My Experience On the Anabolic Diet

[quote]toogoodlookin wrote:
Thanks for that, helps to hear your experiences of the program so far, im to having a hard time shifting this last bit of fat, i have tried everything, i have been doing cv every morning before breakfast for the last 6 weeks and not much differnece on the hold belly fat :frowning: and thought i would give this a try, the only thing that i fear is the carb ups as i was told not to eat large amounts of fats and CHO togetherm/the same time.

Can anyone help me out ?

Also should i be counting in grams or in terms of total calories ?

[/quote]
That last home stretch on the fat track is one my major goals as well. It’s hard not to take all these guys word for the fact that the carb ups will not make you fat if done right. You cut back the fat some on carb ups and the plan is versatile enough to tweak for individual people.

My first carb up starts tomorrow so I’m betting I’ll get a little bloated at first, maybe a lot. Disc Hoss keeps saying that you need to give it all time to fully settle in which make sense. The more used to it your body gets the easier it should be to make decisions about adjustments and the more routine it should become. Check your private messages.

–Tiribulus->

I might have missed this in the thread…

Has anyone played with the idea of adding Surge or Dextrose PWO in their shake, replacing the weekend carb-up after being adapted? Again, this would be after initial break in, maybe even after a month…just to make sure your definitely running on FFA or energy.

Vets have any ideas?

Possible Pro’s/Con’s?

-Aspengc8

[quote]aspengc8 wrote:
I might have missed this in the thread…

Has anyone played with the idea of adding Surge or Dextrose PWO in their shake, replacing the weekend carb-up after being adapted? Again, this would be after initial break in, maybe even after a month…just to make sure your definitely running on FFA or energy.

Vets have any ideas?

Possible Pro’s/Con’s?

-Aspengc8[/quote]

With a steady influx of CHOs in your diet, even if it were just post workout, you would not be a FFB. Your body would become less sparing with CHOs, begin to rely on them as a fuel source and would defeat the optimal hormonal environments we’re trying to create with the AD.

What you are proposing is very much in line with Berardi’s principles as well as the T-Dawg diet . . . which are both good from what I’ve read/heard.

One modification you may want to look into is Poliquin’s. He sets his clients up on a 4 day low CHO/high fat diet followed by one meal that’s CHO rich.

Hope that helps.

Sasha

[quote]AlphaDragon wrote:
Is it ok if we start this during a “back off” week?

I just realized that my 2nd week on the AD (assuming I begin on Monday, which was my original plan) will be a scheduled back off week. Is there any problems with this?

Thanks.

[/quote]

AlphaDragon,

This won’t make a difference. Continue as planned but just eliminate and pre/post workout nutrition.

Cheers,

Sasha

Close on the training rationale.

You’ve got to respect the intensity/volume interface. You can stimulate much protein degradation with a heavy weight (your 95% 1rm, for example), but you can’t do it long enough before CNS fatigue hits you. Conversely on the opposite end of the spectrum you can’t use 5lb dumbbells and perform 100 rep sets all day in an almost calisthenic type workout. This gives mucho volume but the intensity is not at a level sufficient to induce the structural damage to signal sacromere (actual protein accretion) growth. You want to be able to use a “heavy” (relatively speaking) weight, and then keep it going for a good volume level(relatively speaking).

With the 95% you get great intensity (the real mathematical equation of nearness to 1 rep max, not to be confused with a grimace and a backwards ball cap!) but cannot sustain any appreciable volume. If you get too light (usually less than 60% 1rm for a rough estimate) and perform sets/reps till the cows come home, you’ll not be stimuating enough damage to your money motor units (IIA,IIB)and at best you’ll get a very small amount of sacroplasmic growth.

What’s it all mean?
1.Keep a set rep volume of about 25-60 reps per bodypart per session if you train full body 2-3x per week. Toward the upper end for 2x per week, toward the mid/lower end for 3x per week.

2.Use a large enough load to create degradation of the IIA and IIB fibers (70-85% 1RM or about 12-14rm down to 4-5rm). You should train in this frame for about 2/3 to 3/4 of your sessions. You can then do high rep active recovey stuff on off days, or speed stuff once a week or even a low volume strength session once a week. That will be dependent upon your nutrition and recovery abilities.

The weight used (intensity) is direcly proportional to the amount of damage/degradation of protein that occurs BUT you must keep this process up for a decent volume or you’ll have a big spike of stimulation but no actualization of growth due to a blunted volume. Heavy weights can’t be lifted for a big volume. That’s a fact of life.

Think of it this way: You’re a thief. You’re trying to get as much out of your neighbor’s house as you can before the fuzz shows up. Do you:

A) Try to carry everything all at once in a concentrated effort? (corresponds to a heavy load and low volume)

B) Try to take thing one at a time and spend all night doing it? (corresponds to a light load and high volume)

C) Optimize the above by taking as much as you can comfortably handle (don’t want to drop something and alert the victims AND you don’t want to break your newly acquired goodies)and do this for as long as necessary to get the payload? (corresponds to moderately heavy weights with a moderately high volume)

That’s why you see Waterbury’s set/rep Bible written as such. Through decades of research and experimentation, it’s been found that moderately heavy weights done for moderatly high volumes will give the best growth. In order to accomplish this volume while using the necessary magnitude of loading, you avoid failure until the very end IF at all.

This has the added benefit of allowing you the greatest frequency of training too. You don’t overwhelm your body at a given training session, you stimluate it and then can rapidly recuperate to do it again. Over time, your frequency will increase and so will your exposure to the growth stimlulus and you’ll be bigger/stronger.

DH[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
Disc Hoss wrote:
Trib,
With a workout effort like that you’ve got to try about 20-30g of BCAA powder during a workout. I am utterly amazed at how I am never sore anymore. One day I missed the BCAA, last Saturday to be exact, and despite the plentiful CHO I felt like a truck hit me for two days after my workout. BCAA rock. I take powder and mix it with some Diet Rockstar or crystal light. It doesn’t mix worth a crap but the taste is very tolerable. Plus the taurine in the drink really elevates my mood.

Best,
DH

Yeah huh? You really do seem to believe in those branched chain aminos. I’m going to be doing some ordering soon and I’ll grab a bottle or jug as 20-30 grams will be a lot easier to consume in powder form. You were saying that concentric failure may be counterproductive and load figured into volume is key. That is an article I’d like to see. A quick whirl around the brain gives me an idea of what you’re saying. In a nuthshell 4 sets of one rep each at 95% of 1 rep max stimulates more action than 1 set of 4 reps done to failure at whatever percentage of one rep max that turns out to be? That because, simply put, you’re moving more weight over the same amount of work. Is this where you’re going? If so I never thought of it like that before.
Thanks,

–Tiribulus->

[/quote]

First cho up starts in a little while and I must confess to being a little nervous.

–Tiribulus->

Sasha and Tribulis:

Thanks for the replies to my inquiry.

[quote]Disc Hoss wrote:
Close on the training rationale…

[/quote]
This may the wrong thread to continue this, but I may have to rethink much of what I’ve believed for a long time if this is the case. I’ve always been an “apocalyptic intensity, low/moderate volume per session, low frequency” guy and have gotten good results this way.

That isn’t to say I wouldn’t be entirely pleased to learn something that worked better. If I remember correctly you’re a powerlifer right?

This seems counterintuitive to strengh goals on it’s face, but then again what could be more counterintuitive than eating shitloads of fat to lose it?

I’m going to look further into the Waterbury method. I’ve seen you and others mention it before as well. In the meantime meal one of my first carb day has me kinda drowsy now. Oatmeal, milk, some honey, raisins, apple, banana,60 grams of whey powder and a drizzle of EVOO in a big pot. For my daughter and wife as well actually.

Like I say, I was feeling great and this first carb day finds me a bit trepadacious, but I do understand the reasoning behind it. We’ll see how the day proceeds. I plan on going pretty much clean and keeping track of my glucose levels because of the diabetes.

Thanks again,

–Tiribulus->

[quote]SashaG wrote:
aspengc8 wrote:
I might have missed this in the thread…

Has anyone played with the idea of adding Surge or Dextrose PWO in their shake, replacing the weekend carb-up after being adapted? Again, this would be after initial break in, maybe even after a month…just to make sure your definitely running on FFA or energy.

Vets have any ideas?

Possible Pro’s/Con’s?

-Aspengc8
[/quote]

Dipasquale mentions experimenting with PWO carbs and to try anywhere between 10g and 150g of carbs PWO. So try it and see how it works for you.

Poliquin’s carb recommendations depend on one’s bodyfat %. The higher one’s bodyfat %, the less carbs one consumes. The lower it is, the more carbs one consumes.
If one’s bodyfat % is not too high, Poliquin has one consume carbs PWO.
The amount of carbs one consumes on the 5th day depends on one’s bodyfat level. If one’s bodyfat % is:
Low: high carb day
Middle: high carb 1/2 day
High: high carb meal.
Thus, if one is lean and wishes to add lbm, Poliquin recommends consuming PWO carbs and having a high carb day every 5th day.

This is the second day of my first carb up and I’m not sure what to say at this point. Pretty uneventful. I ate very clean 30/30/40 (about) P/F/C before I started the AD. I went through an entirely anti-climactic crash about five days in that lasted an evening.

Had a couple mildly sub par workouts in the first week and performance rebounded considerably during the second week and coming into this first carb up weekend. Have been going squeaky clean for this first carb up as well. Lotsa oatmeal, steamed potatoes, sweet potatoes, beans (no cans for anything, all home cooked), raisins, bananas, apples, tomatoes, sunflower seeds and peanuts. Egg whites with a few yolks, salmon, milk, cottage cheese and whey for protein. Some butter, EVOO, and usual fish oils and flax for fats. Flax meal is great in oatmeal.

I did gain nine pounds between early yesterday morning and last night, but was back to just about normal this morning again. No cramps or constipation, hardly any gas. A small amount of water retention. All in all uneventful. Energy was fine for yesterdays workout. Maybe because I was eating so clean before, the transition has been pretty easy for me.

From listening to some guys I was buckling up for a rough ride the first couple weeks, but hasn’t been that big a deal. I do still sweat more than before and I’m seeing adipose fat start to come off. I think I ate more protein than I should have yesterday. I don’t know how bad that is. I don’t know what to say. Mental clarity IS quite noticably better and I have been a little bit foggy during this first carb up, but not anything drastic.

I almost wish I could just eat low carb all the time. Feel better overall. I doubt if I’ll even be looking forward to carb ups much. I’m intrigued to see what the coming weeks bring. Oh yeah, blood glucose tests have been SUPERB, even after a huge bowl of fruity oatmeal yesterday morning, including milk and honey. 158 90 minutes later. 6 months ago that would’ve put me over 500 for sure.

For any type 2 diabetics, I can’t get my blood sugar out of normal range now even with monstrous bowls of carb laden foods that would’ve been downright dangerous a few months ago. Oh well better shut up now. Thought I’d report on my fist carb up.

–Tiribulus->

[quote]Kliplemet wrote:
if you want variety on this diet expect to spend a lot more time and money than with a more conventional diet

true?[/quote]

Not if you’re creative. There are dozens of different herb/spice combinations which can be added to olive oil and/or water to marinate any meat, giving you tons of variety in flavour. I don’t know how many types of fish there are, but I haven’t gotten bored yet. Meat can be grilled, roasted, or stir-fried, vegetables can be steamed, also stir-fried, or eaten raw. Chicken/steak salads with various combinations. I like to blend an avocado with a can of tuna when I’m getting tired of regular tuna salad.

Probably the only thing that takes a significant amount of time is if you want any kind of egg other than scrambled, you won’t be able to make them all at once.

Like I said, be creative.

[quote]Kliplemet wrote:
if you want variety on this diet expect to spend a lot more time and money than with a more conventional diet true?[/quote]
Personally I want results and couldn’t care less about variety and taste. I boil my eggs most of the time and my food goes in the food processor all together for work every day. Taste is entirely irrelevant. If something tastes good it’s an ancillary bonus. I just don’t care. If I start caring I won’t stick to any diet. That’s just how I am. I love eating too much.

–Tiribulus->

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
Kliplemet wrote:
if you want variety on this diet expect to spend a lot more time and money than with a more conventional diet true?
Personally I want results and couldn’t care less about variety and taste. I boil my eggs most of the time and my food goes in the food processor all together for work every day. Taste is entirely irrelevant. If something tastes good it’s an ancillary bonus. I just don’t care. If I start caring I won’t stick to any diet. That’s just how I am. I love eating too much.

–Tiribulus->

[/quote]

I pretty much eat the same thing every day and the only thing that really ever gets to me is my big lunch salad and usually only on Fridays. So, I’ll load it up with extra crushed red pepper and garlic pepper and what not to help myself out. My variety comes at night when I might try something different for supper and on the weekends when I reload.

[quote]Plisskin wrote:
I pretty much eat the same thing every day and the only thing that really ever gets to me is my big lunch salad and usually only on Fridays. So, I’ll load it up with extra crushed red pepper and garlic pepper and what not to help myself out. My variety comes at night when I might try something different for supper and on the weekends when I reload.[/quote]

I’ve had to resign myself to the fact that I have an incurable all or nothing personality. I have to eat either purely for function or out come the twinkies and hershey bars. This has nothing to do with the AD, it was the case before I started.

I just finished my first carb up and I held the moosetracks ice cream in my hands and put it back in the freezer in the store. To me it’s a small price to pay. That dreamy yummy sensation in my mouth for a minute or two FOR WHAT? I read through the thread about when the new Grow! was released and was kinda startled by entire pages dedicated to how it tastes or doesn’t taste.

Don’t get me wrong, to each his own, but I personally can’t afford to give a shit. I want what works, period. If someone made worm infested poodle diarrhea flavored protein that was helpful in achieving my goals I’d eat it (albeit with some effort). I honestly don’t even mind steak, whole eggs, cheese, salmon, garlic, greens, celery, evoo, flax meal and vit/min supps blended into glop in the food processor. You can get used to anything if the motivation’s strong enough.

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
Plisskin wrote:
I pretty much eat the same thing every day and the only thing that really ever gets to me is my big lunch salad and usually only on Fridays. So, I’ll load it up with extra crushed red pepper and garlic pepper and what not to help myself out. My variety comes at night when I might try something different for supper and on the weekends when I reload.

I’ve had to resign myself to the fact that I have an incurable all or nothing personality. I have to eat either purely for function or out come the twinkies and hershey bars. This has nothing to do with the AD, it was the case before I started.

I just finished my first carb up and I held the moosetracks ice cream in my hands and put it back in the freezer in the store. To me it’s a small price to pay. That dreamy yummy sensation in my mouth for a minute or two FOR WHAT? I read through the thread about when the new Grow! was released and was kinda startled by entire pages dedicated to how it tastes or doesn’t taste.

Don’t get me wrong, to each his own, but I personally can’t afford to give a shit. I want what works, period. If someone made worm infested poodle diarrhea flavored protein that was helpful in achieving my goals I’d eat it (albeit with some effort). I honestly don’t even mind steak, whole eggs, cheese, salmon, garlic, greens, celery, evoo, flax meal and vit/min supps blended into glop in the food processor. You can get used to anything if the motivation’s strong enough.

[/quote]

I’m in the same boat as you, Trib. I eat the same food, everyday, around the same times. I’ve beaten into my mindset that food is strictly energy. If it tastes good and meets my goals, great. If it doesnt taste good, but meets my goals, I just add hot sauce! :slight_smile:

I’ve been making minor tweaks to find what works best for my body. Carb-up is limited to one day, usually saturday. Complex carbs only, not crap. This past saturday was all oatmeal. Thats right, oatmeal with some equal + sugar free marmalade.

I also followed someones advice and tried the creamcheese w/equal on it. Mixed it all up and tasted GREAT! I also started adding 10 minutes of HIIT on the cross-trainer machine at the end of my workouts…it has been the special sauce so far, and im seeing some outstanding results.

-Aspeng8

ps- Is this really a Anabolic diet, or more of a Anabolic lifestyle? Im leaning towards the latter.

[quote]aspengc8 wrote:
Is this really a Anabolic diet, or more of a Anabolic lifestyle? Im leaning towards the latter.[/quote]

Eating low carb does not have to be boring, lacking flavor, or seem like a chore. As your last sentence states, one should look at eating this way as a low carb lifestyle, and not a low carb diet, otherwise it implies short term and one will have a very hard time sticking with eating low carb over the long term.

Just recently, I finished reading a book written by the guy who wrote Poliquin’s nutrition manual. The book has a nice “Resources” section. In it, he lists ~25 low carb cookbooks that he recommends, because one of the most asked questions he gets is, “What can I eat other than baked or roasted chicken or fish for dinner with veggies.” So, if one wishes to jazz up his/her low carb meals, buy a few low carb cookbooks. Some of them are very cheap (e.g., $1-3 for a brand new hard copy).

Well Gents:

Day 1 in progress. Up to this point I did a basic low carb diet for a few weeks (but still following AD protocol and carbed up on the weekend). Now, what I did was NOT the AD because I didn?t track cals in/carbs, etc. I tracked 2 days. One day during the week was about 60 carbs (MAN, it?s easy to go over in carbs) and the second day was a weekend ?carb up? (I never thought I?d say this, but I think I did too much protein on the weekend).

I was never into processed sugars too much, but this weekend I had about 3 icecream/coffee drinks (MAN, they are so good).

Anyway, I know there isn?t anything to report as this is only day 1, technically?but just wanted to chime in that I?m on board.

Welcome aboard the Anabolic train.
A note to the repetiveness of the diet: I, too, basically eat the same thing day in and day out, tracking it all regardless because it just makes it easier. When you find out something that works you stick with it, and I have to spend enough time as it is prepping the food for the day, without the added hassle of figuring out new things not to mention shopping.

Big omelet for breakfast then it’s broccoli and chicken and/or beef and/or pork or tuna or sardines and spinach and chicken and/or beef and or pork and/or chicken or tuna or sardines. Good thing I love broccoli, though too much of a good thing will turn your shit green, which may be wonderful on St. Patty’s day, and a good trick to play on your friends, but any other day is just disconcerting.

Yup, same here, just about the same stuff everyday. Eggs, cheese, chicken, steak, tuna, saucage … lettuce for extra fiber, spinach… looking forward to carb up #1 coming this weekend after this second break-in phase. Then, there’s time to experiment and have some variety in my diet.

Still feeling a bit bloated though… but I’m trying to up my calories a bit and start gaining some SERIOUS mass over the coming after-summer and winter months, and to trim down towards next summer…

So as I’m going along, I guess questions will rise sooner or later. Even though I’ve been lifting for a while now, I still consider myself a ‘beginner’…

Anyone got any suggestions for a workout programme for me, im currently in day 2 of my 12 day adapt phase and after this im going to be going on a fat loss plan so need a routine to do like a 4 day split or something,

I looked at a few programmms from Waterbury and the supersets will be hard to perform as gym equipment is always in use so i would find it hard to stick to the rest periods etc

Any ideas ?

Thanks