London Bombing

West did nothing to deserve this attack

By Ezra Levant – Calgary Sun

The intellectuals of the left tell us that we need to understand Muslim terrorists if we are going to stop them.

That’s true. But the left’s idea of understanding is an exercise in hiding from the truth, not seeking it.

We ought not to be so ethnocentric, we’re told. We should try to look at things from their point of view. We should ask: Have we done something to provoke them? Have we offended or humiliated them? What did we do to cause this attack?

Why did they think we deserved this – and what can we do to change our own behaviour so we won’t deserve it next time?

Can we meet them halfway? We have heard this refrain a thousand times – including from Jean Chretien. He told the CBC after 9/11, “you cannot exercise your powers to the point of humiliation for the others.”

“We’re looked upon as being arrogant, self-satisfied, greedy and with no limits,” said Chretien, looking thoughtful, imagining he was getting to the root of it.

At the time, Bill Graham said: “I think the prime minister’s comments were right on.”

Today Graham serves as Paul Martin’s foreign minister.

Many leftist pseudo-intellectuals talk that way. The post-modern liberal mind cannot make sense of terrorism – why would anyone want to kill women and children? What would drive someone to do such things?

Surely, our political system can provide a safe outlet for their grievances. Don’t we have departments of multiculturalism? Don’t we give foreign aid? Don’t we have racial affirmative action?

So: If they’re still mad enough at us to bomb us, what did we do wrong?

But that is not getting into the terrorists’ mind. That is not emerging from ethnocentrism – that is burrowing deeper into it, hiding from the reality of things. The post-modern, post-Christian mind does not have the vocabulary to deal with Islamic terrorism.

We do not use the word “evil” anymore, even with apolitical criminals, whose crimes are called sicknesses now, or syndromes, caused by – what is it this week? society? parents? TV? – and who need our understanding and accommodation, not our rejection or punishment. All the more so for avowedly political murders like those in London.

Leftists who call for more understanding or dialogue or compromise, are not understanding the Muslim “other.” They are projecting themselves onto the terrorists, imagining what it would take to cool themselves off if they were ever that mad about something. Have a seminar; bring in some professional mediators; do some role playing – bond.

Such a response does not understand the terrorists. To understand them is simple, if terrifying: Read their writing and listen to their speeches.

They want the world to be ruled by sharia law, where the only constitution is the Qu’ran. They want a theocracy, like Afghanistan was and Iran is, where infidels are killed, or kept in a state of submission, called dhimmitude.

Read Osama bin Laden’s speeches, not those of his lawyers and psychologists in the media. Like Hitler’s Mein Kampf, bin Laden is plain about his intentions.

There was no half way, no compromise, no win-win possible with Hitler. The Jews didn’t do any one thing in particular to him – he hated their very existence.

The West didn’t do any one thing to bin Laden that caused his hate – other than to live freely and outside his authority.

Sixty-five years ago, Britain understood Hitler was evil, and responded with Spitfires, not psychologists.

Here’s hoping Britain today has the same clarity of thought.

[quote]jlesk68 wrote:
Website that carried al-Qaida claim has connections to Bush family???

http://www.guardian.co.uk/attackonlondon/story/0%2C16132%2C1524813%2C00.html

UK-based dissident denies link to website that carried al-Qaida claim

David Pallister
Saturday July 9, 2005
The Guardian

The claim of responsibility for the London attacks was first posted on one of the dozens of Islamic websites that are routinely monitored by western intelligence services.

The statement, under the name of the Secret Organisation of the al-Qaida Jihad in Europe, said: “The heroic mujahideen have carried out a blessed raid in London. Britain is now burning with fear, terror and panic in its northern, southern, eastern and western quarters.”

Article continues
It was posted on an Arabic website, al-qal3ah.com, which is registered by Qalaah Qalaah in Abu Dhabi and hosted by a server in Houston, Texas.

But two Israeli groups devoted to exposing the network of jihadist sites claim that it is connected to the London-based Saudi dissident Saad al-Faqih. Mr Faqih, who is based in Willesden, north-west London, and runs the Movement for Islamic Reform in Arabia (Mira), was designated by the US treasury last December as a supporter of al-Qaida. The UK Treasury followed suit by freezing Mr Faqih’s assets.

Speaking in December 2004 before the assets were frozen, Mr Faqih ridiculed any idea that “millions of dollars” would be frozen. “I have no assets in the US and all I have in the UK is a current account with a few hundred pounds.”

The US claimed that Mr Faqih was an associate of Khaled al-Fawwaz, who was arrested in Britain on a US extradition warrant for his alleged involvement in the 1998 east African embassy bombings.

The US said that “extremists utilise a website controlled by al-Faqih and Mira on messageboards to post al-Qaida-related statements and images. While Mira has issued disclaimers warning users to not attribute postings on Mira message boards to al-Qaida, information available to the US and UK governments shows that the messages are intended to provide ideological and financial support to al-Qaida affiliated networks and potential recruits.”

Mr Faqih has always vigorously denied being involved with terrorism. Yesterday he was indignant about being linked to the website.

“It does not belong to me at all,” he told the Guardian. “It is a Zionist smear.”

He had seen the message on Thursday morning and doubted its authenticity. “It was only there for a few minutes, and they misquoted the Qur’an.” He also said the website - or more accurately a bulletin board - could be used by anyone.

The server in Houston has intriguing connections. Everyone’s Internet was founded by brothers Robert and Roy Marsh in 1998 and by 2002 had an income of more than $30m (now about ?17m).

Renowned for his charitable work, Roy Marsh counts among his friends President George Bush’s former sister-in-law, Sharon Bush, and the president’s navy secretary.

Everyone’s Internet, which also hosts a number of pornographic sites, states: “We support the uncensored flow of information and ideas over the internet and do not actively monitor subscriber activity under normal circumstances.”

However, the company has responded to requests to take down objectionable material and insists it cooperates with US law enforcement agencies.
[/quote]

This website (this very thread)also contains the Secret Society of al-Qaeda in Europes claim of responsibility.

Is T-Nation a terrorist front? Is TC really Osama bin Laden? I have never seen a picture of them together…

[quote]redswingline wrote:
West did nothing to deserve this attack

By Ezra Levant – Calgary Sun

The intellectuals of the left tell us that we need to understand Muslim terrorists if we are going to stop them.

That’s true. But the left’s idea of understanding is an exercise in hiding from the truth, not seeking it.

We ought not to be so ethnocentric, we’re told. We should try to look at things from their point of view. We should ask: Have we done something to provoke them? Have we offended or humiliated them? What did we do to cause this attack?

Why did they think we deserved this – and what can we do to change our own behaviour so we won’t deserve it next time?

Can we meet them halfway? We have heard this refrain a thousand times – including from Jean Chretien. He told the CBC after 9/11, “you cannot exercise your powers to the point of humiliation for the others.”

“We’re looked upon as being arrogant, self-satisfied, greedy and with no limits,” said Chretien, looking thoughtful, imagining he was getting to the root of it.

At the time, Bill Graham said: “I think the prime minister’s comments were right on.”

Today Graham serves as Paul Martin’s foreign minister.

Many leftist pseudo-intellectuals talk that way. The post-modern liberal mind cannot make sense of terrorism – why would anyone want to kill women and children? What would drive someone to do such things?

Surely, our political system can provide a safe outlet for their grievances. Don’t we have departments of multiculturalism? Don’t we give foreign aid? Don’t we have racial affirmative action?

So: If they’re still mad enough at us to bomb us, what did we do wrong?

But that is not getting into the terrorists’ mind. That is not emerging from ethnocentrism – that is burrowing deeper into it, hiding from the reality of things. The post-modern, post-Christian mind does not have the vocabulary to deal with Islamic terrorism.

We do not use the word “evil” anymore, even with apolitical criminals, whose crimes are called sicknesses now, or syndromes, caused by – what is it this week? society? parents? TV? – and who need our understanding and accommodation, not our rejection or punishment. All the more so for avowedly political murders like those in London.

Leftists who call for more understanding or dialogue or compromise, are not understanding the Muslim “other.” They are projecting themselves onto the terrorists, imagining what it would take to cool themselves off if they were ever that mad about something. Have a seminar; bring in some professional mediators; do some role playing – bond.

Such a response does not understand the terrorists. To understand them is simple, if terrifying: Read their writing and listen to their speeches.

They want the world to be ruled by sharia law, where the only constitution is the Qu’ran. They want a theocracy, like Afghanistan was and Iran is, where infidels are killed, or kept in a state of submission, called dhimmitude.

Read Osama bin Laden’s speeches, not those of his lawyers and psychologists in the media. Like Hitler’s Mein Kampf, bin Laden is plain about his intentions.

There was no half way, no compromise, no win-win possible with Hitler. The Jews didn’t do any one thing in particular to him – he hated their very existence.

The West didn’t do any one thing to bin Laden that caused his hate – other than to live freely and outside his authority.

Sixty-five years ago, Britain understood Hitler was evil, and responded with Spitfires, not psychologists.

Here’s hoping Britain today has the same clarity of thought.

[/quote]

This is nothing more then right wing propaganda attempting to brainwash more sheep that Democrats are tree hugging hippies that would “try to understand the terrorists” instead of kill them.

Any reasonable person Repub or democrat wants terrorists killed. Reasonable people want it done so that there is a positive result.

The current administration has created a situation that is favorable to the enemy. We had the opportunity to wipe al qaeda out through a direct focus on them with our resources.

Instead our leaders chose to take the focus elsewhere and create a quagmire that terrorists go to for skill refinement. The latest CIA reports confirm this. Many other cells are active throughout the world as the London bombing has shown.

I can’t speak for others, but as a Democrat who is opposed to this war if you put Osama Bin Laden in front of me and handed me a weapon, I wouldn’t hesitate to put a round between his eyes! I wouldn’t be trying to “understand him”.

Like wise, I wouldn’t disagree for one nano second in using lethal force or waging war with a competent plan and method for winning. Not for starting an unneeded war in a country with no ties to the real enemy and exacerbating the problem!

The trying to paint rationale people who oppose the inept mind set of this whole administration as “peace loving, Dr. Phil let’s try to understand each other, bead wearing, fools,” is a desperate attempt to keep the sheep in the flock. Many more peoples who were initially supportive of the “war president” are waking up and seeing this for what it is!

Only the most brainwashed or disconnected to reality are still playing their violins while the flames dance higher and higher.

[quote]redswingline wrote:
West did nothing to deserve this attack

By Ezra Levant – Calgary Sun

The intellectuals of the left tell us that we need to understand Muslim terrorists if we are going to stop them.

That’s true. But the left’s idea of understanding is an exercise in hiding from the truth, not seeking it.

We ought not to be so ethnocentric, we’re told. We should try to look at things from their point of view. We should ask: Have we done something to provoke them? Have we offended or humiliated them? What did we do to cause this attack?

Why did they think we deserved this – and what can we do to change our own behaviour so we won’t deserve it next time?

Can we meet them halfway? We have heard this refrain a thousand times – including from Jean Chretien. He told the CBC after 9/11, “you cannot exercise your powers to the point of humiliation for the others.”

“We’re looked upon as being arrogant, self-satisfied, greedy and with no limits,” said Chretien, looking thoughtful, imagining he was getting to the root of it.

At the time, Bill Graham said: “I think the prime minister’s comments were right on.”

Today Graham serves as Paul Martin’s foreign minister.

Many leftist pseudo-intellectuals talk that way. The post-modern liberal mind cannot make sense of terrorism – why would anyone want to kill women and children? What would drive someone to do such things?

Surely, our political system can provide a safe outlet for their grievances. Don’t we have departments of multiculturalism? Don’t we give foreign aid? Don’t we have racial affirmative action?

So: If they’re still mad enough at us to bomb us, what did we do wrong?

But that is not getting into the terrorists’ mind. That is not emerging from ethnocentrism – that is burrowing deeper into it, hiding from the reality of things. The post-modern, post-Christian mind does not have the vocabulary to deal with Islamic terrorism.

We do not use the word “evil” anymore, even with apolitical criminals, whose crimes are called sicknesses now, or syndromes, caused by – what is it this week? society? parents? TV? – and who need our understanding and accommodation, not our rejection or punishment. All the more so for avowedly political murders like those in London.

Leftists who call for more understanding or dialogue or compromise, are not understanding the Muslim “other.” They are projecting themselves onto the terrorists, imagining what it would take to cool themselves off if they were ever that mad about something. Have a seminar; bring in some professional mediators; do some role playing – bond.

Such a response does not understand the terrorists. To understand them is simple, if terrifying: Read their writing and listen to their speeches.

They want the world to be ruled by sharia law, where the only constitution is the Qu’ran. They want a theocracy, like Afghanistan was and Iran is, where infidels are killed, or kept in a state of submission, called dhimmitude.

Read Osama bin Laden’s speeches, not those of his lawyers and psychologists in the media. Like Hitler’s Mein Kampf, bin Laden is plain about his intentions.

There was no half way, no compromise, no win-win possible with Hitler. The Jews didn’t do any one thing in particular to him – he hated their very existence.

The West didn’t do any one thing to bin Laden that caused his hate – other than to live freely and outside his authority.

Sixty-five years ago, Britain understood Hitler was evil, and responded with Spitfires, not psychologists.

Here’s hoping Britain today has the same clarity of thought.
[/quote]

Though I agree with parts of his article I have one question: He is sure that leftists project themselves onto the terrorists and therefore have no idea what is really going on in their minds. On the other hand he is pretty confident that he knows what is going on in a terrorists mind. Why is it not possible that he got it also wrong?

He starts with a good point and then, in the next paragraph , he pretty much does the same he critized people for.

And that Hitler analogy is stupid for so many reasons that I?m not going to go into it. However there is a branch of science, well at least literature, called history and it helps if one has studied nazi-germany if one feels that it is necessary to bring up Hitler in every second argument one makes.

Redswing,

Can’t say I agree with the characterization of people’s thinking, but near the end the story gets to the point…

[quote]Read Osama bin Laden’s speeches, not those of his lawyers and psychologists in the media. Like Hitler’s Mein Kampf, bin Laden is plain about his intentions.

There was no half way, no compromise, no win-win possible with Hitler. The Jews didn’t do any one thing in particular to him – he hated their very existence.

The West didn’t do any one thing to bin Laden that caused his hate – other than to live freely and outside his authority.

Sixty-five years ago, Britain understood Hitler was evil, and responded with Spitfires, not psychologists.[/quote]

What the story you have quoted fails to realize, is that leaders do not fight alone. In the case of Bin Laden, he is able to find and recruit willing subjects to join his cause.

It is a mistake by the writer of the article to assume that trying to understand these mechanisms of recruitment are in some way equivalent to a desire to appease or otherwise deal with Bin Laden himself.

The conditions are obviously ripe for the situation the world now faces. Lets make those conditions not so ripe. This is not appeasement or tolerance. Stopping the ability of twisted leaders to recruit followers would be like putting water on the fire of terrorism.

We have to make it possible for moderate muslims to take a stand without being killed when they do so. It has to be fashionable to agree with western policies and actions instead of to hate them and rail against them.

Might alone will not accomplish this. And, finally, granted, at times might is absolutely necessary. Once people become totalitarian idealists who believe the ends justify the means, then they need to be stopped. These aren’t the people that need to be courted. The author does a disservice to imagine that anyone thinks so.

We don’t need the terrorists style of totalitarian thinking on our own side, rumbling the drums of war and hatred, to divide us into patriots and dreamers, fighters and appeasers. There are stances that can be between these viewpoints… and if we don’t start allowing for them, we’re in for tough times indeed.

Where do you imagine peace will come from, when it finally comes?

[quote]redswingline wrote:
West did nothing to deserve this attack

By Ezra Levant – Calgary Sun

The intellectuals of the left tell us that we need to understand Muslim terrorists if we are going to stop them.

That’s true. But the left’s idea of understanding is an exercise in hiding from the truth, not seeking it.

We ought not to be so ethnocentric, we’re told. We should try to look at things from their point of view. We should ask: Have we done something to provoke them? Have we offended or humiliated them? What did we do to cause this attack?

Why did they think we deserved this – and what can we do to change our own behaviour so we won’t deserve it next time?

Can we meet them halfway? We have heard this refrain a thousand times – including from Jean Chretien. He told the CBC after 9/11, “you cannot exercise your powers to the point of humiliation for the others.”

“We’re looked upon as being arrogant, self-satisfied, greedy and with no limits,” said Chretien, looking thoughtful, imagining he was getting to the root of it.

At the time, Bill Graham said: “I think the prime minister’s comments were right on.”

Today Graham serves as Paul Martin’s foreign minister.

Many leftist pseudo-intellectuals talk that way. The post-modern liberal mind cannot make sense of terrorism – why would anyone want to kill women and children? What would drive someone to do such things?

Surely, our political system can provide a safe outlet for their grievances. Don’t we have departments of multiculturalism? Don’t we give foreign aid? Don’t we have racial affirmative action?

So: If they’re still mad enough at us to bomb us, what did we do wrong?

But that is not getting into the terrorists’ mind. That is not emerging from ethnocentrism – that is burrowing deeper into it, hiding from the reality of things. The post-modern, post-Christian mind does not have the vocabulary to deal with Islamic terrorism.

We do not use the word “evil” anymore, even with apolitical criminals, whose crimes are called sicknesses now, or syndromes, caused by – what is it this week? society? parents? TV? – and who need our understanding and accommodation, not our rejection or punishment. All the more so for avowedly political murders like those in London.

Leftists who call for more understanding or dialogue or compromise, are not understanding the Muslim “other.” They are projecting themselves onto the terrorists, imagining what it would take to cool themselves off if they were ever that mad about something. Have a seminar; bring in some professional mediators; do some role playing – bond.

Such a response does not understand the terrorists. To understand them is simple, if terrifying: Read their writing and listen to their speeches.

They want the world to be ruled by sharia law, where the only constitution is the Qu’ran. They want a theocracy, like Afghanistan was and Iran is, where infidels are killed, or kept in a state of submission, called dhimmitude.

Read Osama bin Laden’s speeches, not those of his lawyers and psychologists in the media. Like Hitler’s Mein Kampf, bin Laden is plain about his intentions.

There was no half way, no compromise, no win-win possible with Hitler. The Jews didn’t do any one thing in particular to him – he hated their very existence.

The West didn’t do any one thing to bin Laden that caused his hate – other than to live freely and outside his authority.

Sixty-five years ago, Britain understood Hitler was evil, and responded with Spitfires, not psychologists.

Here’s hoping Britain today has the same clarity of thought.
[/quote]

No, I just can?t help it…

The Hitler reference above is JUST, PLAIN STUPID.

One of the reasons for Hitlers popularity, maybe even one of the main reasons for him becoming Reichskanzler was the treaty of Versailles that was considered to be completely unfair by the germans. Why? Because it was deeply, deeply unfair and humiliating for them. With this treaty the allies of the first world war laid one of the cornerstones of Hitlers rise to power and of the second world war.

Compare that to the situation now. Yes, after a certain point Hitler had to be removed with force. But that point would probably have never come if the allies had not be so arrogant and stupid in the first place.

However, the US actually learned from their mistakes an rebuild Germany after the second world war. Financed small businesses, encouraged independent media, democracy. One might say a liberal, step by step, no gungho attitude approach but I think it worked.

How We Can Prevail
New hope: Defeating terror requires Muslim help?and much more than force of arms
By Fareed Zakaria
For more articles by Fareed Zakaria, visit the archive.

The London bombings have failed. Barbarous in intent, brutal for a few hundred people, unsettling for all who watched in horror, they have nonetheless failed. In one day much of the city’s transport system was up and running again, its Underground stations busy and its buses crowded with passengers. Most businesses stayed open, and people didn’t panic. Right after the blasts, Britain was scheduled to play Australia in a cricket match at Headingley stadium in Leeds, 170 miles from London. The organizers decided that the game would go on. Britain won.

The clear hope of the terrorists last Thursday morning was to disrupt economic activities at one of the world’s financial centers. For years now, Al Qaeda’s leaders, including Osama bin Laden, have urged that this be the goal of future attacks. But in 24 hours the London stock market was back to its pre-bombing levels. World markets bounced back even faster. All indications are that Britain will see a minimal drop in tourism and virtually none in trade.

This is part of a larger pattern of global resilience that has been growing ever since September 11, 2001. After those attacks, global markets took two months to return to their Sept. 10 levels. After the Madrid bombings in 2004, the Spanish market took one month to recover. The broader economic picture is similar. After 9/11, the United States lost hundreds of billions of dollars in economic activity. The Bali nightclub bombing in 2002 had a similarly dramatic effect on the Indonesian economy, with tourism vanishing and trade and investment drying up for months.

But a year later, after another Indonesian bombing, this time at the Marriott hotel in Jakarta, the market dropped only briefly and there was little significant damage to the Indonesian economy. The bombings in Morocco and Turkey in 2003 similarly had little economic effect. After the Madrid attack, Spain grew faster than it had for three years.

Economic activity is perhaps the best measure of the psychological response to terrorism. Do people get scared, stay home, refuse to travel and shop less? Or do they come to the view that life goes on? Overwhelmingly, much of the world appears to have arrived at the latter position. And in doing so, people have robbed the terrorists of their most potent weapon.

The other important difference between the London bombings and 9/11 has been the response of the world of Islam. For months after 9/11, I kept writing that it was sad and disturbing that Muslims were reluctant to condemn the attacks. This time is different. Major Muslim groups in Britain have unambiguously denounced the bombings. Even “fundamentalist” organizations have condemned it.

The Muslim Association of Britain, a hard-line group with alleged ties to militants in the Middle East, called the bombings “heinous and repulsive” and urged Muslims to help the emergency services and police. “We have faith in Britain and British people that we as a country will not be defeated by this,” said its spokesman, Anas Altikriti.

The response outside Britain has also been much stronger than ever before. The grand imam of Al-Azhar, Sheik Mohammed Sayyed Tantawi, condemned the bombers but went further, rejecting the argument that this attack could be justified as an attempt to force Britain out of Iraq. “This is illogical and cannot be the motive for killing innocent civilians,” he said. More striking have been the condemnations from radical groups like Hamas, Hizbullah and Egypt’s Muslim Brotherhood, all of which have denounced the bombings.

Many of them have, of course, coupled their attacks on the terrorists with denunciations of American and British policies in the Middle East, particularly regarding Iraq and the Palestinian territories. But that kind of rhetoric is old news. What is new here is the fact that no one, not even Hamas, can continue to condone or even stay silent about these barbarities.

September 11 shocked the Arab psyche. For months afterward, Arabs and many Muslims went through phases recognizable to psychologists: shock, denial, anger. (Remember those absurd claims that 9/11 was a Mossad plot?) They are finally, slowly, moving toward recognizing that there is a great dysfunction in the world of Islam, which has allowed Muslims to concoct wild conspiracy theories, blame others for their problems and, worst of all, condone grotesque violence.

Now things are changing. The day before the London bombs, a conference of 180 top Muslim sheiks and imams, brought together under the auspices of Jordan’s King Abdullah, issued a statement forbidding that any Muslim be declared takfir?an apostate. This is a frontal attack on Al Qaeda’s theological methods. Declaring someone takfir?and thus sanctioning his or her death?is a favorite tactic of bin Laden and his ally in Iraq, Abu Mussab al-Zarqawi.

The conference’s statement was endorsed by 10 fatwas from such big conservative scholars as Tantawi; Iraq’s Grand Ayatollah Ali Sistani; Egypt’s mufti, Ali Jumaa, and the influential Al-Jazeera TV-sheik, Yusuf al-Qaradawi. Signed by adherents of all schools of fiqh (Islamic jurisprudence), it also allows only qualified Muslim scholars to issue edicts. The Islamic Conference’s statement, the first of its kind, is a rare show of unity among the religious establishment against terrorists and their scholarly allies.

This hardly puts an end to the struggle within Islam. The same day the Jordanian statement was issued, Al Qaeda in Iraq said that Egypt’s ambassador to that country, Ihab al-Sherif, would be killed as an apostate. The day of the London bombings, an Internet message purportedly from Zarqawi’s group said the “ambassador of the infidels” had been killed.

These kinds of events will continue. There should be much, much greater condemnation from mainstream Islam. Moderates must adopt a zero-tolerance policy on terrorism, regardless of what they think of Iraq, Palestine or any other policy issue. But those clamoring for such condemnations should bear in mind that this will not solve the problem. Even if the moderates win and overwhelm the extremists, there will always be some number of unconverted jihadists, who either out of depravity or conviction seek to do evil.

If 99.99 percent of the Arab world rejects terrorism, that still leaves 20,000 people to worry about. If 99.9 percent of the Muslim world is against the terrorists, there’s 1 million people out there who are dangerous. And the technologies of destruction ensure that they will, on occasion, be successful.

To realize victory, we have to understand this struggle is more complex than we have been led to believe. Simple slogans telling us we fight terrorists in Iraq so that we will not have to fight them here, are just that: slogans, not comprehensive policies. In fact, as London shows, terrorists can fight in two places at the same time. Or three. Or 10. And the great danger, of course, is that they can fight with dangerous weapons. The calculus of terror would change irrevocably if one of these splinter groups were ever to get its hands on nuclear materials or biological pathogens. So far the Bush administration has not given this danger the priority it urgently requires.

The broader shift that needs to take place, however, is a better definition of victory. America’s political leaders continue to give their citizens the impression that victory means ensuring that there will be no other attack on American soil?as long as we go on the offense abroad, get perfect intelligence, buy fancy new technologies at home, screen visas and lock some people up.

But all these tough tactics and all the intelligence in the world will not change the fact that in today’s open societies, terrorism is easy to carry out. The British authorities, perhaps the world’s best at combating terror, admit they had no warning about last week’s attack. The American response to the London bombs has been a perfect example of U.S. grandstanding. We immediately raised the alert level, scaring Americans, with no specific information about terror attacks in America. Why? Because were something to happen here, politicians and bureaucrats want to be able to say, “Don’t blame us, we told you.”

Real victory is not about preventing all attacks everywhere. No one can guarantee that. It’s really about preventing the worst kinds of attacks, and responding well to others. And on this score, America remains woefully unprepared. "The British attacks failed because Britain has excellent response systems and its people are well prepared on how to respond.

America has neither advantage today," says Stephen Flynn, a homeland-security expert and author of “America the Vulnerable: How Our Government Is Failing to Protect Us From Terrorism.” “We need good education and training for transit workers and citizens, good communication mechanisms among government agencies and the people, and most important, a good public-health infrastructure.” We have little of this today. In the years after 9/11 we have wasted much time, effort and money on other priorities rather than engaging in the massive investment in the systems of response that we need. Our leaders remain unwilling to speak honestly about the world we live in and to help people develop the mentality of response that is essential to prevailing.

The bombs were meant to show that the terrorists were strong and we were weak. In fact they have shown the opposite. But to realize victory fully, we must know what victory means.

The Politics of Rage: Why Do They Hate Us?
To dismiss the terrorists as insane is to delude ourselves. Bin Laden and his fellow fanatics are products of failed societies that breed their anger. America needs a plan that will not only defeat terror but reform the Arab world
By Fareed Zakaria

To the question “Why do the terrorists hate us?” Americans could be pardoned for answering, “Why should we care?” The immediate reaction to the murder of 5,000 innocents is anger, not analysis. Yet anger will not be enough to get us through what is sure to be a long struggle. For that we will need answers. The ones we have heard so far have been comforting but familiar. We stand for freedom and they hate it. We are rich and they envy us. We are strong and they resent this. All of which is true. But there are billions of poor and weak and oppressed people around the world. They don’t turn planes into bombs. They don’t blow themselves up to kill thousands of civilians. If envy were the cause of terrorism, Beverly Hills, Fifth Avenue and Mayfair would have become morgues long ago. There is something stronger at work here than deprivation and jealousy. Something that can move men to kill but also to die.

Osama bin Laden has an answer–religion. For him and his followers, this is a holy war between Islam and the Western world. Most Muslims disagree. Every Islamic country in the world has condemned the attacks of Sept. 11. To many, bin Laden belongs to a long line of extremists who have invoked religion to justify mass murder and spur men to suicide. The words “thug,” “zealot” and “assassin” all come from ancient terror cults–Hindu, Jewish and Muslim, respectively–that believed they were doing the work of God. The terrorist’s mind is its own place, and like Milton’s Satan, can make a hell of heaven, a heaven of hell. Whether it is the Unabomber, Aum Shinrikyo or Baruch Goldstein (who killed scores of unarmed Muslims in Hebron), terrorists are almost always misfits who place their own twisted morality above mankind’s.

But bin Laden and his followers are not an isolated cult like Aum Shinrikyo or the Branch Davidians or demented loners like Timothy McVeigh and the Unabomber. They come out of a culture that reinforces their hostility, distrust and hatred of the West–and of America in particular. This culture does not condone terrorism but fuels the fanaticism that is at its heart. To say that Al Qaeda is a fringe group may be reassuring, but it is false. Read the Arab press in the aftermath of the attacks and you will detect a not-so-hidden admiration for bin Laden. Or consider this from the Pakistani newspaper The Nation:

“September 11 was not mindless terrorism for terrorism’s sake. It was reaction and revenge, even retribution.” Why else is America’s response to the terror attacks so deeply constrained by fears of an “Islamic backlash” on the streets? Pakistan will dare not allow Washington the use of its bases. Saudi Arabia trembles at the thought of having to help us publicly. Egypt pleads that our strikes be as limited as possible. The problem is not that Osama bin Laden believes that this is a religious war against America. It’s that millions of people across the Islamic world seem to agree.

This awkward reality has led some in the West to dust off old essays and older prejudices redicting a “clash of civilizations” between the West and Islam. The historian Paul Johnson has argued that Islam is intrinsically an intolerant and violent religion. Other scholars have disagreed, pointing out that Islam condemns the slaughter of innocents and prohibits suicide. Nothing will be solved by searching for “true Islam” or quoting the Quran. The Quran is a vast, vague book, filled with poetry and contradictions (much like the Bible).

You can find in it condemnations of war and incitements to struggle, beautiful expressions of tolerance and stern strictures against unbelievers. Quotations from it usually tell us more about the person who selected the passages than about Islam. Every religion is compatible with the best and the worst of humankind. Through its long history, Christianity has supported inquisitions and anti-Semitism, but also human rights and social welfare.

Searching the history books is also of limited value. From the Crusades of the 11th century to the Turkish expansion of the 15th century to the colonial era in the early 20th century, Islam and the West have often battled militarily. This tension has existed for hundreds of years, during which there have been many periods of peace and even harmony. Until the 1950s, for example, Jews and Christians lived peaceably under Muslim rule. In fact, Bernard Lewis, the pre-eminent historian of Islam, has argued that for much of history religious minorities did better under Muslim rulers than they did under Christian ones.

All that has changed in the past few decades. So surely the relevant question we must ask is, Why are we in a particularly difficult phase right now? What has gone wrong in the world of Islam that explains not the conquest of Constantinople in 1453 or the siege of Vienna of 1683 but Sept. 11, 2001?

Let us first peer inside that vast Islamic world. Many of the largest Muslim countries in the world show little of this anti-American rage. The biggest, Indonesia, had, until the recent Asian economic crisis, been diligently following Washington’s advice on economics, with impressive results. The second and third most populous Muslim countries, Pakistan and Bangladesh, have mixed Islam and modernity with some success. While both countries are impoverished, both have voted a woman into power as prime minister, before most Western countries have done so. Next is Turkey, the sixth largest Muslim country in the world, a flawed but functioning secular democracy and a close ally of the West (being a member of NATO).

Only when you get to the Middle East do you see in lurid colors all the dysfunctions that people conjure up when they think of Islam today. In Iran, Egypt, Syria, Iraq, Jordan, the occupied territories and the Persian Gulf, the resurgence of Islamic fundamentalism is virulent, and a raw anti-Americanism seems to be everywhere. This is the land of suicide bombers, flag-burners and fiery mullahs. As we strike Afghanistan it is worth remembering that not a single Afghan has been tied to a terrorist attack against the United States.

Afghanistan is the campground from which an Arab army is battling America. But even the Arab rage at America is relatively recent. In the 1950s and 1960s it seemed unimaginable that the United States and the Arab world would end up locked in a cultural clash. Egypt’s most powerful journalist, Mohamed Heikal, described the mood at the time: "The whole picture of the United States… was a glamorous one. Britain and France were fading, hated empires. The Soviet Union was 5,000 miles away and the ideology of communism was anathema to the Muslim religion.

But America had emerged from World War II richer, more powerful and more appealing than ever." I first traveled to the Middle East in the early 1970s, and even then the image of America was of a glistening, approachable modernity: fast cars, Hilton hotels and Coca-Cola. Something happened in these lands. To understand the roots of anti-American rage in the Middle East, we need to plumb not the past 300 years of history but the past 30.

Chapter I: The Ruler

It is difficult to conjure up the excitement in the Arab world in the late 1950s as Gamal Abdel Nasser consolidated power in Egypt. For decades Arabs had been ruled by colonial governors and decadent kings. Now they were achieving their dreams of independence, and Nasser was their new savior, a modern man for the postwar era. He was born under British rule, in Alexandria, a cosmopolitan city that was more Mediterranean than Arab. His formative years were spent in the Army, the most Westernized segment of the society. With his tailored suits and fashionable dark glasses, he cut an energetic figure on the world stage. “The Lion of Egypt,” he spoke for all the Arab world.

Nasser believed that Arab politics needed to be fired by modern ideas like self-determination, socialism and Arab unity. And before oil money turned the gulf states into golden geese, Egypt was the undisputed leader of the Middle East. So Nasser’s vision became the region’s. Every regime, from the Baathists in Syria and Iraq to the conservative monarchies of the gulf, spoke in similar terms and tones. It wasn’t that they were just aping Nasser. The Middle East desperately wanted to become modern.

It failed. For all their energy these regimes chose bad ideas and implemented them in worse ways. Socialism produced bureaucracy and stagnation. Rather than adjusting to the failures of central planning, the economies never really moved on. The republics calcified into dictatorships. Third World “nonalignment” became pro-Soviet propaganda. Arab unity cracked and crumbled as countries discovered their own national interests and opportunities. Worst of all, Israel humiliated the Arabs in the wars of 1967 and 1973. When Saddam Hussein invaded Kuwait in 1990, he destroyed the last remnants of the Arab idea.

Look at Egypt today. The promise of Nasserism has turned into a quiet nightmare. The government is efficient in only one area: squashing dissent and strangling civil society. In the past 30 years Egypt’s economy has sputtered along while its population has doubled. Unemployment is at 25 percent, and 90 percent of those searching for jobs hold college diplomas. Once the heart of Arab intellectual life, the country produces just 375 books every year (compared with Israel’s 4,000). For all the angry protests to foreigners, Egyptians know all this.

Shockingly, Egypt has fared better than its Arab neighbors. Syria has become one of the world’s most oppressive police states, a country where 25,000 people can be rounded up and killed by the regime with no consequences. (This in a land whose capital, Damascus, is the oldest continuously inhabited city in the world.)

In 30 years Iraq has gone from being among the most modern and secular of Arab countries–with women working, artists thriving, journalists writing–into a squalid playpen for Saddam Hussein’s megalomania. Lebanon, a diverse, cosmopolitan society with a capital, Beirut, that was once called the Paris of the East, has become a hellhole of war and terror. In an almost unthinkable reversal of a global pattern, almost every Arab country today is less free than it was 30 years ago. There are few countries in the world of which one can say that.

We think of Africa’s dictators as rapacious, but those in the Middle East can be just as greedy. And when contrasted with the success of Israel, Arab failures are even more humiliating. For all its flaws, out of the same desert Israel has created a functioning democracy, a modern society with an increasingly high-technology economy and thriving artistic and cultural life. Israel now has a per capita GDP that equals that of many Western countries.

If poverty produced failure in most of Arabia, wealth produced failure in the rest of it. The rise of oil power in the 1970s gave a second wind to Arab hopes. Where Nasserism failed, petroleum would succeed. But it didn’t. All that the rise of oil prices has done over three decades is to produce a new class of rich, superficially Western gulf Arabs, who travel the globe in luxury and are despised by the rest of the Arab world. Look at any cartoons of gulf sheiks in Egyptian, Jordanian or Syrian newspapers. They are portrayed in the most insulting, almost racist manner: as corpulent, corrupt and weak.

Most Americans think that Arabs should be grateful for our role in the gulf war, for we saved Kuwait and Saudi Arabia. Most Arabs think that we saved the Kuwaiti and Saudi royal families. Big difference.

The money that the gulf sheiks have frittered away is on a scale that is almost impossible to believe. Just one example: a favored prince of Saudi Arabia, at the age of 25, built a palace in Riyadh for $300 million and, as an additional bounty, was given a $1 billion commission on the kingdom’s telephone contract with AT&T. Far from producing political progress, wealth has actually had some negative effects. It has enriched and empowered the gulf governments so that, like their Arab brethren, they, too, have become more repressive over time.

The Bedouin societies they once ruled have become gilded cages, filled with frustrated, bitter and discontented young men–some of whom now live in Afghanistan and work with Osama bin Laden. (Bin Laden and some of his aides come from privileged backgrounds in Saudi Arabia.)

By the late 1980s, while the rest of the world was watching old regimes from Moscow to Prague to Seoul to Johannesburg crack, the Arabs were stuck with their aging dictators and corrupt kings. Regimes that might have seemed promising in the 1960s were now exposed as tired, corrupt kleptocracies, deeply unpopular and thoroughly illegitimate. One has to add that many of them are close American allies.

Chapter II: Failed Ideas

About a decade ago, in a casual conversation with an elderly Arab intellectual, I expressed my frustration that governments in the Middle East had been unable to liberalize their economies and societies in the way that the East Asians had done. “Look at Singapore, Hong Kong and Seoul,” I said, pointing to their extraordinary economic achievements. The man, a gentle, charming scholar, straightened up and replied sharply, “Look at them. They have simply aped the West. Their cities are cheap copies of Houston and Dallas. That may be all right for fishing villages. But we are heirs to one of the great civilizations of the world. We cannot become slums of the West.”

This disillusionment with the West is at the heart of the Arab problem. It makes economic advance impossible and political progress fraught with difficulty. Modernization is now taken to mean, inevitably, uncontrollably, Westernization and, even worse, Americanization. This fear has paralyzed Arab civilization. In some ways the Arab world seems less ready to confront the age of globalization than even Africa, despite the devastation that continent has suffered from AIDS and economic and political dysfunction. At least the Africans want to adapt to the new global economy. The Arab world has not yet taken that first step.

The question is how a region that once yearned for modernity could reject it so dramatically. In the Middle Ages the Arabs studied Aristotle (when he was long forgotten in the West) and invented algebra. In the 19th century, when the West set ashore in Arab lands, in the form of Napoleon’s conquest of Egypt, the locals were fascinated by this powerful civilization. In fact, as the historian Albert Hourani has documented, the 19th century saw European-inspired liberal political and social thought flourish in the Middle East.

The colonial era of the late 19th and early 20th centuries raised hopes of British friendship that were to be disappointed, but still Arab elites remained fascinated with the West. Future kings and generals attended Victoria College in Alexandria, learning the speech and manners of British gentlemen. Many then went on to Oxford, Cambridge and Sandhurst–a tradition that is still maintained by Jordan’s royal family, though now they go to Hotchkiss or Lawrenceville. After World War I, a new liberal age flickered briefly in the Arab world, as ideas about opening up politics and society gained currency in places like Egypt, Lebanon, Iraq and Syria. But since they were part of a world of kings and aristocrats, these ideas died with those old regimes. The new ones, however, turned out to be just as Western.

Nasser thought his ideas for Egypt and the Arab world were modern. They were also Western. His “national charter” of 1962 reads as if it were written by left-wing intellectuals in Paris or London. (Like many Third World leaders of the time, Nasser was a devoted reader of France’s Le Monde and Britain’s New Statesman.) Even his most passionately held project, Pan-Arabism, was European.

It was a version of the nationalism that had united Italy and Germany in the 1870s–that those who spoke one language should be one nation. America thinks of modernity as all good–and it has been almost all good for America. But for the Arab world, modernity has been one failure after another. Each path followed–socialism, secularism, nationalism–has turned into a dead end. While other countries adjusted to their failures, Arab regimes got stuck in their ways. And those that reformed economically could not bring themselves to ease up politically.

The Shah of Iran, the Middle Eastern ruler who tried to move his country into the modern era fastest, reaped the most violent reaction in the Iranian revolution of 1979. But even the shah’s modernization–compared, for example, with the East Asian approach of hard work, investment and thrift–was an attempt to buy modernization with oil wealth.

It turns out that modernization takes more than strongmen and oil money. Importing foreign stuff–Cadillacs, Gulfstreams and McDonald’s–is easy. Importing the inner stuffings of modern society–a free market, political parties, accountability and the rule of law–is difficult and dangerous. The gulf states, for example, have gotten modernization lite, with the goods and even the workers imported from abroad. Nothing was homegrown; nothing is even now. As for politics, the gulf governments offered their people a bargain: we will bribe you with wealth, but in return let us stay in power. It was the inverse slogan of the American revolution–no taxation, but no representation either.

The new age of globalization has hit the Arab world in a very strange way. Its societies are open enough to be disrupted by modernity, but not so open that they can ride the wave. They see the television shows, the fast foods and the fizzy drinks. But they don’t see genuine liberalization in the society, with increased opportunities and greater openness. Globalization in the Arab world is the critic’s caricature of globalization–a slew of Western products and billboards with little else. For some in their societies it means more things to buy. For the regimes it is an unsettling, dangerous phenomenon. As a result, the people they rule can look at globalization but for the most part not touch it.

America stands at the center of this world of globalization. It seems unstoppable. If you close the borders, America comes in through the mail. If you censor the mail, it appears in the fast food and faded jeans. If you ban the products, it seeps in through satellite television. Americans are so comfortable with global capitalism and consumer culture that we cannot fathom just how revolutionary these forces are.

Disoriented young men, with one foot in the old world and another in the new, now look for a purer, simpler alternative. Fundamentalism searches for such people everywhere; it, too, has been globalized. One can now find men in Indonesia who regard the Palestinian cause as their own. (Twenty years ago an Indonesian Muslim would barely have known where Palestine was.) Often they learned about this path away from the West while they were in the West. As did Mohamed Atta, the Hamburg-educated engineer who drove the first plane into the World Trade Center.

The Arab world has a problem with its Attas in more than one sense. Globalization has caught it at a bad demographic moment. Arab societies are going through a massive youth bulge, with more than half of most countries’ populations under the age of 25. Young men, often better educated than their parents, leave their traditional villages to find work. They arrive in noisy, crowded cities like Cairo, Beirut and Damascus or go to work in the oil states. (Almost 10 percent of Egypt’s working population worked in the gulf at one point.) In their new world they see great disparities of wealth and the disorienting effects of modernity; most unsettlingly, they see women, unveiled and in public places, taking buses, eating in cafes and working alongside them.

A huge influx of restless young men in any country is bad news. When accompanied by even small economic and social change, it usually produces a new politics of protest. In the past, societies in these circumstances have fallen prey to a search for revolutionary solutions. (France went through a youth bulge just before the French Revolution, as did Iran before its 1979 revolution.) In the case of the Arab world, this revolution has taken the form of an Islamic resurgence.

Chapter III: Enter Religion

Nasser was a reasonably devout Muslim, but he had no interest in mixing religion with politics. It struck him as moving backward. This became apparent to the small Islamic parties that supported Nasser’s rise to power. The most important one, the Muslim Brotherhood, began opposing him vigorously, often violently.

Nasser cracked down on it in 1954, imprisoning more than a thousand of its leaders and executing six. One of those jailed, Sayyid Qutub, a frail man with a fiery pen, wrote a book in prison called “Signposts on the Road,” which in some ways marks the beginnings of modern political Islam or what is often called “Islamic fundamentalism.”

In his book, Qutub condemned Nasser as an impious Muslim and his regime as un-Islamic. Indeed, he went on, almost every modern Arab regime was similarly flawed. Qutub envisioned a better, more virtuous polity that was based on strict Islamic principles, a core goal of orthodox Muslims since the 1880s. As the regimes of the Middle East grew more distant and oppressive and hollow in the decades following Nasser, fundamentalism’s appeal grew. It flourished because the Muslim Brotherhood and organizations like it at least tried to give people a sense of meaning and purpose in a changing world, something no leader in the Middle East tried to do.

In his seminal work, “The Arab Predicament,” Fouad Ajami explains, “The fundamentalist call has resonance because it invited men to participate… [in] contrast to a political culture that reduces citizens to spectators and asks them to leave things to their rulers. At a time when the future is uncertain, it connects them to a tradition that reduces bewilderment.” Fundamentalism gave Arabs who were dissatisfied with their lot a powerful language of opposition.

On that score, Islam had little competition. The Arab world is a political desert with no real political parties, no free press, few pathways for dissent. As a result, the mosque turned into the place to discuss politics. And fundamentalist organizations have done more than talk. From the Muslim Brotherhood to Hamas to Hizbullah, they actively provide social services, medical assistance, counseling and temporary housing. For those who treasure civil society, it is disturbing to see that in the Middle East these illiberal groups are civil society.

I asked Sheri Berman, a scholar at Princeton who studies the rise of fascist parties in Europe, whether she saw any parallels. “Fascists were often very effective at providing social services,” she pointed out. “When the state or political parties fail to provide a sense of legitimacy or purpose or basic services, other organizations have often been able to step into the void. In Islamic countries there is a ready-made source of legitimacy in the religion. So it’s not surprising that this is the foundation on which these groups have flourished. The particular form–Islamic fundamentalism–is specific to this region, but the basic dynamic is sim- ilar to the rise of Nazism, fascism and even populism in the United States.”

Islamic fundamentalism got a tremendous boost in 1979 when Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini toppled the Shah of Iran. The Iranian revolution demonstrated that a powerful ruler could be taken on by groups within society. It also revealed how in a broken society even seemingly benign forces of progress–education and technology–can add to the turmoil. Until the 1970s most Muslims in the Middle East were illiterate and lived in villages and towns. They practiced a kind of street-Islam that had adapted itself to the local culture. Pluralistic and tolerant, these people often worshiped saints, went to shrines, sang religious hymns and cherished religious art, all technically disallowed in Islam. (This was particularly true in Iran.)

By the 1970s, however, people had begun moving out of the villages and their religious experience was not rooted in a specific place. At the same time they were learning to read and they discovered that a new Islam was being preached by the fundamentalists, an abstract faith not rooted in historical experience but literal, puritanical and by the book. It was Islam of the High Church as opposed to Islam of the village fair.

In Iran, Ayatollah Khomeini used a powerful technology–the audiocassette. His sermons were distributed throughout the country and became the vehicle of opposition to the shah’s repressive regime. But Khomeini was not alone in using the language of Islam as a political tool. Intellectuals, disillusioned by the half-baked or overrapid modernization that was throwing their world into turmoil, were writing books against “Westoxification” and calling the modern Iranian man–half Western, half Eastern–rootless. Fashionable intellectuals, often writing from the comfort of London or Paris, would critique American secularism and consumerism and endorse an Islamic alternative.

As theories like these spread across the Arab world, they appealed not to the poorest of the poor, for whom Westernization was magical (it meant food and medicine). They appealed to the half-educated hordes entering the cities of the Middle East or seeking education and jobs in the West.

The fact that Islam is a highly egalitarian religion for the most part has also proved an empowering call for people who felt powerless. At the same time it means that no Muslim really has the authority to question whether someone who claims to be a proper Muslim is one. The fundamentalists, from Sayyid Qutub on, have jumped into that the void. They ask whether people are “good Muslims.” It is a question that has terrified the Muslim world. And here we come to the failure not simply of governments but intellectual and social elites. Moderate Muslims are loath to criticize or debunk the fanaticism of the fundamentalists.

Like the moderates in Northern Ireland, they are scared of what would happen to them if they speak their mind.

The biggest Devil’s bargain has been made by the moderate monarchies of the Persian Gulf, particularly Saudi Arabia. The Saudi regime has played a dangerous game. It deflects attention from its shoddy record at home by funding religious schools (madrasas) and centers that spread a rigid, puritanical brand of Islam–Wahhabism. In the past 30 years Saudi-funded schools have churned out tens of thousands of half-educated, fanatical Muslims who view the modern world and non-Muslims with great suspicion. America in this world view is almost always evil.

This exported fundamentalism has in turn infected not just other Arab societies but countries outside the Arab world, like Pakistan. During the 11-year reign of Gen. Zia ul-Haq, the dictator decided that as he squashed political dissent he needed allies. He found them in the fundamentalists. With the aid of Saudi financiers and functionaries, he set up scores of madrasas throughout the country. They bought him temporary legitimacy but have eroded the social fabric of Pakistan.

If there is one great cause of the rise of Islamic fundamentalism, it is the total failure of political institutions in the Arab world. Muslim elites have averted their eyes from this reality. Conferences at Islamic centers would still rather discuss “Islam and the Environment” than examine the dysfunctions of the current regimes. But as the moderate majority looks the other way, Islam is being taken over by a small poisonous element, people who advocate cruel attitudes toward women, education, the economy and modern life in general. I have seen this happen in India, where I grew up.

The rich, colorful, pluralistic and easygoing Islam of my youth has turned into a dour, puritanical faith, policed by petty theocrats and religious commissars. The next section deals with what the United States can do to help the Islamic world. But if Muslims do not take it upon themselves to stop their religion from falling prey to medievalists, nothing any outsider can do will save them.

Chapter IV: WHAT TO DO

If almost any Arab were to have read this essay so far, he would have objected vigorously by now. “It is all very well to talk about the failures of the Arab world,” he would say, “but what about the failures of the West? You speak of long-term decline, but our problems are with specific, cruel American policies.” For most Arabs, relations with the United States have been filled with disappointment.

While the Arab world has long felt betrayed by Europe’s colonial powers, its disillusionment with America begins most importantly with the creation of Israel in 1948. As the Arabs see it, at a time when colonies were winning independence from the West, here was a state largely composed of foreign people being imposed on a region with Western backing. The anger deepened in the wake of America’s support for Israel during the wars of 1967 and 1973, and ever since in its relations with the Palestinians. The daily exposure to Israel’s iron-fisted rule over the occupied territories has turned this into the great cause of the Arab–and indeed the broader Islamic–world. Elsewhere, they look at American policy in the region as cynically geared to America’s oil interests, supporting thugs and tyrants without any hesitation.

Finally, the bombing and isolation of Iraq have become fodder for daily attacks on the United States. While many in the Arab world do not like Saddam Hussein, they believe that the United States has chosen a particularly inhuman method of fighting him–a method that is starving an entire nation.

There is substance to some of these charges, and certainly from the point of view of an Arab, American actions are never going to seem entirely fair. Like any country, America has its interests. In my view, America’s greatest sins toward the Arab world are sins of omission. We have neglected to press any regime there to open up its society. This neglect turned deadly in the case of Afghanistan. Walking away from that fractured country after 1989 resulted in the rise of bin Laden and the Taliban. This is not the gravest error a great power can make, but it is a common American one. As F. Scott Fitzgerald explained of his characters in “The Great Gatsby,” “They were careless people, Tom and Daisy–they smashed things up and creatures and then retreated back into their money, or their vast carelessness… and let other people clean up the mess.” America has not been venal in the Arab world. But it has been careless.

Yet carelessness is not enough to explain Arab rage. After all, if concern for the Palestinians is at the heart of the problem, why have their Arab brethren done nothing for them? (They cannot resettle in any Arab nation but Jordan, and the aid they receive from the gulf states is minuscule.) Israel treats its 1 million Arabs as second-class citizens, a disgrace on its democracy. And yet the tragedy of the Arab world is that Israel accords them more political rights and dignities than most Arab nations give to their own people. Why is the focus of Arab anger on Israel and not those regimes?

The disproportionate feelings of grievance directed at America have to be placed in the overall context of the sense of humiliation, decline and despair that sweeps the Arab world. After all, the Chinese vigorously disagree with most of America’s foreign policy and have fought wars with U.S. proxies. African states feel the same sense of disappointment and unfairness. But they do not work it into a rage against America. Arabs, however, feel that they are under siege from the modern world and that the United States symbolizes this world. Thus every action America takes gets magnified a thousandfold. And even when we do not act, the rumors of our gigantic powers and nefarious deeds still spread.

Most Americans would not believe how common the rumor is throughout the Arab world that either the CIA or Israel’s Mossad blew up the World Trade Center to justify attacks on Arabs and Muslims. This is the culture from which the suicide bombers have come.

America must now devise a strategy to deal with this form of religious terrorism. As is now widely understood, this will be a long war, with many fronts and battles small and large. Our strategy must be divided along three lines: military, political and cultural. On the military front–by which I mean war, covert operations and other forms of coercion–the goal is simple: the total destruction of Al Qaeda. Even if we never understand all the causes of apocalyptic terror, we must do battle against it. Every person who plans and helps in a terrorist operation must understand that he will be tracked and punished. Their operations will be disrupted, their finances drained, their hideouts destroyed. There will be associated costs to pursuing such a strategy, but they will all fade if we succeed. Nothing else matters on the military front.

The political strategy is more complex and more ambitious. At the broadest level, we now have a chance to reorder the international system around this pressing new danger. The degree of cooperation from around the world has been unprecedented. We should not look on this trend suspiciously. Most governments feel threatened by the rise of subnational forces like Al Qaeda. Even some that have clearly supported terrorism in the past, like Iran, seem interested in re-entering the world community and reforming their ways.

We can define a strategy for the post-cold-war era that addresses America’s principal national-security need and yet is sustained by a broad international consensus. To do this we will have to give up some cold-war reflexes, such as an allergy to multilateralism, and stop insisting that China is about to rival us militarily or that Russia is likely to re-emerge as a new military threat. (For 10 years now, our defense forces have been aligned for everything but the real danger we face. This will inevitably change.)

The purpose of an international coalition is practical and strategic. Given the nature of this war, we will need the constant cooperation of other governments–to make arrests, shut down safe houses, close bank accounts and share intelligence. Alliance politics has become a matter of high national security. But there is a broader imperative. The United States dominates the world in a way that inevitably arouses envy or anger or opposition. That comes with the power, but we still need to get things done. If we can mask our power in–sorry, work with–institutions like the United Nations Security Council, U.S. might will be easier for much of the world to bear. Bush’s father understood this, which is why he ensured that the United Nations sanctioned the gulf war. The point here is to succeed, and international legitimacy can help us do that.

Now we get to Israel. It is obviously one of the central and most charged problems in the region. But it is a problem to which we cannot offer the Arab world support for its solution–the extinction of the state. We cannot in any way weaken our commitment to the existence and health of Israel. Similarly, we cannot abandon our policy of containing Saddam Hussein. He is building weapons of mass destruction.

However, we should not pursue mistaken policies simply out of spite. Our policy toward Saddam is broken. We have no inspectors in Iraq, the sanctions are–for whatever reason–starving Iraqis and he continues to build chemical and biological weapons. There is a way to reorient our policy to focus our pressure on Saddam and not his people, contain him militarily but not harm common Iraqis economically. Colin Powell has been trying to do this; he should be given leeway to try again. In time we will have to address the broader question of what to do about Saddam, a question that, unfortunately, does not have an easy answer. (Occupying Iraq, even if we could do it, does not seem a good idea in this climate.)

On Israel we should make a clear distinction between its right to exist and its occupation of the West Bank and Gaza. On the first we should be as unyielding as ever; on the second we should continue trying to construct a final deal along the lines that Bill Clinton and Ehud Barak outlined. I suggest that we do this less because it will lower the temperature in the Arab world–who knows if it will?–than because it’s the right thing to do. Israel cannot remain a democracy and continue to occupy and militarily rule 3 million people against their wishes. It’s bad for Israel, bad for the Palestinians and bad for the United States.

But policy changes, large or small, are not at the heart of the struggle we face. The third, vital component to this battle is a cultural strategy. The United States must help Islam enter the modern world. It sounds like an impossible challenge, and it certainly is not one we would have chosen. But America–indeed the whole world–faces a dire security threat that will not be resolved unless we can stop the political, economic and cultural collapse that lies at the roots of Arab rage. During the cold war the West employed myriad ideological strategies to discredit the appeal of communism, make democracy seem attractive and promote open societies. We will have to do something on that scale to win this cultural struggle.

First, we have to help moderate Arab states, but on the condition that they embrace moderation. For too long regimes like Saudi Arabia’s have engaged in a deadly dance with religious extremism. Even Egypt, which has always denounced fundamentalism, allows its controlled media to rant crazily about America and Israel. (That way they don’t rant about the dictatorship they live under.) But more broadly, we must persuade Arab moderates to make the case to their people that Islam is compatible with modern society, that it does allow women to work, that it encourages education and that it has welcomed people of other faiths and creeds.

Some of this they will do–Sept. 11 has been a wake-up call for many. The Saudi regime denounced and broke its ties to the Taliban (a regime that it used to glorify as representing pure Islam). The Egyptian press is now making the case for military action. The United States and the West should do their own work as well. We can fund moderate Muslim groups and scholars and broadcast fresh thinking across the Arab world, all aimed at breaking the power of the fundamentalists.

Obviously we will have to help construct a new political order in Afghanistan after we have deposed the Taliban regime. But beyond that we have to press the nations of the Arab world–and others, like Pakistan, where the virus of fundamentalism has spread–to reform, open up and gain legitimacy. We need to do business with these regimes; yet, just as we did with South Korea and Taiwan during the cold war, we can ally with these dictatorships and still push them toward reform. For those who argue that we should not engage in nation-building, I would say foreign policy is not theology. I have myself been skeptical of nation-building in places where our interests were unclear and it seemed unlikely that we would stay the course. In this case, stable political development is the key to reducing our single greatest security threat. We have no option but to get back into the nation-building business.

It sounds like a daunting challenge, but there are many good signs. Al Qaeda is not more powerful than the combined force of many determined governments. The world is indeed uniting around American leadership, and perhaps we will see the emergence, for a while, of a new global community and consensus, which could bring progress in many other areas of international life. Perhaps most important, Islamic fundamentalism still does not speak to the majority of the Muslim people. In Pakistan, fundamentalist parties have yet to get more than 10 percent of the vote. In Iran, having experienced the brutal puritanism of the mullahs, people are yearning for normalcy. In Egypt, for all the repression, the fundamentalists are a potent force but so far not dominant. If the West can help Islam enter modernity in dignity and peace, it will have done more than achieved security. It will have changed the world.

[quote]Marmadogg wrote:
Orbitalboner wrote:
Marmadogg wrote:

Very good points but wishing for something that will never happen is immature.

It is time we invaded Saudi Arabia, take their resources and erase Wahabism in that country and go from there.

LOL, yeah that’s much more feasible.

Tell me how it isn’t?

Another hoser with a sarcastic comment.

Either way you are along for the ride.

[/quote]

I’m not sure if you’re aware of this, but you can’t just randomly invade any country of your choosing, let alone invade AND steal their resources, on which much of the world depends.

[quote]JeffR wrote:
wmd wrote:
Thanks JeffR for confirming my belief that one of you GOPs would drop a nasty.

“I left Colin Powell out because he actually served his country. Do look up Wolfowitz, please.”

I did. You are right, he didn’t serve.

“Bush senior fought, but not little W. He managed to avoid his tour in Vietnam.”

Ok, pal. One of the limitations of the internet is that we have to be very precise or we will be misunderstood.

Let’s be quite clear. Did everyone who joined the National Guard during any War deserve the label of “coward” or “manage to avoid” the war?

If avoiding the War was the number one reason for entering the guard, why not fly a desk?

“Sorry on Rummy, I meant to write Ashcroft. And Mr. Cheney found ways to be absent.”

Did you vote for bill clinton? I hate to ask a question for a second time. Let’s be sure we answer all questions the first time around. If not, we are just being rude.

“However Rumsfeld still hasn’t been to war. And I do believe that actually fighting in a war, you know bullets whizzing past your head and watching friends get blown to bits will definitely affect one’s willingness to go to war without doing a lot of careful consideration.”

Perhaps. But, there are definetly more combat veterans who agreed 100% with invading Iraq. If you are who you say you are, ask them for me.

“And JeffR, hows about actually addressing some of the other points I made as opposed to defending the guys you voted for who are sending people into harms way without sufficient armor or ammunition or heck, even enough manpower to do the job and then considering opening up a couple of other fronts.”

Again, I’m having a hard time believing you are who you say you are. This sort of 20/20 hindsight seems rather uninformed. I know there has been military criticism, but it definetly has had a political flavor. You state it as a fact. Curious.

“I’ll send Rummy an apology for calling him a coward as soon as he apologizes for that.”

Reasonably, scratch that, very small of you.

“No I didn’t fly jet fighters. I was in the Army Intel. Good enough for you?”

Interesting that you were in “intel” when you seem no more informed about the bios of the decision makers than the average moveon.org reader.

Interesting.

“What did you do?”

I am not nor have I been in the military.

I flatter myself that I do one or two important things as a civilian that put me in harms’ way. I serve the public.

JeffR

[/quote]

JeffR,

You are a hoot, dude. You really take this stuff to the personal level quick don’t you?

Of course you doubt who I say I am, I’m not one of your Ditto-head friends. And apparently you know very little regarding the duties of military intelligence. We monitor the enemy, silly, not our ostensible leaders. We leave that job to the FBI and CIA and other covert groups. I supervised a collection and jamming platoon and later served as a battalion level S2. I will tell you more about it as soon as the army declassifies those missions and/or you show me your TS/SBI clearance.

And on that note, how do I know you even exist? Or if you are not some 14 year old shitbird with nothing better to do than insult people over the internet? The fact of the matter is, we really don’t know who anybody is on an internet forum, right? So why don’t you just get over it, okay man? It seems you keep making assaults upon my credibility so you don’t have to address W’s lack of service in the Vietnam War yet his enthusiasm for sending other peoples kids to Iraq. Rather you just go straight to attacking anyone who doesn’t share your enchantment with Bush and his cronies.

And Jeff I didn’t answer your question regarding who I voted for because it really isn’t any of your business. That’s sort of why we have secret balloting. I found the question presumptuous and inappropriate. But just to further this discussion, I did not vote for Bill Clinton. You can make any assumptions you want regarding who I did vote for. If what you are curious about are my political leanings, I am neither a democrat nor a republican as I find both parties pretty contemptible. The Dems lack backbone and the Republicans are bullies who cater way to much to the religious right. Niether party has offered up a candidate worth voting for in years, IMO.

[quote]
Let’s be quite clear. Did everyone who joined the National Guard during any War deserve the label of “coward” or “manage to avoid” the war?[/quote]

Nope, only those who are now willing and in a position to send other peoples kids to die and be maimed. Something they themselves weren’t willing to do. And as to why not fly a desk, I bet that’s not half as much fun or laden with manliness as flying a plane, eh?

What exactly is uninformed about it? The part where I assume that a military commander would make sure his troops had all the equipment needed to conduct a war or the part where having enough manpower on the ground is a necessity? How is that 20/20 hindsight except on the part of the architects of this war? I think you don’t know much about being a military commander.

One of the most basic, important courses taught in the ROTC is supply and logistics. Soldiers can’t fight without proper equipment and support. And what is the political flavor of those soldiers and unit commanders who have come out saying “Hey we don’t have what we need here.”? I mean do a google search on it. I know quite a few veterans who were for the war at first and are now not so sure because of exactly this issue. My university paper has an on going feature where guys who are/were in the ROTC here send letters back to us. Maybe it’s just their particular units but they seems less than enthused about their purported missions now, than they were when the war started because they can’t even complete their patrols for lack of ammunition. Whose lack of foresight is that?

[quote]“I’ll send Rummy an apology for calling him a coward as soon as he apologizes for that.”

Reasonably, scratch that, very small of you.[/quote]

How so exactly? Are we no longer allowed to hold our leaders responsible for their incompetence, especially when it gets people killed? I think he and Bush and Cheney, et al, owe a lot of parents apologies. Not to mention the apology they owe the American people. But please continue your attempts to sieze the moral high ground. All that heavenly backlighting makes you an excellent target.

WMD

PC run amok…

BBC edits out the word terrorist
By Tom Leonard
(Filed: 12/07/2005)

The BBC has re-edited some of its coverage of the London Underground and bus bombings to avoid labelling the perpetrators as “terrorists”, it was disclosed yesterday.

Early reporting of the attacks on the BBC’s website spoke of terrorists but the same coverage was changed to describe the attackers simply as “bombers”.

The BBC’s guidelines state that its credibility is undermined by the “careless use of words which carry emotional or value judgments”.

Consequently, “the word ‘terrorist’ itself can be a barrier rather than an aid to understanding” and its use should be “avoided”, the guidelines say.

Rod Liddle, a former editor of the Today programme, has accused the BBC of “institutionalised political correctness” in its coverage of British Muslims.

A BBC spokesman said last night: “The word terrorist is not banned from the BBC.”

[quote]redswingline wrote:
PC run amok…

BBC edits out the word terrorist
By Tom Leonard
(Filed: 12/07/2005)

The BBC has re-edited some of its coverage of the London Underground and bus bombings to avoid labelling the perpetrators as “terrorists”, it was disclosed yesterday.

Early reporting of the attacks on the BBC’s website spoke of terrorists but the same coverage was changed to describe the attackers simply as “bombers”.

The BBC’s guidelines state that its credibility is undermined by the “careless use of words which carry emotional or value judgments”.

Consequently, “the word ‘terrorist’ itself can be a barrier rather than an aid to understanding” and its use should be “avoided”, the guidelines say.

Rod Liddle, a former editor of the Today programme, has accused the BBC of “institutionalised political correctness” in its coverage of British Muslims.

A BBC spokesman said last night: “The word terrorist is not banned from the BBC.”
[/quote]

The intent of their action was not simply to bomb. The intent of their action was to kill.

Perhaps “murderers” is a better description.

Londoners used the public transportation system more then usual this week, according to reports I have seen.

Seems like the terrorists didn’t accomplish much in the way of terrorizing either.

wMD wrote:

JeffR,

“You are a hoot, dude. You really take this stuff to the personal level quick don’t you?”

It’s important in these discussion to understand the context from which a person argues. For instance, if you deride W. as a “coward” and you voted for bill “I’m not reporting for duty” clinton, then you are a total hypocrite. That is the purpose for asking these personal questions. It helps establish if you are a “bread and butter” anybody but Bush clown.

“Of course you doubt who I say I am, I’m not one of your Ditto-head friends.”

You do know, of course, that many of my so called “ditto-head” friends are either serving in the military or have bravely served.

“And apparently you know very little regarding the duties of military intelligence.”

You are correct, I am not nearly as well versed in it as you are. It does seem strange that someone who was in “intel” wouldn’t look up information before calling a former military man a “coward.”

“We monitor the enemy, silly, not our ostensible leaders. We leave that job to the FBI and CIA and other covert groups. I supervised a collection and jamming platoon and later served as a battalion level S2. I will tell you more about it as soon as the army declassifies those missions and/or you show me your TS/SBI clearance.”

I’d be very interested when that time comes.

“And on that note, how do I know you even exist? Or if you are not some 14 year old shitbird with nothing better to do than insult people over the internet?”

Some other people like to insult my intelligence. They usually acknowledge their error. Hard to be 14 and do my job, by the way.

“The fact of the matter is, we really don’t know who anybody is on an internet forum, right? So why don’t you just get over it, okay man? It seems you keep making assaults upon my credibility so you don’t have to address W’s lack of service in the Vietnam War yet his enthusiasm for sending other peoples kids to Iraq. Rather you just go straight to attacking anyone who doesn’t share your enchantment with Bush and his cronies.”

Your opinion of his service needs some re-adjustment (in MY opinion). I’m not big into so-called military men calling other military men “cowards.” Most especially when the person doing the calling may or may not have been exposed to personal danger. It seems reckless to make that sort of assertion. I think you are off about me “dodging” issues. My liberal pals would probably grudgingly agree that I address each issue. They don’t like my responses, but, there it is.

“And Jeff I didn’t answer your question regarding who I voted for because it really isn’t any of your business. That’s sort of why we have secret balloting. I found the question presumptuous and inappropriate.”

See above. Context.

“But just to further this discussion, I did not vote for Bill Clinton. You can make any assumptions you want regarding who I did vote for. If what you are curious about are my political leanings, I am neither a democrat nor a republican as I find both parties pretty contemptible. The Dems lack backbone and the Republicans are bullies who cater way to much to the religious right. Niether party has offered up a candidate worth voting for in years, IMO.”

Do you consider yourself a “paleo-conservative?”

“Nope, only those who are now willing and in a position to send other peoples kids to die and be maimed. Something they themselves weren’t willing to do.”

Interesting. Seems like there are plenty of military men around W. who agreed with his stance.

“And as to why not fly a desk, I bet that’s not half as much fun or laden with manliness as flying a plane, eh?”

You’re going to have to make up your mind. Is he a “coward” or a “man.” Interesting debating style.

“What exactly is uninformed about it? The part where I assume that a military commander would make sure his troops had all the equipment needed to conduct a war or the part where having enough manpower on the ground is a necessity? How is that 20/20 hindsight except on the part of the architects of this war? I think you don’t know much about being a military commander.”

You do know, of course, that this issue has been discussed over and over at the highest levels? Right? It’s a constant re-assessment and W. has been quite clear about deferring to the military commanders on the ground. Too many troops=real occupation/more casualties/more targets/more cost of the operation. It’s a delicate balance, wouldn’t you say, Mr. Sun Tzu?

“One of the most basic, important courses taught in the ROTC is supply and logistics. Soldiers can’t fight without proper equipment and support. And what is the political flavor of those soldiers and unit commanders who have come out saying “Hey we don’t have what we need here.”? I mean do a google search on it. I know quite a few veterans who were for the war at first and are now not so sure because of exactly this issue. My university paper has an on going feature where guys who are/were in the ROTC here send letters back to us. Maybe it’s just their particular units but they seems less than enthused about their purported missions now, than they were when the war started because they can’t even complete their patrols for lack of ammunition. Whose lack of foresight is that?”

Thanks for the anectodal information. I’d be happy to produce an avalanche of info. refuting that statement.

“How so exactly? Are we no longer allowed to hold our leaders responsible for their incompetence, especially when it gets people killed? I think he and Bush and Cheney, et al, owe a lot of parents apologies. Not to mention the apology they owe the American people. But please continue your attempts to sieze the moral high ground. All that heavenly backlighting makes you an excellent target.”

Good luck bringing me down!!!

The incompetence thing is a very serious charge. You haven’t convinced me. Keep at it.

JeffR

Jerffy,

You take a little bit too much pride in your profession…

I’m big, I’m tough, I serve.

You have a job. You get paid to do it. Stop trying to elevate yourself into a tough-guy hero. This is the Internet. You come across like a clown.

WMD, get ready bro, now jerkky is going to bring it to your attention that he is a super anti-terrorist cop and then ask you what you think of cops, insinuate that cops will beat you up ad nauseam and then his alter ego creamsy will make an impromptu appearance to play the bad cop.

creamsy will then make snide remarks regarding your military service and try to bully you with his self description (thought no one has seen proof of this) that he is seven foot tall at a rock hard 280 pounds of solid muscle.

It has come to the conclusion of most rationale minded people on this forum that jerkky is mentally ill and deserves our sympathy, but not any serious consideration as a reasonable person mentally capable of rationale debate.

e-hater wrote:

“WMD, get ready bro, now jerkky is going to bring it to your attention that he is a super anti-terrorist cop and then ask you what you think of cops,”

Oh, my pal has arisen!!! You know full well that the only reason that we have ever had this discussion is that you have constantly stated that people who support this war and are not in the military are cowards and hypocrites. My contention has always been that there are some people who support this war that are neither. In fact, there are professions that actually aid us in this effort that deserve much more than your nasty, ill-informed drivel.

“insinuate that cops will beat you up ad nauseam and then his alter ego creamsy will make an impromptu appearance to play the bad cop.”

As you are well aware, I have asked you repeatedly to go down to your local precint and make your speech. Say (hopefully there will be a 9/11 survivor or relative present) that
if you support this war and you are still at home that you are afraid and hypocritical. Tell them that they aren’t “man enough.”

See what happens.

“creamsy will then make snide remarks regarding your military service and try to bully you with his self description (thought no one has seen proof of this) that he is seven foot tall at a rock hard 280 pounds of solid muscle.”

Wait a minute, aren’t I Cream? The voices are very confused.

Seriously, I remember quite clearly Cream discussing his military service and you went dead silent. It was a beautiful moment.

I do hope you aren’t including me in the physique commentary.

“It has come to the conclusion of most rationale minded people on this forum that jerkky is mentally ill and deserves our sympathy, but not any serious consideration as a reasonable person mentally capable of rationale debate.”

Good old e!!! I love when you get nasty. I tingle.

Damn it, e. If you hadn’t gone off on your Anti-Cop tirade, we could actually have had some good discussions. Unfortunately, you’ve gone way to far with your scorched earth policy. You’ve insulted an entire class of very brave public servants. I remember pictures of my brothers in the WTC on 9/11 giving their lives. It makes me very ANGRY to have some snot-nose punk running his trap about their “lack of courage.” I hope none of their families read your ill-informed horseshit.

JeffR

Jerffy, every time I pass the donut shop and I see all your fat ass brethren chowing down, I think of you and your service and bravery.

Thanks man… if it wasn’t for you and your ilk, I’d have to eat those donuts myself!!! I owe you one.

You take yourself and your profession far too seriously.

I would think this bombing has more in common with the Spanish train attack than what some people are supposing - namely the G8 summit. Al queda took advantage of an up and coming election in Spain. The spanish public was against their country’s (mostly symbolic) support of the U.S. invasion of Iraq. They realized that their leaders were endangering them in the name of so-called national security. That government was thrown out of office and a new one elected which pulled the troops out of Iraq. This, I believe was the goal of Al queda and they succeded.

I think that Al queda is reaching for the same goal in Britan as they are the only ones who are providing more than symbolic support for this globally very unpopular war effort. Despite British governments support of the war it has never been popular with the citizens and has recently become even more aggravated by the damning Downing street memos. If Britan pulled troops it would be a major coup for Al queda.

It is always a terrible moral crime when non-combatants are killed. Spain and now possibly Britan are learning the fate of supporting an interventionist foreign policy. The citizens of this counrty essentially don’t have a honest picture of what is going on due to the massive and effective propaganda campaign that has been going on ever since 9/11. Alot of people still believe the redderick of the Bush Administration that says they attacked us because we are “free” instead of truly looking at the history of the U.S. governments profligate meddling in the affairs of other countries.

We are actually less free because of our foreign policy. All the extra security to gaurd against terrorist blowback chips away at our freedoms.

Very sad.

jerffy, I am slightly befuddled as to why I am even bothering answering you, but I do feel that your hijacking of the police force of the entire U.S. needs to be addressed.

I have one good friend who is a detective for the Colo Springs, Sheriffs Dept. One that is a detective for the Colo Springs, Police Dept. One who is a patrol officer for the Colorado Springs, Police Dept. another who is a patrol officer for the Pueblo, Colo. Police Dept. and another who is a lieutenant on the SORT team for the Colo. Dept. of Corrections.

They are all aware of my views regarding this war and some of them even agree with me. None of them have pulled out their weapons and pistol whipped me because of my views.

You know why? Because even if they disagree they are rationale minded professional adults who don’t owe their entire identity to GWB or Iraq.

That’s what make me question your claims and your state of mental health. You seem like one who in you irrational love of GWB would go to any lengths or make up any story to push your warped agenda.

I sincerely hope JeffR, you receive the help you need!

e,

I’ll bet you that you haven’t made the comments about lack of courage, hypocrisy, etc… to your friends.

Correct?

Please read to them verbatim what you have said.

My contention: You wouldn’t make these comments to people to their face. Why make them here?

JeffR