That’s surprising 
I’m like 5’10’'.
Don’t take this the wrong way but if your 5’10” and 187 Lbs and have your current build I don’t think you have much muscle on your frame at all.
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Yeah, I’m inclined to agree here - basically, that’s why I’m asking in this thread
I honestly think using both of the apps I suggested would be a good idea. You get daily/weekly direction. It seems that maybe that’s what you need.
Is the lid you referenced your current training kit on this site?
Okay so you feel you don’t have much muscle on your frame, but also recognize that you are too fat.
I really don’t advise that you intentionally gain 15+lbs of fat just to see what it looks like.
Your responses are very inconsistent.
Widen your field of view to see beyond the next 3 months. If you want to bulk anyways, do that. If you want to cut first, cool. But pick one and really stick to it. It seems that you’re floating between the two and finding yourself not making progress… which tends to happen if you’re not intentionally moving in any direction.
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I didn’t mean to be inconsistent - I aim to put on mass and my plan was to gain up to like 205lbs (of course, not only fat) and cut afterwards, as I’d much prefer to feel temporarily overweight, than small. If you think it’s impossible in my current shape, I’ll have to cut.
Otherwise yeah, I recognize, that I’m neither muscular nor lean, in other words, not in a great shape overall
I posted my question, because I actively tried only to bulk and it didn’t work - which I got some tips for now, fortunately.
Yeah, probably that’s the way to go now…
Also, what do you mean by
Is the lid you referenced your current training kit on this site?
Theres nothing about your plan that is impossible.
Its the difference between you losing 20lbs to look good now, and losing 35-40lbs to look a little better later.
Losing body fat is rather difficult, particularly when you’re looking at 40-some weeks to get lean.
Do as you will, I’m rooting for you either way.
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Appreciate the tag dude.
Didn’t have a chance to get in on this early, but with the current direction of things, check this out
Specifically this part
And then, from there, I’d get in on a mass gaining program, LIKE Mass Made Simple. I’d go for the book, rather than the article.
I have a very different approach to eating compared to what’s been advocated here. So if that DOESN’T work for you, I could pitch a different approach as well. Or it may be an approach you employ FOR this leaning out phase, if you go in this direction.
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Thank you very much! I’ll have a look at the program. Also, while I do believe, that bulking after cutting is better, I’m really afraid to do this, as I see, how many problems to bulk I have now. If possible, I’d much prefer to bulk somewhat now, at least to see, that I’m able to “control” it, and cut afterwards, when I’m sure, I’m able to “bulk back”, if it makes any sense
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Rather than look at the program, what did you think about what Dan wrote there?
Late to the game here, but I don’t have much to add after these guys all gave you such good advice and info. If you decide to continue with the bulk - I’d suggest consistency. Put a plan in place that has you getting the protein, carbs and fat you need to keep the scale going the direction you want it to go. Follow that plan every single day until it stops working or you get to where you want to be. Don’t overthink it. There’s no magical formula or food, but solid, consistent nutrition works every time.
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Oh, thank you for the reaction, too!
So, just based on my weight, what amount of kcals and carbs would you recommend? Something around 3500kcals and 300g of carbs per day?
Like, getting the body “under stress” of losing weight and making it to gain the muscle faster afterwards? I’d personally expect to gain a lot of fat then, but Dan John is obviously more knowledgeable than me, so, it makes sense, obviously
Sorry using my phone. Autocorrect sucks sometime.
I asked if the link you posted is your current training log?
Happens to the best of us
Yeah, Journey to size is my current training log. I wasn’t using it lately, as I was literally moving to another country and all the trainings I logged only fast into my cell phone.
Dan John is good stuff.
Try finding a copy of Super Squats by Randall Strossen. Read it, then squat. I think you drink milk as well.
May you reach your goals.
Try to keep the log updated so we can see what’s going on and where you may be going wrong and what your doing right.
Why is that? Do you imagine bodybuilders who come out of a competition phase of getting lean gain a lot of fat?
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I don’t think the program is a great fit for you. Taking 10 minutes between sets, and doing all the work but not being able to progress are signs that you’re not really recovering between workouts. You’re too fatigued to kick ass and make gains.
You’ve mentioned a few times how you did better lifting 3 times per week. Now you’re doubling that, lifting 5-6 times. That’s a lot for anyone.
If you want to stick with this routine you might consider adding a day off here and there, so you’re training less. And getting more time to recover and build some strength between workouts.
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