Indigo-3G Observers Thread

Nutrition
162

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]sniper1 wrote:
While I’m sure these thoughts have crossed a lot of our minds, why verbalize it? Maybe this is the time that somebody finally gets things turned around once and for all. I can sit here and find fault in every person on this website if I try, doesn’t really do any good though.

Constructive ctiticism is one thing, but saying you sure look like shit for a level 4 is just trying to make yourself look better, whether you’re doing that consciously or not. I question the people that have a half million posts, and 50% of them are belittling other people, those people most likely, are the most phony people on here.[/quote]

Why verbalize it? There are many good reasons…like the realization that sweeping it under the carpet isn’t actually helping anyone.

There are clearly people here who actually have many posts on the board or who have literally bought tons of supps who have obviously not been doing anything in the gym but showing up…maybe…and then relapsing into a “pallet of cheeze-its” or a pile of cake over and over while buying literally everything this company released.

I doubt anyone paid much attention before…but it is seriously funny how some of us can be judged from the ground up (even down to our character and psyche), but if we dare notice the huge number of people not doing shit, suddenly we’re the bad guys.

That makes no sense.

No one is simply saying “you look like shit for a level four”…because that impliues we are only looking at a minority.

I mean, are some of you really looking at this?

I would say MOST of the people with pictures posted look like straight up newbs…but the goal is to act like that isn’t the case?

Why?

can you explain what good ignoring it does?

Please do so in detail.

No one here is writing that to make themselves look better. If YOUR goal is to change how you look, realizing just how much effort it will take can only help you.

The only thing that comes from ignoring it…is the generation of a fantasy play land where everyone gets to pretend they take this seriously while online before they return to that box of Oreos.

Solution:

How about…if you have been lifting for upwards of 5 years and spent over 10 grand in supplements but don’t look like you lift…that you continue buying supplements but DONATE them to people who will actually put them to good use.
[/quote]

Very good post. I wrote something similar shortly after team 1 was picked… looking forward to team 2’s results now.

163

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]sniper1 wrote:
While I’m sure these thoughts have crossed a lot of our minds, why verbalize it? Maybe this is the time that somebody finally gets things turned around once and for all. I can sit here and find fault in every person on this website if I try, doesn’t really do any good though.

Constructive ctiticism is one thing, but saying you sure look like shit for a level 4 is just trying to make yourself look better, whether you’re doing that consciously or not. I question the people that have a half million posts, and 50% of them are belittling other people, those people most likely, are the most phony people on here.[/quote]

Why verbalize it? There are many good reasons…like the realization that sweeping it under the carpet isn’t actually helping anyone.

There are clearly people here who actually have many posts on the board or who have literally bought tons of supps who have obviously not been doing anything in the gym but showing up…maybe…and then relapsing into a “pallet of cheeze-its” or a pile of cake over and over while buying literally everything this company released.

I doubt anyone paid much attention before…but it is seriously funny how some of us can be judged from the ground up (even down to our character and psyche), but if we dare notice the huge number of people not doing shit, suddenly we’re the bad guys.

That makes no sense.

No one is simply saying “you look like shit for a level four”…because that impliues we are only looking at a minority.

I mean, are some of you really looking at this?

I would say MOST of the people with pictures posted look like straight up newbs…but the goal is to act like that isn’t the case?

Why?

can you explain what good ignoring it does?

Please do so in detail.

No one here is writing that to make themselves look better. If YOUR goal is to change how you look, realizing just how much effort it will take can only help you.

The only thing that comes from ignoring it…is the generation of a fantasy play land where everyone gets to pretend they take this seriously while online before they return to that box of Oreos.

Solution:

How about…if you have been lifting for upwards of 5 years and spent over 10 grand in supplements but don’t look like you lift…that you continue buying supplements but DONATE them to people who will actually put them to good use.
[/quote]

Can you offer a more realistic, less sarcastic solution? Do you think the type of guys you are referring to are bringing down the quality of forums or this site on the whole? We’ll say fine…overabundance of guys who have been at this a long time but show little evidence of it…what now? Should the people who get to use the premier supps be determined by a vote of other members after they post some pics?

On a somewhat related note, you don’t always know the story behind everyone’s path to level 3, 4, or 5. For instance, I’ve been around a rather short time here, and saw myself shoot up to level 4 in no time, as I found Metabolic Drive to be an excellent and affordable meal replacement for a physics grad student in a time crunch. Helped me lean out, too! I could’ve jumped in and had a fair shot at getting the I-3G, but stepped back as I realized I’m still so new to the lifting game and need to see where good old hard work gets me.

164

[quote]jskrabac wrote:

Can you offer a more realistic, less sarcastic solution?[/quote]

You mean like asking people to be brutally honest with themselves so we see less people who have been training for half a decade but look like the same New Years Resolutioners that fuck up my lat pull down machine every year?

[quote]
Do you think the type of guys you are referring to are bringing down the quality of forums or this site on the whole? [/quote]

Didn’t say anything like that. This is fantasy play land for most of these people anyway if that is the result of YEARS of hard work and tons of supplements.

I do, however, think people being honest with what actually works can do nothing but increase the value and overall effect of these forums.

That is what conquers bullshit…real world results…not TALK.

? The sales tactics seem to be working for this company so why would it need to change them?

I am talking about how many people seem to think that “magic bullet” is what is keeping them from making progress…when it is very clear they haven’t actually worked very hard for shit in the gym…because people who do don’t look like that.

[quote]
On a somewhat related note, you don’t always know the story behind everyone’s path to level 3, 4, or 5. For instance, I’ve been around a rather short time here, and saw myself shoot up to level 4 in no time, as I found Metabolic Drive to be an excellent and affordable meal replacement for a physics grad student in a time crunch. Helped me lean out, too! I could’ve jumped in and had a fair shot at getting the I-3G, but stepped back as I realized I’m still so new to the lifting game and need to see where good old hard work gets me. [/quote]

I do believe I keep mentioning a LENGTH OF TIME SPENT TRAINING in every response. No one is expecting people who just started lifting to look like veterans.

However, many of these people have been here for upwards of 5 years…if not ten years in some cases. In my honest opinion, short of major illness, most of these people are bullshitting themselves as well as anyone else around them.

That is why those types jump first at the next new product…because they think THAT is what is holding them back…and not the inconsistent training, the half assed lifting intensity, and the inability to pick a single goal and shoot for it all out instead of running in circles.

Why not just be real about what works?

Half assed training does NOT.

We can see that now.

165

[quote]Professor X wrote:

That is why those types jump first at the next new product…because they think THAT is what is holding them back…and not the inconsistent training, the half assed lifting intensity, and the inability to pick a single goal and shoot for it all out instead of running in circles.

Why not just be real about what works?

Half assed training does NOT.

We can see that now.
[/quote]

Its a great point and your definatly not the first to make it X.

166

glad to see the prof on Indigo-3G. I hope for an uncompromising review. I am really expecting a lot out of Indigo-3G. FOr me when I take HOT-ROX for example I feel a slight increase in energy and I get a tiny bit leaner. But that is ok because it is only a small piece in my supplement arsenal and combined with good dieting I get good results. Indigo-3G is gonna take the place of most of my supplements for the month and it far exceeds what I usually shell per month. i wanna see drastic changes

167

[quote]buffd_samurai wrote:

[quote]hockeydawg wrote:

[quote]buffd_samurai wrote:
Back to topic.

All opinions aside, I am quite pleased Prof X and others are going to be using Indigo-3G. I believe (not sure) team 2 folks consist of more hardcore and experienced trainers, not just Velocity Diet participants…and I’m really interested to see if their experience mimics my own.

Between Velocity Dieters, people just trying to get in shape, fraternity boy chest and biceps only trainers, hardcore powerlifters, bodybuilders, and cross fit trainers, I hope a large cross section of people get to use it to really determine its positive effects no matter what you do or are.

I think it is pretty clear I’m sold on the product. I’ll very interested to see if others will be too…especially the harder core elements of T-Nation.[/quote]
Sorry I wasn’t “hardcore” enough for you.

I understand what you are saying, you would have liked a larger group of peers that were closer to you in experience and physique, but I don’t know if it’s fair to lump together such a large cross section of people and call them “Velocity Dieters”. That way you put it makes it sound derogatory, like a V-Diet participant is synonomous with a fat, unmotivatived, naive, newb.

Yeah, the V-Diet attracts some “newbs” that have little workout experience, are grossly overweight, and have had little motivation in the past. Some of them do the diet, see some success and then revert back to their old ways…yeah it happens. But that isn’t everyone. Some of us actually use it as a kickstart for a permanent change.

I fully realize that I am nowhere near your level of physique (I postulate this anyways since you made the personal decision not to post any pictures of yourself), but I think I was every bit as entitled to be a part of Team 1 as you were. Maybe my experience doesn’t directly translate or validate what you saw, but there are others out there that can look at what I have done and draw parallels to where they are and what the want to do to make a decision, just like there are people out there that look on your exerience and make a decision based on what you reported.

It seems to me that Team 1 did have quite a cross section of people. The fact that there were only 81 means that, yeah, there weren’t a whole lot of other guys in your exact situation. But there were a couple, and I would have much rather of had that, than 81 “hardcore” guys. First, selfishly, because I wouldn’t have been a participant, and secondly because then the conversation on this thread would now be about how there weren’t any less advanced guys, and questions about how would it work for the “average” guy who didn’t have 20+ years of experience in the gym.

[/quote]

Ah dude…it wasn’t my intention to lump everyone into the Velocity Dieter group…and you’re right, my words definitely can be construed to mean I’m being derogatory to those who were. Again, not my intention. And if you read my posts above to this thread, I’m even trying to defend those who really are a little too chubby but are doing something about it. In no way should you look at my opinion to indicate those in team 1 did not deserve to be on team 1. Again, not my intention.

But is was my intention to indicate it would have been nice to have a little more harder core population; you are right there. I will not apologize for that, because yes, being somewhat selfish myself, I have my own interests which would have been better served with the more hardcore element. Look at my posts, my spills, etc on I-3G…it ALWAYS leans towards possibilities of optimizing it even more…and typically with anabolics. I’m looking for more discussion on that topic…getting some, but wishing there were others with my experience level and using I-3G to delve deeper into it. And really now…I truly believe there are many in team 1 who have already categorized me into a certain unsavory group…not intending to (or maybe intending to)…but have a bit. Just like I may have a little but didn’t intend to. It’s all good.

There are hardcore guys on team 1. The Mighty Stu, Synergy, Hospitaller, etc…so you’re right, there is a cross section. There are also really wonderful people in there too who are not at a higher training level but are working their butt off, and I definitely am glad they are part of team 1 as well. But, and this is just me being selfish, it would be really nice to have a bigger hardcore population. Something I think team 2 has. [/quote]

Buffed, drop me a PM.

168

I’ll throw in here, without getting in to a heated debate…those that choose to take Indigo will be impressed. I can’t beleive how far up I have been able to take my carbs and still drop BF.

And if you haven’t read buffed’s log, it’s on the money.

169

question for some of your I3G users… how much money a month are you spending on supps?

I was reading through some of the I3G logs and read some say that they just ordered 4 more boxes of FINiBARs for this month.

I read another guy describing his workout protocol for 2 scoops Anaconda, 2 scoops SWF (or Surge recovery. cant remember) and 1 scoop MAG-10.

I know most people are using the supp staples of a multi, fish oil and whey. All of those items, plus the $400 I3G, would be totaling $600-$700 a month right?

I was just wondering because I was thinking that spending $600+ dollars a month on supps alone sounds crazy to me lol… thats not even counting your normal food. Anyone have any input?

171

[quote]gregron wrote:
question for some of your I3G users… how much money a month are you spending on supps?

I was reading through some of the I3G logs and read some say that they just ordered 4 more boxes of FINiBARs for this month.

I read another guy describing his workout protocol for 2 scoops Anaconda, 2 scoops SWF (or Surge Recovery. cant remember) and 1 scoop MAG-10.

I know most people are using the supp staples of a multi, fish oil and whey. All of those items, plus the $400 I3G, would be totaling $600-$700 a month right?

I was just wondering because I was thinking that spending $600+ dollars a month on supps alone sounds crazy to me lol… thats not even counting your normal food. Anyone have any input?[/quote]

I actually had this same thought today. Where’s the poor man’s version of the protocol? Most of the spills from CT and Shugs make it seem like it’s IMPOSSIBLE to make serious progress without everything you just listed. Unfortunately, that amount of money is what alot of us are paying for rent =)

172

Asking about cost is a valid question in order to assess the economic trade-off of I3G for ones own purpose.

For example, many people have been able to lose fat and increase carbs by merely changing their eating pattern to a Lean-gains IF style where the majority of calories and carbs are post workout on training days and kept lower carbs, lower cals on rest days.

Some of the questions everyone needs to ask are:

  1. What’s my goal?
  2. Do I have a real bio-physical limitation preventing me from achieving that goal.
  3. What’s my time frame to acheive that goal?
  4. Will a given supplement help me get there faster and is that speed worth the cost of the supplement?
  5. Will a given supplement actually over-ride a bio-physical limitation I have in achieving my goal?

So far, it looks like if you answer yes to #2 and #5, Indigo may be worth the price. For example, those with hormonal problems seem to be seeing results and advanced trainees near their limit (like Stu and buffd) seem pretty convinced it’s helped them out. However for those of us in the middle, the cost / speed trade-off becomes important. I haven’t seen that the peri-workout protocols are special enough that they’re worth the cost over regular food and whey/casein blends.

I will personally vouche for dark chocolate finibars as a very tasty, low-fat way to up your carbs on workout days. Basically a candy-bar for the physique conscious individual. They are awesome.

173

[quote]Chushin wrote:
What do you care?

If someone has, and wants to spend, thousands on supps, why does it matter to you?

Will getting answers to your questions help you with your own progress somehow?

Or are you just looking to put other people down?[/quote]

Why do you care, that he cares?

If he wants to know if someone has, and wants to spend, thousands on supps, why does it matter to you?

Will getting an answer to your question help you with your own progress somehow?

Or are you just looking to put other people down?

174

Personally I am doing it the poor man way. I bought Indigo and that is it. I cannot afford everything else as I am applying to medical school and that is quite expensive. So i just make my own workout shakes. It may not be optimal but its what I can do. I decided to do the indigo even though I was doing well with IF but I do have a couple hormonal inbalances that have yet to be resolved (been almost a year of trial so far).

I wanted just a little extra edge. I am 7days in and really notice 1 effect. No bloating after carb meals. I take in at least 100g carbs for my 3 meals of the day and that used to make me bloated but it would dissappear after a couple of hours. Now I never get it. That has been very nice.

175

For me it wasnt about eating more carbs it was about my body using things the way it should since I am sure my hormonal profile doesnt help my body work optimaly for muscle growth.

176

[quote]ryanbCXG wrote:
For me it wasnt about eating more carbs it was about my body using things the way it should[/quote]

This is how I rationalize the effects I experienced during my recent contest prep. Most days, I was only about to have about 175g of carbs (aside from the occasional high day), but I was able to retain a ridiculous amount of LBM while achieving my best ever (so far!) conditioning.

S

177

What do YOU spend on your hobby? your fun? your passion? I know people who spend $10,000 to well over $100k each yeah on sports cars, motorcycles, boats, sports tickets, concert tickets, time share condos, travel, etc. It’s all about what it is worth to YOU! This is my passion, this is my fun, it is what I love to do.

I spend a lot each month, more if there is something I want to try or add to the arsenal…and Indigo-3G is proving to be worth every penny.

178

[quote]Chushin wrote:

[quote]gregron wrote:
question for some of your I3G users… how much money a month are you spending on supps?

I was reading through some of the I3G logs and read some say that they just ordered 4 more boxes of FINiBARs for this month.

I read another guy describing his workout protocol for 2 scoops Anaconda, 2 scoops SWF (or Surge recovery. cant remember) and 1 scoop MAG-10.

I know most people are using the supp staples of a multi, fish oil and whey. All of those items, plus the $400 I3G, would be totaling $600-$700 a month right?

I was just wondering because I was thinking that spending $600+ dollars a month on supps alone sounds crazy to me lol… thats not even counting your normal food. Anyone have any input?[/quote]

What do you care?

If someone has, and wants to spend, thousands on supps, why does it matter to you?

Will getting answers to your questions help you with your own progress somehow?

Or are you just looking to put other people down?[/quote]

Dude, what is up with you in this thread and people asking questions?

Is that not allowed now?

179

[quote]gregron wrote:
question for some of your I3G users… how much money a month are you spending on supps?

I was reading through some of the I3G logs and read some say that they just ordered 4 more boxes of FINiBARs for this month.

I read another guy describing his workout protocol for 2 scoops Anaconda, 2 scoops SWF (or Surge recovery. cant remember) and 1 scoop MAG-10.

I know most people are using the supp staples of a multi, fish oil and whey. All of those items, plus the $400 I3G, would be totaling $600-$700 a month right?

I was just wondering because I was thinking that spending $600+ dollars a month on supps alone sounds crazy to me lol… thats not even counting your normal food. Anyone have any input?[/quote]

My personal take on it is this…honestly, most people running to use this are NOT the types to even see the greatest benefit.

Someone like Stu or anyone else more advanced understands already what it takes to see what they want from their body…so dialing it up a notch to hit that upper 10% after already reaching the other 90 can be far more noticeable and effective. These people understand that the hard work comes from them and aren’t completely reliant on a supplement to see advanced progress to start with.

To those who have put the time in doing what it takes in the gym, yeah, I would say some of these products are worth it.

180

Spent a bit of time reading around in logs and all…I’m unsure how to proceed forward, but for the time being, I’m just going to keep things status quo in regards to my nutrition, and go from there. If I don’t notice or see anything I can quantify, at least a little, I’ll just discontinue use and restart after I’m back to a surplus cal phase.