One-Million Dollarz… I’m game!!
I’ll even throw in an autographed picture of the great Cassanova, Love Goddess. hahahahah.
But in all seriousness, since saturated fat is best for our bodies because it is NATURAL… the t-man who successfully survives the challenge will have the most solid cell membranes that you have ever seen!
And we all know how important cell membrane structure is for our health? Heck, lets make them stronger too!
“Me go now pick nose.”
Cake, does this mean you’re starting the caveman diet?
recently a study was reported and made the national news too i belive, that concluded the single most important factor in determining mortality/health was physical activity.
as a former biology student, getting a BBS and in the masters program for a year, before switching to nursing, i have some knowlege of stats. i am usually quite critical of most studies and can find faults if i know enough about them.
what impressed me about this study is the large size of the sample(over 5000) and the length of the study(many, many years).
in a peanut-shell, a V.A. doc followed several thousand middle age men in the V.A. system for a number of years, and found at the end of the study, the ones still alive had one thing in common…they were physically active, either by profession or by lifestyle. so you could be a strict vegan, health-food nut, have perfect cholesterol levels, or chain-smoke, swill beer, whatever, but in the “end”, if you engaged in regular vigorous exercise/activity, you lived the longest.
not the end all, but interesting…
Guys, I’ve already done THE diet!! I lost over 20 lbs one time while living off of gas station Honey Buns, Big Mac Meals (not super sized), and Fruit Loops. I’m alive and kicking.
Cyco: Just wanted to make a note here before any misinformation gets thrown around. You said butter lots of ‘unnatural trans fats’. That is completely wrong. While butter does have a very small % of trans fats (as does olive oil, flax oil, and animal fat) the fat in butter is is mostly saturated with a balance of monos, and O6/O3 polys
HONEY BUNS!!! YES!!! They are awesome. I can’t believe Dan McVicker didn’t prescribe those to Neil after the doorknob in sock routine.
heavythrower,
I read some stats. recently that concluded that the three biggest underlying killers(those things that promote cancer, heart disease and diabetis), were: Smoking, obesity and inactivity.
This would fall in line with the study that you site regarding activity level being important to longevity. I personally believe this to be the case.
On an anecdotal basis, I have a female cousin who takes every form of vitamin and nutrient there is, Yet, never, ever works out. She is overweight by 30lbs or so (and its fat) and looks at least 5 to 8 years older than her actual age. Incidentally, she is also in poor health.
Conversely, her brother, does not believe in vitamins, or even a proper diet for that matter. But, he is a mason and probably burns more calories in a day than any of us. Needless to say he looks great, ripped and muscular! His body fat is probably less than 12%. He is always the picture of health and never misses a day of work.
These two examples are not scientific. But, we can learn from people in our lives.
Would my cousin be better off if she exercised? Most definitely. Would her brother be better off if he had a better diet. Probably, but the three biggest killers are not, smoking, obesity and a lack of vitamins!
I do think activity is the key!
From my little example who is better off without the other?
Why are you guys so hard on NeilG? He’s only 18. Do you remember how you were at 18? He’s just trying a little too hard; don’t hate on him.
Sometimes people will belive everything the read( its in print it must be real) As you get older and hopefully wiser you can debate things and here all sides to a point.
Hey I like NeilG at least he does a lot of studing the subject, he may come on strong be he is helping other people learn thru this debate.
Mayfield
Obviously you cannot read sarcasm thru my post 
Dairy fat contains ~2-10% various trans fat(eladic c18:1t9, vaccenic c18:1t11 and another i cant recall the name of, c18:1t10), caused by bacterial hydrogenation/isomerisation. It also contains far less (3/5ths of fook all) n-3/n-6 fatty acids (depends on feed really-but recent research showed that increasing n-3 fats in cows diets also increased trans content of fat produced-not a lot mind you, but still significantly), butter is predominantly safa (c4:0, c12:0 and c14:0 are common) and some mufa (c18:1).
(2)
I’ve read most of John Berardi (who I think represents for the most part the thoughts of most people at t-mag) and a lot of the WAPF stuff, including the book by Enig/Fallon “Nourishing Traditions”. In no order here are my thoughts on how the two compare, since a.)they really aren’t that different and b.)I think there is a lot of cosfusion from people without much knowledge about the viewpoints of either camp:
1.WAPF feels that polyunsaturated intake should be limited to >4% of total calories. Berardi feels it should take up one third or more of fat intake, but since he only advocates up to 35% of calories as fat 1/3 is 12% of calories or slightly more.
My thoughts:
Unless you are getting all fat from pasture fed animals you probably need more than 4% to balance 6:3. Beyond that, I can’t say, I know I’m doing pretty well with around 8%.
2.WAPF feels that fat intake should be in most cases 40% or above of caloric intake. JB feels it should only go up to 35%.
My thoughts:
I’m doing well on a diet with about 40-45% and I think my overall recovery times are better (I’m a sprinter, not a bodybuilder) when I stay at least in this range. But of course, thats just me and both camps stress individuality.
3.Instead of the fat JB encourages the upping of protein in macronutrient content by up to about 50%. WAPF feel that high protein diets lead to Vitamin A depletion and loss of bone mass.
My thoughts:
I eat over a gram of protein a day and recover better when I do so. I also think that game with about 10g raw butter (www.organicpastures.com) is better for me than fatty naturally raised but not organic Whole Foods meat.
4.JB is very attuned to insulin levels, WAPF feels that because of Price’s research combining fat and carbs is OK and grains should be milled.
My thoughts:
I do better when I just eliminate grains and go with fruits/veggies in about equal proportions. JB has said that low GI fruits and non-starchy veggies are OK with fats so although I may consume more than 15g of carbs with protein and fat meals they are not of the nature that they would produce insulin rises.
I think WAPF are underestimating the effect a diet full of refined sugars prior to switching to a “Nourishing Traditions” diet can have. If one is raised eating corn and butter or rye bread and butter they can flourish, but when switching to it the complications can be bad.
All in all, I agree with a lot of stuff from both camps and have molded the two together to form a diet plan I am seeing a lot of sucess with (body comp and recovery). I am not going to the extreme in either way and I think this is serving me well.
" The point, I think, is that if one donut (or a certain number of donuts, not to exceed a given level) has no discernable impact on your health, then it is not, in fact, “unhealthy”. "
Cyanide, therefore, is not unhealthy either, because if consumed in infinitessimal doses it will not cause harm. Such a statement is of course utterly and absolutely meaningless and moronic, which I pray you realize.
?
2> Neil G is after attention. If you don’t reply to any of his child like “circular reasoning” he will go away. I promise.?
I?d be willing to bet you have no idea what circular reasoning even is.
?No, zulu, the statements are neither idiotic nor meaningless. You obviously cant understand the concept.
You cannot proove that adding a donut to the diet is unhealth because one donut every now and again is going to make NO difference to the body at all. Worried about the trans fat content of the donut, how it is all unnatural etc, why eat butter with all its ‘unnatural’ trans fat??
Jesus fuck. Butter contains no trans fat? so I have no clue what you?re talking about. Secondly, the statement IS meaningless and stupid. You obviously have no grasp on the most basic logical skills.
You people attacking Neil by deferring to the nearest student in the field really need to start bloody THINKING for yourselves. You?re all a disgrace to this forum.
-Z
You know Neil at times reminds me of the conversations behind the creation of Jared in the round table- almost to unbelievably off that it was funny. Hmmmm if I didn’t know any better…naaa ;0)~
Mounfor,
Great post-You laid it all out there!
ZEB, I’ve seen that sort of example also.
In my case it’s my wife’s 2nd cousin and her husband.
She is in her 50’s, him in his 70’s, and he is easily in vastly better shape than her. He’s been a machinist his whole life, loves to fool around with metal. He eats what he wants, never takes vitamins or worries about his steak and potatoes. Looks her age also, surely doesn’t look 70’s.
Her health on the other hand is a total disaster. She is always overweight, bordering on obese. Takes every vitamin and supplement known to man, and some not known to anyone but wackos. Her “job” is to actively hunt out wackos to buy “life enhancing vitamins” from them. At least it seems like that.
She has been in every multilevel/health related networking type business there is, constantly contests that this current one is the ‘shits’, and within a week or two is onto another program.
Only thing she has never done for her health is stay reasonably active. Instead she always complains that her legs/arms/body is sore/not working, and needs to fix it with a miracle pill.
Great example for the magic pill types.
Actually, if you bite into an apple core, you are eating cyanide. In infintessimal amounts.
You know, Zulu, for someone who goes around saying that people attack other people without any reasoning behind their arguments, you just did a damn fine job yourself.
Cyanide, therefore, is not unhealthy either, because if consumed in infinitessimal doses it will not cause harm. Such a statement is of course utterly and absolutely meaningless and moronic, which I pray you realize.
Meaningless? Moronic? Pretty strong words there, bud. (And I’m not the one misspelling “infintessimal”.)
But okay, I’ll bite. I challenge you to show me (and the rest of the morons on this forum) how taking an infintesimal dose of cyanide - which, by your own admission, will not cause any harm - can be harmful to your health. (Mind you, in my post above I was very clearly talking about amounts of X that were small enough not to affect one’s health.) If you can’t show how something that won’t cause harm will cause harm, then I suggest you aplogize to everyone for calling them names.
This ought to be fun.
LOL, you still don’t get it. Cyanide isn’t unhealthy in infinitessimal amounts… but it is still UNHEALTHY as such. Same as a donut.
And btw, if you expect someone to prove that ANYTHING, in ANY quantity is unhealthy you won’t succeed. You will have rendered the term ‘unhealthy’ meaningless in daily conversation. But anyway, seems like you’re too dense to get it.
-Zulu
I feel compelled to mention that I think the majority of people on this forum are here to share their opinions and insight, although many times they may vary. The degrees of knowledge and differing topics pertaining to Nutrition, training, supplementation and such make this sight trully unique and beneficial.
However, although there are differing opinions on many things most dogmatic statements are made with caution and at the very least some scientific foundation - not some quick google search and a cut and paist.
Where am I going with this?
I think the majority of reasonable people on this forum gave NeilG a chance, as a matter of fact, I think we have given him several chances. I never ment to pick on him or deliberatly put him down, yet I did take offense when I tried to help him and I PM?d him and he responded with advice for me. I wrote him that although he is having great results with what he is doing it doesn?t mean that his way is the only way. I think we all had great results when we started working out. I myself started with the Atkins diet over 4 years ago and lost a significant amount of weight. Yes my body composition changed and I felt better than I did in years. This doesn?t mean that I should get on line and start advocating the Atkins diet to as the real deal…especially to a forum of people that have deeper knowledge of things than I could possibly have.
I think there is a lot of learning and such that needs to take place in all of us especially a 18 year old with less than one year of training under his belt.
PS. sorry for any typos, misspelling and such. I currently in budda argentina and connection time is limited.