Ok hope it helps… try it before each session and don’t be a bitch about it, roll that sucker, it should hurt!
[quote]MODOK wrote:
Those two splits both have their pluses and minuses:
Chest/back split- Due to overlap of many of the smaller upper body muscle groups on consecutive days, provides very fast strength gains on upper body movements. You basically train all of your smaller muscle groups (tris, bis, shoulders) 4 times a week due to the carry over from the chest/back sessions. However- it also beats up your joints due to the fact that you are almost constantly stressing your elbows and shoulders. I ran into this problem and had a pretty chronic elbow tendonitis until I found how to work around it. First, moving the days from chest day, arm day, leg day to chest day, leg day, arm day. Secondly, and most importantly, is exercise selection and performance for the tri and shoulder exercises. For tris, never selecting a tri exercise which causes you to contract completely in a stretched position (French press, true skull crushers, overhead rope extensions, etc.) Instead select only compound (dips, CG Bench or exercises where the tris aren’t stretched during the contraction (pushdowns, etc.) Thirdly is thick handle work as much as you can work it in. I try to do at least half of my upper body pressing exercises with the fat grips. It really takes the pressure off of the tricep and shoulder tendons. Fourthly- a deload week every 4 weeks.
Chest/arms split- this seems to be the logical split, pairing large muscle groups with smaller ones. It works for tons of folks, and I have used it with success. It does address many of the issues with the other split (overuse injuries). However, in my experience, my strength does not keep up on this split in comparison to the other, due to the decreased frequency of the smaller groups (my theory). Given that, I have always migrated back to the old chest/back split and just used the recovery techniques I described. Thats simply the preference of an OCD person though. [/quote]
ahh just saw this. thanks for the input.
one thing about the elbow pain i noticed is i can do as much stretched-tri-work as i want as long as i get a good pump before hand and put it towards the end of my WO. the poundages suffer of course but im still getting stronger doing so…
def gonna start using the fat grips again… forgot how much easier they made pressing feel
[quote]MODOK wrote:
Well, I am a natural fat boy…slow metabolism, huge gut as a 12 year old, carb intolerant, etc. so I have been keenly interested in nutrition over the years, not only in dieting for shows, but simply trying to get a date to the 8th grade prom. I bought The Anabolic Diet as soon as it came out (1994?) and was completely captivated by cyclic ketogenic diets. I used it to great success for the next 6 years, while everyone else in the general public was laughing at me ( go figure). I have refined that basic philosophy over the years to suit my own personal metabolism, but have stayed with the basic formula. I eliminated the processed meats from the diet, replacing them with higher quality proteins, and replaced the rancid fats to a large degree that are found in the processed meats with fresher oils, avacadoes, nuts, olive oil, etc. Of course, I didn’t replace all the fats, but I wanted more of a balance of plant and animal sources. I eat lots of vegetables, 0-3 servings of fruit a day (depending on my goals), and I DO love and eat dairy on a daily basis (even though I’m a little averse to it). My carb load on the weekend now is actually just a few hours long now instead of 36-48 hours. I’ll eat just whatever I want then.
[/quote]
MODOK, is there any chance you could go into a bit more detail on your diet e.g. how you structure it, what a typical day’s food might look like, whether you have target macro nutrient ratios, how much protein you aim for etc etc.
I’ve just been reading your discussion on the ‘is sugar toxic thread’ though some of it was a bit too sciency for me, but would I be right in thinking you limit your carb intake quite strictly and prefer to get extra cals from fats (beyond what you are getting from your target protein intake).
I’m trying to get a handle on my own nutrition at the mo, and trying low carb but I’m struggling to make the cals up that I’ve lost from reducing my carbs so much. I would be extremely interested to see how you do it, assuming you are low carb, but if not I’d still be interested to see how you structure your diet.
Thanks
[quote]MODOK wrote:
Here is a screen shot of my fit day from a couple of days ago.[/quote]
Cheers, I appreciate that. It always helps to see what others are doing… but only 2500 kcals?! 
[quote]Merv77 wrote:
[quote]MODOK wrote:
Here is a screen shot of my fit day from a couple of days ago.[/quote]
Cheers, I appreciate that. It always helps to see what others are doing… but only 2500 kcals?! ;)[/quote]
I was quite surprised by that as well. MODOK, do you have any fitday examples of one of your bulking phases, perhaps when using the AD?
[quote]MODOK wrote:
I will say no matter the caloric level, percentages are >50% fat, 30-35% fat, and < 15% carbs. Thats what I shoot for.[/quote]
should that second fat read as protein?
[quote]Merv77 wrote:
[quote]MODOK wrote:
I will say no matter the caloric level, percentages are >50% fat, 30-35% fat, and < 15% carbs. Thats what I shoot for.[/quote]
should that second fat read as protein?[/quote]
I was thinking the second one but not sure.
According to the pic I believe the second would be protein.
[quote]MODOK wrote:
I’m strictly dieting guys. Thats a typical day on my strict fat loss diet. I don’t have a shot of a maintenance or bulking day yet…I just started using Fitday in the past couple of months.
I will say no matter the caloric level, percentages are >50% fat, 30-35% protein, and < 15% carbs. Thats what I shoot for.[/quote]
wow, only in the 180’s for protein for a guy your size? I’m surprised, but at the same time I have to say when I brought mine down from 325 as a max to around 225 I didn’t really see negative effects while bulking, we’ll see for cutting. And I’m significantly smaller than you.
How do you vary your calories for bulking, maintaining and cutting? If I remember correctly I think you cut getting your leanest on your birthday every year; do you find that this helps track progress and helps in the long run?
[quote]MODOK wrote:
[quote]JoabSonOfZeruiah wrote:
How do you vary your calories for bulking, maintaining and cutting? If I remember correctly I think you cut getting your leanest on your birthday every year; do you find that this helps track progress and helps in the long run?[/quote]
It does help. I’ve consistently been a few pounds heavier every year for the past 4 years… not a bad feat after you’ve been training a long time.
My calories go from 4300 on a bulk, 3600 maintenance, and I do take them down quite low ( ~1800 ) at the end of a cut…but I start the cut at 2800 or so.[/quote]
How does your cardio look from start of the cut to the end?
Modok, when was your avatar pic taken? You’re a big dude, complimented by a big sword (no pun intended)
NICE b-day present. Was that pic pre-diet?
[quote]MODOK wrote:
I do have another 20 g or so of pepto-pro in my training drink, but I am not a big believer in massive protein intake as long as your other bases are covered nutritionally. As long as I’m within shouting distance of 1 g/lb… I have never had any problems with losing mass.
[/quote]
I agree with this wholeheartedly. Write that down 
Oh, and do you do an AD type diet for contest prep? If so, what’s your peak weak look like? Do you carb up before the show like other competitors, or is it different for a fat adapted person? BTW I tried the AD a while back. I didn’t gain much weight or strength even eating at around 3,500-4,500 kcal a day. I was pretty lean gaining though, which was good. When I bulk with carbs, I get much better results, but I also get softer. Bulking implies getting soft though, so to each his own.
[quote]MODOK wrote:
A few months ago. The sword was a birthday present, believe it or not.[/quote]
if Aragorn was on a gram of Test a week…
[quote]MODOK wrote:
[quote]pumped340 wrote:
[quote]MODOK wrote:
[quote]JoabSonOfZeruiah wrote:
How do you vary your calories for bulking, maintaining and cutting? If I remember correctly I think you cut getting your leanest on your birthday every year; do you find that this helps track progress and helps in the long run?[/quote]
It does help. I’ve consistently been a few pounds heavier every year for the past 4 years… not a bad feat after you’ve been training a long time.
My calories go from 4300 on a bulk, 3600 maintenance, and I do take them down quite low ( ~1800 ) at the end of a cut…but I start the cut at 2800 or so.[/quote]
How does your cardio look from start of the cut to the end?
Oh and idk if you track it all but roughly what is your body fat, weight and waistline at before and after?[/quote]
I do a lot of cardio on a cut. I start with 40 minutes 5 or 6 days a week and add 5 minutes to the daily total every two weeks on the diet. I’ve done up to 90 minutes 6 x week before. it usually ends up at 75 minutes though.
All the measurements at the beginning really depend on a lot of factors, but when I end up I’m always right at 32.5 on the waist and 5 or less on the accumeasure calipers on all the sites. Bodyweight at the end has increased over the years to an all time high of 214 this past year. Hoping for >215 this year.
[/quote]
wow thats a lot. Ugh I hate cardio lol.
Sorry for all the questions but how much sleep do you like to get per night and how much do you actually get? When do you feel not enough (e.g. 5 hours) hurts your recovery?
Just wondering cause I have finals now and was thinking if I couldn’t get ~7 consistently per night it would be better to just take a week off. But other people apparently only get like 5-6 a night all the time so I don’t know.
[quote]pumped340 wrote:
was thinking if I couldn’t get ~7 consistently per night it would be better to just take a week off
[/quote]
i never understood this trail of thought… why take an entire week OFF? why not just do your big lifts, cut the accessory shit and get out in like 30 mins?
or just do the CC type deload use 50% max, get a good pump going and leave. unless you’re doing an exercise for each bodypart i cant see it taking that long
maybe its just me but i have a very hard time justifying doing NOTHING for a week…
[quote]MODOK wrote:
[quote]Stronghold wrote:
[quote]MODOK wrote:
I do have another 20 g or so of pepto-pro in my training drink, but I am not a big believer in massive protein intake as long as your other bases are covered nutritionally. As long as I’m within shouting distance of 1 g/lb… I have never had any problems with losing mass.
[/quote]
I agree with this wholeheartedly. Write that down :)[/quote]
Aw, we agree on a ton. I always listen closely to what you have to say. You are one of the absolute best on the board IMO.
[/quote]
I appreciate that man. This is a good thread, always been a fan of the higher training frequency.
[quote]MODOK wrote:
Sleep is a very interesting subject. How much you need appears to be highly variable and possibly even genetically linked in man. There have been studies which show some members of the population can get very few hours of sleep (even 3 or less) and be as rested as other individuals who get a full sleep. Then others who seem to require double digit hours for the same level of rest. I know thats off on a tangent, but I love little mysterious medical oddities like that.
For training purposes, my lifts really do suffer (poundages) if I am lifting at a higher intensity with less than 7 hours of sleep. That seems to be the cut-off, and it is very pronounced. If I am doing more rep work, it doesn’t affect me. So it depends on if I’m really pushing up the poundage in that particular workout whether or not I scratch the lifting day until the next day.
One suggestion would be just to do a pump week (deload). That way you won’t have to worry about not being 100%, and you can still be in the gym.
[/quote]
Interesting, thanks for the input.
I actually just decided about an hour ago to take the next week off. I haven’t missed a workout/taken off in probably 5 months so I don’t think its a big deal and it would just make my life much easier this next week rather than being tired on 5-6 hours per night and stressed feeling like I need to workout all the time. Then summers here
Regarding walking around usually at 10-13%, do you find this easier now that you’ve already gotten really big. Or in other words was getting “fat” at any point necessary? I naturally store fat like crazy and seem to only get results if I allow myself to get up to about 18%. The other side to that though is I’ve never been leaner than maybe 11%. So I guess hypothetically I could get results if I instead went back and forth between say 7%-14% but from what I’ve read this would not be optimal for someone of my body type…even though being 18% sucks lol