Marijuana Raid Leads To Cops Shooting The Family's Dogs

Makavali · May 8, 2010, 5:59am

[quote]GrindOverMatter wrote:
I didnt read this whole thread but let me say this:

I despise Marijuana, I’ve never smoked it before, i’ve never really even considered smoking it(I’m happy to be drug free) Up until this year i never had a strong opinion about it. what changed my my opinion from neutral to hate was living with 2 stoners this year.

almost everynight id come home from a long tiring day at school at my house would reek like pot. The rest of the house would make an effort to keep the kitchen clean and managableable, (7 guys living together) only to be thwarted by these two roomates late night stoner cooking where theyd leave the most disgusting shit out for us to clean.

One of the guys was your typical stoner/surfer guy with a personality i couldnt stand at all, while the other was the whole Hunter S thompson stoner guy who trys come off as smart but all he really was, was a pathological liar (lying about his accomplishments and experiences in order to impress others).

I truely disliked this guy. on top this, our hunter S thompson friend sold weed out of his room in our house, i would of loved to see cops raid our house and see buddy get charged. In this siutation the cops were probably too careless, but for the most part i find myself agreeing with what gregron is saying.

to continue my rant,I honestly havent come across anyone who smokes on a semi regular basis who i don’t consider to lazy or unproductive, face it guys unless you abosolutely need the drug for some medical purpose, it’s just going to drag you down.

So for me the existence of this drug so far has only negatively affected my life, if it ever came to vote in canada, it would be a no decision for me, id vote against it.

[/quote]

Based on two guys you lived with.

It’s not hard to find losers and these guys fit the description well.

Your decision making however, is poorly thought out and basically shows that you swallow the proverbial kool-aid. Enjoy being deep throated by the propaganda.

gregron · May 8, 2010, 6:01am

The question I asked had nothing to do with the bill of rights. I asked for an example of laws that arent smart to follow but you went off m a tangent and didn’t answer my question.

I never said anything about respnses to “the same level” crimes in many states I said when has someone gone 7mph over the speed limit and been shot at for it?

You obviously can’t stay on topic and discuss the issue at hand which is:

A. The police raided the house because illegal narcotics were believed to be on site.
B. They found illegal narcotics in the house.

What can you argue about that? (hint: nothing. So I’m sure you’ll try to change it around and bring up some other issue to try to pigeon hole me but I’m done debating you cause you seem to not be able to stay on topic here)

.greg.

EurekaBulldogLaw · May 8, 2010, 6:50am

[quote]GrindOverMatter wrote:
I didnt read this whole thread but let me say this:

I despise Marijuana, I’ve never smoked it before, i’ve never really even considered smoking it(I’m happy to be drug free) Up until this year i never had a strong opinion about it. what changed my my opinion from neutral to hate was living with 2 stoners this year.

almost everynight id come home from a long tiring day at school at my house would reek like pot. The rest of the house would make an effort to keep the kitchen clean and managableable, (7 guys living together) only to be thwarted by these two roomates late night stoner cooking where theyd leave the most disgusting shit out for us to clean.

One of the guys was your typical stoner/surfer guy with a personality i couldnt stand at all, while the other was the whole Hunter S thompson stoner guy who trys come off as smart but all he really was, was a pathological liar (lying about his accomplishments and experiences in order to impress others).

I truely disliked this guy. on top this, our hunter S thompson friend sold weed out of his room in our house, i would of loved to see cops raid our house and see buddy get charged. In this siutation the cops were probably too careless, but for the most part i find myself agreeing with what gregron is saying.

to continue my rant,I honestly havent come across anyone who smokes on a semi regular basis who i don’t consider to lazy or unproductive, face it guys unless you abosolutely need the drug for some medical purpose, it’s just going to drag you down.

So for me the existence of this drug so far has only negatively affected my life, if it ever came to vote in canada, it would be a no decision for me, id vote against it.

[/quote]

Wow, weed sure has made your life shitty. I mean, stoners leaving food out in the kitchen? ROUGH.

This ain’t crack. Do you know how many people around you smoke/have smoked weed? I’d be willing to be a lot more than you think, and I’m not talking about ‘losers’.

Fuck outta here with yer ‘it brings everyone down.’ The most successful people I know hit the ganj.

Deorum · May 8, 2010, 6:51am

[quote]gregron wrote:

[quote]Deorum wrote:

[quote]gregron wrote:

Theres so many things in your post that need to be addressed I don’t even know where to start.

The police didnt “straight up murder an old lady.” She shot 3 police officers who had a warrant from a judge and were serching her house.

What were you arrested for when you were 16? The fact that you refused to let the cop search your vehicle is suspicious right there. With nothing to hide why would you refuse? But then you make a big deal about it and guess what? The cop finds “drug paraphernalia.” Its not like you were hasstled by this cop and then he found nothing in your car.

As dumb as you think the law is its still a law. I would also say that in 99% of cases it IS SMART to follow laws… What laws arent smart to follow?

I also feel sorry for the guy and his family cause thats a shitty situation but its a shitty situation that he put himself into by breaking the law.

.greg.[/quote]

Are you attempting to sound completely ignorant of the law in this post or was this a side effect of head in ass syndrome?
[/quote]

What law are you talking about?
[/quote]

The law as in the large body of laws that is commonly referred to as “the law”.

Anyway, “What were you arrested for when you were 16? The fact that you refused to let the cop search your vehicle is suspicious right there.”

Whoever said 4th amendment was right. Adhering to your 4th amendment right is not ground for suspicion. For what it is worth the dog has no exception to this and in cases where suspicion was not made and the suspect kept his mouth shut, drugs found under unlawful dog searches have been thrown out in court. (Its late excuse me if my typing is nearly incoherent)

Mettahl · May 8, 2010, 6:57am

[quote]gregron wrote:
The question I asked had nothing to do with the bill of rights. I asked for an example of laws that arent smart to follow but you went off m a tangent and didn’t answer my question.

I never said anything about respnses to “the same level” crimes in many states I said when has someone gone 7mph over the speed limit and been shot at for it?

You obviously can’t stay on topic and discuss the issue at hand which is:

A. The police raided the house because illegal narcotics were believed to be on site.
B. They found illegal narcotics in the house.

What can you argue about that? (hint: nothing. So I’m sure you’ll try to change it around and bring up some other issue to try to pigeon hole me but I’m done debating you cause you seem to not be able to stay on topic here)

.greg.[/quote]

“The fact that you refused to let the cop search your vehicle is suspicious right there. With nothing to hide why would you refuse?”

You said that. I responded to it. This means that I responded to something that you said. This is changing the subject how? Also, notice how the trend of this post leans toward taking your words of “you seem to not be able to stay on topic here” and shoving them in your mouth. You’ll see how everything I’ve said is relevant.

Your question of “what laws are stupid to follow” wasn’t addressed by my post. Do you want to know why? Because it isn’t the topic at hand. I don’t care what laws people find dumb right now. Luckily for me, that seems to mean that I didn’t go off-topic.

Also, you completely understated your “Step A.” It should read: “A. The police raided the house because a high level illegal narcotics were believed to be on site for the purpose of illegal distribution.” I needed to clear that up before continuing on with my argument.

As for the various levels of responses to various levels of crimes, I would like you to point out at what point you think that this isn’t relevant to what’s going on in this thread.

Was the original issue NOT the following- Step 1: Man has drug paraphernalia, which is punishable as a misdemeanor. Step 2: SWAT breaks in, firing shots. Step 3: Realize huge mistakes were made, sweep everything under the rug, and charge the parents with child endangerment to make it seem like it was a job well done.

As an example, I’ll use Texas. Here, crimes are organized in the order of Class C through Class A misdemeanor, and continues to 3rd degree felony through 1st degree felony.

This is ordered as Class C misdemeanor being the least severe, and increasing level by level up through 1st degree felony. There are preset punishments for each level of crime. Here’s a link to the PRESET punishments of a Third Degree Felony, as an example:

http://blog.austindefense.com/2006/10/articles/third-degree-felony-range-of-punishment-texas-penal-code/

Now that all of that is explained, I’ll explain what I mean when I talk about differing (incorrect) levels of punishment. If committing ANY low level misdemeanor incurs a punishment deserved only by a higher level misdemeanor or even a felony (as it was in this case), and this BREACH OF LAW goes unpunished, completely excused and even denied, then what is the purpose of a legal system?

What is the purpose of writing these thousands upon thousands of words down in these penal codes? What’s the point of spending hundreds upon hundreds of legislator’s hours deliberating, and citizen’s hours voting on representatives?

I understand that mistakes CAN and WILL be made, even by state and local government! I also realize that bad intelligence can reach the hands of people that have more power than us (hell, the CIA, the Bush Administration, and Iraq are a decent example of this).

What is completely unacceptable though, is when these mistakes are made, unnecessary action is taken, and NOTHING is done about it. The police departments will do whatever they can to cover it up, try to minimize (play down) the situation, and move on with their lives. Do you not realize the danger of letting such a lackadaisical attitude towards law enforcement’s power take hold? American citizens should be furious about this.

This is a slap in the face of everything that we not only hold dear, but are protected by in our daily lives. Allowing your RIGHTS to be stepped on, and allowing the laws to be bent and broken simply because the people doing so are wearing a uniform, makes absolutely no sense, and is a slippery slope towards something that America was founded on fighting against.

SeanT · May 8, 2010, 7:01am

Looks like he was endangering his child by “enjoying” the “deliciousness” of keystone light at 2:27…

KAS · May 8, 2010, 7:05am

[quote]Eli B wrote:

[quote]KAS wrote:

[quote]theuofh wrote:
Unsurprisingly, reason had a thing on it: Video of SWAT Raid on Missouri Family

The parents were charged w/ child endangering. [/quote]

Good. They know the potential consequences and yet they keep contraban around their kids. That’s just plain selfish.[/quote]

You get busted for personal use pot you generally aren’t going to be charged with child endangerment. It was a retarded face saving move to bring those charges.

Please explain to me how the child was in danger from mom and/or dad smoking pot to relax. No different than having beer or wine.[/quote]

No, beer or wine is legal. And if it were really the same then why bother with the weed in the first place?

Having your house raided is no doubt going to traumatize a child. That doesn’t mean we should let criminals hide behind their kids and not execute search warrants.

KAS · May 8, 2010, 7:17am

[quote]Eli B wrote:

[quote]KAS wrote:

You’re being very selective in the research you choose to believe. Marijuanan has been shown (especially in teenagers) to trigger schizophrenia.

[/quote]

You’re not reading the studies carefully enough

“Since the Swedish study, the evidence has piled up. Still, despite the scary and numbing evidence, there is not yet any evidence that cannabis causes schizophrenia de novo. Instead, it appears to be interacting with some already existing risk factor.”

Genetic predisposition
and almost no risk if you wait until age 18 or 19.[/quote]

Almost correct. You are still at risk until your brain has fully develaoped, which for most males is around 25.

And yes, genetics do play a role. They have already isolated the gene. We also know that this gene can lie dormant for your entire life if you are not exposed to THC.

More research is needed, but from what has already been done it is estimated that 30% of the population in the UK has this gene.

New Zealand and Jamaica have some of the highest rates of cannabis use. These two countries also have some of the highest rates of mental illness.

KAS · May 8, 2010, 7:23am

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]gregron wrote:

how was the 92 year old lady in that article innocent? The article say an undercover cop bought drugs from that house… They werent going into the house looking for her they were looking for a male suspect but she opened fire on them knowing full well they were cops… So once she opened fire on them they shot her.

Since when is shooting three cops make you innocent? I agree with you that this is a sad thing and she happened to be somewhat of a byproduct of drug dealing… but just like the OP article drugs cause the whole issue in the first place… very sad though

.greg.[/quote]

Read above. This is why many people do not respect the police.

No drugs were found at that residence. There was no front page retraction article.

Welcome to reality.[/quote]

Must have sold it all to undercover cops lol.

KAS · May 8, 2010, 7:41am

[quote]Mettahl wrote:

[quote]KAS wrote:

[quote]sam_sneed wrote:

[quote]MangoMan305 wrote:
Don’t have illegal drugs in your home. I know I sure don’t.[/quote]

That’s the message you took home from this story? Have you ever went over the speed limit in your life? I bet you have even though you know you’re breaking the law. But you’re OK with it because you are willing to take that risk because you’re also willing to take the punishment that comes with getting caught. A speeding ticket and maybe points on your license.

I have had small amounts of marijuana in my apartment when I was younger. Enough for a couple joints. I know it’s illegal but I’m willing to accept the punishment of a $1000 fine and possible 6 months loss of my driver’s license.

Just like you with your speeding, I make my decision based on the punishment if I get caught. I do NOT expect cops to bust in my house and starting firing shots at a caged house-pet then trying to take my family away. Over a fuckin misdemeanor amount of marijuana. Incredible.[/quote]

You don’t get to choose the consequences of breaking the law. You may think you’re only going to get a fine, but thats not up to you. The cops don’t know how much weed you have in your house and may well kick your door in.

If you don’t want to risk the consequences don’t break the law.[/quote]

Yeah, idiot, guess what? We have a PENAL CODE for that. Have you ever heard that term? It’s this huge book of crimes and their punishments. It’s pretty nifty, actually.

There’s a reason that we have predeclared punishments for every infraction of the law. That’s so bullshit like this doesn’t happen. Also, I like how you completely ignore the fact that they’ve not only gone outside of the preset penal category for this type of crime, but have done so by multiple levels, and in doing so put everyone in the house at risk.

The consequences of something are already laid out, and are meant to be followed. If you start allowing the rules to be bent just a little bit, then it will only get worse over time. One decade they’re killing your dogs and getting away with it, the next decade they’re able to “accidentally” shoot you with no consequences, simply because they thought they were going to be in a dangerous situation.[/quote]

You missed the point completely.

Yes there is such a thing as the penal code. However, when executing a warrant the police don’t know exactly how much contraban they are going to find. Thats why it’s risky to keep it in your house.

Mettahl · May 8, 2010, 8:01am

Quiz:

What is the correct and just response from the local law enforcement given the situation and how it played out?

A. “We messed up on this one. We would like to publicly apologize to the family and to the community for what happened. We had inaccurate intelligence on the matter, and we made a mistake.”

B. “A pipe?! You are terrible parents, and we’re charging you with endangering your child.”

If you answered A, you’re correct.

Edit: So once again, no, I didn’t miss the point. The point is that the law enforcement overstepped their bounds. Whether they KNEW they were going to do so or not is irrelevant. Mistakes happen, and in this case it was a BIG one. It happened, so own up to it.

Mettahl · May 8, 2010, 8:11am

Also, In case you’re going to ask “why does an apology matter? That’s a petty and immature thing to desire,” or something else that would minimize the importance of a public apology in this case, that way you can continue to claim that I’ve “missed the point.” The answer is pretty obvious.

Things like this happen often. Law enforcement agencies are not immune to mistakes. The problem is that some of these mistakes have harsh consequences, such as here where a family pet was murdered with a child in the next room, maybe even in view of the dying dog (not that it would matter in terms of the child being scarred). This level of response completely outweighed the crime that the man committed, so a mistake was made.

If a public apology is NOT made, and things like this continue to evade the front pages of news sites across the internet, then they will NEVER stop. The police departments will continue to cover their asses, and it will continue to be permissible to “cut the corners” when dealing with the rights of the citizens.

RenegadeDragon · May 8, 2010, 8:51am

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]RenegadeDragon wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]RenegadeDragon wrote:
There definately seems to be alot of the sheep mentality amongst the "all cops are pigs crowd here.

I didn’t do a lot of research into this case because I know how much, or little of the information will actually be released. There are a lot of questions that need to be asked.

this guy actually a drug dealer, does he ussually have more product and he just happened to move it? Does this guy have a criminal history? A violent history? A history of having weapons? The fact that he has a wife, kids and a foofy dog don’t change the status of those questions. [/quote]

What changes the status of those questions is the fact that nothing but personal use amounts were found on the property. Regardless of whatever intel they may have had, you do realize that this is not the first time cops have raided the house of people who were innocent of whatever charges they brought up to get the warrant.

I mean, unless you are for all Americans randomly being raided just in case someone may be smoking a joint somewhere, this just screams bad police work. Even the police chief understands this which is why he is stating that they held the warrant too long.

That brings many questions into play…like why raid this guy when his kid is home with guns blazing???

Sheep mentality would be excusing this based on the fact that they are cops. Sheep mentality is not questioning any laws or even bringing them to public attention so they can be voted on and simply falling in line.

The history of why marijuana is illegal to begin with is steeped in racist non-sense by a scared white majority…afraid that white women would smoke weed and listen to evil jazz music or maybe even something worse…like marry a Mexican guy.

Yes, the above is actually true. Fear is what started this…and fear seems to be what is keeping people in line.

I am glad to see you agree with these tactics. That says a lot.[/quote]

You act like regular people get their door broken down regulary and raided by police.[/quote]

Educate yourself.

http://www.wsbtv.com/news/10374909/detail.html

[/quote]

After some research into that incident…

"On February 24, 2009, U.S. District Judge Julie Carnes sentenced former officer Gregg Junnier to six years in prison, Jason Smith to 10 years in prison and Arthur Tesler to five years in prison.[3] Junnier and Tesler had faced recommended 10 years in prison under sentencing guidelines, while Smith faced 12 years and seven months.[31]

According to US Attorney David Nahmias, the sentences of Junnier and Smith were reduced after they provided information to assist in the prosecutions of the other ex-officers.[3] Carnes also ordered Smith, Junnier and Tesler to reimburse Johnston’s estate the cost of her burial, $8,180.[2][3]"

From the wiki. Personally I would prefer none of the officers are given deals for information or testimony… but that is unfortunately how our system works. I also would prefer the officers be given much longer terms.

You’re trying to make this into some big conspiracy that happens all the time, and it’s not.

And I agree with Mettahl. The proper course of action would be for the department to apologize to the family. For every article people are posting on here there are thousands of similar warrants served successfully without the casualties.

Mettahl · May 8, 2010, 8:47am

[quote]RenegadeDragon wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]RenegadeDragon wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]RenegadeDragon wrote:
There definately seems to be alot of the sheep mentality amongst the "all cops are pigs crowd here.

I didn’t do a lot of research into this case because I know how much, or little of the information will actually be released. There are a lot of questions that need to be asked.

Is this guy actually a drug dealer, does he ussually have more product and he just happened to move it? Does this guy have a criminal history? A violent history? A history of having weapons? The fact that he has a wife, kids and a foofy dog don’t change the status of those questions. [/quote]