Linear Progression be Ran with Higher Reps?

Bigger Stronger Leaner
1

Hey guys,

My first thread on here a few weeks back was about me being quite overweight (210-215 lbs around 35-40% bodyfat)

I have been working on my mobility and focusing on diet to lose weight. I was following a paleo stytle diet that worked for awhile then I just started counting my calories and eating a wider range of food, I am steadily losing weight at a reasonable weight.

My mobility is getting slightly better too which is somehting i am really happy about.

I was planning on running SS once I had the mobility to low bar squat and had some coaching on the other lifts, primarily power cleans.

I am starting to rethink my plan on running SS for a few reasons.

  1. I have no plans to be a powerlifter or competing in a strength based sport. I am just hoping to get fitter and more athletic and add some nice muscle to my frame once I have lost a bit more weight.

I want to have decent run times, decent numbers on the major lifts and the ability to handle my own bodyweight through calisthenics. I am also looking for good mobility.

I would say my goals would be in this order, number one being most important:

  1. Strength (250lb bench / 180lb press / 400lb squat / 500lb deadlift)
  2. Conditioning ( sub 20 minute 3 mile / sub 31 minute 6 mile)
  3. Calisthenics ( 100 pressups / 25 dips / 20 chinups / 50 hanging ab raises)
  4. Mobility ( completely remove all serious mobility issues in hips, shoulders, calves ankles etc)

I have no real reason to focus on any of these as I have no goals in any one that supersede my goals for the others, I might have priorities and goals that I deem more important but that is because I would view gaining the level of strength (not stong in powerlifting terms) I am after as ahrder than getting a sub 31 minute 6 mile time, which I have had in the past.

I was wondering how a linear program based on 3 sets of 10 could go, something like this.

A
High bar squat 3x10
Bench press 3x10
Chinups 3x10 assisted

B
Deadlift 1x10
Press 3x10
Chinups 3x10 assisted

C.
High bar squat 3x10
Bench press 3x10
Chinups 3x10 assisted

These goals are not immediate goals but ones i hope to reach over the coming 3-5 years.

I am probably sitting at around 200lbs and 35& bodyfat now. I would like to know what people think, I am not aiming to be a powerlifter or an advanced runner but rather just have dencent levels of all aspects of fitness.

I am open to any advice. I am making progress with my current stretching routine and diet in terms of weight loss and mobility adnw ant to make sure I am on the right program before I get started.

2

[quote]ScholesGoals wrote:
I am starting to rethink my plan on running SS for a few reasons.

  1. I have no plans to be a powerlifter or competing in a strength based sport. I am just hoping to get fitter and more athletic and add some nice muscle to my frame once I have lost a bit more weight.

[/quote]

If I go play football with my friends, should I let them know I have no plans of becoming a professional football player?

If I go for a jog, should I conclude that I don’t want to be a marathon runner - and never jog again?

SS is a great program. You don’t need any excuses to bail on it.
No one went into it as a novice and came out as a powerlifter, and if the diet was correct then anybody who did SS came out fitter/stronger/slimmer, just like you want.

3

Linear progression won’t work with a higher volume routine. You are better off doing what I call “set progression” which I learned from my time doing German Volume Training. Basically it works like this:

  1. Find your 1 rep max on the lifts you want to advance
  2. start at 60% of this value
  3. Work up to 8x8 or 10x10 in 4-6 weeks with this weight.
  4. Religiously time your rest periods to about 1 to 2:00 depending on your goals (strength longer rest periods with higher percentages or endurance with lower percentages shorter rest)
  5. If you find you are no longer making progress, take a week off and adjust sets/reps/rest then continue for another 4-6 weeks.

2 exercises per session max, as this routine will beat you up good.

4

OP, this is just something that I want to add:

If you don’t have the (ankle and hip) mobility to low bar squat, do box squats. Put a bench under your ass, and sit down on it with the weight on your traps. I do this olympic style (I break at the knees), works great for me.

5

you could do 5/3/1 instead. It’s got low rep and high rep stuff.

6

Or you could do the real sensible thing and do Starting Strength way it is programmed so you actually progress and then do Cardio/Conditioning on your off days. 3 days Strength, 2 days conditioning, 1 day long cardio, 1 day is a perfect set up. Stop making stuff so complicated.

7

don’t do that OP, i’ve seen people do linear routine on higher reps, and they tend to stall much faster. I’d recommend you still do a linear progression routine, your get faster results in size and strength on one. You can still SS but do it in sets of 5. Or there Stronglifts, ICF 5x5. any linear beginners fullbody routine will work

8

I still think if the OPs goal is to lose weight he should focus on higher volume and shorter rest periods, then convert to something strength oriented. SS SL5x5 are good but I think are overrated, especially 5x5 since Mehdi makes a bunch of bullshit claims (apparently the number of reps you can do a pull up is independent of your body weight, for example). They also provide a false sense of how to progress once you have stalled. Personally, the first time I stalled on a linear progression method I had no idea what the fuck to do and wasted time trying to follow that “deload 10%” bull, because it does not work for everybody and has never worked for me.

Not to mention a high volume routine will build work capacity which will give you a surprising ability to push yourself when it comes time to lift heavier weights! I can attest to this one, I was following GVT using only around 155lbs for the bench (1 min rest/set), the hauled off and pressed 205 for 8 sets with 2 minutes rest between sets like it was nothing.

9

Hey guys.

I get what most of you are saying, my problem is still the low bar squat. If I post some videos up on here could I get some form critiques in the thread?

10

Whatever your long term goals are, you still need to start with the basics like everybody else.

Any program you decide to do should allow you to focus on:

  1. Technique
  2. Progressive resistance

Eventually, you may realise you have much potential or actually develope a love for this and run to sign up for your first competition after hitting your first 315lb squat after a couple of months.

11

[quote]Reed wrote:
Or you could do the real sensible thing and do Starting Strength way it is programmed so you actually progress and then do Cardio/Conditioning on your off days. 3 days Strength, 2 days conditioning, 1 day long cardio, 1 day is a perfect set up. Stop making stuff so complicated.[/quote]

You’re the man. OP, here’s your answer.

12

Holy shit I feel like such a dumb motherfucker!,

I was squatting tonight at the gym trying to go over form again seeing if I could fix anything and warming up I tried to exagerate everything, I exagerated the knees out and sitting back and I felt comfortable hitting depth and felt the hamstring stretch because of focusing on exagerating the hip drive.

I am going to get my mate to come film me this week and hopefully I can start the novice program if I get some approval form wise :slight_smile:

I pushed my knees life a full foot wider and everything just clicked.

13

If your goals are as you listed them, then I’m not sure why you would want to change your rep scheme.

Have you tried doing a 10 rep deadlift set (pretty sure both programs advise against touch and go style) ? Especially after squatting.

14

[quote]tsantos wrote:
If your goals are as you listed them, then I’m not sure why you would want to change your rep scheme.

Have you tried doing a 10 rep deadlift set (pretty sure both programs advise against touch and go style) ? Especially after squatting.[/quote]

Hey man,

My wish to change the program was because I until tonight (hopefully I have now got some progress in form) could not squat low bar. I did not want to do a linear program like SS without having a good grasp on form and mobility.

Now that I may have a good idea of form I will probably take reed’s advice and run SS. I will be posting form in a few days and if I get positive feedback will start my training in the way I orignially intendedbefore I concocted this mongrel idea out of sheer self pitty and frustration at not getting form through what i thought was lack of mobility.

If all is well with form and mobility, from august 1st I will run quite a long chain that I had already planned out.

3-6 months of starting strength until I start to regularly stall - recomp on 2500-3000 calories high protein diet, won’t worry too much about losing weight if I am going to run a linear program.

3-6 months greyskull LP which I see reccomended alot on the SS website by people for those who start to constantly stall. Adds AMRAP set and throws in isolation work.

After this I will probably look to jump onto something that I can use for years to take me from novice through to intermideate and advanced intermediate. I like the look of 5/3/1.

oNCE i AM ON 5/3/1 i will start to add in conditioning work and can then really start to worry about my body composition.

I have a cousin in Austrailia who ran SS and from talking to him he finished SS with a 375lb squat, 255lb bench and a 485lb deadlift, I don’t recall his press or clean numbers.

He didn’t run greyskull he did something called the texas methoad and once he had ran that for awhile he jumped on 5/3/1.

I think he now has a 500+ squat, his bench is in the mid/high 300’s and his press is bodyweight or just above. He pulls well over 600lbs which I find really impressive because like me he has quite short arms and long legs.

Hopefully when he comes to visit family next year I can get sometraining with him which would be great, some one on one help probably goes a long way.

I plan on following his path becuase knowing he has had great success with it and has gone from never lifting about 3 years ago to being one of the strongest people I know is something that makes me believe I can do it too.

Sorry about this whiney thread guys I was just having a bit of a pitty party and looking for what I wanted to hear.

After all these past few working on mobility and just having no look with the form all it took was exagerating the cues to realise my alck of depth and lack of ability to keep thoracic extension was due to my knees being too far in making me round my back and move the bar from the center of my feet increasing the moment arm.

15

Focus on getting your bodyfat down to reasonable levels first.

16

What you should get from your cousin’s experience is consistency.

Milk SS, then move to an appropriate program for your goals.

17

[quote]dt79 wrote:
Focus on getting your bodyfat down to reasonable levels first.[/quote]

How on a linear program, you can’t do SS on a defecit, for those whop are over 20% bodyfat coach rip reccomends around 3500ish calories on a paleoish diet.

all the ss coaches and rip say to do ss you have to be eating a fair bit.

18

[quote]ScholesGoals wrote:

[quote]dt79 wrote:
Focus on getting your bodyfat down to reasonable levels first.[/quote]

How on a linear program, you can’t do SS on a defecit, for those whop are over 20% bodyfat coach rip reccomends around 3500ish calories on a paleoish diet.

all the ss coaches and rip say to do ss you have to be eating a fair bit.[/quote]

You should check out twojarslave’s log and ask him about this. He would be the best person to give advice on this.

19

[quote]dt79 wrote:

[quote]ScholesGoals wrote:

[quote]dt79 wrote:
Focus on getting your bodyfat down to reasonable levels first.[/quote]

How on a linear program, you can’t do SS on a defecit, for those whop are over 20% bodyfat coach rip reccomends around 3500ish calories on a paleoish diet.

all the ss coaches and rip say to do ss you have to be eating a fair bit.[/quote]

You should check out twojarslave’s log and ask him about this. He would be the best person to give advice on this.
[/quote]

That’s flattering, but I am NOT the best person to give advice to on losing fat. Now, if you want to know about half-assing your diet all summer and getting stronger on a sub-optimal exercise selection, I’m your guy.

Back to the OP’s conundrum, I will second what Reed has suggested. Keep it simple, work hard and reap the benefits. Will you be able to ride Starting Strength to a 315 lb bench, 405 squat and 495 deadlift AND 10% bodyfat? Maybe, but probably not. You WILL be able to ride it a LONG way if you put in the work, and it is a great program for you at your stage.

Best of luck to you, and never quit. You’ll do great.

20

[quote]twojarslave wrote:

[quote]dt79 wrote:

[quote]ScholesGoals wrote:

[quote]dt79 wrote:
Focus on getting your bodyfat down to reasonable levels first.[/quote]

How on a linear program, you can’t do SS on a defecit, for those whop are over 20% bodyfat coach rip reccomends around 3500ish calories on a paleoish diet.

all the ss coaches and rip say to do ss you have to be eating a fair bit.[/quote]

You should check out twojarslave’s log and ask him about this. He would be the best person to give advice on this.
[/quote]

That’s flattering, but I am NOT the best person to give advice to on losing fat. Now, if you want to know about half-assing your diet all summer and getting stronger on a sub-optimal exercise selection, I’m your guy.

Back to the OP’s conundrum, I will second what Reed has suggested. Keep it simple, work hard and reap the benefits. Will you be able to ride Starting Strength to a 315 lb bench, 405 squat and 495 deadlift AND 10% bodyfat? Maybe, but probably not. You WILL be able to ride it a LONG way if you put in the work, and it is a great program for you at your stage.

Best of luck to you, and never quit. You’ll do great.[/quote]

Only way you could be cooler is if you liked Hunter S Thompson.