[quote]Sloth wrote:
…Ugh, we’re in the home buying business now?[/quote]
It appears so…would love to know how that’s going to be accomplished while under the proposed ‘spending freeze’.
Maybe the DoD will buy all the properties?
[quote]borrek wrote:
Sloth wrote:
…Ugh, we’re in the home buying business now?
my question about that and the whole “taxpayers as investors” thing, is that if my “investment” yields a return, are they cutting me a check? hmmm methinks no[/quote]
What kinda patriot are you anyway.
Don’t you understand that the community gaining those returns in the persons of our beneficent leaders is much better than you keeping your own money. Let’s get with the program Bud.
[quote]Sloth wrote:
…Ugh, we’re in the home buying business now?[/quote]
I asked a question about this before. If the house appreciates in years to come, when the home owner sells for a profit, do the taxpayers get the profit or does the home owner we just bailed out ?
On a different subject, not sure what others think, but the way we are taxed, I think health insurance is a right more than a responsibility. I feel am responsible for getting the best coverage I can for my family, but I think it’s a right that I should be able to get it.
[quote]pwilliams wrote:
Razorslim wrote:
So who won?
Overextended home owners [/quote]
Good one PW
I guess there is not enough socialism in the bailout, now McCain wants to buy up mortagages. I wish someone would of asked him how that applies to his spending freeze on everything but Veterans, Defense etc. If the government makes a habit of buying everything pretty soon we won’t have to worry about socialism. We will be communist and the government will own everything…
These issues have become very important to me:
-
Fiscal responsibility/Reduced Federal Spending/Economic Strength (I think all three go hand-in-hand).
-
Energy Independence/National Security (again, two that I think go hand-in-hand, as BOTH candidates recognize that too often oil “drives” our foreign policy).
-
Responsible, Focused and Efficient Social Programs (Yes, I know; some feel that there is no such animal that can exist, at least in THIS Universe…)
-
A Strong Military
The problem that I now have with both candidates is that just when I thought that they had a pretty good plan for tackling one, they cancel it all (in my mind) with a bad one.
Tonight it was McCain.
He was ready to attack #1 and #3; and I thought his ideas were great:
-
Eliminate certain programs.
-
Decrease Defense Spending.
-
NO earmarks (his words)
-
An across-the-board spending freeze.
Great…then
Right off the bat he comes up with this plan to purchase bad mortgages? At what cost? What was the “bailout” supposed to do?
I agree with McCain’s plan on Medicare. This needs a commission (there are some VERY complex issues with Medicaire); and there needs to be a Congressional “up-and-down” Vote, or you will come up with a plan so pork laden that the “bailout” will seem tame.
Healthcare
To tell the truth, I’m unsure WHICH plan is best in how it will work in practice.
Any of you guys with a link to a NON-partisan, watch-dog group who might reasonably compare and contrast the two plans?
I applaud both candidates for recognizing that historically, NO country has ever been able to maintain a strong military while it became economically weak.
All-in-all a debate that was a wash to me.
Mufasa
Thank you Bill Clinton and Barney Frank for the mortgage crisis. Now, who is going to fix the economy? My wish is for the gov’t to stay the hell out of Wall Street
Its pretty clear that neither one of these guys can tackle our many problems. Obama is extrememly intelligent but has no experience. McCain has lots of experience but is not the sharpest knife in the drawer.
Then they both embrace the philosophy of unselfishness, that one person can be legally forced to help another. Until we quit introducing force into human relationships (except using force against those who initiate it), we’ll have societies such as this. You can’t force the productive to help the non-productive, no matter how ‘heartless’ that sounds.
[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
This is pathetic. My Mccain vote is getting tougher all the time.[/quote]
Of course. We’re being destroyed by our morality and neither one of these yoyos would ever get that. Even if they did, most Americans still believe in coercive government, so it really wouldn’t matter.
[quote]borrek wrote:
lol false reason? you know that a large portion of middle easterners don’t believe the 9/11 hijackers were saudi and were instead american and israeli? reason has nothing to do with it. [/quote]
Rubbish! There’s a larger proportion of Americans who believe that than there are Middle Easterners. Ben Laden wasn’t an unknown figures over there, and people have been dealing with him and his ilk for far longer than you guys. Admittedly, nothing as spectacular and large scale as 9/11, but they got it in the flesh alright. It’s not like they first heard about the Talibans in 2001.
It’s quite hard to blame them for that position. Chances are that you would equally vilify a foreign power that supports and finances dictators, threatens, bombs and invades countries.
Get some perspective.
Also, “most governments there” do not represent the will of the people. Nation states are mostly artificial creations of the French and Brits carving up the place.
Foreign imperialism caused the region a lot in the last 100 years. Israel is now (rightly or wrongly) viewed as a client of The West to keep a foothold on the region. Since Paris and London tamed down their imperialistic ambitions, Washington filled the vacuum. And the latter’s unconditional support for Tel-Aviv is so well documented, that it adds to US’ foreign policy unpopularity in the region.
Keep going, Mick!
What about McCain’s plan to buy up all the bad mortgages of many who should not have had them in the first place?
That will certainly take a HUGE chunk of your tax dollars.
See how confusing and “schizophrenic” this whole election has become as it relates to issues?
Mufasa
McCain just proved why I never liked him for President.
Other than the potential USSC appointments, is there any real difference between Opie and McCain?
Both voted for fucking the taxpayer
Both want health care
Both want Buffet for Sec of Treasury.
Do these guys not know how old Buffet is?
Other than the “no more Bush” folks, is there ANYONE voting for Opie who is truly ecstatic to do so?
Other than the “no Obama” crowd, is there anyone voting for McCain who is truly ecstatic to do so?
And not to hijack, but when was the last time you were truly excited to exercise your right to vote for a presidential candidate?
Here’s mine:
1984 - Reagan (my first presidential election)
2000 - Bush
[quote]rainjack wrote:
McCain just proved why I never liked him for President.
Other than the potential USSC appointments, is there any real difference between Opie and McCain?
Both voted for fucking the taxpayer
Both want health care
Both want Buffet for Sec of Treasury.
Do these guys not know how old Buffet is?
Other than the “no more Bush” folks, is there ANYONE voting for Opie who is truly ecstatic to do so?
Other than the “no Obama” crowd, is there anyone voting for McCain who is truly ecstatic to do so?
And not to hijack, but when was the last time you were truly excited to exercise your right to vote for a presidential candidate?
Here’s mine:
1984 - Reagan (my first presidential election)
2000 - Bush
[/quote]
Never…I’ve never been old enough to vote in an election where I actually really liked the candidates. 2000 was my first election. I was never impressed with Bush even when he was campaigning and pretending to be a fiscally responsible conservative. And didn’t like Gore much either.
[quote]lixy wrote:
borrek wrote:
lol false reason? you know that a large portion of middle easterners don’t believe the 9/11 hijackers were saudi and were instead american and israeli? reason has nothing to do with it.
Rubbish! There’s a larger proportion of Americans who believe that than there are Middle Easterners. Ben Laden wasn’t an unknown figures over there, and people have been dealing with him and his ilk for far longer than you guys. Admittedly, nothing as spectacular and large scale as 9/11, but they got it in the flesh alright. It’s not like they first heard about the Talibans in 2001.
America is their “great satan”,
It’s quite hard to blame them for that position. Chances are that you would equally vilify a foreign power that supports and finances dictators, threatens, bombs and invades countries.
Get some perspective.
Israel isn’t even recognized by most governments there.
Also, “most governments there” do not represent the will of the people. Nation states are mostly artificial creations of the French and Brits carving up the place.
Foreign imperialism caused the region a lot in the last 100 years. Israel is now (rightly or wrongly) viewed as a client of The West to keep a foothold on the region. Since Paris and London tamed down their imperialistic ambitions, Washington filled the vacuum. And the latter’s unconditional support for Tel-Aviv is so well documented, that it adds to US’ foreign policy unpopularity in the region.[/quote]
sorry guys, I left some food out and it brought a rat…
To answer the “excited to vote” question, I don’t think I ever have been. Especially in last election when despite living in the same place for 25 years, showing my voter registration card listing my polling station, and having voted in the same building before, I was told that they “didn’t have me on their records” and didn’t have a ballot for me. I had to fill out a provisional ballot which I knew wouldn’t even be opened unless it was “needed”
[quote]jsbrook wrote:
rainjack wrote:
McCain just proved why I never liked him for President.
Other than the potential USSC appointments, is there any real difference between Opie and McCain?
Both voted for fucking the taxpayer
Both want health care
Both want Buffet for Sec of Treasury.
Do these guys not know how old Buffet is?
Other than the “no more Bush” folks, is there ANYONE voting for Opie who is truly ecstatic to do so?
Other than the “no Obama” crowd, is there anyone voting for McCain who is truly ecstatic to do so?
And not to hijack, but when was the last time you were truly excited to exercise your right to vote for a presidential candidate?
Here’s mine:
1984 - Reagan (my first presidential election)
2000 - Bush
Never…I’ve never been old enough to vote in an election where I actually really liked the candidates. 2000 was my first election. I was never impressed with Bush even when he was campaigning and pretending to be a fiscally responsible conservative. And didn’t like Gore much either.[/quote]
I voted for Bush because I didn’t want Gore or Kerry. I’ll probably vote for McCain - but it’s a vote not only against Obama, but against the political culture that’s assembled around him, and against the media frenzy behind him.
Based on this thread I am glad I didn’t waste my time watching.
[quote]borrek wrote:
Inner Hulk wrote:
You do realize that our close ties with Israel is what helps to mobilize Jihadists against the US, right?
Yeah right. As much as I hate to say it, George Bush is right in that they hate our way of life and will come up with any reason to hate us. Were Iran to nuke Israel off the planet do you think that all of the sudden the middle east would want to be our buddies?
[/quote]
Wow. People still think like this?
Yea, that’s it… they hate us cause we’re free. That’s the stupidist fucking logic in the entire goddamn world.
As much as I agree that Israel really can’t put troops in any Arab country without starting a shitstorm, let’s all agree that Muslims don’t want us to die because we’re “free”.
[quote]rainjack wrote:
Both want Buffet for Sec of Treasury.
Do these guys not know how old Buffet is? [/quote]
Five years more than McCain.
What’s your point?
[quote]katzenjammer wrote:
jsbrook wrote:
rainjack wrote:
McCain just proved why I never liked him for President.
Other than the potential USSC appointments, is there any real difference between Opie and McCain?
Both voted for fucking the taxpayer
Both want health care
Both want Buffet for Sec of Treasury.
Do these guys not know how old Buffet is?
Other than the “no more Bush” folks, is there ANYONE voting for Opie who is truly ecstatic to do so?
Other than the “no Obama” crowd, is there anyone voting for McCain who is truly ecstatic to do so?
And not to hijack, but when was the last time you were truly excited to exercise your right to vote for a presidential candidate?
Here’s mine:
1984 - Reagan (my first presidential election)
2000 - Bush
Never…I’ve never been old enough to vote in an election where I actually really liked the candidates. 2000 was my first election. I was never impressed with Bush even when he was campaigning and pretending to be a fiscally responsible conservative. And didn’t like Gore much either.
I voted for Bush because I didn’t want Gore or Kerry. I’ll probably vote for McCain - but it’s a vote not only against Obama, but against the political culture that’s assembled around him, and against the media frenzy behind him.
[/quote]
I don’t know if I can vote McCain. There are parts of McCain that are preferable to me than Obama, but they seem to be more theoretical than real.
Palin’s even worse. I know many here love her, but I think she’s a total fraud. And I’m not just basing it on interviews with Katie Couric. Her record in Alaska is atrocious. I can’t stand most of her social policies, either.