For sure. No one is going to mistake you for a marathon runner anytime soon…
[quote]Lonnie123 wrote:
For sure. No one is going to mistake you for a marathon runner anytime soon…[/quote]
Haha, exactly. Looking good, Stu! I’d love to be that ‘small’! 
Hey Stu,
What’s your thoughts on carbs and mass gain periods. Traditionally during bulking periods people take in alot of carbs, but how much is really needed? Like for me I do fine on a low carb diet and actually have more energy than if I eat alot of carbs. I take in 100g dextrose with my workout shake but outside of that how many carb do I really need to gain muscle? Most people would probably say alot. Just wanna hear your thoughts on the subject.
Thanks in advance.
Hi Stu. You look great in that pic. I always enjoy your edifying posts and appreciate the perspective you are able to lend to this forum. Best wishes to you on your continued recovery.
Thanks for the encouraging words guys. I will point out that while I had intended to take a lot of photos post surgery, the amount of size I dropped was quite noticeable, and quite quick. This really hit me mentally more than I realized, and I found myself getting upset anytime someone wanted to snap a pic at family gatherings, or just social events. By the time I took the one I tossed up above, I’d already been upping my food for the last 1-2 months, and training as hard as I reasonably can.
It’s interesting to note about my atrophy, that not everyone reacts this way. My brother in law tore his bicep from the bone, and didn’t seem to lose a single pound in 6 months. On the other hand, as I’ve always maintained: the majority of my muscular size came well into my 30’s, when I was done “maturing”, and finally managed to sort through all the BS about diet, supplements (and their actual role in all of ‘this’), and training. As such, my gains might not be as permanent as a teenage who builds a solid foundation during his ‘formative years’.
My arms are definitely looking better, but I can admit that it’ll be some time before I’m tearing my shirts off. The pecs are gonna be a serious issue with the shoulder situation. I’ll get more in depth as to what I’m able to to a bit later on.
The positive thoughts really mean a lot though. Thanks guys.
S
what do you think is the best method for calculating BMR?
[quote]The Mighty Stu wrote:
Thanks for the encouraging words guys. I will point out that while I had intended to take a lot of photos post surgery, the amount of size I dropped was quite noticeable, and quite quick. This really hit me mentally more than I realized, and I found myself getting upset anytime someone wanted to snap a pic at family gatherings, or just social events. By the time I took the one I tossed up above, I’d already been upping my food for the last 1-2 months, and training as hard as I reasonably can.
It’s interesting to note about my atrophy, that not everyone reacts this way. My brother in law tore his bicep from the bone, and didn’t seem to lose a single pound in 6 months. On the other hand, as I’ve always maintained: the majority of my muscular size came well into my 30’s, when I was done “maturing”, and finally managed to sort through all the BS about diet, supplements (and their actual role in all of ‘this’), and training. As such, my gains might not be as permanent as a teenage who builds a solid foundation during his ‘formative years’.
My arms are definitely looking better, but I can admit that it’ll be some time before I’m tearing my shirts off. The pecs are gonna be a serious issue with the shoulder situation. I’ll get more in depth as to what I’m able to to a bit later on.
The positive thoughts really mean a lot though. Thanks guys.
S[/quote]
Just think of how quickly you will be able to make progress. That is the mentally positive side of reverting to an “untrained” state.
[quote]yolo84 wrote:
what do you think is the best method for calculating BMR?[/quote]
What a lot of people forget, is that your food choices (macros) can have an effect into how many calories you can really eat each day. For example, when you eat a lot of protein, your body expends more calories digesting it than it would when breaking down carbs, or even more so, fats. So when you just get one of those simple ‘multiply your bodyweight by X’ suggestions, it can only give you a very rough approximation.
(Look up “Met-coefficients” if you wanna track down a formula that takes this into account)
What you see more often than not, is the BW x 15 suggestion. This is what most people use to lose weight.
A variation on that is the 16,17,18 method. Taking into account if you have a slow, medium, or fast metabolism, you take the suggested # and multiply that by your bodyweight.
Again, this will give you a very ROUGH estimate. When I calculate #s for a client, I always try to figure a range. Then, taking into account what the person’s previous eating looks like I make my best educated-guess, monitoring on a daily basis how their body reacts to various calories, and carbs. (I always have people log their daily intake for a week or so. This gives me a lot of information, but of major importance, is how many carbs their body is used to handling, and just how well it does so.)
Now, there are some seriously intricate calculators online, but, the best indicator of how many cals you really need is to keep track everyday for a period of time, and see if you weight stays constant.
S
Stu, in your experience/opinion what kind of results muscle wise could be achieved lifting only 3x a (push, pull, legs) week given carbs are kept pre-workout and overall calorie intake in kept optimal? Would it depend too much on personal physiology?
I train 5-6x a week and my brother would like to train with me but, can not seem to keep at it hitting the gym so often. I figure if he can stick to a 3x a week plan it may get him in and out gym faster while still giving him the results he “may” want and most importantly it will keep him out of my way… :). He is about 5’10, 170 lbs, bf is low enough to see abs and some leg separation. His goal is to be a lean 190 lbs.
Thanks
[quote]xXSeraphimXx wrote:
Stu, in your experience/opinion what kind of results muscle wise could be achieved lifting only 3x a (push, pull, legs) week given carbs are kept pre-workout and overall calorie intake in kept optimal? Would it depend too much on personal physiology?
I train 5-6x a week and my brother would like to train with me but, can not seem to keep at it hitting the gym so often. I figure if he can stick to a 3x a week plan it may get him in and out gym faster while still giving him the results he “may” want and most importantly it will keep him out of my way… :). He is about 5’10, 170 lbs, bf is low enough to see abs and some leg separation. His goal is to be a lean 190 lbs.
Edit: I mentioned push, pull ,legs but, any set up would be good.
Thanks[/quote]
[quote]deadliftgoal500 wrote:
Hey Stu,
What’s your thoughts on carbs and mass gain periods. Traditionally during bulking periods people take in alot of carbs, but how much is really needed? Like for me I do fine on a low carb diet and actually have more energy than if I eat alot of carbs. I take in 100g dextrose with my workout shake but outside of that how many carb do I really need to gain muscle? Most people would probably say alot. Just wanna hear your thoughts on the subject.
Thanks in advance. [/quote]
Good question. First, I just wanna point out that I’m not one of those ‘bulk up’ thinking guys. I’ve said in many threads over the years that you can’t force feed muscle growth, and I still hold that it’s 100% true, no matter how many armchair/forum experts may wish otherwise. With that said, what you can do with your diet, is ensure that your body is in the best possible position to synthesize new muscle tissue as it genetically can.
That means that you must not only provide the extra ‘building blocks’ with which to construct the new muscle, but energy substrates to carry out the process, while also allowing the optimal hormonal situation for all of this to occur.
Many people simply think of carbohydrates as an energy source, and while this is indeed true, the fact that you can have a very profound influence on your body’s insulin levels via carbohydrate ingestion, should be seriously addressed.
Insulin is one of those double edge issues with bodybuilders and physique athletes. You can be one of those “keep it low and steady to burn fat” types, or one of those “keep it high and steady to gain as much weight as possible” types. If you’re smart though, you realize that both extremes can have negative consequences for someone desiring to have large amounts of muscle and be ripped at the same time. This is where you get into all the talk of ‘Targeted’ carbs, and ‘Nutrient Timing’.
I’ve always focused a good deal of my own carbohydrate ingestion around my breakfast, and my workout. This has been true when in off-season, as well as when cutting for a contest. That doesn’t mean that everything outside of those times are always completely carb free, especially in an off season. IMO though, by not having P+C at every feeding, you allow your body to possibly rely more on fat oxidation at certain stretches.
Dr. Klemzsewski always said that you have two kinds of metabolism going on at all times; glycogen, and fatty acid. Long stretches without carbs will shift the ratio more towards fatty acids. For this reason alone, I’ve always liked alternating P+C and P+F dominant meals.
Now, in terms of amounts (the real crux of your question!)… when you’ve got an idea of how many calories your body needs, there are certain aspects that if you push beyond a certain point, will not only NOT yield better results, but can possible become a detriment. Protein can be one of those.
We all fall victim at some point (usually when first starting out) to the ad-reports telling us that we need 500g of protein a day in order to get our little 150 lbs body to resemble Jay Cutler’s. Unfortunately, it doesn’t work that way. While I do believe that a higher intake for weight training athletes, compared to our sedentary counterparts, will have a positive effect on muscle building, it is only until a certain point. Beyond which, it’s just wasteful.
In some people, ultra excessive, protein-heavy (almost solely!) diets can actually lead to the body’s growing preference on the nutrient as a fuel source. This is why you continually hear about people on keto-genic diets losing muscle in the process.
So now that you’ve decided how much protein you really need in your quest towards your physique goals (adding muscle), you need to distribute the rest of the calories between carbs and fat. THIS is a serious individual consideration. In my case, I’ve always been able to handle a good amount of carbs. This is due to the amount of lean muscle I usually carry around.
From being relatively lean (even far after a contest), my sensitivity has actually increased over the years of competing. I don’t know how common this is, but it’s something I have definitely noticed. Other people, may be more sensitive, and would be better suited leaning more on healthy fats to fill in the gaps.
As far as the argument over using carbs at SOME feedings vs spreading them out to ALL; I’ve heard very good thinking on both approaches. On one hand, is the feeling that always having some insulin (from carb ingestion) will keep you in a more anabolic situation for the majority of the day and hence produce better results.
On the other hand, is the feeling that you get a better response from dips and peaks in blood sugar levels, and will lead to greater results. It’s always a toughie to put two conflicting suggestions to the test when you will find plenty of successful folks who subscribe to both schools of thought. I actually happen to like ‘fatty’ foods, so while it’s not a conscious decision for dips and peaks, I probably have just as many P+F meals as P+C throughout an average day.
I know that’s not exactly giving you definite answers or #s to play with, but IMO, how lean you’re comfortable walking around and how well your body handles carbohydrates are going to be the biggest factors when planning just how many carbs you really need to make gains. Like I said earlier though; with my own ingestion the key points of the day, especially around my training, has made the biggest difference.
(damn, I just scrolled back up… hope I didn’t ramble too much, but you asked for my thoughts!)
S
What rep range do you find most effective for the big lifts?
You probably have answered this previously but do you have a set routine when it comes to exercises or do you go by feel?
Stu, I had the funniest dream 2 days ago. You were working out at Richie’s gym in Sunset park, Brooklyn (ever heard of it?) Anyway, in my dream you were a world famous bodybuilder and I came up to you to ask if you needed help rehabing your shoulder. You agreed and I proceeded to show you some ways to activate lower traps, haha. When I woke up I was thinking to myself I may be spending too much time on the forums, lol.
[quote]The Mighty Stu wrote:
[quote]deadliftgoal500 wrote:
Hey Stu,
What’s your thoughts on carbs and mass gain periods. Traditionally during bulking periods people take in alot of carbs, but how much is really needed? Like for me I do fine on a low carb diet and actually have more energy than if I eat alot of carbs. I take in 100g dextrose with my workout shake but outside of that how many carb do I really need to gain muscle? Most people would probably say alot. Just wanna hear your thoughts on the subject.
Thanks in advance. [/quote]
Good question. First, I just wanna point out that I’m not one of those ‘bulk up’ thinking guys. I’ve said in many threads over the years that you can’t force feed muscle growth, and I still hold that it’s 100% true, no matter how many armchair/forum experts may wish otherwise. With that said, what you can do with your diet, is ensure that your body is in the best possible position to synthesize new muscle tissue as it genetically can.
That means that you must not only provide the extra ‘building blocks’ with which to construct the new muscle, but energy substrates to carry out the process, while also allowing the optimal hormonal situation for all of this to occur.
Many people simply think of carbohydrates as an energy source, and while this is indeed true, the fact that you can have a very profound influence on your body’s insulin levels via carbohydrate ingestion, should be seriously addressed.
Insulin is one of those double edge issues with bodybuilders and physique athletes. You can be one of those “keep it low and steady to burn fat” types, or one of those “keep it high and steady to gain as much weight as possible” types. If you’re smart though, you realize that both extremes can have negative consequences for someone desiring to have large amounts of muscle and be ripped at the same time. This is where you get into all the talk of ‘Targeted’ carbs, and ‘Nutrient Timing’.
I’ve always focused a good deal of my own carbohydrate ingestion around my breakfast, and my workout. This has been true when in off-season, as well as when cutting for a contest. That doesn’t mean that everything outside of those times are always completely carb free, especially in an off season. IMO though, by not having P+C at every feeding, you allow your body to possibly rely more on fat oxidation at certain stretches.
Dr. Klemzsewski always said that you have two kinds of metabolism going on at all times; glycogen, and fatty acid. Long stretches without carbs will shift the ratio more towards fatty acids. For this reason alone, I’ve always liked alternating P+C and P+F dominant meals.
Now, in terms of amounts (the real crux of your question!)… when you’ve got an idea of how many calories your body needs, there are certain aspects that if you push beyond a certain point, will not only NOT yield better results, but can possible become a detriment. Protein can be one of those.
We all fall victim at some point (usually when first starting out) to the ad-reports telling us that we need 500g of protein a day in order to get our little 150 lbs body to resemble Jay Cutler’s. Unfortunately, it doesn’t work that way. While I do believe that a higher intake for weight training athletes, compared to our sedentary counterparts, will have a positive effect on muscle building, it is only until a certain point. Beyond which, it’s just wasteful.
In some people, ultra excessive, protein-heavy (almost solely!) diets can actually lead to the body’s growing preference on the nutrient as a fuel source. This is why you continually hear about people on keto-genic diets losing muscle in the process.
So now that you’ve decided how much protein you really need in your quest towards your physique goals (adding muscle), you need to distribute the rest of the calories between carbs and fat. THIS is a serious individual consideration. In my case, I’ve always been able to handle a good amount of carbs. This is due to the amount of lean muscle I usually carry around.
From being relatively lean (even far after a contest), my sensitivity has actually increased over the years of competing. I don’t know how common this is, but it’s something I have definitely noticed. Other people, may be more sensitive, and would be better suited leaning more on healthy fats to fill in the gaps.
As far as the argument over using carbs at SOME feedings vs spreading them out to ALL; I’ve heard very good thinking on both approaches. On one hand, is the feeling that always having some insulin (from carb ingestion) will keep you in a more anabolic situation for the majority of the day and hence produce better results.
On the other hand, is the feeling that you get a better response from dips and peaks in blood sugar levels, and will lead to greater results. It’s always a toughie to put two conflicting suggestions to the test when you will find plenty of successful folks who subscribe to both schools of thought. I actually happen to like ‘fatty’ foods, so while it’s not a conscious decision for dips and peaks, I probably have just as many P+F meals as P+C throughout an average day.
I know that’s not exactly giving you definite answers or #s to play with, but IMO, how lean you’re comfortable walking around and how well your body handles carbohydrates are going to be the biggest factors when planning just how many carbs you really need to make gains. Like I said earlier though; with my own ingestion the key points of the day, especially around my training, has made the biggest difference.
(damn, I just scrolled back up… hope I didn’t ramble too much, but you asked for my thoughts!)
S[/quote]
Thanks for the really long response lol
As for me, my history with carbs is not a good one, and that’s being generous. When i was 7 I had high cholesterol, high blood pressure, was pre-diabetic and was FAT (definently over 30% bf), and it’s not like my diet was complete crap either. Breakfast was usually a bowl of cereal, lunch was a turkey sandwich and a juice carton and dinner was whatever my mom made, which was usually Indian food with vegetables (I’m Indian).Other than that I had a fruit or two and would only eat out once a week for one meal. It was only when I cut out alot of the carbs in my diet (cereal, my mom’s food, juice) that i lost the fat and got my health back in shape. I’m still somewhat fat (probably around 20%) but my cholesterol, blood pressure and blood sugar is healthy again. So you can see why I would be nervous about taking in carbs to gain muscle. I know they’re needed, and from my experience they definently help when taken peri-workout, but i’m still unsure of taking them outside of that. Even for breakfast i’ve stopped taking in carbs a year ago and my energy levels have been so much better. I think my body just runs better on fat.
So in a follow up question of sorts, for someone like ME, who does not do well with carbs and has a history of health problems, is limiting carbs to about 100 grams peri-workout a good idea?
And thanks again for the lengthy repsonse. How long did it take you to write that haha?
Hey Stu.
What is your strategy (nutrition-wise and exercise-wise) the day after a refeed, when one is at the beginning of a cut?
(A low-fat, medium-protein, high-carb refeed).
Thx in advance.
[quote]deadliftgoal500 wrote:
Thanks for the really long response lol
As for me, my history with carbs is not a good one, and that’s being generous. When i was 7 I had high cholesterol, high blood pressure, was pre-diabetic and was FAT (definently over 30% bf), and it’s not like my diet was complete crap either. Breakfast was usually a bowl of cereal, lunch was a turkey sandwich and a juice carton and dinner was whatever my mom made, which was usually Indian food with vegetables (I’m Indian).Other than that I had a fruit or two and would only eat out once a week for one meal. It was only when I cut out alot of the carbs in my diet (cereal, my mom’s food, juice) that i lost the fat and got my health back in shape. I’m still somewhat fat (probably around 20%) but my cholesterol, blood pressure and blood sugar is healthy again. So you can see why I would be nervous about taking in carbs to gain muscle. I know they’re needed, and from my experience they definently help when taken peri-workout, but i’m still unsure of taking them outside of that. Even for breakfast i’ve stopped taking in carbs a year ago and my energy levels have been so much better. I think my body just runs better on fat.
So in a follow up question of sorts, for someone like ME, who does not do well with carbs and has a history of health problems, is limiting carbs to about 100 grams peri-workout a good idea?
And thanks again for the lengthy repsonse. How long did it take you to write that haha?[/quote]
If, as you’ve already seen, your body just doesn’t handle a very carb heavy diet well, then I think you’ve got your answer there. Just focusing the majority of your daily intake (not counting incidentals) around your workout is probably the best strategy. The rest of the day you can make use of proteins, healthy fats, and veggies. This will allow you to have productive training sessions, and continue to improve your body composition.
And yeah, it took a while. I’m a bit behind with answering the questions on here (and updating on my own status) because I don’t always have a lot of time to spare at work, or even after work before heading to the gym or PT.
I’m working on catching up guys, I’m not ignoring anyone! -lol
S
[quote]xXSeraphimXx wrote:
Stu, in your experience/opinion what kind of results muscle wise could be achieved lifting only 3x a (push, pull, legs) week given carbs are kept pre-workout and overall calorie intake in kept optimal? Would it depend too much on personal physiology?
I train 5-6x a week and my brother would like to train with me but, can not seem to keep at it hitting the gym so often. I figure if he can stick to a 3x a week plan it may get him in and out gym faster while still giving him the results he “may” want and most importantly it will keep him out of my way… :). He is about 5’10, 170 lbs, bf is low enough to see abs and some leg separation. His goal is to be a lean 190 lbs.
Thanks[/quote]
I actually made fairly good gains on a 3x a week schedule when I first started grad school. Time certainly wasn’t a luxury. My influences at the time were the writings of Mentzer, Yates, even Mike Francious (sp?). So I settled on an approach where I relied on the big lifts, some pre-exhaust or at least special attention to exercise ordering for weaker points, and keeping an eye on my overall work volume.
My knowledge of nutrition was practically nil back then except for TRYING to eat every few hours, and I’m sure my understanding of how everything really fits together was even less. Still, it was after that year that I finally broke 16" for my arms. Remember that I started college at 150 (not-lean) lbs, and on my small frame (5’8) those guns looked huge! -lol
Eventually I adopted a 4x a week, which was more productive, but that 3x program yielded results no doubt.
If your brother is going to truly bust his ass on a limited frequency program, he must also realize that the actual growing is done outside of the gym. That’s 4 days each week where he’ll still have to be concerned about his eating, sleeping, any supplements he’s taking etc.
Also, if he’s relatively untrained compared to you, a more rudimentary program may well give him better results than you might expect. I have a fairly overweight client at the moment who’s about 5’2, 220+ lbs. Her “workout” is a 3x a week, alternating 2 day program done at home with a couple of 5 lb handweights. She’s lost 10 lbs in the last 2.5 weeks.
Sure losing weight from a heavier starting point is not the same as synthesizing new muscle tissue, but you’d be surprised at how fast some new trainers can suddenly see results.
As to the targeted carb approach: I’m definitely a big fan. Most people know that even when I diet for a contest, I keep a very considerable amount of my daily carbs before my training. To me, it just allows for a more productive session. If your brother wants to keep the rest of his day P+F (similar to the response I just wrote above I think), it will certainly aid in keeping a leaner body comp, just so long as he’s not force feeding himself 10,000 cals a day or anything.
Also, if he’s as lean as you say at 170 lbs, understand that a 20 lb gain of solid muscle while remaining at a similar bodyfat level is not a simple task.
S
[quote]bnkNando wrote:
What rep range do you find most effective for the big lifts?[/quote]
I used to always keep my rep ranges in the lower end, 6-8, although if I got 5 really quality reps, with continuous tension (non-locking out), I didn’t complain. As I got more into focusing on how the muscles really looked once you stripped the fat away, I would let some exercises creep up a bit. For example, I really began enjoying front squats about 5 years back, and definitely saw results from them.
Still, I felt my legs lacked some compared to some of the really great Natural Pros. So even though I never developed amazing quads from backsquats, I incorporated them after my front squats, but with a different rep range. I truly feel this really helped bring up what was one of my noticeably lagging bodyparts.
So while I always suggest starting with lower rep work, never be afraid to try something new. The actual ratio breakdown of fast twitch to slow twitch muscles is a genetic thing, and unless you’re going to get muscle biopsies on yourself, you’re gonna have to try, observe, and assess like the rest of us! 
[quote]
You probably have answered this previously but do you have a set routine when it comes to exercises or do you go by feel?[/quote]
I definitely have exercises, and orders that I like. Earlier in my training, I would obsess about creating the perfect training split, with the ultimate combination of exercises, for just the right number of reps to get the most out of every muscle group.
While it was great that I was actually thinking so much about what I was going to do, after a certain amount of experience, you start to wing it a bit. Some days you can’t get the equipment that you planned on using. Other days, something feels a bit ‘off’ with a movement, so you scrap it. Bottom line though, is that when you hit a certain bodypart, you realize that there are ‘parts’ of it that you need to address.
For example: On back day, I need to concern myself with width, thickness, lumbar region, and even the teres/subscap area (all those cool little knots!). A good list of exercises will address them all, possibly with an added focus on one or two in particular. If I feel that I haven’t hit an area sufficiently, I can throw in a few more sets, or even another exercise for it.
Sure I’ve got some ‘favorite’ movements, but should things not work out for whatever reason, I’ve got a laundry list of alternatives. If those alternatives aren’t an option, I may take the order of exercises I was considering, and reverse it. Heck, I’ve had back days where I’ve done 10 sets of pullups, 10 sets of barbell rows, and then gone home! Not much thinking involved there, just lots of focus, grit, and pain
S
Hey Stu,
how do you like to dry out for competitions? in terms of water and sodium