Making Progress but Abs are Lacking (W/Photos)

Training Bodybuilding
21

[quote]rsg wrote:
Professor X wrote:
This site is obviously not even appearing to be about bodybuilding at all anymore to these guys.

“The will” to remain really skinny and diet even further so the only thing that stands out on you is your ab muscles?

So all the girls will love your hot beach body.
[/quote]

The funny thing is that these guys (skinny abs beach bodies) often look smaller than their girlfriends when they are wearing clothes!

To the OP…

As it was mentioned you must first establish your ONE main goal.

And a goal IS NOT something like ‘‘I want to gain muscle’’, or ‘‘I want to be ripped’’.

A goal is:

  • measurable
  • precise
  • includes a deadline

For example: ‘‘I want to gain 10lbs of muscle within the next 10 weeks’’

or…

‘‘I want to drop down to 10% body fat within the next 2 months’’

etc.

Only pick ONE main goal. If you pick more than one (e.g. I want to gain 10lbs of muscle but have a great six pack and run a 5 minutes mile at the end of summer) you will likely NOT reach any of them.

Once you have picked that goal you must select the best strategy to achieve THAT goal, NOT other ‘‘unselected’’ goals.

Singleness of purpose is the key to achievement.

So you started training seriously. Good! The fact that you decided to do so tells me that you want to change your physique. But WHAT exactly do you want to achieve? Don’t tell me ‘‘I want to be muscular and ripped’’… everybody who train does! Be more precise. Imagine your ideal physique and establish what it will take you to get there.

For example if you need to gain 20lbs of muscle and drop 4% body fat to get there, that is TWO separate goals that will need to be worked on separately. Trying to do both at the same time will lead you to failure in both cases.

The part you chose to work on first should depend on your current needs and what ‘‘you have’’. For example a fat guy should probably start with losing some of the blubber before focusing on growing more muscle while a guy with little muscle should do the opposite.

Understand that in non-beginners gaining a lot of muscle and losing a lot of fat at the same time is not possible, or at least highly unlikely.

To gain muscle you need to consume an excess of nutrients because growth is energy dependent.

To lose fat you need to consume a caloric deficit

So both are mutually exclusive.

So what is it for you. Right now you don’t have much muscle (although you do show some decent progress) and you are not that much fat. So you could focus on gaining more muscle, which will make you look better and facilitate fat loss in the future, or you can try to get that six pack, accepting that while doing so you will not gain muscle and you might even lose some.

Will the end result (abs with not much muscle) satisfy you?

22

[quote]juanjromero wrote:

look all those adds full of skinny guys with abs, in our society that is the way that sales, is normal the kid wants to be like that. He asked advice on abs, help him to find his way, if that way is not on your way, leave him alone.

[/quote]

I don’t want to jump in and dogpile on you, as you are sincerely trying to help this kid out, but like you said, this is a BODYBUILDING forum. There is no place for skinny guys with abs in BODYBUILDING.

23

Look at the body shape he’s carrying. That’s a classic pear shape if he had more fat on him. I’d be willing to bet he’s carrying a lot (relative to the shoulder/chest area) of fat in his thighs as well.

To the OP, you’ll never be happy with your abs until you put on some quality upper body size to help balance out some unfortunate genetics.

24

[quote]LankyMofo wrote:
juanjromero wrote:

look all those adds full of skinny guys with abs, in our society that is the way that sales, is normal the kid wants to be like that. He asked advice on abs, help him to find his way, if that way is not on your way, leave him alone.

I don’t want to jump in and dogpile on you, as you are sincerely trying to help this kid out, but like you said, this is a BODYBUILDING forum. There is no place for skinny guys with abs in BODYBUILDING. [/quote]

I totally agree with you.

25

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
rsg wrote:
Professor X wrote:
This site is obviously not even appearing to be about bodybuilding at all anymore to these guys.

“The will” to remain really skinny and diet even further so the only thing that stands out on you is your ab muscles?

So all the girls will love your hot beach body.

The funny thing is that these guys (skinny abs beach bodies) often look smaller than their girlfriends when they are wearing clothes!

To the OP…

As it was mentionned you must first establish your ONE main goal.

And a goal IS NOT something like ‘‘I want to gain muscle’’, or ‘‘I want to be ripped’’.

A goal is:

  • measurable
  • precise
  • includes a deadline

For example: ‘‘I want to gain 10lbs of muscle within the next 10 weeks’’

or…

‘‘I want to drop down to 10% body fat within the next 2 months’’

etc.

Only pick ONE main goal. If you pick more than one (e.g. I want to gain 10lbs of muscle but have a great six pack and run a 5 minutes mile at the end of summer) you will likely NOT reach any of them.

Once you have picked that goal you must select the best strategy to achieve THAT goal, NOT other ‘‘unselected’’ goals.

Singleness of purpose is the key to achievement.

So you started training seriously. Good! The fact that you decided to do so tells me that you want to change your physique. But WHAT exactly do you want to achieve? Don’t tell me ‘‘I want to be muscular and ripped’’… everybody who train does! Be more precise. Imagine your ideal physique and establish what it will take you to get there.

For example if you need to gain 20lbs of muscle and drop 4% body fat to get there, that is TWO separate goals that will need to be worked on separately. Trying to do both at the same time will lead you to failure in both cases.

The part you chose to work on first should depend on your current needs and what ‘‘you have’’. For example a fat guy should probably start with losing some of the blubber before focusing on growing more muscle while a guy with little muscle should do the opposite.

Understand that in non-beginners gaining a lot of muscle and losing a lot of fat at the same time is not possible, or at least highly unlikely.

To gain muscle you need to consume an excess of nutrients because growth is energy dependant.

To lose fat you need to consume a caloric deficit

So both are mutually exclusive.

So what is it for you. Right now you don’t have much muscle (although you do show some decent progress) and you are not that much fat. So you could focus on gaining more muscle, which will make you look better and facilitate fat loss in the future, or you can try to get that six pack, accepting that while doing so you will not gain muscle and you might even lose some.

Will the end result (abs with not much muscle) satisfy you? [/quote]

Those are the words, skinny guys like me, need…

Thanks…

26

Listen to RainJack.

Define training “hardcore”. That means very different things to different people.

It appears that you are fairly lean and have genetically thin abdominals. I doubt that you will ever have a stellar six pack, but you sure as hell can work to improve the rest of your body to compensate. When you have established enough of a base you can diet down to a low body fat and maybe get a decent set of abs for next summer. I think it would be in error to continue to diet down in search of your abs at this time.

As CT said, you have to choose a goal, one goal and follow through with it.

Also, check out some of the articles that talk about abdominals with external load, CT’s serratus crunch article comes to mind.

Good job so far.

27

so i am guessing that developed abs are a long term goal, and is not possible without the accompaniment of more overall mass?

28

[quote]Zagman wrote:
Listen to RainJack.

Define training “hardcore”. That means very different things to different people.

It appears that you are fairly lean and have genetically thin abdominals. I doubt that you will ever have a stellar six pack, but you sure as hell can work to improve the rest of your body to compensate. When you have established enough of a base you can diet down to a low body fat and maybe get a decent set of abs for next summer. I think it would be in error to continue to diet down in search of your abs at this time.

As CT said, you have to choose a goal, one goal and follow through with it.

Also, check out some of the articles that talk about abdominals with external load, CT’s serratus crunch article comes to mind.

Good job so far.[/quote]

I state now that i know and accept this is a place for hardcore bodybuild.

But, :slight_smile: (I can’t stop).

I think that we can increase the place usefulness if people like me ask some (now to you) dumb questions that you made yourself on you beggining. That will increase the number of hardcores in the future. This kind of guiding (I am reading now) is a much better quality of advice.

I must state that the first post from toohungry was surely right.

But after that it is just the usual rate of people as skinny, equivalent to the self limiting concept of hardgainer. Both B.S.

My point is: let the guy recognize whether he has the heart and guts to become a hardcore, his choice. we give him all the info possible to he make the choice, let’s not play the god who chooses who is fittable or too skinny to become a hardcore.

I am decided to become as huge as my life allows me. I am certainly dissapointed of the kind of advice that recalls me why I am bodybuilding (beacause I am skinny and was skinnier), but every time i receive that kind of answers, I increase my poundage for the least quantit that my strength allow me, just to improve, and some day left behind to that only person I want to beat: Myself.

29

[quote]eremesu wrote:
so i am guessing that developed abs are a long term goal, and is not possible without the accompaniment of more overall mass?[/quote]

Developed abs is not truly an appropriate goal due to the factors involved in attaining them: abdominal hypertrophy and a very low body fat. Those are two semi opposed goals. That is separate from the fact that the poster doesn’t have the muscle mass required to pull off a lower level of body fat without looking anorexic.

Developing overall mass, then achieving a low level of body fat leads to an appealing physique.

To answer your question, it is possible to have developed abs without a substantial amount of overall mass. But, in this case it appears he isn’t genetically gifted with prominent abdominals, so it becomes a long two part goal that requires a reevaluation of his goals.

30

he is more gifted than me. i think he is sexy. i am wondering about abs since i have no idea what mine look without my body fat

31

[quote]eremesu wrote:
so i am guessing that developed abs are a long term goal, and is not possible without the accompaniment of more overall mass?[/quote]

I have seen guys thinier than a toothpick with great abs, but for the T-Magnum standards is not adequate, there are other places for that kind of body goals. If you are fat and want to get just lean, get P90X see the records, those will not threat you (it is not free). You will get your beach boy, and this place will stay as hardcore has you never see on avatars (just the Christian Thibaudeau one, that is himself, others: just cartoons).

for getting advice on abs, diet is the most important thing if you don’t want to be huge. if you want to be huge, don’t waste your time with abs, it will be your drawback. abs are not a goal for itself on bodybuild, they are subproduct of having aligned your workout, mass and diet.

32

[quote]eremesu wrote:
i am wondering about abs since i have no idea what mine look without my body fat[/quote]

In your avatar you look too hairy to show any abs.

:stuck_out_tongue:

33

[quote]juanjromero wrote:
Zagman wrote:
Listen to RainJack.

Define training “hardcore”. That means very different things to different people.

It appears that you are fairly lean and have genetically thin abdominals. I doubt that you will ever have a stellar six pack, but you sure as hell can work to improve the rest of your body to compensate. When you have established enough of a base you can diet down to a low body fat and maybe get a decent set of abs for next summer. I think it would be in error to continue to diet down in search of your abs at this time.

As CT said, you have to choose a goal, one goal and follow through with it.

Also, check out some of the articles that talk about abdominals with external load, CT’s serratus crunch article comes to mind.

Good job so far.

I state now that i know and accept this is a place for hardcore bodybuild.

But, :slight_smile: (I can’t stop).

I think that we can increase the place usefulness if people like me ask some (now to you) dumb questions that you made yourself on you beggining. That will increase the number of hardcores in the future. This kind of guiding (I am reading now) is a much better quality of advice.

I must state that the first post from toohungry was surely right.

But after that it is just the usual rate of people as skinny, equivalent to the self limiting concept of hardgainer. Both B.S.

My point is: let the guy recognize whether he has the heart and guts to become a hardcore, his choice. we give him all the info possible to he make the choice, let’s not play the god who chooses who is fittable or too skinny to become a hardcore.

I am decided to become as huge as my life allows me. I am certainly dissapointed of the kind of advice that recalls me why I am bodybuilding (beacause I am skinny and was skinnier), but every time i receive that kind of answers, I increase my poundage for the least quantit that my strength allow me, just to improve, and some day left behind to that only person I want to beat: Myself.
[/quote]

Good you have direction and possibly the will. But you need to slow down and listen to those like Rainjack who possess a wealth of knowledge.

I understand that you believe that some of the individuals on this site are too harsh, but understand those individuals make T-Nation what it is. If we cater to everybody’s whims and feelings there is no honesty, no candor.

You label yourself at 5’8", 154 and 8%(really?). You also call yourself a bodybuilder. This is not the place for a debate on what a bodybuilder is, but know that you are tiny and an absolute beginner by most standards. Take time, read the wealth of knowledge that is here, and truly think about something before you write it.

T-Nation is The Testosterone Nation; a place to be serious about bodybuilding and strength, not a place solely meant for ego stroking or cheerleading.

Learn to value honesty.

For your information I have even been labeled small by some of the members on this site; they are right. I am a work in progress and YEARS away from where I need to be.

34

[quote]eremesu wrote:
he is more gifted than me. i think he is sexy. i am wondering about abs since i have no idea what mine look without my body fat[/quote]

In all honesty, if you have never achieve a body fat of roughly 10% then you will not know what your abs might look like. By your profile you are rather small and should spend time to establish a clean diet and solid training routine. One you have added a 15-20lbs to your frame of lean mass, then think about dieting down and finding those abs.

35

I’m thinking of inviting juanjromero into T-Cell Alpha.

36

[quote]juanjromero wrote:
You will get your beach boy, and this place will stay as hardcore has you never see on avatars (just the Christian Thibaudeau one, that is himself, others: just cartoons).

[/quote]

Ummmm, that’s why we have profiles…

37

[quote]juanjromero wrote:
eremesu wrote:

I have seen guys thinier than a toothpick with great abs, but for the T-Magnum standards is not adequate, there are other places for that kind of body goals. If you are fat and want to get just lean, get P90X see the records, those will not threat you (it is not free).
[/quote]

So everyone should have the same goals huh? I think the best thing about this forum is that it seems to have great information for whatever your goals are, be it lose a bunch of fat or pack on as much muscle as possible. I surely don’t want a bodybuilder’s physique but I’ve learned more on this site in the last few months than anywhere else.

38

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
<<< more muscle, which will <<<>>> facilitate fat loss in the future, >>>[/quote]

Another article I’d REALLY love to see, though how much is there to say about the fact that the more lean mass somebody has the more energy they burn even while sleeping never mind while actually trying to get leaner. If bf doesn’t increase beyond a certain reasonable level while muscle does increase then you wind up by definition with a lower % of BF even before dieting not to mention a much larger furnace to shovel the fat into when you do diet down.

This physiological fact has gotten really lost somewhere along the line.

39

[quote]DavidSappenfield wrote:
juanjromero wrote:
eremesu wrote:

I have seen guys thinier than a toothpick with great abs, but for the T-Magnum standards is not adequate, there are other places for that kind of body goals. If you are fat and want to get just lean, get P90X see the records, those will not threat you (it is not free).

So everyone should have the same goals huh? I think the best thing about this forum is that it seems to have great information for whatever your goals are, be it lose a bunch of fat or pack on as much muscle as possible. I surely don’t want a bodybuilder’s physique but I’ve learned more on this site in the last few months than anywhere else. [/quote]

You are posting in the Bodybuilding forum. Shocking, isn’t it?

40

[quote]DavidSappenfield wrote:
I surely don’t want a bodybuilder’s physique [/quote]

I hear ya… All those big, icky muscles all over the place!