thanks danh…i try really hard…one question though: how can you criticize something you don’t believe in? it’s like you believing in martians and me ridiculing you because of it.
hedo, you wrote:
“It was biased, skewed to the left and lacked even a basic regard for factual representation.”
and…
“I couldn’t help thinking of the movie “Triumph of the Will” it was a documentart that glorified Nazi Germany in 1936. This piece of shit movie was just as bad.”
and the following(!)(?)
“I am sure it will do well based on some of the pathetic pieces of shit I saw in the theater.”
My point: Speaking of “bias” and “Nazi Germany” some of the things you wrote reminded me of just that. I guess those “pathetic pieces of shit” you saw in the theater won’t be part of your master race. What was wrong with them you could so easily discern? Was it curved noses?
You’re a hoot.
[quote]jo3 wrote:
Support Bush, even if you hate him. You can vote for Kerry if you believe he’s the better candidate for President, but support Bush while he’s in office. He IS your President. I try my best to not be affiliated with any party, but I tend to have more conservative views. With that said, had Gore won in 2000, I would have still given him all my support because he’s my leader.
[/quote]
LOL… you sound a lot like a superstar featured in Moore’s film, so you’re in good company with this blunt-minded notion…Britney Spears’ company!
Which ones?
thunderbolt23 You haven’t seen it, so how could you make such judgements? Having just seen it, I think it can certainly lead the neutral or borderline voter away from Bush. It certainly can.
[quote]randman wrote:
Why is everyone surpised that the movie theaters are packed? Every dripping, french-loving liberal out there is going to that movie and masterbate in glee over its anti-war/anti-Bush messages.[/quote]
And every right wing extremist will sit at home making likewise ignorant and retarded remarks.
How so? Like Hedo said, actual footage is used throughout much of the film - how can you argue with Powell and Rice stating that Iraq posed no threat, had no weapons, and never rebuilt their military at the start of their term, and drastically reversing those positions?
Does GWBush not appear to you to be awfully arrogant when he warns everyone in the world to fight terrorism then tells reporters to watch him drive the golf ball? HE SAYS IT. THOSE ARE HIS ACTIONS! Does he not reinforce the many criticisms of him being concerned only for his wealthy supporters when he jokes to his (presumably) fund-raising crowd that they are the “haves and have-mores.” And that “some people call you the elite, I call you my base.” It’s actual footage.
Moore shows documents, interviews experts and citizens. Of course, he shows opinions that support his own contentions because…DUH! it’s his movie and he has a point to make!
Saudis had relationship with the US long before 9/1l actually, Clinton had great relations w/ the Saudi’s King Fahd donated $23 mill to The Unvi. Of Arkansas for Middle Eastern studies. I sure Moore didn’t bring that up in the movie.
Although, I never have seen the film yet just clips from the news. He keeps on blaming on having Bush with ties w/ bin laden’s family when Bin Laden’s family disowned their infamous son long ago before 9/11.
Grant Moore is controversial just like Mel Gibson was in The Passion of The Christ. But, Moore’s movie will not bring out the same $$$ amount as Mel’s.
I am asking Moore why are you calling this film a Documentary. Which it is obviously not? Even the critics whether it is liberal or right. Both agree this not a non-fictional Documentary. That the problem I have w/ Micheal Moore.
I think Moore is a talented producer/artist. It?s a shame and the sham that he uses his talent to bash other people.
While he can’t be criticized himself and take it like a man.
I was watching him on Charlie Rose he made a statement “America is not a land of opportunity.” “We are giving immigrants false hopes if they think they are going to make it here.” This was before Fahrenheit 9/11. This when he won the Oscar for “Bowling For Columbine”
I heard that I was floored here this guy is a multi-million. And claiming there’s no opportunity for immigrants ect. I feel that this was a incorrect statement and my money will never go to his movies after he said that.
I the only way I would even phathom watching his movies is either barrowing it from a friend or watching a ripped DVD copy.
Like I said Moore is talented and entertaining but use it in a positive way not a negative.
Sorry for the long post I am done talking about Moore.
In Health,
Silas C.
Kenman - Thank You.
Master Race. Not really. I was referring to the other movie goers. A lot of gender benders and those that adore them. Pathetic to me. But I am a gentleman so I mind my own business.
Bush is a leader. Moore is a propagandist. That’s about it.
The country was attacked by a foriegn enemy. Trust me I was there. I’m from NYC. I saw innocent people walking around covered in blood. Covered, it’s not like the movies blood is everywhere. I saw people making cell phone calls to loved ones. Days later I saw other loved ones walking around with pictures of dead parents and kids, trying to find the missing.
Guess what I was 5 blocks from the WTC in Battery Park and I stood speechless for a lot longer then 7 mins.
I was inspired by Fighter planes circling my city after the attacks. The pilots flew low and slow…over Manhattan, they turned so that those of us on the ground could see they were armed to the teeth. It wasn’t going to happen again. Me and a lot of other city residents saw Bush down at Ground Zero. We won’t forget. Despite the BS that Michael Moore put’s out.
Anyway back to the point. I saw it. I thought it biased and I think even an amatuer could edit footage to convey any message they want. Lanni made National Socialism look like the way to go… that’s why they call it propaganda.
Regardless. It’s my opinion. I am entitled to it and to be honest I am at that point in life where I don’t give a shit if people agree with me or not. Just so you know I actually think Moore has a sense of humor and is a true populistg at heart. That is until he produced this piece of shit.
hedo-
I hope you know my post wasn’t directed towards u. I am in agreement w/ u. By the way I was surprise that you went to see it.
In Health,
Silas C.
You have got yo be kidding! What about the 3,000 people we lost in September 2001? What about their families and their grief?
Michael Moore has since recanted his position about this being fact and has now said that it is all his opinion. Hmmmmmm what stinks here? Moore has not produced or written one factual thing since he has started and is another liberal left leaning hypocrit.
Furthermore, Bush did say that Iraq has ties to Al Queda and did not say that Iraq was responsible for 9/11. If they harbored terrorist then they got what they deserved. Nothing would have been done if we layed this all at the feet of the corrupt United Nations and Kofi A Hole.
I just saw it and I thought it was a POWERFUL film.
Well, Right Side Up has said much of what needs to be said… though how can anyone refute the movies’ truthfullness without ever seeing it?
Of course it’s biased, and of course things may have been taken out of context (though man, they sure look bad/hilarious/disturbing). Its a hell of a movie…
After seeing this film, I had a sense of balance.
After listening to Rush nearly every day, I know what the far right’s position is. Now, I have been presented with the far left position.
It’s up to me to do my own research and to decide who and what to believe.
That was 2 different scenes spliced togather. It wasn’t done very well, you can see some of the blue screen around GWB during the first part of the statement.
It was funny, though!
[quote]Jeff Rage wrote:
Does GWBush not appear to you to be awfully arrogant when he warns everyone in the world to fight terrorism then tells reporters to watch him drive the golf ball? HE SAYS IT. THOSE ARE HIS ACTIONS!
That was 2 different scenes spliced togather. It wasn’t done very well, you can see some of the blue screen around GWB during the first part of the statement.
It was funny, though![/quote]
Are you sure, Jeff? I didn’t notice that, and I don’t think Moore would do that. Look, Bush has done enough stupid shit on camera not to have to create some illusion.
Will you deny what he said at the fundraiser? “the haves and the have mores…some call you the elite, I call you my base”
Did he not demand that someone in his camp declare “nice shot” upon shooting some skeet?
Did he not use phrases like “Smoke 'em out” over and over and over?
These are a couple that come to mind. His arrogance is undeniable.
[quote]GreenBrian wrote:
Well, Right Side Up has said much of what needs to be said… though how can anyone refute the movies’ truthfullness without ever seeing it?
Of course it’s biased, and of course things may have been taken out of context (though man, they sure look bad/hilarious/disturbing). Its a hell of a movie… [/quote]
Um, I just want to address the idea that you can’t have an opinion on a movie without having seen it.
While I suppose this is true about things like lighting, and how the movie works overall, consistency and such, it is decidedly not true about aspects of the movie, such as “truthfulness” as offered above, that are NOT matters of opinion but of fact. To the extent Moore gets his facts wrong, or misrepresents things via omission, one can have an opinion on that fact simply from the accurate reports of others. Please see this article for Moore’s general truthfulness:
http://slate.msn.com/id/2102723/
Also, it’s possible to have a general opinion of this movie without having seen it. I have a general opinion about Debbie Does Dallas, and I’ve never seen that particular movie – however, I am familiar enough with the genre to have a fairly good idea of what I would be getting. As I said, I don’t have an opinion about the lighting or other such specifics that I would have to see, but I can have a general opinion based on Moore’s other works, and what has been reported on this one.
Wasn’t that at the correspondents dinner where presidents are expected to be funny?
I’m almost positive it wasn’t a fundraiser. It was a joke for the press.
Are you sure, Jeff? I didn’t notice that, and I don’t think Moore would do that. Look, Bush has done enough stupid shit on camera not to have to create some illusion.
Will you deny what he said at the fundraiser? “the haves and the have mores…some call you the elite, I call you my base”
Did he not demand that someone in his camp declare “nice shot” upon shooting some skeet?
Did he not use phrases like “Smoke 'em out” over and over and over?
These are a couple that come to mind. His arrogance is undeniable.
[/quote]
Please keep in mind that even moore has said that this is NOT a true documentary ( he said that on the daily show of all places) it is a movie that was made in a documentary style to “bring out the secrerts of the bush family any way he ( moore) can” and also means to suspend the truth to add in theory.
It is a good movie,it made me laugh, it made me go OOOOH and it made me think ( but not too much) but I swear to Ephedrine if teachers use the DVD as a textbook i am going to just … well… eat… alot! then poop on them all!
Regarding the “haves and have nots” crack, it was joke deliverd at the Alfred E. SMith Foundation Dinner, where it is tradition for the speakers to trade barbs and poke fun at one another.
Some excerpts:
‘"Your great-grandfather was my favorite kind of governor: the kind who ran for president and lost,’" said Al Gore. ’
‘Bush also mentioned Smith’s ill-fated campaign, admitting, “It gives me hope that in America it’s still not possible for a fellow named Al to be the commander-in-chief.”’
‘Gore also used his time at the podium to answer his critics, jesting, “I never exaggerate. You can ask Tipper or any of my 11 daughters.”’
‘Gore jokingly crowed about his strategy of using “real people” to illustrate policy points. “Like the woman who’s here tonight, whose husband is about to lose his job. She’s struggling to get out of public housing and get a job of her own. Hillary Clinton, I want to fight for you!”’
http://www.cnn.com/2000/ALLPOLITICS/stories/10/20/al.smith.dinner/
It’s a fund-raising night full of pokes and gags. Gore was whipping them out as fast as Bush.
But, in the hands of Moore, it becomes some shadowy slipup about Bush promising rich people the keys to the White House.
Such stupidity. I remember seeing the clips for this back in 2000, but couldn’t remember where it took place. Within seconds using a garden variety search engine, I had the real story in front of me.
And yet, our Leftist friends and their champion Moore seem to be immune to the rigors of such ordinary scrutiny.
Bush’s wisecracks were harmless fun in a political venue of self-deprecating humor. Just don’t tell that to Moore’s lemmings that believe everything served to them.
Why isn’t the Left ashamed of Michael Moore? Why aren’t you embarassed that this the spokesperson of your ideas?
If I were on the Left, I’d fire him.