'It's Worse Than Cocaine'

[quote]hungry4more wrote:

[quote]DBCooper wrote:

[quote]hungry4more wrote:
Hmmm…well that would depend on how you define “abused” I suppose. [/quote]

Abuse is like porn; I know it when I see it. This applies to any and all drugs.[/quote]

Wouldn’t that kinda make the original point of this thread null and void, really?

Because not only is it ridiculous to put steroid abuse on the same level of popularity/commonality as cocaine, but SO MANY other substances would be much more appropriate for comparison. I have yet to see the episode of “Cops” where the have to deal with some juiced-up meathead who’s roid-raging at the neighbours…[/quote]

and if you did i am sure that juiced up meathead would have a few grams of coke in his system anyway, but it would still be blamed on the roids.

[quote]dshroy wrote:

[quote]hungry4more wrote:

[quote]DBCooper wrote:

[quote]hungry4more wrote:
Hmmm…well that would depend on how you define “abused” I suppose. [/quote]

Abuse is like porn; I know it when I see it. This applies to any and all drugs.[/quote]

Wouldn’t that kinda make the original point of this thread null and void, really?

Because not only is it ridiculous to put steroid abuse on the same level of popularity/commonality as cocaine, but SO MANY other substances would be much more appropriate for comparison. I have yet to see the episode of “Cops” where the have to deal with some juiced-up meathead who’s roid-raging at the neighbours…[/quote]
and if you did i am sure that juiced up meathead would have a few grams of coke in his system anyway, but it would still be blamed on the roids.[/quote]

So true.

Haha imagine ronnie flipping shits on coke.

[quote]Liv92 wrote:
Haha imagine ronnie flipping shits on coke. [/quote]

2012 anybody? lolol.

[quote]Vir wrote:

[quote]hungry4more wrote:

[quote]DBCooper wrote:
I think you guys are confusing steroid use with steroid abuse. Granted, cocaine use (based on my own experiences and those of some old friends of mine) almost assuredly leads to abuse, steroid use can lead to abuse. Maybe it isn’t as likely to lead to abuse, but steroid abuse can lead to horrific consequences similar to cocaine abuse. However, that shit with Ben Affleck was absolutely ridiculous.[/quote]

Cocaine is physiologically addictive. Steroids are not. [/quote]

It takes a lot of use to get addicted to cocaine, you don’t do a few lines and get immediately hooked. Very few people only ever do one cycle of steroids though.[/quote]

There is no violent physiological withdrawal period related to steroids. No one goes into DT’s because they haven’t taken a shot in a few weeks.

[quote]DBCooper wrote:

[quote]AzCats wrote:
Illegal Drugs (cocaine, heroin, marijuana, and methamphetamine) = 15,000-20,000 deaths per year

Legal Drugs (Tylenol, advil, aspirin and so on) = 106,000 deaths per year

Steroids (legal in many countries) = 0 (zero) deaths per year

You be the judge![/quote]

another falsehood.

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/2008/06/28/2008-06-28_news_examines_relationship_between_stero.html

There are also articles that downplay this, but they come from BB sites. It’s like citing Freud’s Cocaine Papers as evidence that cocaine is good or citing High Times as evidence that weed doesn’t cause severe lung and heart damage.[/quote]

How do we know that they didn’t have health problems before taking the steroids. The steroids could have just made the problems worse but weren’t the cause by themselves.

[quote]DBCooper wrote:
This is all inaccurate. My mom works with a lot of drug addicts and she gets a steroid abuser every once in a while. Mental attachment is the epitome of addiction. As a recovering alcoholic/addict, I can attest to this. While it may take a lot of cocaine, or any drug for that matter, to develop a physical addiction, the mental addiction can start right away. You do a drug, you like the way it makes you feel or the way you think people perceive you when you are under the influence, and BAM, you can be on the road to addiction.

When I stopped drinking and drugs, I experienced very little physical withdrawal symptoms, but I can tell you I definitely drank enough and smoked enough weed and coke to have them. I ground the shit out of my teeth without even noticing it for a couple of weeks, but that was about it. The mental addiction/disease is why I relapsed a couple times within the first couple of months. It’s different for everyone. I know a lot of people who stopped drinking and went through every physical withdrawal symptom in the book, but once these stopped, they had no desire to start again.

I’ve seen people relapse after more than twenty years of sobriety and it’s not due to some physical need for drugs/booze; it’s a mental thing. In fact, the phsyical side of any addiction, including steroids, is just a side effect of a mental addiction. Steroids may have little to no physical withdrawal symptoms, but there is certainly a mental addiction. Other drugs have a very magnified physical addiction aspect, like heroin.[/quote]

You have no clue what you’re talking about. Shit, if we’re going to start demonizing stuff because people can become psychologically addicted to it, let’s start with food. Anything can become psychologically addictive. Running is psychologically addictive. Sex is psychologically addictive. Are you going to demonize those things too? Only someone who really didn’t understand the psychology of addiction would try to make the points you’re trying to make here. Psychologically addicted people simply LIKE doing what they are doing enough to ignore the consequences of those actions or lack the self awareness and control to intervene when an opportunity to abuse presents itself.

Physiological dependence IS the HALLMARK of addiction. Without physiological dependence, you have moved from legitimate medical science to pseudoscience best handled by counselors instead of DOCTORS.

The VAST (99.999999%) of steroid users (and abusers) stop using with ZERO professional intervention. Nearly ALL physiologically addictive psychoactive drugs REQUIRE professional intervention.

You don’t even know what you’re referring to when you say “mental addiction”. Those who relapse after years of sobriety tend to have abusive/addictive personalities. You’ve got your definitions entirely backwards, as mental addiction doesn’t lead to physiological addiction, but rather the affects of the drugs on brain chemistry (physiological) leads to the psychological dependence and reinforces the compulsion to use as the addict withdraws.

I’d be willing to bet money that the steroid abusers your mom sees are also abusing drugs like Vicodin, Oxy, Nubain, coke, X, amphetamines, or some other highly psychoactive recreational drug in addition to the steroids, but because steroids are the great social evil of our times, that is what is singled out as their primary malady.

[quote]DBCooper wrote:

another falsehood.

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/2008/06/28/2008-06-28_news_examines_relationship_between_stero.html

There are also articles that downplay this, but they come from BB sites. It’s like citing Freud’s Cocaine Papers as evidence that cocaine is good or citing High Times as evidence that weed doesn’t cause severe lung and heart damage.[/quote]

So your sources for this insight are a supplement company’s website that sells an herbal blend that it claims to be more powerful than andro and Dr. Henry Wadler, a man who has been exposed numerous times to give negative two shits about actual science and who’s entire career depends upon the continued demonization of steroids?

Pretty sure High Times and Freud are more qualified than your examples. Please play again.

Gawd. You guyz. Srsly.

Everybody knows it’s the creatine rage that is the worse.

[quote]DBCooper wrote:

[/quote]

Wrong, look up diuretics, they are not steroids. Most of those guys on that list died of complications due to diuretics not steroids.

This article source is invalid because it’s from a newpaper, don’t push this crap on here.

If you’re going to come in here spewing bullshit, dont. Your resources suck and are not valid. Instead of listening to what the whiny incompetents that spew erroneous statements and propaganda have to say. Think for yourself and do the research.

[quote]ukrainian wrote:

How do we know that they didn’t have health problems before taking the steroids. The steroids could have just made the problems worse but weren’t the cause by themselves.[/quote]

Yeah, it’s not like athletes with congenital heart defects are much more likely to die young as a result of those defects because of massive demands imposed on their circulatory systems by their respective sports and higher body weights or anything.

internet arguments are for ruh tards

.greg.

Roidz will kill ya… -_-

Hey sweet Stronghold replied how I wanted to, I like that guy.

Someone suggested I do some research on steroids. Here is a quote from a steroid abuse expert and a well-respected doctor in his field, according to the research I performed.

“For males in the U.S., heart disease is the number one cause of death, and steroid abuse makes heart disease even worse,” stressed Dr. Linn Goldberg, a professor at Oregon Health Sciences University, and an expert on steroid abuse.

I understand that steroid abuse in and of itself may not cause death, but it can certainly exacerbate the effects of other behaviors harmful to the heart’s health.

As for “mental addiction”, I fully understand that those who are predisposed to addictive behavior are likely to abuse drugs and that this does not mean that every single behavior that can become psychologically addictive will lead to abuse by everybody. I’m not demonizing sex or eating or running, I’m simply pointing out that someone who does take these behaviors to extremes can suffer as a result. Someone with an addictive personality is certainly capable of abusing steroids to the point of harm. Does it happen often and are there other aspects involved? No and yes. But there are numerous studies that show that steroid abuse can lead to heart problems. Does this happen on the same level as cocaine abuse: no, but it does happen. I’m not trying to say that cocaine and steroid abuse are on an equal level, but steroids can most certainly be abused.

Steroids can be used responsibly without withdrawal symptoms and I don’t think there is any way to “responsibly” use cocaine. But someone who is predisposed to addictive behavior and uses steroids is a prime candidate to become that .01% who suffers drastically from it as a result. If I gave the impression that I believe cocaine abuse and steroid abuse are equally problematic, my mistake; that wasn’t where I was going. But don’t try to tell me that steroid use is 100% safe for all grown men to use in any way, shape or form.

So do I use creatine as an excuse to beat my wife? How do I go about this, I dont want to say I beat my wife because I’m a drunk; I’ll sound stupid, I need something to blame.

See the point I’m making here? Steroids are bad because people have decided they’re bad, and its socially acceptable to put alot of undeserved blame on them. Sure theres enough fuck ass’s around that abuse steroids and happen to have bad additudes to start with. Its them coupled with kids who’re too young to be using them, as well as uneducated and over reactive parents, media looking to make a story, and basically people in general.

Everyone likes to state something as a fact if they think people will agree with them.

The steroids arent the problem, its the dick bags that abuse them that are the problem, not to mention people who are unstable to begin with and think steroids will make their troubles go away.

There is a sign posted above the water fountain above my 24Hour Fitness that preaches about the evils of steriods. I was pretty surprised when I read the sign.

[quote]bradden wrote:
So do I use creatine as an excuse to beat my wife? How do I go about this, I dont want to say I beat my wife because I’m a drunk; I’ll sound stupid, I need something to blame.

See the point I’m making here? Steroids are bad because people have decided they’re bad, and its socially acceptable to put alot of undeserved blame on them. Sure theres enough fuck ass’s around that abuse steroids and happen to have bad additudes to start with. Its them coupled with kids who’re too young to be using them, as well as uneducated and over reactive parents, media looking to make a story, and basically people in general.

Everyone likes to state something as a fact if they think people will agree with them.

The steroids arent the problem, its the dick bags that abuse them that are the problem, not to mention people who are unstable to begin with and think steroids will make their troubles go away.[/quote]

Well, since you clearly aren’t a dickbag, and I’ll assume you aren’t some kid or are unstable, if you were to abuse steroids, it wouldn’t have any harmful effects on you? Are you simply incapable of ever abusing steroids? If you aren’t a dickbag, a kid, unstable and so on, is it impossible for you to ever abuse steroids? Or are you really trying to tell me that ONLY dickbags and so on ever suffer from the effects of steroid abuse?

[quote]OctoberGirl wrote:

There is a sign posted above the water fountain above my 24Hour Fitness that preaches about the evils of steriods. I was pretty surprised when I read the sign.

[/quote]

You know what my favorite part of 24H fitness is? That its open 24 hrs.

[quote]rrjc5488 wrote:

[quote]Otep wrote:

[quote]rrjc5488 wrote:
The only people I hear bitching and moaning about roid rage are people who have never used steroids.[/quote]

For what it’s worth, you rarely find alcoholics donating to MADD.[/quote]

Well, yeah, true. But I still stand by what I said.

And since we’re on the topic of alcohol, was it Bigger Stronger Faster that brought up the point of ‘alcohol rage’?

I’m sure there have been millions (at this point) of drunken fights that wouldn’t have been started if the fighters involved had been sober, yet society still doesn’t bat an eyelash at alcohol…

[/quote]

Bump the above. The government is too much into controlling things that don’t really matter. They let alcohol and smoking off the hook because they can tax it appropriately. And I think some drugs should be illegal if they cause others harm. But I’ve known plenty of people that would be better off with a joint than another shot of alcohol. I mean how many people that are getting stoned are out beating their wives/girlfriends, fighting, breaking whatever they come across, etc. The worst damage I’ve ever seen someone that was high do, was cleanout the entire refrigerator.

Same deal with steroids. I’ve had several friends and aquaintences that were on steroids. Most of them were upright guys, always happy, very non-hostile…all the time. The one that I knew was a DKHD, was already DKHD to begin with, therefore, steroids just made him a super DKHDs. Enough said…

v/r

Gremlin