My Protein Sparing Modified Fast Log

Nutrition
121

:slight_smile:

Btw, sardines were only an example substitute fish. A brand of salmon that had about 50% of its calories from fat would also be perfectly suitable, or mackerel if having the same property.

Or if you are using fish oil capsules, then if you wanted some moderately lean (for example 90/10) beef or some other meat that had about half its calories from fat, that would be fine too.

On a day when allowing more carbs, you could substitute a leaner fish or meat. For example the tuna would be fine on a day when you were allowing 100 g of carbs.

Basically, you do want at least 50% and probably really preferably a little more of the calories to be from sources other than protein. So when carbs are very low, you do need the fat. When bringing in the moderate carbs, the fat can come down sufficiently if desired for same total calories.

122

[quote]Bloobird wrote:
tplet wrote:
5 times a week intense

Maintenance:
2039 Calories/day
Fat Loss:
1631 Calories/day
Extreme Fat Loss:
1224 Calories/day

i think i will do 1300.

You mostly gained water, and very little fat, 1650 is FINE, please don’t do this to yourself.[/quote]

if he wants to figure in 1300 cals a day,thats cool.
we got through to him at some level.
Atleast hes not going for 800 cals a day.

And maybe when hes counting the 1300 cals he will get hungry and “slip” and see that in the end 1600 will suit him fine then maybe he will see he can go to 1800,then maybe 2000 and when he remains the same weight and even looses 2 or so pounds a week on 2k then he will see by his own experiance that we are right and he will feel much better having some food in him.

I have no idea why this wasnt said before but I just thought of something I was told.

Think of your body like a moving truck,and food is fuel.

now if you have your back loaded up with all kinds of junk(weight) you have to have better gas and more of it in order to get where you need to go.
if you start to run low on gas it gets harder to move the weight at the same speed so you get sluggish.

if you take some the weight out the back then you can move faster again.
untill you run lower on gas,then you have to take more out ect. and the cycle keeps going.

if you only put 2 dollars in the tank you can only go so far without pooping out.

now on the same note,if you have more gas you can make more trips (work more and work harder)with a full trunk.

if you want to take less trips thats fine you add more weight,if you dont want to add more weight you add more trips.

so in short if you eat alot and want to lose weight you work more,or eat less.

if you want to be stronger then simply work more,you will be faster,stronger and the correct weight but you have to have the food to fuel yourself.

or you can starve get weak and shrivel up,
same thing but you wont be stronger or faster
that choice is yours.

lol did I lose you? think I lost myself :wink:
have you read about that swimer guy Phelps I think his name was.
Im not big into swiming sorry.
this guy was way trim,he looked skinny to me but because of the workload he was under he ate something like 10,000 calories a day on his training days.
some insane amount.

123

By the way, now as to WHY it is not more productive to cut calories too low, as was originally being planned, but is actually counterproductive:

When calories taken in come well short of calories expended, the body always burns both muscle and fat to accomodate the difference.

Whether the ratio is greatly in favor of burning fat or results in severe muscle loss is dependent on many factors but among them, very strongly among them, is the severity of the caloric deficit.

Go too severe, and fat loss can actually be SLOWER while muscle loss most assuredly accelerates.

Did you know that most severely anorexic women weighing sad amounts like 70-whatever pounds ACTUALLY DO NOT have low percent bodyfat?

Values such as 30% bodyfat are actually quite typical for them.

Though of course they suffer a body dysmorphia (not seeing things the way they actually are) they actually are not fabricating their concerns from nothing. While of course their body circumferences are stick-like, they actually are flab-coated.

How can this be? With this extreme weight loss, how do they still have considerable fat on them?

Because that is how the body works when caloric deficit is extreme!

Such low calories are, it is presumed, handled as if they were a threat to survival. Who knows, if calories have stayed as low as they have been for as long as they have been, this horrible situation might continue for a long time.

So how to survive? The same energy stores will last a lot longer if the body sheds “unnecessary” muscle and organ weight while hanging on to quite a bit of the fat as long as it can.

Needless to say, it’s unproductive to fat loss for athletic purposes or health purposes to go into that zone.

The 1500 cal/day figure, or your 1650 or similar value, keeps you out of that zone.

The extreme low values previously considered would not have.

124

Im going to stay out of this, just a comment to Mr. Roberts kudo’s on sticking with this.

125

Thanks, 300andabove! The end result has been worth it.

Now that the planned calories have moved up to 1650, the coconut oil could be moved up to 2 tbsp a day if needed to get sufficient total calories from fat (for total non-protein calories to be at least 825).

The whey shake could also be fortified to advantage with 2 or 3 eggs.

126

Coconut oil is a very good choice on a plan that is otherwise somewhat restrictive in fat intake. Great posts by BR in this thread.

Also, please do not do a CKD after this man. You are a growing guy. CKDs are not for lean 14 year olds. You need to stop reading into the crap and focus on what is important.

This thread is the perfect example of what happens when you become too detail oriented.

Read Professor X’s posts. You don’t get huge or strong or perform at a high level by fucking with your body at 14 and cutting off macros and shit.

You need to eat and grow and lift, period. Learn to listen to your body from an early age and keep forcing adaptation.

If there’s ANYONE who doesn’t need to worry about the details with regards to diet and just focus on eating in quantity and lifting hard, it is a growing athletic 14yo.

127

U need to listen to these guys man. Your 14 years old dude. You have plenty of time left to wrestle. So start eating and training like a mad man and reach your potential. Then move up a weight class or two for next year. Instead of doing this stupid short-term bullshit and being a fucking dwarf for the rest of your life.

128

wow. happy days happy days

129

im going to start monitoring my weights and updating here every day.

consuming 1600 calories of food sources are egg whites, multivitamin, broccoli, pickels, cheese, sugar-free jello to snack, chicken breast, drink nothing but water, green beans, whey protein shake, light mayo, low carb tortilla wraps/bread, tuna. how is it looking?

130

[quote]tplet wrote:
im going to start monitoring my weights and updating here every day.

consuming 1600 calories of food sources are egg whites, multivitamin, broccoli, pickels, cheese, sugar-free jello to snack, chicken breast, drink nothing but water, green beans, whey protein shake, light mayo, low carb tortilla wraps/bread, tuna. how is it looking?[/quote]

looking better :slight_smile:

I would add in spinich,low on calories but high in protien and nutrients.

also if you use only a “dab” of mayo I would get the omega rich mayo its by smart choice or something like that.it uses flax oil in it and adds more omega fatty acids.

swap half your tuna for canned salmon.

you can drink green tea or regular tea if getting sick of water.
crystal light is good tasting too.
the low carb tortillias are a gimmic IMO just eat whole wheat breat and tortillias but limit what you eat.

add in more vegies,cabbage,celery,spinich like i mentioned. cauliflower. all these will add fiber and nutrients but not so many calories so wont be so hungry.

pickles are good but alot of sodium make sure your drinking lots of water.
drink your whey after working out and when you wake up.

Also send me a PM with your email I have an Ebook that I know you will be interested in I want to send to you. it has an answer to every question you could ever ask bout nutrition.

131

[quote]tplet wrote:
im going to start monitoring my weights and updating here every day.

consuming 1600 calories of food sources are egg whites, multivitamin, broccoli, pickels, cheese, sugar-free jello to snack, chicken breast, drink nothing but water, green beans, whey protein shake, light mayo, low carb tortilla wraps/bread, tuna. how is it looking?[/quote]

It is sounding like it is failing to get at least half the 1600 calories (800 calories) from non-protein sources.

You’re being fat-aversive. There indeed is such a thing as eating too much fat and the number of people that make that mistake far exceeds the number that make the reverse, but the above is making the reverse mistake.

Whole eggs rather than only whites, fat-containing cold-water fish (sardines, mackerel, salmon) instead of tuna, allowing 90/10 ground beef, and coconut oil are ways you can get the non-protein calories up to at least 800.

132

im using alot of mayo, cheese is alot of fat cals…all these foods in big portions

low carb tortillas i dont see how their not ideal, 18g carb 12g dietary fiber and 8g protein…45 fat cals

133

Also… I would scrap the ‘light’ mayo and go for the regular stuff…

134

Also… I would scrap the ‘light’ mayo and go for the regular stuff…

135

If you add up the fat calories (take the grams and multiply by 9) from your food choices and they do total out, along with you carb calories, to at least half your total, that is to say to at least 800, then OK.

As to whether the cheese can do the job largely on its own (as the mayo is “light”) I guess it depends on the kind of cheese. The cheese I eat gets only half its calories from fat. That is fine, but takes care of only itself so to speak. Such a cheese wouldn’t do anything towards balancing out all the high-protein/no-fat other sources you have in your diet.

However, it’s true that many cheeses are higher in fat than that and might indeed get your total up sufficiently.

Really, no reason to be aversive to whole eggs, 90/10 beef, cold water oily fish and so forth, if they get you to your 800 non-protein calories.

Nothing wrong with the low-carb tortillas.

136

[quote]tplet wrote:
eating small serving packet of tuna every hour from the time i rise untill the time i sleep. [/quote]

mercury poisoning?

137

[quote]aznt0rk wrote:
tplet wrote:
eating small serving packet of tuna every hour from the time i rise untill the time i sleep.

mercury poisoning?[/quote]

Seriously did you EVEN try read past the 1st 2-3 posts, come now is that comment really necessary.

And to the original poster, from many different sources you will need at LEAST 0.6g per lbm of good fats or your hormones will suffer.

Your a teenager for gods sake, EAT more i remember when i was your age i was eatin every 2 hrs and i didnt have a CLUE what protein/carbs/fats were!

138

Actually, tplet, if you are going to be doing this for a month then you have a little more work to do that really ought to be done.

Namely, a diet of this sort can readily come short in minerals and electrolytes that are NOT supplied by your multivitamin.

I would not be at all surprised if your proposed diet falls short in potassium (quite likely), phosphorus, magnesium, and/or calcium (despite the cheese.)

These are the ones you need to check.

Seriously, I’ll be surprised if everything comes out OK. Supplementation really will be valuable, but what is needed can only be known by finding out what is lacking in this diet.

Eating fewer calories and limiting food selection tends to result in high likelihood of coming up short on some of these very-needed things.

You can find values for each food you plan to consume at the USDA Nutrient Database:

http://www.nal.usda.gov/fnic/foodcomp/search/

At your weight if you get the RDA for each of these you will be OK.

These are: potassium, 3500 mg. Almost no single food is really rich in potassium – in other words a modest amount of just one thing when the rest of the diet is substantially low in potassium won’t be enough to make up for it. Greens are among the best sources but may not be enough.

“Salt Substitute” can easily provide any needed balance in potassium by using small amounts such as 1/4 tsp with some meals. The label will tell you how much potassium you are adding with each 1/4 tsp: I think it is about 600 mg but don’t recall exactly.

Phosphorus, 1000 mg. Avocados are fairly rich with 485 mg per 100 g and 160 calories. Avocados are a good source of fat. A quality guacamole product could be a good source as well.

Calcium: 1300 mg. Easily supplement with for example a calcium citrate tablet product.

Magnesium: 410 mg. Again easily supplemented, for example with a magnesium citrate tablet product.

As a final note, you might even come out low on sodium. For sure keep sodium up to at least 2000 mg/day and there would be nothing wrong with 4000 mg/day.