Wildcat where is it now?
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
[quote]js252 wrote:
hey man didn’t you see a few pages ago, using stats to back stuff up is sort of shunned upon in this
here thread, sweeping generalizations will do.
stats… pfft, aint nobody got time for that.[/quote]
Oh yeah, I forgot. Stats are only good for determining points in fantasy leagues. Otherwise, they’re meaningless.[/quote]
Please with this bullshit fellas.
For those of us that have been around this here thread back when our teams weren’t winning, know I make bold predictions from time to time.
Some of us want to have fun around here, youz two should try it once in awhile.
[quote]pat wrote:
[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
In all seriousness Kapernick is gonna have an average maybe slightly above average year. The 49s schedule is favorable, which helps. He’ll have 25-30 combined TDs, like 3,000-3,500 yds passing, and 300-600 yrds rushing. Niners will make the playoffs, but I’m not sold they will win the division. Seattle’s schedule is favorable too. Teams will adjust to Kap this year, same with RG3, same with other “pistol” QBs. [/quote]
First of all, the stats you listed off are hardly “average” stats for an NFL QB. They’re well above average.
If you project his stats in 7 starts last year out over the course of an entire season he has pretty remarkable stats for someone in his first year of playing time (I think he attempted all of five passes in 2011 and had no rushing attempts). That sort of projection comes out to roughly:
4000 passing yards (that would rank 12th in the NFL last year)
Completion % of 62.4 (good for 11th)
Passing yards per attempt of 8.32 (good for 1st, which illustrates how good he is from the pocket and how he’s not strictly a runner)
Passer rating of 98.3 (7th in the league)
Rushing yards 900 rushing yards (1st amongst QBs and 19th overall)
23 passing TDs (14th)
11 rushing TDs (1st amongst QBs and 5th overall)
7 INTs (2nd)
Total Quarterback Rating 76.3 (3rd in the NFL)
And those stats are just assuming that he maintains his pace from last year. If he shows marked improvement from last year those stats all go up significantly. Based on how well he was throwing the ball as he gained more experience, including throughout the playoffs, I expect his trajectory to continue upward. There is simply nothing average about the way the guy played last year and for him to drop down into “average” QB play would represent a VERY significant statistical regression on his part.
I think the really telling statistics are his QBR and his average passing yards per attempt vs. his completion percentage. The guy makes more downfield throws than literally any QB in the league based on last year. He averaged 8.32 yards per attempt in the regular season but jumped way up to 9.98 in the postseason against some pretty good defenses in Atlanta and Baltimore.
No QB who completed a higher percentage of his regular season throws than Kaepernick’s postseason completion % of 61.3 came anywhere close to averaging 9.98 yards per attempt. RG3 was the only QB in the regular season who completed more than 61.3 % of his throws and averaged more than 8 yards per attempt (65.6/8.14). Kaepernick’s regular season completion % and yards per attempt were also tops. No one who completed more than 62.3 % of their passes averaged as much as 8.32 yards per attempt and RG3 was the ONLY QB who averaged more than 62.3 % AND more than 8 yards per attempt. When it comes to downfield passing, Kaepernick is already in very rarefied air.
Kaepernick, based on both his first 7 career starts along with his postseason play, has already shown to be an extremely elite passer, arguably more elite than anyone when it comes to downfield passing accuracy. And we all know that he is arguably the premiere running QB in the league, given his 10.6 rushing yards per attempt average, which is light years in front of RG3’s average (6.8).
And then of course we have QBR, which is a stat that takes into account the game context in which stats are accumulated. Basically, the stats reflect the importance of the situation so that clutch performances are elevated above statistically-identical performances in garbage time and against poorer teams. Kaepernick finished above everyone but Brady and Peyton Manning last year in that category.
So what exactly makes you think a guy like Kaepernick, who CLEARLY has very rare throwing and running ability and has already proven he’s more than simply untapped potential, will be anywhere close to average next year? NOTHING about him is average.[/quote]
I think you misunderstood me. I think Kap will be a good QB next year and in the future. He has the tools to be a great QB in fact. I expect he will come back to earth this year though. I think the praise while warranted is still premature. Let’s see what he does over the course of a full season. I don’t expect him to play at the level he played at last season for an entire season. I also think defensive coordinators will have a solution for the pistol offense this year. They will at least be able to handle it better anyway.
He’s going to be GOOD…I just expect him to be brought back to earth this year is the take away message here. [/quote]
Ditto. Defenses have had all winter to figure it out and I am pretty sure most of them have. I predict the read-option will not be near as successful this year. That doesn’t mean he won’t be really good, but the ‘shock and awe’ factor is no longer in play.[/quote]
Other than the game against Green Bay, Kaepernick rarely ran the read-option. Like I pointed out earlier, Kaepernick is in a league of his own so far when it comes to downfield accuracy. The fact is that the league has eventually figured out a way to stop a lot of developments from offenses, yes.
However, no one has figured out how to stop a guy who can consistently make downfield throws from the pocket, short of collapsing the pocket on the QB and forcing him to pull the ball down and run. Unlike virtually all pocket passers in the NFL over the last 30 years or so, Kaepernick can run once he is flushed out of the pocket.
You were watching the NFC Championship Game, right? How many times did Kaepernick run the ball? Once? Twice? How many times did they run the read-option with him keeping the ball? Not one single time in the entire game. And yet he still made play after play, but from the pocket. He is the epitome of the dual-threat QB.
And I laugh at the assumption that the league will catch onto the read-option and the pistol offense. You blindly assume that Harbaugh and company are simply going to keep things the same. With an entire offseason to implement new nuances in their offense there are going to be all sorts of new wrinkles for teams to prepare for. Don’t forget that the 49ers’ offensive attack was already considered the most varied, nuanced and creative system in the NFL before they switched from the extremely limited Alex Smith to the ultra-dynamic Kaepernick.
And the pistol offense gives teams SO many more potential things to account for, even if they line up in it every snap and don’t run the read-option out of if one time. The read-option is simply ONE aspect of the pistol offense. With an entire offseason for the most creative offensive minds in football, coaching the most physically-talented QB in the league, there is going to be a HUGE amount of different things the 49ers can run out of that formation. Shit, there’s at least a dozen different pistol formations possible, maybe even twice that many.
The 49ers just drafted a TE who measures in at 6’5" 265lbs and played in the fucking SLOT most of his career at Rice. So they basically replaced Delanie Walker with a guy who has 5 inches and 40lbs on him and is just as fast. Add to that a healthy Kendall Hunter, LaMichael James, Frank Gore, Vernon Davis, a replenished WR corps and the best offensive line in the game and this season has the makings of an extremely potent offensive attack out here in SF. The sort of personnel they have on offense gives them the flexibility to run WAY more plays out of WAY more personnel groupings and formations, pistol or otherwise, than what they showed with what was essentially a limited offensive attack last year.
Mark my words: This season will mark a paradigm shift in the way offenses are run, with the 49ers heads and shoulders above the rest of the league in terms of innovation, scheme, variety and explosiveness.
[quote]countingbeans wrote:
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
[quote]js252 wrote:
hey man didn’t you see a few pages ago, using stats to back stuff up is sort of shunned upon in this
here thread, sweeping generalizations will do.
stats… pfft, aint nobody got time for that.[/quote]
Oh yeah, I forgot. Stats are only good for determining points in fantasy leagues. Otherwise, they’re meaningless.[/quote]
Please with this bullshit fellas.
For those of us that have been around this here thread back when our teams weren’t winning, know I make bold predictions from time to time.
Some of us want to have fun around here, youz two should try it once in awhile. [/quote]
I am having all sorts of fun. Statistics are part of the game and serve to bolster an argument when used in proper context. After all, that’s what half of all these threads are anyways, arguments. If you don’t like when i use simple statistical evidence to back up an assertion, then don’t make an entirely subjective, baseless statement that forces me to use statistical evidence to show you just how wrong you are.
Post after post of jock riding for a QB with 10 games as his body of work, who’s surrounded by heaps of talent, and I get called out for thinking the Jets might be a sleeper. Literally you would think Kapyourdick had a bust in Canton at this point but let’s call out beans for having a little fun?
Then to add insult to injury I get my jock ridden by some kid that has never posted here, and then some other kid who never posts here to passive aggressively call me out a couple pages later making up a scenario that didn’t exist?
Awesome
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
[quote]countingbeans wrote:
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
[quote]js252 wrote:
hey man didn’t you see a few pages ago, using stats to back stuff up is sort of shunned upon in this
here thread, sweeping generalizations will do.
stats… pfft, aint nobody got time for that.[/quote]
Oh yeah, I forgot. Stats are only good for determining points in fantasy leagues. Otherwise, they’re meaningless.[/quote]
Please with this bullshit fellas.
For those of us that have been around this here thread back when our teams weren’t winning, know I make bold predictions from time to time.
Some of us want to have fun around here, youz two should try it once in awhile. [/quote]
I am having all sorts of fun. Statistics are part of the game and serve to bolster an argument when used in proper context. After all, that’s what half of all these threads are anyways, arguments. If you don’t like when i use simple statistical evidence to back up an assertion, then don’t make an entirely subjective, baseless statement that forces me to use statistical evidence to show you just how wrong you are.[/quote]
Um yeah… You’re missing the point entirely.
Where were you when the 9ers weren’t winning? Oh yeah, posting the in the baseball thread.
Also lol @ your use of “stats” when I buried your “Steve Young was a pure pocket passer” line of bullshit with stats, only for you to return with “but did you watch the games?”
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
[quote]pat wrote:
[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
In all seriousness Kapernick is gonna have an average maybe slightly above average year. The 49s schedule is favorable, which helps. He’ll have 25-30 combined TDs, like 3,000-3,500 yds passing, and 300-600 yrds rushing. Niners will make the playoffs, but I’m not sold they will win the division. Seattle’s schedule is favorable too. Teams will adjust to Kap this year, same with RG3, same with other “pistol” QBs. [/quote]
First of all, the stats you listed off are hardly “average” stats for an NFL QB. They’re well above average.
If you project his stats in 7 starts last year out over the course of an entire season he has pretty remarkable stats for someone in his first year of playing time (I think he attempted all of five passes in 2011 and had no rushing attempts). That sort of projection comes out to roughly:
4000 passing yards (that would rank 12th in the NFL last year)
Completion % of 62.4 (good for 11th)
Passing yards per attempt of 8.32 (good for 1st, which illustrates how good he is from the pocket and how he’s not strictly a runner)
Passer rating of 98.3 (7th in the league)
Rushing yards 900 rushing yards (1st amongst QBs and 19th overall)
23 passing TDs (14th)
11 rushing TDs (1st amongst QBs and 5th overall)
7 INTs (2nd)
Total Quarterback Rating 76.3 (3rd in the NFL)
And those stats are just assuming that he maintains his pace from last year. If he shows marked improvement from last year those stats all go up significantly. Based on how well he was throwing the ball as he gained more experience, including throughout the playoffs, I expect his trajectory to continue upward. There is simply nothing average about the way the guy played last year and for him to drop down into “average” QB play would represent a VERY significant statistical regression on his part.
I think the really telling statistics are his QBR and his average passing yards per attempt vs. his completion percentage. The guy makes more downfield throws than literally any QB in the league based on last year. He averaged 8.32 yards per attempt in the regular season but jumped way up to 9.98 in the postseason against some pretty good defenses in Atlanta and Baltimore.
No QB who completed a higher percentage of his regular season throws than Kaepernick’s postseason completion % of 61.3 came anywhere close to averaging 9.98 yards per attempt. RG3 was the only QB in the regular season who completed more than 61.3 % of his throws and averaged more than 8 yards per attempt (65.6/8.14). Kaepernick’s regular season completion % and yards per attempt were also tops. No one who completed more than 62.3 % of their passes averaged as much as 8.32 yards per attempt and RG3 was the ONLY QB who averaged more than 62.3 % AND more than 8 yards per attempt. When it comes to downfield passing, Kaepernick is already in very rarefied air.
Kaepernick, based on both his first 7 career starts along with his postseason play, has already shown to be an extremely elite passer, arguably more elite than anyone when it comes to downfield passing accuracy. And we all know that he is arguably the premiere running QB in the league, given his 10.6 rushing yards per attempt average, which is light years in front of RG3’s average (6.8).
And then of course we have QBR, which is a stat that takes into account the game context in which stats are accumulated. Basically, the stats reflect the importance of the situation so that clutch performances are elevated above statistically-identical performances in garbage time and against poorer teams. Kaepernick finished above everyone but Brady and Peyton Manning last year in that category.
So what exactly makes you think a guy like Kaepernick, who CLEARLY has very rare throwing and running ability and has already proven he’s more than simply untapped potential, will be anywhere close to average next year? NOTHING about him is average.[/quote]
I think you misunderstood me. I think Kap will be a good QB next year and in the future. He has the tools to be a great QB in fact. I expect he will come back to earth this year though. I think the praise while warranted is still premature. Let’s see what he does over the course of a full season. I don’t expect him to play at the level he played at last season for an entire season. I also think defensive coordinators will have a solution for the pistol offense this year. They will at least be able to handle it better anyway.
He’s going to be GOOD…I just expect him to be brought back to earth this year is the take away message here. [/quote]
Ditto. Defenses have had all winter to figure it out and I am pretty sure most of them have. I predict the read-option will not be near as successful this year. That doesn’t mean he won’t be really good, but the ‘shock and awe’ factor is no longer in play.[/quote]
Other than the game against Green Bay, Kaepernick rarely ran the read-option. Like I pointed out earlier, Kaepernick is in a league of his own so far when it comes to downfield accuracy. The fact is that the league has eventually figured out a way to stop a lot of developments from offenses, yes.
However, no one has figured out how to stop a guy who can consistently make downfield throws from the pocket, short of collapsing the pocket on the QB and forcing him to pull the ball down and run. Unlike virtually all pocket passers in the NFL over the last 30 years or so, Kaepernick can run once he is flushed out of the pocket.
You were watching the NFC Championship Game, right? How many times did Kaepernick run the ball? Once? Twice? How many times did they run the read-option with him keeping the ball? Not one single time in the entire game. And yet he still made play after play, but from the pocket. He is the epitome of the dual-threat QB.
And I laugh at the assumption that the league will catch onto the read-option and the pistol offense. You blindly assume that Harbaugh and company are simply going to keep things the same. With an entire offseason to implement new nuances in their offense there are going to be all sorts of new wrinkles for teams to prepare for. Don’t forget that the 49ers’ offensive attack was already considered the most varied, nuanced and creative system in the NFL before they switched from the extremely limited Alex Smith to the ultra-dynamic Kaepernick.
And the pistol offense gives teams SO many more potential things to account for, even if they line up in it every snap and don’t run the read-option out of if one time. The read-option is simply ONE aspect of the pistol offense. With an entire offseason for the most creative offensive minds in football, coaching the most physically-talented QB in the league, there is going to be a HUGE amount of different things the 49ers can run out of that formation. Shit, there’s at least a dozen different pistol formations possible, maybe even twice that many.
The 49ers just drafted a TE who measures in at 6’5" 265lbs and played in the fucking SLOT most of his career at Rice. So they basically replaced Delanie Walker with a guy who has 5 inches and 40lbs on him and is just as fast. Add to that a healthy Kendall Hunter, LaMichael James, Frank Gore, Vernon Davis, a replenished WR corps and the best offensive line in the game and this season has the makings of an extremely potent offensive attack out here in SF. The sort of personnel they have on offense gives them the flexibility to run WAY more plays out of WAY more personnel groupings and formations, pistol or otherwise, than what they showed with what was essentially a limited offensive attack last year.
Mark my words: This season will mark a paradigm shift in the way offenses are run, with the 49ers heads and shoulders above the rest of the league in terms of innovation, scheme, variety and explosiveness.[/quote]
Unless Kap gets hurt
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
After all, that’s what half of all these threads are anyways, arguments. If you don’t like when i use simple statistical evidence to back up an assertion, then don’t make an entirely subjective, baseless statement that forces me to use statistical evidence to show you just how wrong you are.[/quote]
Furthermore had you actually posted in this thread back before the 49ers actually put together a winning record, you would have noticed the tone and friendly nature of most of the back-and-forths of this thread.
It wasn’t about “proving someone wrong” like an internet warrior e-douche. It was about shooting the shit about football. (Except for that dude with the Barney avatar. He was an angry fellow.)
[quote]Derek542 wrote:
Unless Kap gets hurt[/quote]
He sounds like every Atlanta fan after Mike Vick’s first season…
How many rings does he have?
Or shit, every Atlanta fan now that Matt Ryan is the QB…
I fucking hate this time of year, draft is done, no real training camps.
Just arguing hypothetical events in the future.
Oh by the way I hate Jerry Jones. 
9rs are stacked, but like every team in the league they have lynch pins.
Kap gets hurt how good will they be?
[quote]countingbeans wrote:
Post after post of jock riding for a QB with 10 games as his body of work, who’s surrounded by heaps of talent, and I get called out for thinking the Jets might be a sleeper. Literally you would think Kapyourdick had a bust in Canton at this point but let’s call out beans for having a little fun?
Then to add insult to injury I get my jock ridden by some kid that has never posted here, and then some other kid who never posts here to passive aggressively call me out a couple pages later making up a scenario that didn’t exist?
Awesome[/quote]
Well, I for one have never called you out for your Jets predictions, nor for anything else. So if that is what your vitriol arises from, direct it elsewhere and not at me.
And what’s wrong with me pumping up Kaepernick? I’m excited about what he brings to the table. I’m a diehard 49ers fan who grew up watching Montana and then Young and then a revolving door of jerkoffs for ten years. Now that the 49ers look like they’re back for the long haul and have a QB who, in just 10 games, has displayed all the physical attributes necessary to be a great QB, I am really excited about what the next ten football seasons or so have in store for me. This is the NFL thread, is it not?
So what am I supposed to do when I visit this thread and see the occasional comment regarding Kaepernick being a flash in the pan or overrated or lucky or whatever? Am I supposed to sit there and say, “gee, I don’t want to rub countingbeans the wrong way so I should just sit on my hands and not say anything at all”? Is that what this thread is about, discussing football strictly under your terms? Discussing football so long as we don’t get TOO excited about a legitimate star in the league who just happens to be playing on our favorite team?
Fuck that shit. I’ll come in here and discuss Kaepernick or anything else related to the 49ers all I want and at whatever intensity level I want. If you don’t like it, you can fuck off and die for all I care. It’s not my problem you can’t handle the fact that the team I so passionately root for, and which walloped your team last year, is on the way up and yours is on the way down.
That’s right, the Patriots are on the way out, pal. Brady had one of the best runs ever, probably second only to Montana, but it’s coming to a close now. Kaepernick’s is just starting and if you want to lambast me for riding his fucking cock ten games into his career, then so be it. But the fact is that when all is said and done I’ll be the one who got in on the ground floor of his fucking elevator while your credibility will forever be tarnished in these threads for trying to minimize the career trajectory of a future Hall of Fame QB.
And if I’m wrong about him, so what if I’m fucking wrong? I’m a fan, and I choose to be fanatically optimistic rather than fanatically pessimistic. It’s more FUN that way, you stodgy old bastard.
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
Kaepernick is in a league of his own so far when it comes to downfield accuracy. The fact is that the league has eventually figured out a way to stop a lot of developments from offenses, yes.
[/quote]
He’s played in 7 games. Let’s see how he does being banged up for an entire season before we hand him the MVP award.
Teams will adjust to the pistol, wildcat, etc… Teams always do. Like RG3 a few good hits and I don’t beleive Kap will be able to run when flushed like EVERYTIME like you think.
I don’t know, I don’t remember. The Falcon’s shouldn’t have been in that game, imo, anyway.
Off course Jim will adjust. Who considered the 49ers to have the most varied/nuanced offenses in the league? You’re so over the top “extremely limited,” and “ultra-dynamic,” give me a break. KAP has played 7 games and most of them were against OKAY teams. He played well in the playoffs. So did this guy named Joe Flacco, and he’s still an average maybe slightly above average QB at best.
DB, I like your post, but you are so jaded it’s comical.
“the most creative offensive minds in football, coaching the most physically-talented QB in the league”
Seriously…
Awesome, he could easily be a bust and the niners have good players, but so do a lot of other teams. They’re good on paper that’s for sure.
[quote]
Mark my words: This season will mark a paradigm shift in the way offenses are run, with the 49ers heads and shoulders above the rest of the league in terms of innovation, scheme, variety and explosiveness.[/quote]
Okay, words marked.
[quote]countingbeans wrote:
Also lol @ your use of “stats” when I buried your “Steve Young was a pure pocket passer” line of bullshit with stats, only for you to return with “but did you watch the games?”
[/quote]
I don’t remember you burying anything. And for the record, I DID post in here when the Niners sucked, just not often. I was in here on a pretty regular basis as soon as the Niners hired Harbaugh, not as soon as they started winning.
And your argument about Young not being a pure pocket passer was poor at best. It revolved entirely around your bastardization of the definition of “pure pocket passer” to “strictly pocket passer”. To me, a guy who is a pure pocket passer makes plays from the pocket primarily. If he can also run, fine. But the point is that they stay in the pocket until nothing is happening there and THEN they take off running, not like Vick where he ran at the first sign of trouble.
In Young’s prime, from 1992 to 1998, he was as pure a pocket passer in the game in that respect. He made plays from the pocket and he didn’t look to scramble until after he’d made his progressions through several reads or the pocket just outright collapsed on him. It’s why he was consistently throwing for more than 3000 yards at a time when offenses didn’t routinely throw the ball 70% of the time.
And your idea of blowing up that argument was pointing to his total rushing yards or whatever. The reason I asked if you ever even saw him play on a regular basis was because if you HAD seen him play regularly, you would have known the context in which those yards were gained. He had a career rushing average of almost 8 yards a carry, so when he ran, he almost always gained big yardage. If you saw him play in his prime, you would have known that he wasn’t strictly a scrambler or a one-read-and-off-he-goes QB. A lot of the yardage he gained came on designed naked bootlegs where he’d roll out to his left and either pass it or keep it and run.
But when it came to passing, the guy made plays with his arm from within the pocket better than any of his contemporaries, except for maybe Brett Favre or John Elway. If being one of the best of your generation at making plays with your arm from in the pocket doesn’t make you a pure pocket passer, I don’t know what does.
It also helps that the Niners have an easy schedule. Put Kap on the Browns, then let’s see how great he is.
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
Well, I for one have never called you out for your Jets predictions, nor for anything else. So if that is what your vitriol arises from, direct it elsewhere and not at me.
And what’s wrong with me pumping up Kaepernick? [/quote]
My issue isn’t with you or your love for your QB. My issue is with how adimatly some people who never post in this thread took me to task for not toeing the “Jets will be horrid” line and demanded this that and the other about a fairly straight forward, not so crazy idea.
I used your love of a guy with 10 whole starts, and these same people not having any issue with anything you said as an example of why I think the other two dudes are relative fucksticks.
And for the record, you are one of the first people to bash yourself or your team when it is warranted. You have a clear idea of who you are and where your limits are. It just so happens that you are the most vocal about what is basically an unproven commodity at this point, and these two are riding your dick for your posts.
[quote] Am I supposed to sit there and say, “gee, I don’t want to rub countingbeans the wrong way so I should just sit on my hands and not say anything at all”? Is that what this thread is about, discussing football strictly under your terms? Discussing football so long as we don’t get TOO excited about a legitimate star in the league who just happens to be playing on our favorite team?
Fuck that shit. I’ll come in here and discuss Kaepernick or anything else related to the 49ers all I want and at whatever intensity level I want. If you don’t like it, you can fuck off and die for all I care. It’s not my problem you can’t handle the fact that the team I so passionately root for,[/quote]
You’re again missing my point. Had I not been jumped on by like 4 people after not a single one mentioned the Kap jock riding, I wouldn’t have used your love for dude as an example of why certain posters are dicks.
Beat? Yes. Walloped? Not even close.
If that was a Wallop, what happened in Seattle the week after that one?
[quote]is on the way up and yours is on the way down.
That’s right, the Patriots are on the way out, pal.[/quote]
I’ve said as much myself, over and over again. Again, had you been posting here you’d understand why a comment like that is silly to be honest.
Good lord, really? Just really with this?
Wow.
[quote]Derek542 wrote:
Wildcat where is it now?[/quote]
Bingo
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
[quote]countingbeans wrote:
Also lol @ your use of “stats” when I buried your “Steve Young was a pure pocket passer” line of bullshit with stats, only for you to return with “but did you watch the games?”
[/quote]
I don’t remember you burying anything. And for the record, I DID post in here when the Niners sucked, just not often. I was in here on a pretty regular basis as soon as the Niners hired Harbaugh, not as soon as they started winning.
And your argument about Young not being a pure pocket passer was poor at best. It revolved entirely around your bastardization of the definition of “pure pocket passer” to “strictly pocket passer”. To me, a guy who is a pure pocket passer makes plays from the pocket primarily. If he can also run, fine. But the point is that they stay in the pocket until nothing is happening there and THEN they take off running, not like Vick where he ran at the first sign of trouble.
In Young’s prime, from 1992 to 1998, he was as pure a pocket passer in the game in that respect. He made plays from the pocket and he didn’t look to scramble until after he’d made his progressions through several reads or the pocket just outright collapsed on him. It’s why he was consistently throwing for more than 3000 yards at a time when offenses didn’t routinely throw the ball 70% of the time.
And your idea of blowing up that argument was pointing to his total rushing yards or whatever. The reason I asked if you ever even saw him play on a regular basis was because if you HAD seen him play regularly, you would have known the context in which those yards were gained. He had a career rushing average of almost 8 yards a carry, so when he ran, he almost always gained big yardage. If you saw him play in his prime, you would have known that he wasn’t strictly a scrambler or a one-read-and-off-he-goes QB. A lot of the yardage he gained came on designed naked bootlegs where he’d roll out to his left and either pass it or keep it and run.
But when it came to passing, the guy made plays with his arm from within the pocket better than any of his contemporaries, except for maybe Brett Favre or John Elway. If being one of the best of your generation at making plays with your arm from in the pocket doesn’t make you a pure pocket passer, I don’t know what does.[/quote]
lol, yes, “pure pocket passers” rush for 4k yards in their career, yup…
[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
Kaepernick is in a league of his own so far when it comes to downfield accuracy. The fact is that the league has eventually figured out a way to stop a lot of developments from offenses, yes.
[/quote]
He’s played in 7 games. Let’s see how he does being banged up for an entire season before we hand him the MVP award.
Teams will adjust to the pistol, wildcat, etc… Teams always do. Like RG3 a few good hits and I don’t beleive Kap will be able to run when flushed like EVERYTIME like you think.
I don’t know, I don’t remember. The Falcon’s shouldn’t have been in that game, imo, anyway.
Off course Jim will adjust. Who considered the 49ers to have the most varied/nuanced offenses in the league? You’re so over the top “extremely limited,” and “ultra-dynamic,” give me a break. KAP has played 7 games and most of them were against OKAY teams. He played well in the playoffs. So did this guy named Joe Flacco, and he’s still an average maybe slightly above average QB at best.
DB, I like your post, but you are so jaded it’s comical.
“the most creative offensive minds in football, coaching the most physically-talented QB in the league”
Seriously…
Awesome, he could easily be a bust and the niners have good players, but so do a lot of other teams. They’re good on paper that’s for sure.
[quote]
Mark my words: This season will mark a paradigm shift in the way offenses are run, with the 49ers heads and shoulders above the rest of the league in terms of innovation, scheme, variety and explosiveness.[/quote]
Okay, words marked. [/quote]
Well of course I’m going to use some over-the-top language to illustrate my point. It’s just my way of coloring things up a bit. Is that so bad?
And I for one don’t consider Joe Flacco an average QB and have never been one of the ones in here ridiculing him for that or his eyebrows or his demands of elite status and so forth.
And you ask who considered the 49ers offense to be so varied and creative? Only literally every analyst I’ve ever heard in the last two years when the subject was broached. Who else can lay claim to that description?
As far as RG3 goes, he got injured making a cut and without getting hit in the first place. And prior to that, he was scrambling in the middle of the field, whereas virtually ALL of Kaepernick’s runs are to the outside, by design or otherwise, where the only guys who can lay a hit on him are either smaller than him or slower than him. Plus, he’s built to take a hit better than RG3 is since he has about three inches and 25 lbs on him.
And again, my point is that Kaepernick doesn’t have to run constantly in order to gain big yardage. He can pass the ball from the pocket as well as anyone in the league right now, in my opinion, which I have bolstered with statistical evidence.
And while Kaepernick played well against OKAY teams, he also excelled against some good teams, such as Chicago (well, good defense anyways) and NE and in NO when New Orleans was playing very well. He also stepped up his game immensely when facing playoff teams in Green Bay, Atlanta and Baltimore.
And here is another telling statistic that I think has some serious relevancy when it comes to his mental toughness, which is always a tough thing to gauge in a young QB: every time Kaepernick has EVER turned the ball over in his career, whether on a fumble or an interception, he has responded by taking the team down the field for a score on the very next possession. Every. Single. Time.
Small sample size, sure but that includes in the playoffs and the Super Bowl, so he has shown in the limited opportunities available to him that he can respond well to adversity.
[quote]countingbeans wrote:
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
Good lord, really? Just really with this?
Wow.
[/quote]
I’m just suprised the soon to be 15 time MVP and first ballot Hall-of-Famer is 0-1 in the Super Bowl.