New Bankruptcy Law

Actually, the whole issue of health care billing brings up another area ripe for reform: health provider billing practices.

In a nutshell, patients who are uninsured pay a much higher rate for the same services than does the government (medicare) or insurance companies. The ones who pay are made to subsidize the hospitals and other health providers for the profit margins they lose on their other contracts and the indigent patients that hospitals are required to treat by law.

Basically, if the government is going to force doctors and health providers to care for the indigent, the government should foot the bill. And the rate that uninsured patients pay surely shouldn’t be higher than the government is charged for the same services. That’s my opinion anyway, after paying close to $1000 out of my own pocket for a few stitches in my thumb from a cut I accidentally inflicted on myself during the summer between the time I graduated from law school and before I started working.

[quote]BostonBarrister wrote:
doogie wrote:
Nobody is forced to accept a credit card offer. If the offer sucks, don’t get the card. There is no justification for running up debt and then not paying because you decide it isn’t fair.

This is entirely true. However, the details of the offer should be plain, and claims should not directly contradict reality – that’s fraud. THe only reason my example isn’t explicit fraud is because the fees and interest are contingencies and not guaranteed to occur. However, would you like to place any bets concerning probability?[/quote]

Take this opportunity to join reality for a moment. The terms and conditions are now in large print on the back of any offer clearly explaining the promo rate, the go to rate and when the rates kick in.

Nobody makes people open the offer and sign the application, this is a choice.

Big business and yes - credit card companies -create a lot of jobs in this country.

When someone files bankruptcy and doesn’t pay their bills, consumers - yes the ones that do pay their bills- pick up the slack.

It isn’t fraud and isn’t even close. If you don’t like it -just pay cash.

[quote]Atreides wrote:

Take this opportunity to join reality for a moment. The terms and conditions are now in large print on the back of any offer clearly explaining the promo rate, the go to rate and when the rates kick in.

Nobody makes people open the offer and sign the application, this is a choice.

Big business and yes - credit card companies -create a lot of jobs in this country.

When someone files bankruptcy and doesn’t pay their bills, consumers - yes the ones that do pay their bills- pick up the slack.

It isn’t fraud and isn’t even close. If you don’t like it -just pay cash.
[/quote]

I’m much less concerned about expiring promotional rates than about how quickly and irreversibly an interest rate can shift from a regular rate to a penalty rate. The “irreversibly” part, and the fact that it is nearly impossible for consumers to protest imposed fees or penalties, should be very clear.

And it should be written in clear, plain English, not legalese – much like the regulations the SEC imposed some years ago on company filings (only somewhat successfully) or the requirement in many jurisdictions that the sections of a residential lease be explained in clear, plain language (more successful).

[quote]pbody03 wrote:

So I find it rather annoying when I see some one here running their mouths about how we are responsible for our own debts. We all are but shit happens, Bankruptcy = stealing, my ass. Just hope you never have to go through what I have. Bad things can happen to good people.[/quote]

Shit happens. So? Is that supposed to make it morally acceptable to pass that shit on to someone else? You ran up the debt, you lost your job. Why should the credit card companies take the hit for that?

Check it out.

[quote]BostonBarrister wrote:
Zeb wrote:
I simply want all of us to take personal responsibility for our actions. Hiding behind an easy bankruptcy law helps no one! Least of all the people who are in debt.

Zeb,

I agree, but I think it’s an incomplete and even counter-productive “reform” if it doesn’t address the practices of credit-card companies as well.[/quote]

Where we disagree is that you equate practices by certain credit card companines with consumers filing bankruptcy. I think that the consumer should be disciplined enough to know where he/she is probably already in over their head.

Update:

Senate Approves
Bill to Overhaul
Bankruptcy System

By MICHAEL SCHROEDER
Staff Reporter of THE WALL STREET JOURNAL
March 11, 2005; Page A3

WASHINGTON – The Republican-controlled Senate, brushing aside a flood of last-minute Democratic amendments, approved the most significant overhaul of the bankruptcy system in more than two decades.

By a vote of 74-25, lawmakers passed a bill that would require more people who file for personal bankruptcy protection to repay a portion of their debts.

The Republican majority accepted only a few minor amendments to the bill during debate during the past week, largely to satisfy House Republican majority leaders who have said they would accept the Senate version of the bankruptcy bill as long as it was unencumbered by substantive new provisions.

The Senate vote on the bill was delayed a day because of a battle over an amendment pushed by Democratic Sens. Paul Sarbanes of Maryland and Patrick Leahy of Vermont. The amendment would have stripped out language from the bill that allows investment banks that had underwritten securities for a company before it sought bankruptcy protection to continue representing the same company during the proceedings.

Amendment supporters believe such continuing investment-bank relationships represent a clear conflict, especially in the aftermath of scandals such as WorldCom Inc. That view received support from Securities and Exchange Commission Chairman William Donaldson, who has said permitting such arrangements would be “a mistake.”

Opponents argued the amendment would provide a near-monopoly on bankruptcy work for the two biggest backers of the measure: Lazard and Blackstone Group, both New York investment firms that do almost no securities underwriting. The amendment, which likely wouldn’t have imperiled House support, was voted down 55 to 44.

The Senate version of the bankruptcy bill is expected to move quickly through the House, which passed a nearly identical bill by a 265-99 vote in January 2004. The low turnout then resulted from members not having returned to Washington from the holiday break.

As a first step, the House Judiciary Committee is tentatively scheduled to approve the Senate version of the bill Wednesday. The full House likely will vote to approve the measure after a day or two of debate in the first week of April, following the two-week spring recess, according to Republican House staff.

An even faster timetable isn’t out of the question. Philip Corwin, an outside attorney for the American Bankers Association, said it still is possible the House leadership could send the bill to the floor for a vote immediately after committee action next week. Supporters, including credit-card companies, banks and retailers, are pressing for a quick vote to avoid giving opponents an additional two weeks to sway undecided members with any negative media coverage of the bill.

The new rules would go into effect six months after the bill is signed into law by President Bush, who has said he supports the overhaul.

Henry Sommer, president of the National Association of Consumer Bankruptcy Attorneys, said passage of the legislation may produce a “bulge of people who might file earlier” for bankruptcy than they had planned. The numbers also may jump in the next few months as a result of attorneys advertising “that the law would become less favorable” to filers, Mr. Sommer said.

The bankruptcy legislation is aimed at limiting consumers’ use of Chapter 7 of the U.S. Bankruptcy Code to wipe out credit-card bills or loans unsecured by a house or other assets. Under a new means test, filers with income higher than their state’s median income who can pay at least $6,000 over five years – $100 a month – would be forced into Chapter 13, where a judge would order a repayment plan.

Among other provisions, people would be required to pay for credit counseling six months before filing for bankruptcy protection. Certain types of debt can’t be wiped out in bankruptcy, including child support, alimony, student loans and most taxes.

Backers of the legislation argue that the bankruptcy system has become increasingly abused by compulsive shoppers, divorced or separated fathers avoiding child support, and wealthy debtors who shield assets in trusts or through loopholes in the law. Opponents say the bill would penalize middle-income workers, single mothers, minorities and the elderly, and would remove a safety net for those who have lost their jobs or face big medical bills.

Only a few amendments were added to the bill, including a provision offered by Sen. Edward Kennedy (D., Mass.) stipulating that corporate insiders can’t receive retention bonuses to remain with a company while it is being reorganized unless he or she has received a job offer from another company. The turnaround-company industry lobbied unsuccessfully the past few days to have that measure removed.

Another significant amendment approved by the Senate directs bankruptcy judges to give special consideration in the means test to low-income veterans, active-duty service members and veterans with serious medical conditions.

The bill also has a little-noticed but important provision that is designed to prevent systemic financial crises by letting creditors close out their derivatives contracts with companies that have filed for bankruptcy.

Although the provision has been long pushed by the Federal Reserve Board, the Treasury Department and big financial-services companies, it has been attached for years to failed past bankruptcy-overhaul legislation. The law would reduce risk by allowing swaps and other financial contracts to be unraveled quickly and easily, without the approval of slow-moving bankruptcy courts.

Write to Michael Schroeder at mike.schroeder@wsj.com

Shit happens was my whole point. Do you think I purposely lost my job so I could declare and not pay my debt, hello? The poor credit card company, you mean the one that made more off me in interest and service charges than my total debt to them? You mean the company that jumped all over me at the first chance even though I had been a good on time paying customer? You mean the company that makes huge profits from gouging the consumer with outlandish rates and services charges? You mean the ones that have insurance and contingency funds for this very thing? Yup I feel real bad for them.

Do you seriously think I ran to bankruptcy as my first option? You don’t know my circumstances and I’m not about to discuss them with you. Of course I got off really easy didn’t I? Lost my vehicle, my job, screwed my credit for the better part of a decade. Yup just what I wanted. If you are ever in this position, and I hope you aren’t, maybe you won’t be so arrogant, but hey it’ll never happen to you, right? I guess I’m just morally bankrupt as well eh?

From Redstate.org:

http://www.redstate.org/story/2005/3/10/105835/413

The bankruptcy bill ( http://politology.us/archives/2005/03/bankruptcy_prot.php ) before the Congress is bad law, bad practice, and an example of bad faith with the common people whom elected officials presumably serve. When it passes – and it will – it will be thanks purely to the Republican Party.

I’m not going to bore you with a million links to analyses of the bill and its politics – they are found easily enough. The point here is fairly simple: The bill is basically a gift to corporate lenders that tightens requirements on consumers while paradoxically loosening restrictions on credit card companies. The argument for the bill goes something like this: The record number of bankruptcies in America is indicative of a lack of personal responsibility made possible through too-lax bankruptcy laws; these bankruptcies in turn force up costs and interest rates for responsible consumers; ergo, if we tighten bankruptcy requirements, American consumers and the credit industry will be better off.

This argument is almost wholly false for several reasons:

It’s already plenty difficult to declare bankruptcy for the average consumer. I know because I’ve seen it, and I also know that it is a profoundly humiliating process that forever follows and tarnishes a person’s good name and good credit. The notion that bankruptcy is somehow easy and easily abused to be deeply offensive. Make no mistake: there are those who abuse it nonetheless; but the solution to this is existing enforcement, not en masse punishment.

The record number of bankruptcies in America is not the fault of consumers so much as it’s the fault of credit companies willing to extend credit to pretty much anyone, independent of their means or station. When I lived in Brooklyn, one of my roommates was unemployed for almost a full year. After six months of unemployment, he did an experiment and saved all the pre-approved credit offers he received. The result: in one month, this unemployed 26-year old was offered almost a hundred thousand dollars in preapproved credit. That the bankruptcy bill does zero to address this corporate malfeasance – a major and easily-addressed cause of the bankruptcy rate – is absurd.

To my knowledge, there is no empirical evidence establishing a relationship between bankruptcies and credit interest rates. The latter remain wildly variable, indicating that the credit companies have plenty of leeway. Furthermore, there is no empirical evidence that credit companies – or any businesses involved in forms of lending – are suffering more than ordinary cost-of-business risk from bankruptcies. This is a red herring.

The people affected by this bill are almost exclusively the desperate and the stupid. While we ought to have little problem allowing the latter their fate, having been amongst the former, I believe compassion demands something more for them than a simple tightening of the screws. But then, compassion appears to have no place amongst the Republicans pushing this wretched law:

[i]Republicans also defeated an amendment that would have permitted seniors entering bankruptcy to protect $75,000 of the value of their homes, as well as one that would have exempted from the means test family members forced into bankruptcy by the need to care for a sick relative.

And the GOP rebuffed an effort by Sen. Daniel K. Akaka (D-Hawaii) to force credit card companies to disclose to their clients how long it would take to pay off their balances if they made only the minimum payments.[/i]

Republicans also defeated an amendment that would have permitted seniors entering bankruptcy to protect $75,000 of the value of their homes, as well as one that would have exempted from the means test family members forced into bankruptcy by the need to care for a sick relative.

And the GOP rebuffed an effort by Sen. Daniel K. Akaka (D-Hawaii) to force credit card companies to disclose to their clients how long it would take to pay off their balances if they made only the minimum payments.

This is on us, folks. This is on the Republican Party. It’s going to hurt a lot of people; it is a pure giveaway to business sectors that need no state help; and it makes us look like the corporate toadies we apparently are. Shame.

[quote]Cory089 wrote:
Check it out.

[/quote]

Cory,

If you believe this article, that study is misconstrued (however, I still have a problem with medical pricing):

February 11, 2005, 7:35 a.m.
Misdiagnosed
A medical-bankruptcy study doesn?t live up to its billing.

By Gail Heriot

“Half of Bankruptcy Due to Medical Bills ? US Study.” ( http://wireservice.wired.com/wired/story.asp?section=Breaking&storyId=984336&tw=wn_wire_story ) At least so said the Reuters headline in last week’s story. And similar stories in newspapers across the country agree. Soon it will be repeated as gospel on Capitol Hill and by the chattering classes everywhere. ( http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A9447-2005Feb8.html ) Understandably, middle-class Americans have started to feel a little queasy about their health and about the adequacy of their health insurance.

The fundamental problem is that it isn’t true. Despite what the authors have encouraged us to believe, the Harvard study, entitled “Illness and Injuries As Contributors to Bankruptcy,” ( http://content.healthaffairs.org/cgi/content/full/hlthaff.w5.63/DC1 ) isn’t really about medical bills, crushing or otherwise. It’s about bankruptcies that can ? at least if you’re willing to stretch things a bit ? be classified as medically related. It finds that 54.5 percent of all bankruptcies have “a medical cause.” But “medical cause” is used as a term of art here. In fact, the study does not claim that injury or illness was the primary cause of those bankruptcies. And, perhaps more importantly, it does not claim that the bankruptcies were caused by the crush of medical bills.

Don’t get me wrong. Some bankruptcies are caused by crushing medical debt. But they aren’t half of all bankruptcies, and the only way to create the impression they are is to jimmy the figures. For example, the study classifies “uncontrolled gambling,” “drug addiction,” “alcohol addiction,” and the birth or adoption of a child as “a medical cause,” regardless of whether medical bills are involved. Yes, there may be situations in which a researcher might legitimately want to classify those conditions as “medical,” but a study that is being used to prove that Americans are going bankrupt as a result of crushing medical bills is not one of them. A father who has gambled away his family’s mortgage payment is not likely the victim of crushing medical bills. Similarly, new parents who find they can no longer afford their previous lifestyle now that one of them has to stay home with the baby will usually find the obstetrician’s bill the least of their problems. Babies are a financial hardship even when hospitals give them away free.

Maybe that’s why only 28.3 percent of the surveyed debtors themselves agreed with the authors that their bankruptcy was substantially caused by “illness or injury.” The rest put the blame elsewhere, even when the study labeled their problems as at least in part “medical.”

Buried in the study is the fact that only 27 percent of the surveyed debtors had unreimbursed medical expenses exceeding $1,000 over the course of the two years prior to their bankruptcy. Presumably 73 percent ? the vast majority ? had medical expenses during that two-year period of $1,000 or less. Had that figure been recited up front, it would have been obvious that the proportion of bankruptcies driven by unmanageable medical debt was nowhere near half.

Nobody likes to pay $1,000 in medical expenses even when they get two years to do it in, but for most Americans (particularly those with enough at stake to seek the protection of bankruptcy) it is not catastrophic. Indeed, for many families it is utterly routine. Something else is going on in the overwhelming majority of these bankruptcies, whether it’s gambling debt, drug or alcohol addiction, child care expenses, divorce, loss of a job, or just plain out-of-control spending. The authors’ decision to include any case in which the debtor had paid out more than $1000 in medical expenses in the course of two years as a bankruptcy with a “medical cause” is not just questionable. It’s downright misleading.

What would be significant for the public to know is how common the cases of bankruptcy due to crushing medical debt actually are ? debt in the range of $10,000 or more in single year. That, however, is something the study is careful not to disclose, even though the raw data behind the study would appear to be sufficient to make such computations possible. Instead, at every turn, the authors present the data in ways that encourage the reader to misidentify medical expenses as the leading cause of bankruptcy.

For example, at one point the reader is told that the mean out-of-pocket medical expenditure for an illness-related bankruptcy is $11,854. But this is not the average for the 54.5 percent of bankruptcies that the study holds to have “a medical cause;” it’s the average for the much smaller group (28.3 percent) in which the debtor agreed that illness and injury played a substantial role. And the $11,854 figure is not for the year or two prior to the bankruptcy, but for the entire period of the illness, which may be many years or even decades. Finally, and most importantly, it is a mean and not a median. Just one truly catastrophic illness costing a total of $6 million over the course of any length of time would be enough to put the group’s mean at above $12,000, even if nobody else in the sample ever spent a dime on medical bills. It’s hard to see why a serious scholar would use the mean instead of the median if the point of the study is to demonstrate fairly that a large proportion of bankruptcies are caused by medical bills. Means don’t show that.

At least one of the authors ? Dr. Steffie Woolhandler, a Cambridge Hospital internist and associate professor of medicine at Harvard, makes it clear that she does indeed have an agenda ? health-care coverage that is universal and comprehensive. “Covering the uninsured isn’t enough. We must also upgrade and guarantee continuous coverage for those who have insurance,” she said in a statement. She went on to condemn employers and politicians who advocate what she called “stripped-down plans, so riddled with co-payments, deductibles and exclusions that serious illness leads straight to bankruptcy.”

But Dr. Woolhandler’s diagnostic skills leave something to be desired here. If medical debt is not the problem in these bankruptcies, more comprehensive health-care coverage is not the solution. Indeed, in some cases, it may even be counterproductive. For employers (and employees), coverage without deductibles and copayments will mean more expensive health-care coverage. Some may try to make up the difference by cutting corners on disability insurance or by hiring fewer employees. Will that in the long run lead to fewer bankruptcies? Or more? This study sheds no light on those questions. Only by torturing to data has Dr. Woolhandler made it appear that it does.

? Gail Heriot is a professor of law at the University of San Diego.

Also, get this.

Here’s a link to some of the rejected amendments:

Some were ridiculous and obviously meant to derail the bill.

However, look at #37:

Nelson (FL) Amdt. No. 37; To exempt debtors from means testing if their financial problems were caused by identity theft.

Thoughts?

[quote]BostonBarrister wrote:
From what I’ve seen of it so far, I don’t like it. While I generally lean libertarian in contracting, the fact that I consider credit-card offers virtually fraudulent (libertarians hate fraud)[Here’s a link to a recent report on credit-card company practices: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A10361-2005Mar5.html ] leads me to take the position that credit companies should shoulder the burden of offering credit to bad credit risks, rather than making it easier for them to get at assets – especially given the very liberal rules regarding the addition of late penalties and increased interest rates.[/quote]

Sorry for getting into the discussion so late (I’ve been away) but I’d like to still have the opportunity to agree with you. :slight_smile:

Yes, Bankrupcy should only be used as a last resort, and I’ve always said that there has to be something wrong in regions that have suspiciously high bankrupcy filing rates.

However, I too believe this bill will give an incentive to credit companies to adopt even less ethical practices, and can potentially put a lot of people in very bad situations – including more people ending up living on the street.

Several people have mentioned there are many reasons people can find themselves in a situation they cannot pay their bills; it’s not limited to ignorance or stupidity. Sometimes it’s sheer bad luck – a stupid accident, an unexpected health crisis, or even a crash on the real estate market.

For example, even though the Bay Area has currently a somewhat low incidence of bankrupcies, the real estate market is at an all-time high. With several lenders financing 100% of the house price, and people getting fired everyday due to outsourcing, and having to go back to college, imagine what will happen if suddenly the bubble bursts and the house prices come crashing down…

Here’s my solution… I don’t know if anyone ever thought of it before, but it makes sense to me. Have “negotiation only” health insurance. It wouldn’t pay out for anything, but it would be extremely low cost, and the company would have to negotiate rates for services the same way that normal insurance companies do. That would solve the problem of disparate health-care costs based due to being uninsured. Simple!

[quote]BostonBarrister wrote:
In a nutshell, patients who are uninsured pay a much higher rate for the same services than does the government (medicare) or insurance companies. The ones who pay are made to subsidize the hospitals and other health providers for the profit margins they lose on their other contracts and the indigent patients that hospitals are required to treat by law.
[/quote]

The idea that bankrupcy makes life difficult for those who file is absurd. I don’t know what it is like elsewhere. But here in Ohio we have billboards everwhere saying- Hey we’ll finance it here. Bankruptcy, divorce, chargoffs, bad credit? NO Problem here.

These people pay 8 percent on their car loans instead of 4. Big deal.

And credit cards? I know of two banks that will open with you the day after you file. Life is oh so hard… yeah right.

[quote]Atreides wrote:
The idea that bankrupcy makes life difficult for those who file is absurd. I don’t know what it is like elsewhere. But here in Ohio we have billboards everwhere saying- Hey we’ll finance it here. Bankruptcy, divorce, chargoffs, bad credit? NO Problem here.

These people pay 8 percent on their car loans instead of 4. Big deal.

And credit cards? I know of two banks that will open with you the day after you file. Life is oh so hard… yeah right. [/quote]

I bet they get great rates; 8% on a car loan vs 4% is a big fucking deal over 4-5 yrs on a 30,000 loan.

[quote]Snoop wrote:
I bet they get great rates; 8% on a car loan vs 4% is a big fucking deal over 4-5 yrs on a 30,000 loan. [/quote]

If you just filed for bankruptcy and you’re looking to buy a $30K car, then you’re only proving the point of people who are arguing that you don’t know how to manage money.

Atreides wrote:

The idea that bankrupcy makes life difficult for those who file is absurd. I don’t know what it is like elsewhere. But here in Ohio we have billboards everwhere saying- Hey we’ll finance it here. Bankruptcy, divorce, chargoffs, bad credit? NO Problem here.

These people pay 8 percent on their car loans instead of 4. Big deal.

And credit cards? I know of two banks that will open with you the day after you file. Life is oh so hard… yeah right.

I see, since you haven’t filed for bankruptcy or applied for credit afterword, you’re an expert on the matter. Let me explain how it works( in Canada anyway).

First your credit is screwed for 6 years on paper. That’s just great. Yup I can just walk into any of those car dealerships and get a new vehicle providing I have a large cash down payment and pay crazy, 18-24% interest rates. Yup it’s just great. I can also get a credit card as well by coming up with a cash deposit. I don’t know why I waited so long to do this, smell those roses.

Things might be easier in Ohio, but I doubt it’s a cake walk as you appear to think or everyone would be doing it now wouldn’t they. Of course only people with no or little moral backbone that are looking for a free ride declare bankruptcy. Care to join me? I bet not.

Aren’t businesses supposed to price their products to cover defaults (bankruptcy and so on), shoplifting and other shrinkage? Don’t we already pay for this?

Is this supposed to lower prices and interest rates or something?

[quote]BostonBarrister wrote:

Nelson (FL) Amdt. No. 37; To exempt debtors from means testing if their financial problems were caused by identity theft.

Thoughts?[/quote]

Unfuckingbelievable.

In a nutshell, the government that is elected to represent ME thinks that it’s perfectly fine for a company to send out a pre-approved credit application, containing personal information, via USPS mail, and if that information is then stolen and used against me it is entirely MY problem.

I just opened one as I was reading this, an envelope from one of my CC banks promising “Instant Tax Relief”. Inside are several checks preprinted with my name, address and account number. So now all anyone would need a a reasonable approximation of my signature and a few other easily obtainable pieces of information and they could tap this $10k line of credit. I wouldn’t pay it, because I hadn’t used it and likely wouldn’t even look closely at the statements. In a few months the debt would about double due to interest and penalties, and then it would be in default. All my problem, and the person who did this to me could have opened other accounts in my name, racking up hundreds of thousands of dollars of debt in my name.

Thanks to MY representative government, which is looking out for me, I can no longer file for chapter 7, I must file under chapter 13 and repay the debts that aren’t mine. But the best news is that I can’t protect my house or any other asset from means testing. How great is that?

Yes, I can probably eventually prove my claim that it wasn’t me, but likely not before I’ve been completely financially ruined.

But hey, all those nice people who work for credit card companies still have a job, and that’s whats really important here.

[quote]Atreides wrote:
The idea that bankrupcy makes life difficult for those who file is absurd. I don’t know what it is like elsewhere. But here in Ohio we have billboards everwhere saying- Hey we’ll finance it here. Bankruptcy, divorce, chargoffs, bad credit? NO Problem here.

These people pay 8 percent on their car loans instead of 4. Big deal.

And credit cards? I know of two banks that will open with you the day after you file. Life is oh so hard… yeah right. [/quote]

8 percent? I guess I should move to Ohio. I filed bankruptcy in 1997, and financed a car 2 1/2 years later at 19.5%. That’s a far cry from 8%. In fact, last summer, in 2004, I financed a truck and the best I could get was 10%. This is 7 years after the bankruptcy.

You know 2 banks that will open accounts with me the day after I file? I doubt that. You’re saying I drop the papers off at the bankruptcy court and, before anything is approved or a judge even looks at them, the next day I can have 2 new credit cards. Like I said, I don’t think so.

But, let’s say that is true. Isn’t that exactly what BB and others are referring to with the credit company’s unethical practices? They’re preying on someone in a financial crisis. You can’t tell me that the day after someone files, they are suddenly ready to take on new credit and debt.

I don’t know that facts on this, but I believe that most credit card companies have already made their monies worth well before the individual files bankruptcy. The interest and fees after only a few short months probably more than covers the amount borrowed.

The bottom line is that finance and credit companies prey on the ignorant and uninformed. Sure, no one is making these people accept credit offers, but they sure look attractive. There’s very little out there in terms of educating people in financial responsibilty. Some don’t learn until it is too late and bankruptcy is the only option.