I asked myself this question that many of you have asked yourselves . If I was there and I needed food and water I would do what I had to do . In regards to stealing 5 pairs of nikes , plasma tv’s , breaking into hospitals to steal meds ! These people are using this terrible disaster as an excuse to make self gain , and they should be shot on sight !
[quote]Brad407 wrote:
I asked myself this question that many of you have asked yourselves . If I was there and I needed food and water I would do what I had to do . In regards to stealing 5 pairs of nikes , plasma tv’s , breaking into hospitals to steal meds ! These people are using this terrible disaster as an excuse to make self gain , and they should be shot on sight ! [/quote]
Shot on sight Brad? Really?
[quote]elevationgain wrote:
Brad407 wrote:
I asked myself this question that many of you have asked yourselves . If I was there and I needed food and water I would do what I had to do . In regards to stealing 5 pairs of nikes , plasma tv’s , breaking into hospitals to steal meds ! These people are using this terrible disaster as an excuse to make self gain , and they should be shot on sight !
Shot on sight Brad? Really?
[/quote]
The nike sneakers and the TV’s no don’t shoot them, the ones stealing from the hospitals at gunpoint and killing and raping along the way, absolutely shoot the bastards.
V
[quote]JJJJ wrote:
I would invite my “understanding” friends on the left side of this spectrum to tour some of the mass graves in Bosnia and take a good whiff of what happens when control breaks down in a “civilized” society.
That situation also started with “a tiny criminal element” breaking the law with no repercussions.
[/quote]
Now rescue crews are having to stand down because they are being shot at. Police say they’ve never seen the violence (in an already violent city) at these levels. It ain’t from folks taking much needed food and water, folks. It’s from letting the criminals run wild.
But they don’t know any better, right? So, it’s okay.
The point I was making, about visible law enforcement, is that if you have the ability to shoot these people [because you are there watching them]… then you won’t need to shoot them.
What’s the matter Zeb, have nothing useful to add to the converstation? For someone who complains when others use personal attacks you use them yourself far too much…
If the point I was making was so obvious, how come the original person seemed to not realize it? Just because you or I think something is obvious doesn’t mean the rest of the world sees things the same way.
I haven’t finished reading this thread yet, but Gov. Blanco just held a press conference. She said that her request for 20,000 uniformed officers and National Guard memebers has been accepted and are on their way to the New Orleans area.
[quote]vroom wrote:
What’s the matter Zeb, have nothing useful to add to the converstation? For someone who complains when others use personal attacks you use them yourself far too much…[/quote]
Actually I don’t think that I use personal attacks enough. Personal attacks are the main language of some around here. By the way, what I wrote is far from a personal attack, and you know it.
It seems like you like to explain the obvious for no apparent reason.
[quote]Vegita wrote:
I agree, things quickly have gone from stealing tv’s to commiting much more serious crimes.
[/quote]
What I can’t believe is that this seems to surprise a lot of people.
Zeb,
Mentioning me by name and then insulting me is a personal attack. Personal attacks are not just name calling… and you very well know it.
Perhaps you should take your own advice and lay off it… or stop complaining when other people do it also.
Is anyone else noticing the “laid back” attitude of the great and wonderful president in all of this? All of the talk of protection from terrorists…and not one plan was in place and ready to go in case of another national emergency?
The time it is taking for them to finally get a plan together is the time many of these people have to live.
[quote]BostonBarrister wrote:
I want to cross-post this on related threads:
Here’s a bunch of organizations to which you can donate, courtesy of Instapundit:
[/quote]
Thanks BB for adding some much needed relief to a thread that was otherwise becoming overwhelmed with fiddling over the small points while Rome burned (or in this case, New Orleans flooded).
[quote]Professor X wrote:
Is anyone else noticing the “laid back” attitude of the great and wonderful president in all of this? All of the talk of protection from terrorists…and not one plan was in place and ready to go in case of another national emergency? [/quote]
Yeah, I don’t get this. Sunday afternoon the reports were it was going to be horrible. Seems a prepared govt could have had troops and supplies on the ground Monday. I don’t get it.
[quote]futuredave wrote:
Professor X wrote:
Is anyone else noticing the “laid back” attitude of the great and wonderful president in all of this? All of the talk of protection from terrorists…and not one plan was in place and ready to go in case of another national emergency?
Yeah, I don’t get this. Sunday afternoon the reports were it was going to be horrible. Seems a prepared govt could have had troops and supplies on the ground Monday. I don’t get it.
[/quote]
Yeah - it’s easy to Monday morning qb when you have the luxury of 20/20 hindsight.
What in the hell could one man do for a city that is built below sea level? You can bitch all you want about how Bush did ir didn’t do anything. But in the big picture - you sound like spoiled kids.
Shit happens. This was the worst shit that has ever happened to the U.S. It’s nobody’s fault. And you guys know it.
[quote]Vegita wrote:
makkun wrote:
JPBear wrote:
Not about looters but I just want to say I’m sorry that other countries haven’t offered you guys more help. I just read a story where some environmental group tried to blame the whole thing on global warming caused by America, Hugo Chavez blaming President Bush for unsuccessful evacuations, Arabs celebrating the hurricane, and Europeans debating whether or not people should donate to such a rich country. I haven’t heard of tons of countries lining up to help. I hope that is just the media trying to cover the negativity and not really the case.
…
They were not asked so far:
Why Europe Hasn’t Jumped to Help Katrina’s Victims
By Jody K. Biehl in Berlin
http://service.spiegel.de/cache/international/0,1518,372348,00.html
"… Unlike underdeveloped Third World nations, America has a well-honed and highly organized system of emergency aid distribution. So, when disaster hits, the nation – and even individual states – can readily help themselves. “If the American Red Cross asks us for help, we will be there directly,” said Margitta Zimmermann, German Red Cross spokesperson. “But so far, there haven’t been any calls for our services.”[italics inserted by makkun]…
…Although European agencies won’t be sending relief workers, they will accept donations and pass them on to American aid groups. But for the moment, none are planning a large fundraising drive to help American victims. But, then again, they never do. The only exception came with Sept. 11, when both the German Red Cross and Caritas were swamped with calls from Germans wanting to donate…
…In the wake of Katrina, at least so far, she said, the phone lines have been relatively quiet. By 11 a.m. Tuesday, for instance, Caritas had only received one donation. That may change, however. “The first impressions were that the damage was under control,” Decker said. “But if the media reports continue in the way they did yesterday (Monday), then I think the response will be much greater.”
Sorry for being slightly off topic, but I thought this should be clarified immediately, as anti-European feelings in the forums tend to get a bit out of hand. If asked for direct involvement, they will help.
Other than that all I can say is that it is just heartbreaking.
I agree. I hope the situation will be turning out for the better soon.
Makkun
This is a little weak in my opinion, and possibly the difference between americans and europeans/ the rest of the world. Americans generally try to help even when not asked, sure it gets annoying sometimes, sure we get carried away with it and sometimes over do it. I still feel it is better to over do it than to sit back and assume all is well even when every indicator points to it not being well. Europeans should also understand that even if we do need help, do you actually think we would ask for it? Our pride is what makes us so strong, overcoming hardships and dissasters is what makes us who we are.
That being said, if a friend offered us assistance we would also show how humble we can be by accepting it with thanks. I guess from my point of view, no matter what situation one of my friends was in, even if they were 10 times better off than I was if they ran into a snag, I would be doing everything I could to get them back on thier feet. That is one of the best ways to see who your “real” friends are.
V[/quote]
WELL PUT!!!
[quote]rainjack wrote:
Yeah - it’s easy to Monday morning qb when you have the luxury of 20/20 hindsight. [/quote]
It’s not Monday, it’s Thursday. That’s a big part of the problem.
One man? He’s the president last I checked. The meteorologist were literally screaming about how devestating this was going to be on Sunday. I was under the impression we’d geared up for all sorts of catastrophies after 9/11. Seems we’re not as prepared as I thought. That’s the point.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
RankHypocrisy wrote:
Professor X wrote:
I am sure that was the goal. I wonder what the response would have been if I had made a similar comment when the BTK killer was caught, adding to dozens of other white male serial killers, this one getting away with it for 30 years. How about a good, “who is this damn crazy?”
Actually, that very point was made, a number of times. Serial killers are usually white men. It’s a fact.
Now, most of the people who are looting in New Orleans are blacks. Blacks are, in fact, much more likely to commit violent crimes than whites. It’s a fact.
You are welcome to insert as many PC-platitudes as it takes for you to be able to accept this, such as ‘yes, but the majority are still good,’ or ‘yes, but there are good people in every ethnicity,’ or ‘yes, but it is because society has failed them,’ etc.
The facts remain.
You’re one of those “crazy” white guys, aren’t you?[/quote]
No he’s not “crazy” pRof X he just speaks the truth and it hurts doesn’t it?
[quote]rainjack wrote:
Yeah - it’s easy to Monday morning qb when you have the luxury of 20/20 hindsight.
What in the hell could one man do for a city that is built below sea level? You can bitch all you want about how Bush did ir didn’t do anything. But in the big picture - you sound like spoiled kids.
Shit happens. This was the worst shit that has ever happened to the U.S. It’s nobody’s fault. And you guys know it.[/quote]
Actually, much worse shit has happened before. Also, this is not the worst hurricane in history: it’s just that this time the consequences were more serious, for all the reasons explained here:
http://slate.msn.com/id/2125352/nav/tap2/?GT1=6900
And these consequences were made worse by the pathetically (s)low response of the Federal Government.
There was plenty of warning: anyone who actually paid attention to what the Meteorologists said and watched the several past documentaries on what would happen to New Orleans if a hurricane like this one hit it knew it would be bad. GW has some of the brightest minds in the World at his disposal. What does he do? He tells people “Get out of there; I will!” – knowing full well people are not necessarily intelligent, resourceful and rational about these things.
To quote the article above:
"
The poorest neighborhoods, though, are the lowest-lying ones. Places like Treme and the Lower Ninth Ward are full of people without the means to have gotten themselves out; the ones left behind had the least to lose but lost whatever they had.
"
I agree with Professor X: although I can’t possibly expect GW to fix everything himself, his attitude has been way too hands-off. He should have been there as soon as possible. He was in the region, but instead of going to Houston (the closest possible safe place), he went to DC. The President of the United States should be an inspiration and a leader for every American. GW behaves like a bad manager – he’s very good at telling people what to do, but completely incompetent at motivating them.
Rainjack, you talk a lot about how elitists are so annoying. Have you realized that GW is one of them?
You can’t possibly convince me there isn’t a lot of racism and elitism in general at play here. If this had happened, say, in Houston, not only the place would have been much better prepared for such a disaster, I’m sure it would be invaded with Federal aid by now.
Again to borrow from the article:
"
But for all its multigenerational families, New Orleans is?or maybe was?a place where a third of the people live below the poverty line and where the job market has been stagnant for decades. The gentrification of Marigny and Bywater in the last few years brought hope that the urban renewal that had come to so many other cities might not pass by New Orleans entirely. Those neighborhoods are now underwater. The city will get rebuilt no matter what, if only for the oil and gas industries. But who all is going to be there?
"
[quote]futuredave wrote:
rainjack wrote:
Yeah - it’s easy to Monday morning qb when you have the luxury of 20/20 hindsight.
It’s not Monday, it’s Thursday. That’s a big part of the problem.
What in the hell could one man do for a city that is built below sea level?
One man? He’s the president last I checked. The meteorologist were literally screaming about how devestating this was going to be on Sunday. I was under the impression we’d geared up for all sorts of catastrophies after 9/11. Seems we’re not as prepared as I thought. That’s the point.
You can bitch all you want about how Bush did ir didn’t do anything. But in the big picture - you sound like spoiled kids.
Spoiled kids? Can you not resort to name calling for once? If you don’t have anything to say other than “don’t critisize the President” then how about just not posting.
Questioning this nations level of preparedness in case of catastrophic events is not the whining of spoiled kids. The future holds earthquakes, floods, terrorist attacts and god knows what else. Yes, “shit happens” and one of the very important jobs of the president is to make sure we’re prepared for it.
[/quote]
You can’t be prepared for this level of destruction. You bitching is solving nothing.
And for those of you with their feelings on their sleeves - saying that you sound like spoiled kids is not name calling. You are throwing rocks for no real purpose.
You wanna do something about it? Then get off your ass, donate money, get the hell to NOLA - but sitting in your comfortable California home and bitching is just childish. And once again - you know it.
So spare me the “quit calling me names” bullshit.
[quote]hspder wrote:
rainjack wrote:
Yeah - it’s easy to Monday morning qb when you have the luxury of 20/20 hindsight.
What in the hell could one man do for a city that is built below sea level? You can bitch all you want about how Bush did ir didn’t do anything. But in the big picture - you sound like spoiled kids.
Shit happens. This was the worst shit that has ever happened to the U.S. It’s nobody’s fault. And you guys know it.
Actually, much worse shit has happened before. Also, this is not the worst hurricane in history: it’s just that this time the consequences were more serious, for all the reasons explained here:
http://slate.msn.com/id/2125352/nav/tap2/?GT1=6900
And these consequences were made worse by the pathetically (s)low response of the Federal Government.
There was plenty of warning: anyone who actually paid attention to what the Meteorologists said and watched the several past documentaries on what would happen to New Orleans if a hurricane like this one hit it knew it would be bad. GW has some of the brightest minds in the World at his disposal. What does he do? He tells people “Get out of there; I will!” – knowing full well people are not necessarily intelligent, resourceful and rational about these things.
To quote the article above:
"
The poorest neighborhoods, though, are the lowest-lying ones. Places like Treme and the Lower Ninth Ward are full of people without the means to have gotten themselves out; the ones left behind had the least to lose but lost whatever they had.
"
I agree with Professor X: although I can’t possibly expect GW to fix everything himself, his attitude has been way too hands-off. He should have been there as soon as possible. He was in the region, but instead of going to Houston (the closest possible safe place), he went to DC. The President of the United States should be an inspiration and a leader for every American. GW behaves like a bad manager – he’s very good at telling people what to do, but completely incompetent at motivating them.
Rainjack, you talk a lot about how elitists are so annoying. Have you realized that GW is one of them?
You can’t possibly convince me there isn’t a lot of racism and elitism in general at play here. If this had happened, say, in Houston, not only the place would have been much better prepared for such a disaster, I’m sure it would be invaded with Federal aid by now.
Again to borrow from the article:
"
But for all its multigenerational families, New Orleans is?or maybe was?a place where a third of the people live below the poverty line and where the job market has been stagnant for decades. The gentrification of Marigny and Bywater in the last few years brought hope that the urban renewal that had come to so many other cities might not pass by New Orleans entirely. Those neighborhoods are now underwater. The city will get rebuilt no matter what, if only for the oil and gas industries. But who all is going to be there?
"[/quote]
This is the same thing as blaming Bush for 9/11.
Name another natural disaster that has hit the U.S. which can claim totally wiping out the 23rd largest city in the nation. I’m thinking you can’t. Not in your lifetime.
To sit back in the comfort of your home and point fingers is just pure bullshit. There will be more than enough time for all the ABBers to blame Bush later. I’m not saying that criticism isn’t a part of the process - but let’s concentrate on the problem at hand rather than bitching about what the president did/didn;t do.