’s room.
I’ve never seen any stats on this. And were these assaults sexual or did some guy in a sports bra get his ass kicked because he was perving on a woman out in the gym and later got punched by her husband in the locker room?
I just don’t see many straight guys getting overwhelmed with desire when a bearded lady comes into the locker room. Most sexual assaults in the LGBTQ communuty are by other LGBTQs.
Now put yourself in a woman’s shoes, as best you can via your lifetime of observations, instead of projecting your own sense of safety and security around another man who happens to be dressed unconventionally…. and crossing behavioral norms on to your side of the fence. Do you still sincerely hold the same view?
The reason why locker rooms exist in their current state is because they provide a sense of security and privacy from the opposite gender, especially for women. I can’t agree that allowing a dude to take over a women’s locker room while sequestering them to a toilet stall or out of the option to change or shower is appropriate. This is an intersection where if someone needs to check feelings and adapt behavior, it’s the man playing dress up. Not the women being actual women. It’s losing the forest through the trees in an effort to appease woke ideology.
Ive notice people gloss over the fact , in all of this is that all is required for a guy to gain access is to say " I identify "
Theres no test or ultra secret handshake to verify someone is actually Trans.
I agree here. I meant that locker room use isn’t a necessity that has to be provided to everyone like a bathroom should. That if a trans woman doesn’t feel comfortable in the men’s locker room, then she should use a regular bathroom not a locker room with a stall and change there, or just change at home.
It is pretty common actually. Trans women especially are assaulted both physically and sexually at high rates.
I am not advocating that we just ignore everything male about a trans woman, and grant her rights to all women’s places. I think there should be a distinction between a bathroom and locker room for instance. Behavior also matters. I think we need to consider safety / comfort a little in the case of forcing trans women to use men’s bathrooms and locker rooms.
Have you heard of Blaire White? She is a trans woman, that does conservative commentary on YouTube. If I saw her in public I’d think she was a fairly attractive woman. For reference:
I feel that allowing her to use a women’s bathroom would be far less risky for assault than if by policy she had to use men’s bathrooms (because some men would eventually assault her).
Blair is a man, though. Moot point.
I don’t disagree with you. Is it okay for men to be assaulted or raped?
We are okay with little boys being in the women’s bathroom because it is safer for them to be there with their mother than alone in the men’s room. If safety is overall better for someone like Blaire to be in the women’s bathroom, isn’t that what we should advocate for so long as there are behavior standards?
I don’t think so.
Allowing Blaire to use women’s restrooms and locker rooms, which are the actual context of this post, opens a Pandora’s Box of identity definition and allows situations like the post being discussed to occur, which is not a one-off event.
Responsibility of Blaire’s safety, in his decision to dress the way he does, does not shift to women in general to bear the brunt of. This is a selfish misplacement of responsibility. If Blaire feels unsafe in a public mens room or locker room while dressed as a woman, he can make the decision for himself to wear a different outfit.
Blaire White agrees with me.
An old coworker got in trouble for doing things like installing cameras in the bathrooms at his parent’s house when they hosted a VBS for their church at their place. He had a LOT of material, and I can only imagine how in demand that could be for how elaborately this dude planned it all. Ugh.
A problem with that study is that it is actually a survey. How do the individuals surveyed define sexual assault? Sexual assault is a crime and there should be police records to back these claims up.
As far as trans people being victims of violence at higher rates, the number of trans people is so small that I wonder how meaningful stats are. Also, do these stats account for risky behavior? How much violence against trans people is domestic violence? I believe lesbian couples engage in intimate partner violence at higher rates than other demographics.