He’s over 50 years old, is conditioned like few I’ve ever seen, and steps on stage at around 170. Not much, I know, but look at his body fat (basically none!) and he is not very tall.
Now, I know that achieving a body like this naturally could conceivably be possible, but after 50, in a country where steroids are legal and very readily available, at that level of conditioning…really? Also, there are some pretty damn big guys in this country competing at the top level. If you really want examples I can post them.
The thing is, all of the upper level bb competitions in this country are tested. All of them. They test about one month out from the shows. So, ostensibly, all of the top level Japanese bodybuilders are natural. I just don’t believe this to be so. And I’m certain it is the same for natural shows everywhere else, too.
So this is my question: How do these guys pass the drug tests? Is it masking agents? Do they just use short acting drugs and drop them before the tests and then megadose as soon as the test is finished? From anybody who knows anything about this, I would love to hear of the methods in which these tests are foiled. What do you think?
I think its possible with someone who has super superior genetics! Every now and again there are a few who fall into this category.
The thing is, AAS not being used in bb competions is unheard of! So even someone with super superior genetics would most likely not be comparable to those with less superior genetics who use AAS.
My thought is this…They are definately using AAS, but its the Japanese, some of the most inventive people in the world! They probably invented a way to pass the test which they probably invented! Or definately masking agents.
Yeah one has to be very skeptical regarding athletes who call themselves natural.
I won’t point fingers at anywone, however there are a lot of natural shows out there being competed in by bodybuilders who just go ‘off’ long enough prior to a contest to not get caught. This is unfair of course to the BB who are truly forever natural by strong personal choice, however, it happens routinely.
There was a news article posted in the “news from the frontlines” or wahtever thread saying that asians had a really high percentage of their population that lacked an enzyme or something that made AAS detectable in their urine.
Personally I think its really low to use and enter a natural show. I have nothing against use in general though.
[quote]Defekt wrote:
There was a news article posted in the “news from the frontlines” or wahtever thread saying that asians had a really high percentage of their population that lacked an enzyme or something that made AAS detectable in their urine.
Personally I think its really low to use and enter a natural show. I have nothing against use in general though. [/quote]
I think so too. But, for me, that only applies to countries where there is a clear distinction between “natural” and whatever you call the other kind of show. Here, there is no distinction, ALL upper-level shows are tested. And a quick look around will tell you that most of the guys stepping on stage over 190 ripped, who are Japanese, who are under 5’9", are probably anything but natural.
I still would like to know, however, what exactly it is these guys do to pass their tests? I would love to see an example cycle that one would run that takes into account being tested one month out from a show.
Testing for anabolic steroids (in other words, artificial testosterone) was introduced in the 1970s, and the incidence of cheating seems to have fallen dramatically as a result. The tests, however, are not foolproof. And a study just published in the Journal of Clinical Endocrinology & Metabolism by Jenny Jakobsson Schulze and her colleagues at the Karolinska Institute in Sweden suggests that an individual’s genetic make-up could confound them in two different ways. One genotype, to use the jargon, may allow athletes who use anabolic steroids to escape detection altogether. Another may actually be convicting the innocent.
The test usually employed for testosterone abuse relies on measuring the ratio of two chemicals found in the urine: testosterone glucuronide (TG) and epitestosterone glucuronide (EG). The former is produced when testosterone is broken down, while the latter is unrelated to testosterone metabolism, and can thus serve as a reference point for the test. Any ratio above four of the former to one of the latter is, according to official Olympic policy, considered suspicious and leads to more tests.
However, the production of TG is controlled by an enzyme that is, in turn, encoded by a gene called UGT2B17. This gene comes in two varieties, one of which has a part missing and therefore does not work properly. A person may thus have none, one or two working copies of UGT2B17, since he inherits one copy from each parent. Dr Schulze guessed that different numbers of working copies would produce different test results. She therefore gave healthy male volunteers whose genes had been examined a single 360mg shot of testosterone (the standard dose for legitimate medical use) and checked their urine to see whether the shot could be detected.
The result was remarkable. Nearly half of the men who carried no functional copies of UGT2B17 would have gone undetected in the standard doping test. By contrast, 14% of those with two functional copies of the gene were over the detection threshold before they had even received an injection. The researchers estimate this would give a false-positive testing rate of 9% in a random population of young men.
Dr Schulze also says there is substantial ethnic variation in UGT2B17 genotypes. Two-thirds of Asians have no functional copies of the gene (which means they have a naturally low ratio of TG to EG), compared with under a tenth of Caucasians�??something the anti-doping bodies may wish to take into account.
Awesome stuff, Schmazz. Although I think it complicates my question, rather than satisfactorily answering it. I wonder if these guys know, or if they just go in on a wing and a prayer, or what?
And as far as the other natural guys who do have a working copy of the gene, what is it they are doing?
I guess I’m asking how effective masking agents are. Or if anybody knows anything about them. Or if it is all just fast acting, 2-3X a day injections until a week before test time.
Since the tests look for that certain ratio. How would a masking agent make that ratio look “normal again”?
Cause in the Olympics if you get gold your tested. And if you happen to make up for a certain portion of the population that are fails. Your labeled a cheat and your athletic career goes down the tubes as well. Or you could end up in jail or something else for that matter.
Edit …re-read that article …wow I need coffee …tired!
Since the tests look for that certain ratio. How would a masking agent make that ratio look “normal again”?
Cause in the Olympics if you get gold your tested. And if you happen to make up for a certain portion of the population that are fails. Your labeled a cheat and your athletic career goes down the tubes as well. Or you could end up in jail or something else for that matter.
Edit …re-read that article …wow I need coffee …tired![/quote]
Epitest is classified as a “masking agent.”
Patrick Arnold used it in a cream to help keep his athletes T:E ratio in check, since they were also receiving higher doses of test, along with the THG.
[quote]Schmazz wrote:
dirtbag wrote:
Wow great thread…
Since the tests look for that certain ratio. How would a masking agent make that ratio look “normal again”?
Cause in the Olympics if you get gold your tested. And if you happen to make up for a certain portion of the population that are fails. Your labeled a cheat and your athletic career goes down the tubes as well. Or you could end up in jail or something else for that matter.
Edit …re-read that article …wow I need coffee …tired!
Epitest is classified as a “masking agent.”
Patrick Arnold used it in a cream to help keep his athletes T:E ratio in check, since they were also receiving higher doses of test, along with the THG.[/quote]
If that is the case and it is a masking agent. Why not just test for unusual levels of that substance in the sample.
Also if they do test for it could there not be genetically gifted people that can have higher then normal levels of this substance?
Sounds like a witch hunt more then science. If that was the case.
