Narcissism, Ego, Denial

Off Topic
41

[quote]jsbrook wrote:
Yup. It’s definitely narcissism and ego, in part. Having 20 inch arms and/or 6% bodyfat is very removed from being fit, strong, and healthy and having a body that performs and allows you to succeed in sports and activities of your choosing. Is it a bad thing? I would say no. I think more of it, though, is pushing yourself to your limits and seeing how far you can take it, in any case. No different that anything else. [/quote]

There are no people who succeed in sports with big arms while being lean?

42


Let me guess, he trained his arms and the rest of his body this way STRICTLY for sports and he is now less healthy and less athletic as a result? He never trained for esthetics at all?

43

I don’t have to lift just to stay alive.

I lift to live well.

Being more proud than you are good is a vice; not being as proud as you are good is a weakness. Being just as proud as you are good when you are not very good is modest; being great and knowing it is a virtue.

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http://images.t-nation.com/forum_images/1/0/1022870.1145334775369.1022833.1145333189759.002[1].jpg

[quote]malonetd wrote:
oboffill wrote:
We fuel our egos, fashion ourselves cavemen…

I fashion myself after this caveman.[/quote]

That’s one of those “clubbell” workouts, isn’t it?

45

Yep someone got those damn funny ciggarette’s out again.
People bag bodybuilders for loving themselves and looking at mirrors all day.
Just look at woman and a few boys :d they wear makeup every fuckin day and stand in front of the mirrir brushing their hair,they go for a piss OH lets look in the mirror for 10 mins,thats why it takes them soooo long when they go to the bathroom,they just fix themsleves up all the time in the mirror.
Same with all that fuckin pilaties or whatever u call it and all these stupid diets, zone,abc,hollywood,slimfast,eat nothing but ass all day ahhhhhhhhh i could go on forever.All for the sake of a better body.
So bodybuilders are not the only ones who check themselves out all day.

Rant over

K of K

46

[quote]Professor X wrote:
Massif wrote:
oboffill wrote:
Step back and look at the world in which we live.

This is the line that annoys me most. You take a look at the world we live in. It’s full of fat, weak-fleshed and weak-spirited heart attacks waiting to happen. It’s full of people who are too weak to stand behind a cash register without using a back brace. It’s full of people who are too fat to walk. It’s full of motherfuckers like you trying to justify the fact that you are soft and weak by saying you are the next evolution of the human race.

The only dudes who can justify not lifting because of technological advances is Davros or the Terminator (not Arnie, the actual terminator).

Why are there so many people who don’t lift seriously on this damn forum?! I just don’t get it. I don’t log into “MarthaStewart.com” and start asking why everyone is so damn concerned about what color their bed sheets are! I mean, what the living fuck do they get out of logging in here?

The main ones making posts about taking steps back to look at the world are usually the ones doing the LEAST with their lives on this planet in relation to anyone but themselves. I knew one competitor in NPC who made it a major issue to do community service programs for youth in the area. The guy was HUGE and I don’t think I ever saw him over 8% body fat. He would have meals in Tupperware in his car.

How foolish would it have been to judge him as if all he cared about was bodybuilding simply because he looked the way he did? Why do weak fuckers try to make themselves feel better by acting as if the guys who actually LOOK like they train seriously only care about bodybuilding?

You will find extremes in any aspect of life but you must be truly stupid to walk around stereotyping entire groups of people in a negative light.[/quote]

Well spoken Professor (or doctor) X. It’s nice to see someone say something intelligent and enlightening in this thread.

47

[quote]King of Kings wrote:
Yep someone got those damn funny ciggarette’s out again.
People bag bodybuilders for loving themselves and looking at mirrors all day.
Just look at woman and a few boys :d they wear makeup every fuckin day and stand in front of the mirrir brushing their hair,they go for a piss OH lets look in the mirror for 10 mins,thats why it takes them soooo long when they go to the bathroom,they just fix themsleves up all the time in the mirror.
Same with all that fuckin pilaties or whatever u call it and all these stupid diets, zone,abc,hollywood,slimfast,eat nothing but ass all day ahhhhhhhhh i could go on forever.All for the sake of a better body.
So bodybuilders are not the only ones who check themselves out all day.

Rant over

K of K[/quote]

Bodybuilders are jus the only one’s who make enough progress so you can actually see it. The SlimFast junkies care just as much just don’t see any results and you can’t tell they are into it so it is not as easy to pick on them; they have nothing tangible to show for it except a kitchen full of fat-free items that cram in sugar instead or low-carb items that any nutriotinist would abhor. The other day someone at my lunch table ate 5 chocolate puddings for lunch and said he was going on a diet to lose weight, which he really does need to. When I asked how 5 chocolate puddings were part of his diet he said that they were fat-free, but I inspected the label and realized they made up for any fat-free benefits, if there are any, by piling in the sugar. I am waiting for him to start with the fat-free Pepsi.

48

[quote]Professor X wrote:
How foolish would it have been to judge him as if all he cared about was bodybuilding simply because he looked the way he did? Why do weak fuckers try to make themselves feel better by acting as if the guys who actually LOOK like they train seriously only care about bodybuilding?
[/quote]

I train about 6 hours a week, yet somehow, because I look like I workout, people act like it is all that I do. Even at work, where I spend 50 hours a week, people act like lifting weights is all I do.

It gives them justification as to why they look like shit. It must take hours a day to make real progress, and they just don’t have that much time to spend in the gym. I mean, they all spend an hour on the treadmill while watching Oprah and don’t see any results, so I couldn’t possibly only spend an hour a day at the gym.

To the OP,

No attitude, no spine, no fucking balls. That is the world I see when I have a look around. If you want to join that world, go ahead, but don’t post on here whinging about how some guy with a back like a tree and arms like your fucking chest spilt your decaf soy latte while you were out gaying it up and he didn’t say sorry.

I bet you 100 to 1 that if you actually saw results in the gym, you wouldn’t be on here weeping like a milky tit. Given that, does that make denial our problem or yours?

49

To NOT train and grow strong is to dishonour the hundred thousand generations of men and women before us, our ancestors, who struggled to survive, yes even just one generation ago. To grow weak, technologically reliant or fat is a disgrace and something to be ashamed of. It is an insult to our ancestors, and an insult to god(s).

If my son or daughter allowed themselves to be weak, unfit, overweight or otherwise lazy I would be ashamed of them.

If I did also, so would my fathers before me.

You never know when this technological world can falter. Apart from super volcanoes etc… just look at New Orleans. Do you want to be in a situation like that, out of shape, weak, unfit? Where’s your technology there?

Although you do have some points and I am sure that we are all affected by those “negative” qualities of personality, some more than others. Some in a bad way, others perhaps in a good way. As far as I am concerned they are only a negative if you take yourself and what you do too seriously, if you do not have a sense of humour about yourself. Because that can cause a negative emotional / physiological state, and just plain sucks.

When I look at myself in the mirror I just think what a miracle it is, the human body, and life - all life, all creatures. It is just plain fucking amazing. There is no other way to put it.

How the hell we can eat something and generate energy and mass out of it. Reassemble it into something else. And the way we respond to training, experiencing that connects us to our evolutionary history.

The way our body will add muscle, but doesn’t want to add too much if food is scarce, because it is looking after our needs, genetically aware / selected to withstand the hard times that IT knows are likely to come one day.

So I don’t think that fits so well into the (artifical) definitions of ego-based behaviour, if your want to go the conventional psyche route then it is more super-ego based training to be fitter and stronger to help others in emergencies and also a connection with the great soul of humanity, the universe and our deep history.

But yeah some people are just too into themselves. Or so it seems, maybe they are yearning for the things I listed in the above paragraph, and don’t quite realise it. Even the real cocky fellows.

50

LOL @ obo. You’re what, 18-19? It’s pretty obvious that you just started college last fall.

Listen, let me share some great experience I’ve learned in my 21 years on this Earth:

People as young as you and I both are don’t know jack shit. We’re idiots. Every single inspriation and epiphany we’ve ever had are nothing but some souped up reruns from the older generations.

Twice now you’ve started threads like this, and attempted to share great insight and wisdom. But dude, you’re a moron. It’s insulting to ME, and I’m nothing but a 21 year old punk. I can only imagine how someone who was raising a family when you were shitting your diapers feels when you do this.

You replied in this thread, and it seems like you enjoy thinking how riled up all the posters get when you expose our insecurities. I can only speak for myself, but I’m plenty secure in what I can do and in who I am. My response to this thread is not rooted from any sort of deep-seeded insecurity, but more aggravation that young people think they have any sort of perspective on life to be making these sorts of sweeping generalizations. Because we don’t.

YOU don’t. So stop.

51

[quote]oboffill wrote:
How else can you explain lifting weights but narcissism? We obviously love our bodies to the point where we eat every few hours, lift unnecessarily heavy weights, look at our bodies in the mirror.

We fuel our egos, fashion ourselves cavemen or warriors, feel good about hitting a heavy set of deadlifts.

Step back and look at the world in which we live. This heavy lifting shit is unnecessary for survival. We have all the convieniences of science and technology to NOT have to worry about extreme amounts of strength and fitness.

We fall in love with that beautiful human looking back at us in the flowing stream in the forest. [/quote]

I don’t disagree with you, but I’d like to put what you said into perspective.

Absolutely everything that humans do is based on narcissism and hedonism. There really is no such thing as a “selfless” act. Even altruism, the welfare morality, etc, can all be attributed to self-interest, i.e. psychological egoism.

Pumping and flexing is no more or less vain than devoting one’s life to feeding homeless orphans.

52

[quote]Nominal Prospect wrote:
Pumping and flexing is no more or less vain than devoting one’s life to feeding homeless orphans. [/quote]

I don’t believe that for a moment. Philosophies of justification have always rung hollow to me.

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I didn’t have much of an ego when I started working out. I was only 12. I don’t know about the rest of you, but I like being able to pick up heavy things, RUN up a flight of stairs, and throw somebody across the room if I have to. The statement that being bigger, stronger, and in better shape is useless today has got to be one of the more insipid comments I have seen. How in the Hell is being strong useless? You know obo, most therapist-types have issues themselves, mayhap you should think about that before you start trying to spread this garbage around.
You know, you guys saying this crap always have to try and bring people down. Just because you are too lazy to work hard doesn’t mean people who do have some sort of deep-seated problems. Does everybody who drives a Corvette have a small prick? In a midlife crisis? I doubt it. Especially since I see women driving them, too. Maybe they just like fast cars.

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Hey guys, I just posted a new thread, “Of Bodybuilding and Metrosexuality.” I’m sure you guys will love that one too. lol.

P.S. I’m not against working out or bodybuilding or strength training or any of that. I actually love workig out. And I don’t look like that P.O.W. or that fat kid from those pics, anymore.

Pie in all your faces. lol.

55

[quote]Digital Chainsaw wrote:

Hopefully, after a few years max (and several sobering plateaus), one reflects on their own motives, and the aesthetics begin to become balanced with things like health, well-being, and (maybe this is just me) an appreciation for the process of working out for its own sake; a ritualistic quality, if you will.

[/quote]

Absolutely.

We bodybuilders(and all athletes and people, for that matter)thrive on having some sort of security and regularity in our lives. Working out becomes a daily part of our lives, and gives us that sense of security.
Without it, something is missing.
If the person isn’t very well-rounded and has other things going on, his day will be empty, and so will he be.

[quote]Nominal Prospect wrote:

Absolutely everything that humans do is based on narcissism and hedonism. There really is no such thing as a “selfless” act.

[/quote]

Very true. In fact, insecurity, for the most part, is based on DIRECT gratification and approval for one’s self, instead of indirect, such as helping people.
In layman’s terms, this means using the word “I” and “Me” a lot, always seeking approval, getting very defensive at the least threat of one’s beliefs and persona, doubting everything(or becoming very arrogant and unflexible).
Unfortunately, most posters in this thread seem to confirm that fact.

56

[quote]tGunslinger wrote:
[/quote]

You are one wise 21 year old, fellow!

What I wouldn’t give to be 21 again and yet have all the knowledge, wisdom (and money) I have now.

But I can’t be 21 again.

But a wise 21 year old who realises this and seeks out the wisdom and knowledge of older people, you lucky bastard.

[quote]Nominal Prospect wrote:
Absolutely everything that humans do is based on narcissism and hedonism. There really is no such thing as a “selfless” act. Even altruism, the welfare morality, etc, can all be attributed to self-interest, i.e. psychological egoism.[/quote]

I do not agree because I discount the whole concept of “selfish act” that is thrown around and the concept that it is negative.

Rather than divide things into selfish, self oriented etc… it is more useful to divide behaviours into results-achieving and results-failing.

You can always say that everything is “selfish” because even altruistic behaviour is to satisfy our selfish personal value of helping other people.

But more important is to look at what a person is trying to achieve and whether it gets results.

Example, if a person is trying to improve their appearance because they are unsatisfied in self worth, and if changing their appearance doesn’t achieve a feeling of self worth, then that is a results-failing behaviour. Even if they are actually making good progress with their appearance (because of twisted perceptions).

Where the hell am I going with this? Well calling bodybuilders narcisstic is just one person’s opinion of another persons’ behaviour that is far more complex than just lumping it in a bucket.

57

[quote]Magarhe wrote:
To NOT train and grow strong is to dishonour the hundred thousand generations of men and women before us, our ancestors, who struggled to survive, yes even just one generation ago. To grow weak, technologically reliant or fat is a disgrace and something to be ashamed of. It is an insult to our ancestors, and an insult to god(s).

[/quote]

Wow. To take advantage of the tremendous progress mankind has made in the past millenia is to dishonor your ancestors and the gods? We live in a world where being fit is not a necessity; to workout if you don’t enjoy it is to toil preparing for a battle that will probably never come. WE (HUMANS) DID NOT SURVIVE BECAUSE OF OUR PHYSICAL ATTRIBUTES. We survived because of our intellect. Our species is even called homo sapien sapien, and sapien means intelligence. Our intelligence is what distinguishes us from the rest of the animal kingdom. Do you really think humans overpowered the other animals to survive? The true testament to man’s primordial survival power is that skinny, intelligent nerd you think is a disgrace to man’s early ancestors. Guess what happened to the early human-like creatures that depended more on their body than their mind? The more intelligent ones killed them. It’s just Natural Selection that brains will prevail over brawn almost every time. Man is distinguished from the animal kingdom and is the dominant organism because we struggle with our brain not with our body.

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[quote]KombatAthlete wrote:
Magarhe wrote:
To NOT train and grow strong is to dishonour the hundred thousand generations of men and women before us, our ancestors, who struggled to survive, yes even just one generation ago. To grow weak, technologically reliant or fat is a disgrace and something to be ashamed of. It is an insult to our ancestors, and an insult to god(s).

Wow. To take advantage of the tremendous progress mankind has made in the past millenia is to dishonor your ancestors and the gods? We live in a world where being fit is not a necessity; to workout if you don’t enjoy it is to toil preparing for a battle that will probably never come. WE (HUMANS) DID NOT SURVIVE BECAUSE OF OUR PHYSICAL ATTRIBUTES. We survived because of our intellect. Our species is even called homo sapien sapien, and sapien means intelligence. Our intelligence is what distinguishes us from the rest of the animal kingdom. Do you really think humans overpowered the other animals to survive? The true testament to man’s primordial survival power is that skinny, intelligent nerd you think is a disgrace to man’s early ancestors. Guess what happened to the early human-like creatures that depended more on their body than their mind? The more intelligent ones killed them. It’s just Natural Selection that brains will prevail over brawn almost every time. Man is distinguished from the animal kingdom and is the dominant organism because we struggle with our brain not with our body.

[/quote]

A nuclear explosion prevails over every damn thing.

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[quote]Professor X wrote:
A nuclear explosion prevails over every damn thing.[/quote]

Correction:
Nuclear Bomb beats Rock, Paper, and Scissors. That’s hardly every damn thing.

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[quote]Correction:
Nuclear Bomb beats Rock, Paper, and Scissors. That’s hardly every damn thing. [/quote]