Let's Talk South Carolina

Off Topic Politics & World Issues
221

[quote]ZEB wrote:

[quote]Mufasa wrote:
An interesting insight that I read on Romney (Comparing him to Kerry of 2004; follow me now!)

Kerry’s whole “narrative” was of being the decorated Vietnam Vet, who risk his lives for his men. It actually formed the “appeal” for him as a candidate and became the central focus of his campaign.

Once that “narrative” was attacked and brought back “down to earth”; his campaign floundered and he never recovered. The central “theme” of his campaign was taken away, essentially not leaving him with much.

Now Romney. He is positioning himself as a “job creator” with business experience that can get this Country back on track. Many feel that he HAS to begin to create a narrative on how a Company like Bain Capital is/was “good” for job creation. If he doesn’t, others will create it for him. (And Newt has shot the first Salvo).

What Venture Capitalist do is often a very complex set of transactions, deals, contracts, etc. It doesn’t lend itself to soundbites. But Romney HAS to begin that discussion, especially explaining how firms that go out of buisness and pensions/retirements are eliminated; yet firms like Bain walk away with millions.

In reality, a lot of these companies were going under whether Bain brought them or not. But if “buisness experience” and “job creation” are his central theme,Romney has to articulate how he did that at Bain…

Or Bain becomes his “Swift Boat”.

Mufasa [/quote]

One HUGE difference, the average failure rate for a new business is about 50% and Romney had a success rate of about 70%. Did he fail on occasion, sure. But did he help create hundreds of thousands of jobs with his success rate? Absolutely!

The Bain argument will soon be a thing of the past as we speak they are working on commercials to point out Romney’s success rate.

There is no comparison between Kerry of 04’ and Romney now. But I do give the democrats (and their little helper Newty boy) credit for attacking him at his strong point. But when all the facts are known they won’t have that.[/quote]

That’s well and good, Zeb, for YOU to express those realities (which I agree with)…but ROMNEY has to begin to express those realities.

Mufasa

222

[quote]Mufasa wrote:

[quote]ZEB wrote:

[quote]Mufasa wrote:
An interesting insight that I read on Romney (Comparing him to Kerry of 2004; follow me now!)

Kerry’s whole “narrative” was of being the decorated Vietnam Vet, who risk his lives for his men. It actually formed the “appeal” for him as a candidate and became the central focus of his campaign.

Once that “narrative” was attacked and brought back “down to earth”; his campaign floundered and he never recovered. The central “theme” of his campaign was taken away, essentially not leaving him with much.

Now Romney. He is positioning himself as a “job creator” with business experience that can get this Country back on track. Many feel that he HAS to begin to create a narrative on how a Company like Bain Capital is/was “good” for job creation. If he doesn’t, others will create it for him. (And Newt has shot the first Salvo).

What Venture Capitalist do is often a very complex set of transactions, deals, contracts, etc. It doesn’t lend itself to soundbites. But Romney HAS to begin that discussion, especially explaining how firms that go out of buisness and pensions/retirements are eliminated; yet firms like Bain walk away with millions.

In reality, a lot of these companies were going under whether Bain brought them or not. But if “buisness experience” and “job creation” are his central theme,Romney has to articulate how he did that at Bain…

Or Bain becomes his “Swift Boat”.

Mufasa [/quote]

One HUGE difference, the average failure rate for a new business is about 50% and Romney had a success rate of about 70%. Did he fail on occasion, sure. But did he help create hundreds of thousands of jobs with his success rate? Absolutely!

The Bain argument will soon be a thing of the past as we speak they are working on commercials to point out Romney’s success rate.

There is no comparison between Kerry of 04’ and Romney now. But I do give the democrats (and their little helper Newty boy) credit for attacking him at his strong point. But when all the facts are known they won’t have that.[/quote]

That’s well and good, Zeb, for YOU to express those realities (which I agree with)…but ROMNEY has to begin to express those realities.

Mufasa[/quote]

Very true, but for a while they were in the sit tight Gingrich won’t go that far mode. Now that they realize that he’s just mean ole’ Newt and will do anything to stop Romney even if it means killing his own chances they a-re going to bring out the heavy artillery early. The facts will be laid bare. But I must say even with all the crap that Newt has thrown Romney still leads in both SC and Fla. I’d say his campaign has some serious legs.

223

[quote]ZEB wrote:

[quote]Sloth wrote:

[quote]ZEB wrote:

[quote]Sloth wrote:
Oof.

…Less than a decade later, the mill was padlocked and some 750 people lost their jobs. Workers were denied the severance pay and health insurance they’d been promised, and their pension benefits were cut by as much as $400 a month.

What’s more, a federal government insurance agency had to pony up $44 million to bail out the company’s underfunded pension plan. Nevertheless, Bain profited on the deal, receiving $12 million on its $8 million initial investment and at least $4.5 million in consulting fees.

PROFITABLE FAILURES

In his campaign for president, Romney has championed free markets and vowed to shrink the role of government. The Republican has argued that his business acumen makes him the best candidate to fix the nation’s economy and bring down the stubbornly high unemployment rate. Romney’s opponents point to his business career as evidence that he is willing to cut jobs and benefits.

The story of Bain’s failed investment in the Kansas City mill offers a perspective on a largely overlooked chapter in Romney’s business record: His firm’s brush with a U.S. bailout.

His supporters say the pension gap at the Kansas City mill was an unforeseen consequence of a falling stock market and adverse market conditions. But records show that the mill’s Bain-backed management was confronted several times about the fund’s shortfall, which, in the end, required an infusion of funds from the federal Pension Benefits Guarantee Corp…

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/01/06/us-campaign-romney-bailout-idUSTRE8050LL20120106[/quote]

LOL…Sloth you are a drama king. What about all the companies that he helped start including Staples? I don’t know of any business person who hits a home run every time. Romney has had his share of failures and far more successes. But you hate him so hey go for it…it’s all good entertainment :)[/quote]

Miss the bail out?[/quote]

We’re tilling old soil again Sloth. As I said at least once, it’s the government that should not be handing out bailouts. It’s not the businesses fault for taking “free money”. Remember the example I gave you? If you and I had a business that was in trouble and the government offered to hand us a huge check we’d be quite happy to take it.

I know you hate the guy but you still have to be consistent.[/quote]

No, I wouldn’t be happy to take it. I’d feel like a scum bag firing everyone off, stripping the company, letting the government bail out the pensions, and then paying off me and my crony capitalist partners millions. Scumbags for using the taxpayer while they made millions. Is Romney going to bail out the employee who can’t make his mortgage?

224

[quote]ZEB wrote:

[quote]Mufasa wrote:

[quote]ZEB wrote:

[quote]Mufasa wrote:
An interesting insight that I read on Romney (Comparing him to Kerry of 2004; follow me now!)

Kerry’s whole “narrative” was of being the decorated Vietnam Vet, who risk his lives for his men. It actually formed the “appeal” for him as a candidate and became the central focus of his campaign.

Once that “narrative” was attacked and brought back “down to earth”; his campaign floundered and he never recovered. The central “theme” of his campaign was taken away, essentially not leaving him with much.

Now Romney. He is positioning himself as a “job creator” with business experience that can get this Country back on track. Many feel that he HAS to begin to create a narrative on how a Company like Bain Capital is/was “good” for job creation. If he doesn’t, others will create it for him. (And Newt has shot the first Salvo).

What Venture Capitalist do is often a very complex set of transactions, deals, contracts, etc. It doesn’t lend itself to soundbites. But Romney HAS to begin that discussion, especially explaining how firms that go out of buisness and pensions/retirements are eliminated; yet firms like Bain walk away with millions.

In reality, a lot of these companies were going under whether Bain brought them or not. But if “buisness experience” and “job creation” are his central theme,Romney has to articulate how he did that at Bain…

Or Bain becomes his “Swift Boat”.

Mufasa [/quote]

One HUGE difference, the average failure rate for a new business is about 50% and Romney had a success rate of about 70%. Did he fail on occasion, sure. But did he help create hundreds of thousands of jobs with his success rate? Absolutely!

The Bain argument will soon be a thing of the past as we speak they are working on commercials to point out Romney’s success rate.

There is no comparison between Kerry of 04’ and Romney now. But I do give the democrats (and their little helper Newty boy) credit for attacking him at his strong point. But when all the facts are known they won’t have that.[/quote]

That’s well and good, Zeb, for YOU to express those realities (which I agree with)…but ROMNEY has to begin to express those realities.

Mufasa[/quote]

Very true, but for a while they were in the sit tight Gingrich won’t go that far mode. Now that they realize that he’s just mean ole’ Newt and will do anything to stop Romney even if it means killing his own chances they a-re going to bring out the heavy artillery early. The facts will be laid bare. But I must say even with all the crap that Newt has thrown Romney still leads in both SC and Fla. I’d say his campaign has some serious legs.[/quote]

Agree.

Again…Romney has to “frame the narrative” on this Bain Capital thing; or his opponents (including the President) will do it for him.

Mufasa

225

[quote]Mufasa wrote:

[quote]ZEB wrote:

[quote]Mufasa wrote:

[quote]ZEB wrote:

[quote]Mufasa wrote:
An interesting insight that I read on Romney (Comparing him to Kerry of 2004; follow me now!)

Kerry’s whole “narrative” was of being the decorated Vietnam Vet, who risk his lives for his men. It actually formed the “appeal” for him as a candidate and became the central focus of his campaign.

Once that “narrative” was attacked and brought back “down to earth”; his campaign floundered and he never recovered. The central “theme” of his campaign was taken away, essentially not leaving him with much.

Now Romney. He is positioning himself as a “job creator” with business experience that can get this Country back on track. Many feel that he HAS to begin to create a narrative on how a Company like Bain Capital is/was “good” for job creation. If he doesn’t, others will create it for him. (And Newt has shot the first Salvo).

What Venture Capitalist do is often a very complex set of transactions, deals, contracts, etc. It doesn’t lend itself to soundbites. But Romney HAS to begin that discussion, especially explaining how firms that go out of buisness and pensions/retirements are eliminated; yet firms like Bain walk away with millions.

In reality, a lot of these companies were going under whether Bain brought them or not. But if “buisness experience” and “job creation” are his central theme,Romney has to articulate how he did that at Bain…

Or Bain becomes his “Swift Boat”.

Mufasa [/quote]

One HUGE difference, the average failure rate for a new business is about 50% and Romney had a success rate of about 70%. Did he fail on occasion, sure. But did he help create hundreds of thousands of jobs with his success rate? Absolutely!

The Bain argument will soon be a thing of the past as we speak they are working on commercials to point out Romney’s success rate.

There is no comparison between Kerry of 04’ and Romney now. But I do give the democrats (and their little helper Newty boy) credit for attacking him at his strong point. But when all the facts are known they won’t have that.[/quote]

That’s well and good, Zeb, for YOU to express those realities (which I agree with)…but ROMNEY has to begin to express those realities.

Mufasa[/quote]

Very true, but for a while they were in the sit tight Gingrich won’t go that far mode. Now that they realize that he’s just mean ole’ Newt and will do anything to stop Romney even if it means killing his own chances they a-re going to bring out the heavy artillery early. The facts will be laid bare. But I must say even with all the crap that Newt has thrown Romney still leads in both SC and Fla. I’d say his campaign has some serious legs.[/quote]

Agree.

Again…Romney has to “frame the narrative” on this Bain Capital thing; or his opponents (including the President) will do it for him.

Mufasa
[/quote]

IMO the Republicans are the only one that have a problem with Romney and Bain. I would like to hear how dividing the business from the real estate and finding cheaper labor equate to creating jobs

226

Pitt:

THAT’S why I think Romney has to “frame the narrative”.

While it’s probably true that with Capitalism “some win/some lose”; that wouldn’t be a very good campaign slogan when people see themselves and others losing jobs,homes,insurance and retirement funds; while there is a candidate who spent millions remodeling just one of his homes.

(NOTE: I have no connection to the “Occupy” movement! Just making an observation!)

Mufasa

227

Also; I don’t think that it’s so much a worry by the opposition; but more something that can become a tough thing for Romney to defend since a major part of his platform is as a “job creator”.

Again; if he doesn’t clearly define what his company did (or didn’t do); his opposition will. (And you can bet that it won’t be positive!)

Ironically, Newt has provided the “blueprint” for attacking Romney’s job creation claims.

Mufasa

228
229

[quote]Mufasa wrote:

Also; I don’t think that it’s so much a worry by the opposition; but more something that can become a tough thing for Romney to defend since a major part of his platform is as a “job creator”.

Again; if he doesn’t clearly define what his company did (or didn’t do); his opposition will. (And you can bet that it won’t be positive!)

Ironically, Newt has provided the “blueprint” for attacking Romney’s job creation claims.

Mufasa[/quote]

Hey I’d vote for Newt over Obama. I’d vote for Santorum over Obama…Hey I’m easy I’d vote for just about any sane person over Obama.

230

After Two Days of Debate, Evangelical Leaders Unite Behind Santorum

Read more: After Two Days of Debate, Evangelical Leaders Unite Behind Santorum | TIME.com

Think this will cause Santorum to become the one “anti-Romney”? I kinda think it will.

Also, Colbert seems to have “entered” the debate.

231

Following is a rare and brief glance at one takeover that did not go Bain Capital’s way. Rumor has it they never attempted the hostile take over of another insurance company again…

232

[quote]Gambit_Lost wrote:

Also, Colbert seems to have “entered” the debate.
[/quote]

Colbert hasn’t entered the debate. Like Stewart, and the rest of the liberal comedians he just wants to take a shot at Romney. And this is a perfect example of what I’m talking about when I mention that the media wants Obama to win. Where is Colbert’s video on Obama attending a racist church? Or, how about the funny video about Obama driving up the debt to 15 trillion? Or how he flip-flopped on a dozen issues? Oh yeah…none of that is funny. But this thing on Romney that’s high quality humor.

See what I’m talking about Mufasa?

And the not so funny part of it is that there are legions of young people who get their news from idiots like Colbert and Stewart and they’re eating this up like it’s Grandma’s homemade bread.

As I’ve been saying it will take an almost perfect campaign from start to finish to even win a squeaker over Obama.

233

[quote]ZEB wrote:

[quote]Gambit_Lost wrote:

Also, Colbert seems to have “entered” the debate.
[/quote]

Colbert hasn’t entered the debate. Like Stewart, and the rest of the liberal comedians he just wants to take a shot at Romney. [/quote]

It was perhaps a poor choice of words. That’s why I used the quotation marks. Anyway, it is a shot at Mitt, but isn’t it mostly shots at: (1)Super PACs (2)“corporations as people”?

234

[quote]Gambit_Lost wrote:

[quote]ZEB wrote:

[quote]Gambit_Lost wrote:

Also, Colbert seems to have “entered” the debate.
[/quote]

Colbert hasn’t entered the debate. Like Stewart, and the rest of the liberal comedians he just wants to take a shot at Romney. [/quote]

It was perhaps a poor choice of words. That’s why I used the quotation marks. Anyway, it is a shot at Mitt, but isn’t it mostly shots at: (1)Super PACs (2)“corporations as people”?
[/quote]

And where is the shot at the Obama’s super PACs, and the unions that give millions to Obama’s reelection? I guess that’s just not funny right?

LIBERAL BIAS IN THE MEDIA!

235

[quote]ZEB wrote:

[quote]Gambit_Lost wrote:

[quote]ZEB wrote:

[quote]Gambit_Lost wrote:

Also, Colbert seems to have “entered” the debate.
[/quote]

Colbert hasn’t entered the debate. Like Stewart, and the rest of the liberal comedians he just wants to take a shot at Romney. [/quote]

It was perhaps a poor choice of words. That’s why I used the quotation marks. Anyway, it is a shot at Mitt, but isn’t it mostly shots at: (1)Super PACs (2)“corporations as people”?
[/quote]

And where is the shot at the Obama’s super PACs, and the unions that give millions to Obama’s reelection? I guess that’s just not funny right?

LIBERAL BIAS IN THE MEDIA![/quote]

patients ZEB, Obama will be going toe to toe with the Republican nominee and hopefully Ron Paul

237

[quote]pushharder wrote:
Sorry fellers, after watching the Myrtle Beach debate I can honestly say Romney does NOT impress me enough to get my vote. All of the others, and that includes Paul, did a much better job than he did.

He particularly lost me on his gun control answers.[/quote]

Yep, on gun control. Did you Romney’s answer on his tax returns? I cringed! With Newt’s on Thursday, I believe they all will have released them (I think). And he’s a maybe, by April? Red flag. Big Red flag. The GoP won’t be able to fire it’s nominee if a big stinker comes out with that maybe, possible, if at all release so late.

238

What is it exactly that you want to know, Sloth?

That Romney is rich?

That Romney is VERY rich?

That Romney is STINKIN" rich OR

“This guys is freakin’ loaded to the GILLS”!

Take your pick.

Mufasa

239

[quote]pittbulll wrote:
IMO Obama is less bad than Romney[/quote]

Wow to this^ Unfricken believable. I am no fan of Romney, but O is the worst this country has known.

240

[quote]pushharder wrote:
Sorry fellers, after watching the Myrtle Beach debate I can honestly say Romney does NOT impress me enough to get my vote. All of the others, and that includes Paul, did a much better job than he did.

He particularly lost me on his gun control answers.[/quote]

Funny how that works Push, a candidate, just like a fighter, always looks better when they’re actually standing toe to toe with one man and not four jumping all over them.

Considering that every opponent on the stage with the exception of Ron Paul (there’s a deal) attacked him I think he did just fine. The other candidates had nothing to lose as they are all going to lose the SC primary. Romney had a lead to protect and he did a great job doing it. He was cool under fire and spat out coherent answers with a beginning middle and an end. That’s more than I can say for other candidates on stage last night.

And in a one on one debate Romney will eat Obama’s lunch!