I was a non competitive, but aesthetically capable of doing so, bodybuilder for 20 years. Standing at 5’ 8”, 10% bf, 250lbs. I began with the same stats but weighing 126lbs.
The reason I’m sharing those stats is so you can be assured that after two decades of committed lifting, optimization of my diet, advanced manipulation of PED’s, and a scientific academic background in the field, by the final stages of my physique development career, I was certainly beyond the level of development that my natural genetic ability could have brought, high doses of AAS and HGH et al, only foster relatively minor gains at that point.
I agree, we need to be specific when discussing these variables
So we’re aiming our AAS advice only to those who are 260+ lean? NONE of us are qualified to give guidance to those in this position (except maybe @brooks2).
Moreover, no one in this category of human is spending their time here, asking questions about “what should my next cycle be???”. So if we’re calibrating our advice only to apply to mutants, this Pharma section can RIP.
OP is 5’7, 185lbs and 15-20% BF. Why we’re discussing the genetic outliers in this conversation is beyond me.
The thing is I’ve decided to only cut for a short-time year round and do a quick cut (for a month or two). A lot of people here have suggested doing that before. So naturally, there will be blasts and cruises throughout the year so were you suggesting doing a bulk every time I cruise and doing a cut every time I blast? How would that work with my mini-cut plan? Honestly, it’s my first time cruising and blasting
Also, I may have exaggerated about my bfp, sorry I don’t have access to the bfp calculator at the moment. I was 7-8% not too long ago and I still look “alright” so I’m probably less than 15%.
I have always liked to approach a discussion with defined foul lines.
What is a good cycle (or blast) for a 120lb man?
What is a good cycle (or blast) for an advanced bodybuilder who weighs 280+lbs?
Most all of us are on the playing field between the 120lb skinny young man and the 280+lb elite bodybuilder.
When I started using AAS weighing about 180lbs I made good progress on low AAS doses. As I added muscle, I felt the need to increase my weekly dosage in order to add more muscle. It seemed to be the case based on my feedback of getting stronger, or not.
I believe most on here would believe that the more muscle you get above your natural level, the more AAS you will need to add even more muscle. We are discussing a spectrum. What is the best cycle for the OP today won’t be sufficient if he gains 20lbs of muscle in the next few years.
@hankthetank89 is discussing one of the foul lines. I see zero harm in that and actually see it as valuable input.
You don’t think arguing the exception is an automatic foul line?
NO ONE who weighs 260lbs lean is coming here to take this advice. There are far more serious AAS boards who have members actually meeting these stats; why they aren’t here, i wonder?
Yes. Typical 3 month bulk, 3 month cut. Longer mass phases are unnecessarily slow (unless you are a genetic freak, because we have to disclose that now apparently).
^this will allow you to stay 10-15%BF year round, which helps to optimize nutrient partitioning.
^^semi-bro science
Foul lines define the edges of the playing field. It is instructive to know the edges of the playing field. If the 120lb skinning man by some strange happenstance became an elite 280+lb bodybuilder, he would be gradually increasing his AAS dosage as he gained more muscle.
But it is ridiculous for the 120lb man take the same dosage as when he became 280+lbs. He would be wasting most of the AAS.
I, in no wise, was suggesting that anyone elite would come here for AAS advice. It is just instructive in how much a lighter man might use.
If you cannot see my point, we just don’t analyze problems anything alike. I approach the need to increase AAS when I no longer respond to the current dosage. I use a metric as feedback to determine adjustments. I don’t take dosage advice as gospel. I test everything.
Noted for next time, thanks! I wanna try this bulking all year round+minicut first that a lot of folks here suggested. In general, I enjoy bulking better. I look alright at this point in terms of leanness and I’ve gained almost 20 lbs of muscle without gaining too much fat (I think Winny a few months ago helped a lot). I still see some cuts on my abs at the moment, so if this gets bad then I’ll do more cutting. It’s my first time cruising and blasting so I’m still experimenting.
Yes. Common practice would be aligning the playing field to the sport being played (the individual being discussed) and the audience (people on this forum/that will listen to this advice). I still think it unnecessary to keep clarifying this; arguing the exception is saying “yeah but…” to an otherwise correct point. Let’s call that a foul line?
I can answer this. If you have read my comments on this thread they have only addressed adding muscle.
I competed in the 1970’s, 1980’s, and 1990’s, where I never “blasted and cruised.” I only ran cycles. I wasn’t aware of the Blast and Cruise method of using AAS.
I didn’t comment about “cutting” because the only reason I ever “cut” was for a competition, where I managed to stumble upon 70+ trophies. And yes, I tested everything I knew to test.
I bulked on AAS and I cut on AAS. I used the same dosages, apart from the last 10 days before a competition.
We should definetly mention that, if we give out info that is true only in certain cases. What i dont like about online steroid info is that when i google stuff, 99% info is garbage, which is either posted by 160lbs teens, or posted to them.
So what i disliked about your previous info is that you put out info that guys can build muscle on larger amounts of drugs, when cutting. Which is only true for a beginner who shouldnt be using steroids in the first place.
Like the typical myth that 350mgs of tren is a big dose, is garbage put out by a 150lb teenager, who took that dose and gained 30lbs… Now there are grown men, with experience, taking 350mgs and thinking “where are my 30lbs?”.
The info we put out should be universal, or we should specify that its only for undertrained people who still can gain natty.
Why are we giving him steroid advice??? He actually has gotten advice to eat and train like a normal person for 2-3 years more and then come back. He ignored it all. He is taking god knows which steroid cycle, to be the size of an average person on the street. Now you feeding people like that info on how he can cut and gain at the same time, on lots of steroids, this moron is gonna do 1g of tren, thinking he will end up 230lbs and 8% bodyfat in 3 months. The dude has no idea what it means to gain anything natty, but after reading info like that he will definetly try the cycle.
People below 200lbs with bodyfat as high as 20%, should not take steroids.
Unless weirdly short, a man should be able to be 220lbs at 20% BF normally…not even training that hard.
The guy is smaller than i was at 18. I started at 147lbs when i was 15, i was 200 when i was 18, and all i did was add some big macs to my daily eating, and did some moronic splits i had seen on the internet.
A person should be able to be a chubby 200-220 - it just shows he can eat.
Doing 5 cycles to get where any normal person gets natural, is just ridiculous.
Giving serious advice about tren recomps, and gaining size on a cut on a load of steroids, to people who cant even count basic calories and train basic lifts for 2 years, is just crazy to me.
LOL I literally followed your advice last time and honestly I’m satisfied. I could say your advice sucked but I wouldn’t do it to spite you for being a b*ch here lol I gained almost 20 lbs, mostly lean (probably thanks to Winny for keeping the fat off that I’d otherwise get if I were natty and eating this much). And NO, I disagree with what you said about bulking natural—I think I’d be fatter now if I was natty and eating this much!
I know you based that on the bfp that I put which isn’t accurate, maybe I should’ve not said that because I haven’t had access to a bfp machine since I was 7% during a cutting Tren-Mast-Test cycle (the leanest I’ve ever been). That was just a guess.
So you’re right, I’m gonna continue my cruise and blast no matter what.
sigh No one’s answered my question yet, so I guess I’m gonna go with the most gentle compounds which Deca (first time) and Test, followed by a cruise, and save the harsher compounds for my cutting blast in the summer time. Any other insights, please let me know.
And no, my bfp may or may not be 15%-20%. I don’t know, it was a guess. I’ll try to find a machine asap and post the results here.
No man, you didnt follow anyones advice. You have made 10 topics on what steroids you should use, and in every single one, people were telling you to learn to eat and train.
You ignored my advice, and only took the part you liked, that was a general discussion.
Ofc, because my advice is about what works. But it doesnt change the fact that most people get your numbers natty. You just waste gear and risk health to get stuff that is FREE.
Every girl i have trained, gains 20lbs in the first year, just by learning to count macros, total calories and doing basic barbell movements.
You have created more topics on steroids here than anyone else, but you are still smaller than my father or grandfather who never trained, or me when i was 18yr old, natty and didnt know anything about anything.
The advice from me, and everyone else, 2 years ago, when you started making topics, was that you need to eat and train, and leave drugs alone for some years. You ignored that advice. You took the parts you liked about general discussion about drugs and dosages and did cycle after a cycle, and guess what - after all this time on steroids, you are around 10lbs heavier and with the same childish mentality.
As soon as you go off, you will lose those lousy 10lbs also, because nothing besides drugs are holding them.
By starting way too soon, and because you never learned to eat and train, you are smaller than average natty dude in the gym and despite being on steroids long enough, you still didnt manage to max the natty gains… you actually grow less on steroids, than i can make a natty woman grow by just knowing basics.
I gained almost 20 lbs, mostly lean (probably thanks to Winny for keeping the fat off that I’d otherwise get if I were natty and eating this much). And NO, I disagree with what you said about bulking natural—I think I’d be fatter now if I was natty and eating this much!