[quote]IrishSteel wrote:
here is the image of one of those torpedos . . . [/quote]
for this torpedo 10 people died? how funny.
[/quote]
you are still totally clueless . . . no one ever said they were smuggling torpedos into Gaza!!![/quote]
quote from doubleduce:Wait for them to get to Israeli waters and torpedo there asses?[/quote]
yes - it was a joke about sinking the flotilla instead of bothering to stop and redirect the ships so they could be inspected for weapons - it was a facetious comment showing the absurdity of the claim that Israel was trying to be needlessly violent toward the flotilla members - and I cannot believe I spent this much time trying to explain an obvious conversation thread to you
[quote]Jewbacca wrote:
Fact is, if the arabs put down their weapons tomorrow, there would be peace.
If the Israelis (and I am Israeli, living in the USA) put down their weapons, they would all be killed.
[/quote]
x999999999999999
This is the truth.[/quote]
Thats bullshit the only way to peace is to free the palestinians and stop building on their land, even the UN says the israeli settlements are illegal, people here talk about the Israeli deaths compare that to the
thousands killed by these bastards[/quote]
according to whose law?
You do realize that Israel accepted a 2 state solution, it’s the Palestinians who rejected it. they wouldn’t agree to live “free” as long as Israel was allowed to exist.
And like I said, if Israel listened to the likes of the UN, they’d be dead.
[quote]IrishSteel wrote:
here is the image of one of those torpedos . . . [/quote]
for this torpedo 10 people died? how funny.
[/quote]
you are still totally clueless . . . no one ever said they were smuggling torpedos into Gaza!!![/quote]
quote from doubleduce:Wait for them to get to Israeli waters and torpedo there asses?[/quote]
You still are missing it. Double Duce was talking about the Israelis torpedoing the flotila when it entered Israeli waters. This was a hypothetical after my question of what could have Isreal done better. We never mentioned that the flotila had any torpedos.
My wife was killed 15 years ago by an retarded arab boy his father strapped with dynamite and sent into Israel to blow himself up. Imagine doing that to your own child, let alone a child who did not understand what was happening. I’ve raised 4 daughters by myself, and would die before putting them in danger.
There is a good side and a bad side here.
[/quote]
My deepest sympathies, and forgive an Irish fool’s kind thought: Death leaves a heartache no one can heal, Love leaves a memory no one can steal.
[quote]Jewbacca wrote:
Fact is, if the arabs put down their weapons tomorrow, there would be peace.
If the Israelis (and I am Israeli, living in the USA) put down their weapons, they would all be killed.
[/quote]
x999999999999999
This is the truth.[/quote]
Thats bullshit the only way to peace is to free the palestinians and stop building on their land, even the UN says the israeli settlements are illegal, people here talk about the Israeli deaths compare that to the
thousands killed by these bastards[/quote]
First, get the terms right. Everyone outside of the English speaking world knows there is no such thing as a “Palestinian.” That is an Anglized term for “Philistene.” As in Goliath, of David-and-Goliath. The Philistenes were a proto-Greek sea-faring people, probably from Crete. The current occupants of Gaza are arabs, largely from Syria and Jordan. They are not Greek.
The arabs came in two waves, mostly after Jews starting returning to Israel in the late 1800s — after the pogroms in Czarist Russia. They came because the Jews (eventually under the British mandate) offerred jobs and a nice place to live and be free citizens. Before that, outside of Jerusalem proper, the country was empty. Go read Mark Twain’s “innocents abroad” for example. He gave a first hand account of an empty, desolate, country.
While we’re on the topic, you know the gold domed mosque stuck on the Temple Mount? Al-Asqa? You know, the mosque not mentioned in the koran, but now claimed to be the mosque from where Mohammed flew on his winged horse? It was built some years AFTER Mohammed died. That little lie is somehow swallowed by Western Media too lazy to check — and a source of much amusement to my muslim friends who laugh at how silly the Western media is. (The lie was created by Yasser Arafat, BTW, to create a religious claim.)
On this topic of “arab land” (and, in particular, East Jerusalem/Gaza, which is the topic at hand). Well, it wasn’t “arab land” until 1948 when Jordan invaded, killed the Jews there, and then kicked out all the poor arabs from its country to colonize the now-empty houses. Before that, it was nicely mixed between Christian (largely Eqyptian), Druze, Muslim Arabs, and Hasidic Jewish families, and had been for 2000 years.
Israel is not just Jewish. About 20% of the population is arab. They vote, hold citizenship, pay taxes, live on welfare, get health care, and serve in the military, just like everyone else. Indeed, until the USA liberated Iraq, the only country where arabs lived like that was Israel.
My wife was killed 15 years ago by an retarded arab boy his father strapped with dynamite and sent into Israel to blow himself up. Imagine doing that to your own child, let alone a child who did not understand what was happening. I’ve raised 4 daughters by myself, and would die before putting them in danger.
There is a good side and a bad side here.
[/quote]
My deepest sympathies, and forgive an Irish fool’s kind thought: Death leaves a heartache no one can heal, Love leaves a memory no one can steal.[/quote]
I am completly with you and will not post anything that is not about peace for this region anylonger. i apologize to everyone whom I may offended here.
[quote]jre67t wrote:
Guys, this was a setup to lure Israel. Think about it, if it was just medical aid along with food supply that you wanted to get to people that you deeply care about. Would it not be worth your time to have the ship inspected Israel? Whats so hard about that, really. Israel fell into this trap all to easily.
If the pro-Gaza boats really cared about there mission why not let them on to inspect and why defy them. I support Israel on this. All this looney people who support Gaza are just plain dumb to realize that Israel is protecting its own state. It has enemies on all sides, yet you all buffons want to blame them for everything. They did what they had to do to protect themselves, just like any real Man will do to protect his Wife and Children.
Let me restate that this was done on purpose to make them Jews look bad. [/quote]
Israel is like a child protected by a bully, Israel made a deal not so long ago, not to build in Gaza and while Obama was in then they change their mind News :Israel to build 700 new homes in East Jerusalem; state also may seize private Palestinian land in West Bank.
Now this fiasco, I do not believe it is in Israel�¢??s interest to have a peace agreement, I think we need to back off. They feel they can act any way they want and America has their back
As law has it Israel committed an act of PIRACY.[/quote]
Oh please. Maybe they just understand peace with the likes of hamas is an impossibility. People like you just don’t get it. The only way peace can be achieved is for one group to wipe the other off the face of the map. You cannot reason with these people. It is kill or be killed.
It is actually amazing Israel has survive thus far using as much restraint as they have.[/quote]
They are all brothers , the only thing that separates Israel from Palistine is AMERICA
[quote]dmaddox wrote:
When the Israelis settlement goes up, are they kicking Arabs off their land or is it just a piece of empty land?[/quote]
Empty land duly paid for to legal owner in voluntary, arms-length, transactions.
[quote]dmaddox wrote:
When the Israelis settlement goes up, are they kicking Arabs off their land or is it just a piece of empty land?[/quote]
Empty land duly paid for to legal owner in voluntary, arms-length, transactions.[/quote]
So when the Israel government buldozed all those settlements, those people were up a creek without a paddle. They lost their money and their land? It reverted back to the original owner?
[quote]dmaddox wrote:
When the Israelis settlement goes up, are they kicking Arabs off their land or is it just a piece of empty land?[/quote]
Empty land duly paid for to legal owner in voluntary, arms-length, transactions.[/quote]
So when the Israel government buldozed all those settlements, those people were up a creek without a paddle. They lost their money and their land? It reverted back to the original owner?[/quote]
I don’t know if it reverted back, but there was a compensation fund, so the Israeli taxpayers paid the settlers in Gush (for example) for the land condemned by Israel and given to the arabs (or left unoccupied).
Somewhat off topic, but the Gush is a pristine white sand beach with decent surfing for the Mediteranian. Perfectly located near tourist sites between Egypt and Israel. Ideal weather. Great fishing, both surf and just off shore. Wine country couple hours to the north.
The arabs are sitting on a tourist gold mine. If they stop trying to kill their neighbors, they’d be rich.
Interesting read. Bold is mine. It doesn’t sound like what Israel did was illegal according to international law.
San Remo Manual on International Law Applicable to Armed Conflicts at Sea, 12 June 1994
SECTION II : METHODS OF WARFARE
Blockade
A blockade shall be declared and notified to all belligerents and neutral States.
The declaration shall specify the commencement, duration, location, and extent of the blockade and the period within which vessels of neutral States may leave the blockaded coastline.
A blockade must be effective. The question whether a blockade is effective is a question of fact.
96. The force maintaining the blockade may be stationed at a distance determined by military requirements.
A blockade may be enforced and maintained by a combination of legitimate methods and means of warfare provided this combination does not result in acts inconsistent with the rules set out in this document.
98. Merchant vessels believed on reasonable grounds to be breaching a blockade may be captured. Merchant vessels which, after prior warning, clearly resist capture may be attacked.
and
SECTION VI : CAPTURE OF NEUTRAL MERCHANT VESSELS AND GOODS
Neutral merchant vessels are subject to capture outside neutral waters if they are engaged in any of the activities referred to in paragraph 67 or if it is determined as a result of visit and search or by other means, that they:
(a) are carrying contraband;
(b ) are on a voyage especially undertaken with a view to the transport of individual passengers who are embodied in the armed forces of the enemy;
(c ) are operating directly under enemy control, orders, charter, employment or direction;
(d) present irregular or fraudulent documents, lack necessary documents, or destroy, deface or conceal documents;
(e) are violating regulations established by a belligerent within the immediate area of naval operations; or b are breaching or attempting to breach a blockade.[/b]
[quote]Mishima wrote:
ok lets shoot everybody who critizes Israel in advance - because they are all terroristloving scum who support sucidide bombing israeli childres. lets kill them all. [/quote]
interesting.
do you think it is wrong when Hamas kills israeli children in a suicide bombing?
Or is it only wrong when Israel attacks civilians?
These people are living behind walls as a result of relentless suicide attacks perpetrated by Hamas.
If it were Israel’s goal to have an apartheid state and have Palestinians living behind walls, why did it take Israel 52 years to begin their construction? Not to mention that Egypt, a muslim state has their own walls around Gaza.
[quote]Rational Gaze wrote:
This attack was launched in international waters. There is video footage of Israeli soldiers shooting at passengers before boarding the ship. These ships (two of them registered with the USA) were full of humanitarian aid, innocent civilians. Nearly twenty people have been killed.
This is sickening, there is no justification for this, no excuses. If there is any retaliation for this, they have brought it on themselves.[/quote]
I’d really like to see that footage. All I’ve seen so far is troops roping down to the shipes and then being attacked.
Didn’t JFK do the same exact thing…and isn’t he a liberal hero??
[quote]weby wrote:
What is Israel has done and does on a daily basis is state terrorism, I wish someone would blow up the israeli lobby up in America maybe then something might happen to these scums.[/quote]
Since when is self-defense terrorism? Every conflict with Israel has been started by those who attack it in order to destroy it. NAME ONE CONFLICT THAT WAS INSTIGATED BY ISRAEL?
[/quote]
Only facts that matter:
1: 3000 missiles where launched from gaze into Israel last YEAR ALONG.
2: Syria, Jordan, Turkey, and Egypt could END THE SUFFERING of the Pali’s TOMMOROW…instead they keep them poor and stupid as a political ploy…
3: Israel has the RIGHT TO DEFEND HERSELF.
Only facts that matter:
1: 3000 missiles where launched from gaze into Israel last YEAR ALONG.
2: Syria, Jordan, Turkey, and Egypt could END THE SUFFERING of the Pali’s TOMMOROW…instead they keep them poor and stupid as a political ploy…
3: Israel has the RIGHT TO DEFEND HERSELF.
End of fucking debate.[/quote]
Agree with 1 and 3, and 2 if you add Israel to that list (although - Turkey? Why?)
The fact remains, though, that there’s a humanitarian crisis going on in Gaza. And yes, I blame Hamas for that as well.