Sport fishermen use hook and line to cath their fish. That requires a certain population density of fish in the first place. Once the competion for food in that particular area drops the fish get more and more picky about what they eat. Sport tackle, even the live bait rigs don’t look exactly like the real thing, even if the difference is just the motion in the water. Basically sport fishing relies on the volition of the fish. He either choose to bite or not.
Commercial methods from purse seines, drift nets, bottom draggers, and trawl nets don’t rely on what the fish wants to do, just that it’s in the water. Most of those methods not only overfish the target species but there is a thing called “bycatch” which is the killing of non target species as well. Bottom draggers have 3 ton mud rollers on them. Any fish that doesn’t go in the net to be killed by the rapid rise to the surface dies by being ironed into the mud. You’ll never catch the last of any fish species on hook and line, using commercial methods you damn well might.
“Most cancers occur due to an interaction between our bodies, genetic makeup (read hereditary), environment, lifestyle, tobacco, sexual behavior, poor diet”
Which would indicate that MOST (your words) can be prevented by changes in lifestyle and or environent. If MOST can be prevented, them the others may be preventable or cured (or at the very least slow the progression of the disease).
To the extent this has turned into a “what causes cancer” discussion, this is stupid. There was just new study out that seems to show a VACCINATION that seems adept at preventing cervical cancer – which should be an indication that we don’t have the faintest clue what sort of combination of factors come together to actually cause cancer.
Now, that isn’t to say we can’t show that certain behaviors don’t dramatically increase your risk of contracting cancer. But it seems more clear each day that the complex interactions of genes, health habits and environment that come together to cause human health conditions are poorly understood at best. Chemo staves off death, but doesn’t cure cancer, and makes life miserable. Diet and exercise help, but as was pointed out earlier, when you start living healthy is important – not to mention that other factors continue to play a role. It’s a great, big balancing test, in which you have maybe the faintest idea where you stand genetically and environmentally.
And that’s not even as bad as all the people who apparently have the environment figured out. “If we don’t stop burning carbon fuels, the sky will fall.” Or, “We don’t have to pay attention to anything we do.” Please. We have absolutely no idea what effect our actions have on the environment – in a very few cases, such as overharvesting of resources, we know, but in the macrocosmic picture of cause-and-effect we are lost. The Kyoto Treaty is an excellent example of environmental silliness run amok. So is the idea that we can just fish a species out of existence and know the effects that will have. We should manage the effects we know, and balance the other effects we’re basically guessing.
Sorry for the rant. However, both sides of this debate make me wring my hands.
Since this has become a discussion on environment (which it obviously leads to when speaking of factory farming) listen to this one:
Jerry Fallwell - on CNN - had the nerve to say that Global Warming is a hoax, that it’s simply a ploy to destroy the American economy built on industrialization. Isn’t this the most ridiculous thing you’ve ever heard.
People like this represent the ignorance of America and the whole world - It boils down to selfishness - Most people don’t care to listen to others and organizations like PETA (which can be quite extreme) ALWAYS seem extreme when trying to open up the minds of people.
Millions of people just dismiss information out there and stand direct on their opinions without educating themselves first. The guy talking to Jerry Fallwell on CNN couldn’t get a word in edgewise - Jerry was not willing to listen to what the other had to say - all Jerry did was quote phrases out of the bible and cut the other guy off. This is what is leading to the destruction of this earth - the ignorance of man and selfish greed.
I seriously doubt that all species of fish will be eliminate by commercial fishing if it is regulated. It doesn’t matter how many fish is out there, if you don’t know how to catch fish then you won’t catch any. I’m not saying that you don’t know how to catch fish but where I live some people seem to catch their limits easy while others don’t catch anything. Another question: How is a certain species of fish estimated by biologists? Probably by samples, questioneers, and formulas. Seems like a big chance of an error when the ocean and lakes are so big. There is no way of telling the true population of fish in a big body of water. It just seems that some sportfisherman want to shut down the commercial industry because they can’t catch fish. It has made our seafood business turn more to imports. Now that is really helping the economy out.
There were 23 ice ages with the associated warming periods between them before man started “destroying the planet”. Impact and change does not equate to destruction. When Mt. Pinotubo (sp?) in the Phillipines popped it’s top that one event had more effect on the atmosphere than years and years of human caused changes to the atmosphere.
Sure, there are changes we make that definitely are not in the best interest of our longevity. The loss of valuable topsoil due to farming techniques that were outdated 30 years ago is one that doesn’t make sense. We can document the negative impacts that has on watersheds and we know that the topsoil lost takes a lot longer to make than it does to blow or wash away. Polluting water sources is another known evil. The only thing we know about global warming is that it’s happening and we probably contribute to it. There is no real evidence to prove it wouldn’t happen due to natural weather cycles a few years or decades later if we didn’t impact it at all. The National Weather Service with all it’s technology has trouble forecasting the weather in one area more than a day or two out with any accuracy yet we’re dead certain that the dire predictions of the impacts of gobal temperature changes in the next decade or two are correct. Why does this seem reasonable?
Jordan who let you in here you’re in danger of making sense and every one knows thats not always allowed ( except perhaps here in the “T” nation. :o})) I think Jerry Fallwell and his type are the real hoax. Those guys will twist and turn in any direction if it increases their income from donations. They twist the good books to fit their latest needs and the hell with the world and all its people. The strange thing as Jordan pointed out is that people actually listen to these clowns and even give them money to continue doing their social damage. The sick part is they are actually effecting the politics of The USA in a manner that is making the US a laughing stock to the rest of the world. Then have the nerve to condem the beliefs of others.
LOL! Okay bro, you go right ahead and keep picking the goodies out of the trees! I’ll keep using my short stature and lower center of gravity to catch those damn chicken and turkeys that I love to eat so much! LMAO!
Do you have selective reading ability, like selective memory. Did you read ALL of my reply or just the part you want to criicize. No one knows why the gene is activated or what activates it. Yes Steve, you are correct that lifestyle, tobacco, hazardous /chemical materials, diet, etc… can possibly turn on this gene. But the fact remains that now matter how pristine our lifestyle and environment is we cannot escape what has been passed down to us from our parents. Hence the reason why children get cancer. Do they live a “filthy” lifestyle? Inversely, there are people who drink, smoke and have lousy diets and have been “given” genes that allow them to live quite a long time. Step outside the fitness box and realize that although we can “better the odds” we cannot escape everthing unless we live in a bubble from birth.
Stronski, although I don’t see how my last post would show me to have selective memory or reading, we are in agreement that diet and exercise cannot prevent everything. We are also in agreement that diet and exercise can, however, help to some extent (how large of an extent we don’t know). The problem I have had with this thread since I entered it is that you are either misinterpreting what Mike M., ko, and now I, am saying, or you enjoy making up false statements. Not once did I say that diet and exercise can prevent EVERYTHING. Mike and ko never said this either. A quick read through the previous posts would have given you this information…are you sure I am the one suffering from selective reading? Anyway, despite this statement never being said, you have made it the premise of your attack on Mike and now me. The only thing I can conclude from this is what I stated before: either you don’t understand what we were trying to say, or you are just looking for some reason to argue with people and say they seem “uneducated”. If the former is the case, then I will save you the trouble of dealing with your selective reading, and direct you to the first few sentences of this post (scroll up).
