How about this: how can a nation complain about people not having a sense of civic duty while also espousing ideals that revolve around selfishness?
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Governments are made up of people and in this country how does it go? Of the people…
You don’t think we already have redistribution? I think we have a lot of it. And it’s not going to the people I’m talking about. It’s actually going to the people who need it the least. Who actually works to make sure the rules of government help them out? Who is in the halls? Who helps craft the legislation by lobbying? Who pays for huge fundraising efforts and expensive dinners and why? It ain’t poor people. Hell it ain’t even people like me who aren’t poor. Redistribution happens often in this country. It just isn’t in the sense you’re using the word. The redistribution to those with less is carefully measured and calculated. Enough so those people will stay in line. Enough so people won’t have such a small amount that they notice the actual large amounts of redistribution above them. And much of that is just going to work it’s way back up anyways.
A certain level of comfort? Explain that one to someone with nothing. Explain that to people scared to go to the hospital because the cost may ruin their life. Do you think the airline executives who bought back so much stock have ever considered waiting to see if they could beat an illness without help because the price?
Opportunity is vastly different in this country for certain kids and families. If you were living here I could introduce you to them. For some kids their parents are saying “look how low the market may go, what a perfect time to buy!” For others they just know they didn’t have much when dad had a job and now his future is uncertain. They aren’t concerned when the perfect time to buy stock is. They never had the chance to do that. And we’re worried about them getting a certain level of comfort?
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If his actions killed all of his colleagues in Congress, would it really be that bad?
I know that you’re just a troll, but it’s hard not to comment on this. Men are now being forced not to do business because it’s been deemed too dangerous by those doing the world’s most feminine job. Are you proposing that men disregard these government dictates and get back to work, while leaving the women, children, and the vulnerable in relative safety at home? Cool. Good Idea.
I have three children and a wife, both parents, three out of four grandparents(one in a nursing home), two sisters, two brothers-in-law, and five niece/nephews, both mother-and-father-in-law, and about 30 other in-laws. I truly have no idea how or why any of that would change one’s perspective.
“When things are going well, capitalism is okay. But when things go badly, we need government to save us.”
Same.
I was going to comment on this to tell you what type of comment you should expect in return, but I scrolled down a few posts and saw it had already been said.
I’d imagine @Alrightmiami19c agrees.
I’d imagine @Alrightmiami19c agrees.
Yep. So let’s double down on that! Sounds like a plan.
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To you I doubt it. You say you’re a Christian but you don’t ever seem to act like one. It’s not as if giving the virus to all members of Congress only puts them at risk. It’s not as if Rand was only around members of congress and no one else. But hey fuck those people as well. I mean what would we have him do? Stay inside for a bit in a giant beautiful house to protect others while he healed? Fuck that shit swim those laps.
I can only hope you’re not as callous and cold hearted with all those family members you mentioned as you’ve consistently shown here. For their sake and the sake of the poor people you claim to work with (and perhaps care about?) I hope your actions are essentially the polar opposite of the Mad Max no rules let society burn you espouse on here.
Thankfully the ideas of anarcho capitalism are limited to very few people. Though I wish they could see how quickly their dream society would crumble. They would be running back within a matter of weeks. The ideas you have of zero rules are absolutely as insane as the ideas of total government control.
But maybe this is just all God’s plan so why try and help others? Maybe Rand giving it to people is loving his neighbors? I wonder if we have different bibles?
Do you truly believe COVID-19 is any worse than any number of other illnesses that don’t require shutting down everything? I do not.
Yes. Rules are all it takes. Rules are, at least, most of what it takes. The most authoritarian societies alway have the most wealth. The USSR was so intimidated by an actor’s talk that it, the world’s wealthiest society, folded.
What do you, a guy that claimed to have some libertarian leanings during the Obama Presidency, believe is an appropriate response to COVID-19? Should people be arrested for leaving the house? Coughing in public? Should all places of business be shut down? Should Police, Fire-EMS, and Military personnel be the only people working?
No doubt. Every new law is a step closer to Paradise, you know.
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Who exactly is the troll?
I didn’t propose anything; I merely stated facts.
With that said, I will say that any libertarian, anarcho-capitalist comic book utopia will only exist as such: fiction for fanboys. The reality is, you can believe in economic Darwinism and privately funded freedom and civil rights all you want when things are good. But, when things go bad, and your kids are starving you won’t just let them die because it’s a matter of sticking to your principles (like Rev. Jim Jones). No, you will accept the obligation that comes with being a man and do whatever you have to to feed your family and wish you had never believed in a system that brought you to that point.
No, they would create a state that was even more authoritarian. Look at what Marx wrote and then compare that to the USSR or China. The Utopia in Utopia, the actual book by Thomas More, is a surveillance state that limits people’s movement and ability to assemble.
A lack of rules is in fact a rule. But it’s not about no rules; it’s about who makes the rules and that isn’t anything new.
Did I say that?
Absolutely. It has already shown the ability to stress our health care system in a way that we haven’t seen on a nationwide level in modern times. It’s doing all that even when we have taken steps to keep it from spreading rapidly. We just took those steps too late.
We have over 500,000 cases of the illness. It’s hit every state in the nation. Do you have any number where you would start to take it seriously? Or does it just never matter to you? Or are you going to be so caught up in linking deadlier diseases to ignore exactly what makes this different which is pure number of hospitalizations?
I mean 7 weeks ago I could see your point. Hell I have posts on this forum saying sounds like an overreaction. But that’s before it exploded across the country. At what number does it need to reach? Or are you so entrenched in your position that another couple thousand is just no big deal? I changed my mind on it. I frequently change my mind when strong arguments are presented. Why don’t you?
Step one would have been to do a lot more earlier. We didn’t because well the economy and stuff. A very short sighted view. We maybe had the potential to avoid a long a long shutdown with different actions. But we had a leader who didn’t take it seriously until it was impossible to deny.
No.
No.
They aren’t.
They aren’t.
I didn’t say that. What functions best for society is a mixed market economy. That’s essentially a proven fact at this point. Arguing for no government is just as absurd as arguing for the government to do everything.
Thinking society should never adapt to unique challenges like this one is flat insane. Something tells me you’re staying inside maybe not working much with a lot of free time. I wonder how your response would change should all those people you mentioned be at a high risk? If it wouldn’t change then we simply don’t view things the same way. I feel an obligation to change my life at this moment of time. Not just to protect my loved ones but other people’s as well.
We gained 501,882 from March 10 to April 10. When do you think it’s time to view this as an issue?
You did not I apologize. But that wasn’t my point in bringing that up as you can see from the rest of my post.
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My feelings, previous generations have failed us just as were failing our children. Slowly giving away what was the greatest system of self governance ever created. It wasn’t strong enough and eventually human nature will break it down until the one light of freedom in the world gets dimmer and dimmer and is eventually snuffed out.
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I wouldn’t disagree with this on the whole. But I also think the opportunities for the average kid to go on to do something great are much higher today than they were 100 years ago. I don’t believe any expansion of government is automatically creating a worse world. Anymore than I think is getting rid of something “stupid” the government does is a mistake.
I think you have to balance it all as best as possible to adapt to a changing world. To me it’s a very simplistic view of our country to think anything done by government is automatically bad or good. We have all sorts of things I wish we didn’t do and all sorts of things I think we should. To me at least more action or less action is the wrong way to look at it. I’m much more interested in what the more or less looks like and I think this is the overwhelming way most Americans look at it. They just might not make as much noise in this Information Age.
That’s rational. COVID-19 is like being forced to drink bleach while being sodomized with a branding iron. Do you enjoy being sodomized with a branding iron while drinking bleach? If you disagree with anything, you must.
I don’t think this is the right move. Then again I’m that weirdo who thought Rand Paul acted like a moron and thinks Coronavirus is a threat so take that for what you will.
Any action of government requires power, which is derived from the people. But once that power is given it almost never gets returned to the people. So with every new law we are ceding power to the collective that we cannot get back. Its better to never give it away in the first place. The “what” is less important than you think.
Take for instance the Patriot act. Let’s say George W was the best person on the planet, second coming if Christ type of guy. He wields that executive power and never overreaches. Only targets true terrorists after mountains of evidence is compiled and so on. Lets say he doesn’t even invoke it. It’s just there for extreme cases. Now its already too late. That power is in the governments hands and it will not be returned. Fast forward, Satan NAZI Trump gets to weild that same power. He may not be so benevolent. See why temporary suspension of rights means loss of rights?
I want the government to do as little as possible and have no real significance in the average American’s life. I feel people can make their own decisions about their own lives.
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I disagree with can’t get back. Laws are changed all the time. I’m for child labor laws. I’m for speed limits. I’m for laws against rape and child abuse. If this is giving power to the collective I’m fine with it. I’m ok with laws against slavery. I don’t think the creation of those were bad. I think they were good.
What they do matters. I’m for roads, bridges, hospitals, schools, fire departments, law enforcement, the military. I may disagree and dislike some of the ways we use those things. But I don’t want them to not exist. I’m thankful that some of the kids I work with aren’t out on their own. I don’t think the meals they eat, medicine they get, glasses they have are insignificant.
I don’t think government needs to do everything. But I do think it should exist. And I don’t think any new law is necessarily bad. I bet if we asked blacks, women, and kids in 1880 (random year) if they would rather live I 2020 they would say yes.
If we want to say government shouldn’t have to do certain things I can get on board for sure. But I have a kid with a feeding button, helmet, diaper, non verbal. And he takes “advantage” of government things. He’s a real taker. He’s going to end up being one of those people who don’t pay income taxes. A complete drain on people like me who have some of their money taken by the government.
It’s going to be hard for me to think that kid shouldn’t be taken care of. I bet if he could talk his words wouldn’t be “I sure wish I didn’t have to deal with this oppressive government worker making sure I have formula!”
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Changed yes. But the power to do so is wielded where? No child left behind became common core. But who is still calling the shots? The federal government. Shouldnt have been involved in the first place.
To the rest of your post, the only legitimate role of government is to protect individual rights. Those being life, liberty and property.
But muh roads!!!
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Why wouldnt his parents, family and community take care of him without compelling everyone else to do it?