Karate Girl vs Gym Rat Guy

[quote]jbpick86 wrote:

[quote]Sentoguy wrote:

[quote]jbpick86 wrote:
Side note and possible derail but what has caused being a black belt to lose such a tremendous amount of the meaning that it once held? My little cousin is going for his black belt and he is like 12 or 13. I knew a guy in school that he was a black belt since 9 and would tell people as such before one guy decide to football tackle him and beat the crap out of him while he was running his mouth.

It just seems like belts now are given out just to keep parents happy because there kid is progressing. I always thought the pursuit of a black belt was supposed to take years and mean that you had spent a tremendous amount of time perfecting your self.

I also think that people underestimate the effect experience with fighting has on a fight. I think if you have one of these “participation” black belts that has never actually been in a fight against a bigger just strong mofo that regularly brawls just because, black belt guy is in trouble. At least that has been my personal experience. The phrase “Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth” really does hold true.[/quote]

The short answer to your question is that Martial Arts has become a business in the US (for the civilian population anyhow, and even the Military/LEO population to a lesser degree). As such some schools (and even entire systems/organizations) have realized that they can make more money and have more students if they hurry people through the ranks and never make any of their students uncomfortable (sparring, hard conditioning, exposure to the elements, etc…).

As a result you get a bunch of “black belts” with inflated senses of self worth, accomplishment, and fighting prowess walking around. It’s a sad state of affairs IMO, but as long as the general public remains ignorant about these business practices and these school owners/organizations continue to make money hand over fist, I don’t expect the situation to change any time soon.[/quote]

That’s kind of sad as it seems to cheapen the accomplishment that “black belt” should have associated with it. But undoubtedly a lot of people realize this if a 12 year old can accomplish it then it really isn’t that special anymore.[/quote]

Yes it is sad. What really sucks though is that this colors much of the general public’s perception of what a Black Belt is worth, so they think that because certain BB’s are jokes that none of them mean anything. It also is a little bit frustrating for those of us who have legitimate BB’s (and had to bust our butts for years and sweat, bleed, and suffer to get there) when someone finds out that you are a BB and says something like, “Oh, my 12 year old nephew is a Black Belt too” and you just have to nod and say, “oh, that’s nice” instead of what you really want to say which is that his black belt is a joke and that our Yellow Belt (1st belt in our system) is probably harder than his BB test was.

Creepy thread.

[quote]Sentoguy wrote:

[quote]jbpick86 wrote:

[quote]Sentoguy wrote:

[quote]jbpick86 wrote:
Side note and possible derail but what has caused being a black belt to lose such a tremendous amount of the meaning that it once held? My little cousin is going for his black belt and he is like 12 or 13. I knew a guy in school that he was a black belt since 9 and would tell people as such before one guy decide to football tackle him and beat the crap out of him while he was running his mouth.

It just seems like belts now are given out just to keep parents happy because there kid is progressing. I always thought the pursuit of a black belt was supposed to take years and mean that you had spent a tremendous amount of time perfecting your self.

I also think that people underestimate the effect experience with fighting has on a fight. I think if you have one of these “participation” black belts that has never actually been in a fight against a bigger just strong mofo that regularly brawls just because, black belt guy is in trouble. At least that has been my personal experience. The phrase “Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth” really does hold true.[/quote]

The short answer to your question is that Martial Arts has become a business in the US (for the civilian population anyhow, and even the Military/LEO population to a lesser degree). As such some schools (and even entire systems/organizations) have realized that they can make more money and have more students if they hurry people through the ranks and never make any of their students uncomfortable (sparring, hard conditioning, exposure to the elements, etc…).

As a result you get a bunch of “black belts” with inflated senses of self worth, accomplishment, and fighting prowess walking around. It’s a sad state of affairs IMO, but as long as the general public remains ignorant about these business practices and these school owners/organizations continue to make money hand over fist, I don’t expect the situation to change any time soon.[/quote]

That’s kind of sad as it seems to cheapen the accomplishment that “black belt” should have associated with it. But undoubtedly a lot of people realize this if a 12 year old can accomplish it then it really isn’t that special anymore.[/quote]

Yes it is sad. What really sucks though is that this colors much of the general public’s perception of what a Black Belt is worth, so they think that because certain BB’s are jokes that none of them mean anything. It also is a little bit frustrating for those of us who have legitimate BB’s (and had to bust our butts for years and sweat, bleed, and suffer to get there) when someone finds out that you are a BB and says something like, “Oh, my 12 year old nephew is a Black Belt too” and you just have to nod and say, “oh, that’s nice” instead of what you really want to say which is that his black belt is a joke and that our Yellow Belt (1st belt in our system) is probably harder than his BB test was.[/quote]

It’s interesting that that is the impression you get in the US. I’ve lost track of the number of times I’ve told someone I was a boxer, and had them tell me ‘ye, but you wouldn’t want to mess with so and so, cos he’s got a blackbelt in karate’.

[quote]Sentoguy wrote:
“Oh, my 12 year old nephew is a Black Belt too” and you just have to nod and say, “oh, that’s nice” instead of what you really want to say which is that his black belt is a joke and that our Yellow Belt (1st belt in our system) is probably harder than his BB test was.[/quote]

My buddy told me his 13 year old got his Black Belt in TKD. I actually laughed at him. He didn’t really take it to well because his kid lives and breathes it but it is a slap in the face to people that actually have to earn a legit rank.

[quote]LondonBoxer123 wrote:

[quote]Sentoguy wrote:

[quote]jbpick86 wrote:

[quote]Sentoguy wrote:

[quote]jbpick86 wrote:
Side note and possible derail but what has caused being a black belt to lose such a tremendous amount of the meaning that it once held? My little cousin is going for his black belt and he is like 12 or 13. I knew a guy in school that he was a black belt since 9 and would tell people as such before one guy decide to football tackle him and beat the crap out of him while he was running his mouth.

It just seems like belts now are given out just to keep parents happy because there kid is progressing. I always thought the pursuit of a black belt was supposed to take years and mean that you had spent a tremendous amount of time perfecting your self.

I also think that people underestimate the effect experience with fighting has on a fight. I think if you have one of these “participation” black belts that has never actually been in a fight against a bigger just strong mofo that regularly brawls just because, black belt guy is in trouble. At least that has been my personal experience. The phrase “Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth” really does hold true.[/quote]

The short answer to your question is that Martial Arts has become a business in the US (for the civilian population anyhow, and even the Military/LEO population to a lesser degree). As such some schools (and even entire systems/organizations) have realized that they can make more money and have more students if they hurry people through the ranks and never make any of their students uncomfortable (sparring, hard conditioning, exposure to the elements, etc…).

As a result you get a bunch of “black belts” with inflated senses of self worth, accomplishment, and fighting prowess walking around. It’s a sad state of affairs IMO, but as long as the general public remains ignorant about these business practices and these school owners/organizations continue to make money hand over fist, I don’t expect the situation to change any time soon.[/quote]

That’s kind of sad as it seems to cheapen the accomplishment that “black belt” should have associated with it. But undoubtedly a lot of people realize this if a 12 year old can accomplish it then it really isn’t that special anymore.[/quote]

Yes it is sad. What really sucks though is that this colors much of the general public’s perception of what a Black Belt is worth, so they think that because certain BB’s are jokes that none of them mean anything. It also is a little bit frustrating for those of us who have legitimate BB’s (and had to bust our butts for years and sweat, bleed, and suffer to get there) when someone finds out that you are a BB and says something like, “Oh, my 12 year old nephew is a Black Belt too” and you just have to nod and say, “oh, that’s nice” instead of what you really want to say which is that his black belt is a joke and that our Yellow Belt (1st belt in our system) is probably harder than his BB test was.[/quote]

It’s interesting that that is the impression you get in the US. I’ve lost track of the number of times I’ve told someone I was a boxer, and had them tell me ‘ye, but you wouldn’t want to mess with so and so, cos he’s got a blackbelt in karate’.
[/quote]

You can actually find both instances in the US.

[quote]Sentoguy wrote:

[quote]LondonBoxer123 wrote:

[quote]Sentoguy wrote:

[quote]jbpick86 wrote:

[quote]Sentoguy wrote:

[quote]jbpick86 wrote:
Side note and possible derail but what has caused being a black belt to lose such a tremendous amount of the meaning that it once held? My little cousin is going for his black belt and he is like 12 or 13. I knew a guy in school that he was a black belt since 9 and would tell people as such before one guy decide to football tackle him and beat the crap out of him while he was running his mouth.

It just seems like belts now are given out just to keep parents happy because there kid is progressing. I always thought the pursuit of a black belt was supposed to take years and mean that you had spent a tremendous amount of time perfecting your self.

I also think that people underestimate the effect experience with fighting has on a fight. I think if you have one of these “participation” black belts that has never actually been in a fight against a bigger just strong mofo that regularly brawls just because, black belt guy is in trouble. At least that has been my personal experience. The phrase “Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth” really does hold true.[/quote]

The short answer to your question is that Martial Arts has become a business in the US (for the civilian population anyhow, and even the Military/LEO population to a lesser degree). As such some schools (and even entire systems/organizations) have realized that they can make more money and have more students if they hurry people through the ranks and never make any of their students uncomfortable (sparring, hard conditioning, exposure to the elements, etc…).

As a result you get a bunch of “black belts” with inflated senses of self worth, accomplishment, and fighting prowess walking around. It’s a sad state of affairs IMO, but as long as the general public remains ignorant about these business practices and these school owners/organizations continue to make money hand over fist, I don’t expect the situation to change any time soon.[/quote]

That’s kind of sad as it seems to cheapen the accomplishment that “black belt” should have associated with it. But undoubtedly a lot of people realize this if a 12 year old can accomplish it then it really isn’t that special anymore.[/quote]

Yes it is sad. What really sucks though is that this colors much of the general public’s perception of what a Black Belt is worth, so they think that because certain BB’s are jokes that none of them mean anything. It also is a little bit frustrating for those of us who have legitimate BB’s (and had to bust our butts for years and sweat, bleed, and suffer to get there) when someone finds out that you are a BB and says something like, “Oh, my 12 year old nephew is a Black Belt too” and you just have to nod and say, “oh, that’s nice” instead of what you really want to say which is that his black belt is a joke and that our Yellow Belt (1st belt in our system) is probably harder than his BB test was.[/quote]

It’s interesting that that is the impression you get in the US. I’ve lost track of the number of times I’ve told someone I was a boxer, and had them tell me ‘ye, but you wouldn’t want to mess with so and so, cos he’s got a blackbelt in karate’.
[/quote]

You can actually find both instances in the US.
[/quote]

I think the perception of black belt has to do with the age of the person in the US. Grew up pre 80’s then you probably think of it as a bigger deal where my generation grew up with the 12 year old black belts. Also I have noticed what you are saying about different gyms and their black belt qualifications being tougher from watching MMA match ups. I was watching one the other day with two primarily BJJ guys and the announcer was saying that although fighter A was a brown belt fighting a black belt, because he trained at X gym that brown belt probably was more advanced than the other guys black belt. I cant remember any names so I left them all out. You would think that there would be some uniformity to belt classification.

[quote]jbpick86 wrote:
I was watching one the other day with two primarily BJJ guys and the announcer was saying that although fighter A was a brown belt fighting a black belt, because he trained at X gym that brown belt probably was more advanced than the other guys black belt. I cant remember any names so I left them all out. You would think that there would be some uniformity to belt classification. [/quote]

Once you get to Brown in BJJ your skill level is at the point that you should probably be able to hold your own or even tap on some occasions most Black Belts. As for a school trumping another, that’s a pretty broad statement without knowing the head instructor, his pedigree, and the size of the school.

[quote]MWP wrote:

[quote]jbpick86 wrote:
I was watching one the other day with two primarily BJJ guys and the announcer was saying that although fighter A was a brown belt fighting a black belt, because he trained at X gym that brown belt probably was more advanced than the other guys black belt. I cant remember any names so I left them all out. You would think that there would be some uniformity to belt classification. [/quote]

Once you get to Brown in BJJ your skill level is at the point that you should probably be able to hold your own or even tap on some occasions most Black Belts. As for a school trumping another, that’s a pretty broad statement without knowing the head instructor, his pedigree, and the size of the school. [/quote]

He actually did call the names of both schools and trainers, I just cant remember so I didn’t want to guess and misrepresent. Sorry if I wasn’t clear on that.

Just as a side note I train at an MMA gym, most of the staff competes in what they coach and at MMA. We have Muay Thai, BJJ, Boxing and MMA champions. We have quite a few women (1 to 4 female to male ratio is quite a lot in my book for an MMA place) the average woman here is about my height 5’7 and between 140-160 lbs. When sparring/rolling there have been plenty of times when these women have won/submitted larger men. One of the best grappling instructors/practitioners that we have is a former Olympic Judo champion and BJJ champion.

Now given of course none of this is similar to a true fight on the street where the person might be looking to kill/maim you, but in the contrived scenario of the op where it’s just a fight I have no doubt that most of these women would have no problem submitted/choking out an average gymrat/bodybuilder. The female instructor, in such a scenario, could probably easily win against most much stronger than her meaning those significantly above the average gymrat/bodybuilder, especially if they have no training. Of course she is a VERY small percentage of female combat athletes though.

[quote]CircaThursday wrote:
im not just being a douche[/quote]

[quote]CircaThursday wrote:
im not just being a douche[/quote]

Are you sure?

Damn, I wrote a kinda-long response to the “participation belts” thing above and it seems to have disappeared… oh well. No one would like what I said anyway…lol

wtf

[quote]Gambit_Lost wrote:

[quote]CircaThursday wrote:
im not just being a douche[/quote]

[quote]CircaThursday wrote:
im not just being a douche[/quote]

Are you sure?[/quote]

I think the OP has been trying to excuse himself from this thread for a while, maybe we should let it rest.

[quote]humble wrote:
wtf[/quote]

Humble, c’mon man, you’re not going to let the OP get away that easy are you!?!

I read the first post and quickly scrolled down the thread looking for you ripping him a new one. I don’t have much in life - give me this at least buddy.

lol… da faq is more than enough. Fucking troll cunt

if the guy has any skills at all, he wins 99/100 times under those circumstances.

i train muay thai. i’m pretty experienced. when i spar with guys who have 5 inches and 50 pounds on me with intermediate skills, it is a hell of a time for me.

[quote]Sifu wrote:

[quote]CircaThursday wrote:
The guy is 6 foot 3 and bench press 270 weights 215
girl is 5 foot 3 150 pounds
dojo is not full contact [/quote]

She sounds like a round little thing with a big juicy ass. Do you have any pictures or a phone number? More importantly does she have a restraining order against you or anyone associated with you?[/quote]

I’m with Sifu, when were you planning on attempting this rape? Cause time of day matters.