Thanks so much for the support - I’m not happy so the kind words are helpful. I take every failure as a fiery rage under my ass and it will push me until I have this one in the books.
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Thank you so much - I won’t leave it like this so you’ll see me soon in this weight class.
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- I usually aim to drink 4 litres per day (I know this is low but I’m not usually disciplined enough for more than that) and I use a gradual approach to water load (depending on how much I have to cut) - 10 days out I start with double what I usually drink and go up 1/2 to 1 litre more per day, usually ending around 12-14 litres. It seems that as long as you keep your body at a different level every day, it keeps it flushing.
- It was very old school back then - a lot of lasix and calorie restrictions (do not try this at home kids) - not a way to go. From what I hear today from my olympic lifting friends, it’s similar to the powerlifting cuts.
As for your comment about sauna timing - I totally see your point (an likely agree for a small to medium cut), but the challenge with large ones is that to cut that amount of weight, one high dose of diuretics in the morning wouldn’t be enough…let’s say I took a first dose at 11 and went into the sauna, I’d be done the process around 8/9 pm and instead of going straight to weigh in as it is doing sauna through the night, it would keep me in a very dehydrated state for 12-16 hours which is a lot of time cramping and further dehydration (it’s hard to time the diuretics I find and the more time I’m in a dehydrated state I get to puking, dizziness, cramping, low body temp, hypo…i try to keep this time down as short as possible so I aim to hit my numbers an hour or two before weigh in). It seems the sides are held off mostly until the process stops.
I know I used very general ideas - I will aim to write a proper article with these concepts - it will also be a topic in the book I’m currently writing. The trick to these phases is how long each one is and how much volume goes into each, as well as consideration to what level you’re starting at (do you have a good muscular base, how is your technique, is your body used to lifting over 85/90% - these variables matter when building blocks). This is a hard venue to get into a huge amount of detail without a specific case study - if you do have a specific question, I’m happy to try and help.
I cut from 232 to 198 just to prove I could for a meet 2 years ago. First time I squat 600 in a meet haha.
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Thanks for your response Amit. I guess I had just never “thought” about the different blocks, in the terms you mentioned.
It’s common to use the the" double progression" method or EMOMs (low reps, more sets) or something in the early/hypertrophy block. Its like a no-brainer this type of work would make your technique sharper, but I get so wrapped up in thinking about “hypertrophy ranges” I forget about trying to practice technique.
Or “absorbing force.” It’s not only moving heavy stuff heavy, you have to control the weights. The descent of a heavy squat “sets you up” for the reverse and ascent, if your technique is good, and you can absorb the weight and control the force.
Once again thanks for an informative answer. I have to apologize for being unclear in my earlier comment, although it won’t change any part of your answer. Nor should it, you have a large amount of experience and knowledge on it and I was mentioning it in passing. I find it interesting that it sounds like you often puke or go hypo when cutting, because I have never had someone puke and I aim to keep hypoglyemic symptoms at bay/minimized…although we all do I suppose. I have not helped anybody try to cut 30 lbs off and I frankly would not feel comfortable with that, it sounds like you are extremely close to some serious bad shit happening. Kudos to you.
I guess the follow up question is obvious–how do you personally know you’ve crossed a line and that you personally need to stop your cut/miss weight for safety reasons? What do you find most effective for cramping if you still need to keep cutting to make weight? I’ve used a few different things but I am always looking to improve my approach.
For your bodybuilding cuts, how much did you end up usually losing in water for the Olympia?
Amit, could you comment on the virtues of following a written training program for a meet prep as opposed to a more fluid day-to-day process of going by feel?
As a relative beginner I have found that I prefer to have an entire training cycle written out, right down to the sets and reps for assistance work (I have used a coach for help with the programming.) However since I follow a conjugate program, it wouldn’t be terribly difficult to just adhere to the system without an actual written program as long as I know what weights I need to hit and what weak points I need to focus on. I hope that makes sense. In your experience is one way better than the other?
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Perhaps in the future, Amir, Aragorn, and the other trainers here, would be kind enough to start a separate thread on weight cutting for fighters. This is really a very informative discussion. Thanks to all.
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You’re a special kind of beast. I heard your nutrition coach is a phenom…and extremely tall and handsome…the kind of guy you want to take home to mom.
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I am always open to hearing other coaches opinion - I love to learn from other informed coaches and take what I can.
I can definitely say when you’re doing those big cuts you’re riding a fine line between risking your health big time and being fine. I would say up to 20/22 lbs cut you can keep most symptoms at bay and keep it relatively safe…more than that, you’re taking a big toll on your kidneys and other body systems.
As for me, I’ll be honest and say that once I’ve decided I’m going to make weight, if I don’t pass out or cramp to the point of immobility, I’ll make the weight. It’s not a healthy way to think but I’ve always been very goal oriented and will push until I get there. I have a high threshold for discomfort and the thought of failure will push me to the end.
Potassium, calcium, magnesium in high doses are all very helpful. Keeping myself covered up with light compression between sauna sessions also seems to help with muscle cramping. Staying calm also helps - if you freak out it seems to make it significantly worse - keeping my mind as calm as possible helps it settle…even breathing right into the cramp seems to help. Also even my therapist says don’t stretch a cramp - it does seem to help for me much of the time.
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Exactly! Just about putting the right blocks into the right place in your training. There’s room for everything and all areas need to be addressed.
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Great idea - I actually have quite a background in martial arts and could have used then what i know now. For now, don’t hesitate to ask your questions here and tag Aragorn as well if you’d like his input.
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For a beginner or intermediate, I almost always recommend following a specific program to a T - down to reps, sets, everything. My reasons are that first it takes out the guessing game and lets you concentrate on lifting…in these levels there is a high tendency to down play or up play abilities (north america tends toward up play) which makes every workout a max attempt which will hinder progress at some point. Having a coach programming you for 12 weeks helps you to do the blocks correctly - push and back off when you need to. These are things that even for me are hard to do and I still bounce ideas off those I trust to ensure I’m not doing the same thing. I also think that real instinctual training can only happen after years and years of experience and trial/error with your own body and very few people can say they do it properly. I think just in the last 5 or 6 years I finally learned to stop training when I should (or push harder) despite what the program calls for.
So I guess to answer your question - I think following a program properly is better as long as you have a good coach. Monitor your progress and provide feedback so your coach can make necessary changes etc.
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Great to read your answers, very informative as always. It seems from your answers to everyone in his thread that we think along the same lines in many areas. Also, I do think being goal oriented is almost a prerequisite sometimes for success at anything as demanding as a weight cut or elite performance in any area.
A couple random questions just because I am curious–
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What would you say is your least favorite or most problematic lift in powerlifting? And if we threw olympic lifting in there what was your least favorite training lift (or even competitive lift) to work on? Why?
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What inspires you to lift now? Do you have any people that inspire you to lift? How do you motivate yourself?
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Are you ever going to lift (meaning film) a session with John Meadows? I feel like that would be some fun times and great viewing haha. I’d love to see you, Dave Tate, and John in the same building kicking each other’s butts.
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- It’s a complicated answer for me - as prior to my two bicep surgeries I was a fairly well rounded lifter (I used to bench 500 for 3, pull 750 with straps, and squat has always been strong but honestly my deadlift was my strongest lift for ages). The surgeries changes a lot for me (not sure if it was the surgery, doctor, my body…whatever, but no matter who I see at this point, and I’ve seen mannnyy therapists of all backgrounds, I can’t regain proper bicipital and arm function). Bench at the point is a huge issue because my biceps (and everything related) can no longer stabilize properly and it has cost me more than 100lbs which is more than frustrating. It also killed my grip completely which took about the same amount of weight off my deadlift. The combo is killer on my total which is frustrating since I could be competing for best totals as well as best squats. It’s not the fact that lost the numbers, it’s that I know what my body was capable of doing and now no matter what I do, I’m unable to get where I used to be. At least I’m still enjoying deadlifting, where bench has basically just become an excuse to lay down between important lifts
lol
As for Olympic lifting, I really enjoyed both competitive lifts. I remember having issue with grip on snatch (seems an ongoing issue for me) and used to be able to snatch 20-30lbs more with straps. My issues back then were mostly with exercises that required shoulder flexibility/mobility…overhead squats, drop snatch - not my favorites.
For body building I liked everything except lunges…to this day I’ve never met someone who likes those.
- I’ll give you a long answer… I still remember when I was 6 watching the Olympics and telling my mum I want to be the best in the world. I went through track and field, martial arts, Olympic lifting, body building, now powerlifting…I always had (and I remember so deeply and clearly to this day) and inexplicable drive to win and be the best. I always wanted to be better than everyone and had an insane will to prove it in everything that I cared about. There is no way for me to put into words properly for me to let you understand what I mean here…If I care about being the best at something, for me it becomes a complete obsession the runs my life, choice, thoughts, decisions, actions…pretty much everything I do from morning until night is purely to support me getting to my goal…it’s like a consuming fire…this may mean sacrifice, lack of attention to other sometimes important things, hurting personal relationships, etc (I think the only place I read some thing similar was when I read articles by Michael Jordan and Floyd Maywater etc - they are the best, but you may not want to be their friend).
I am aware that this ability to block everything in order to achieve, has served me well in my sport and has hurt a lot of other areas of my life. It’s so hard to know if it’s a good or bad thing …after 20 years I can see the prices I’ve paid. Young athletes who say to me that they will do whatever it takes, I always wonder if they actually know what that means - what needs to happen in mindset and choices to actually become the best. I always give the examples that Ieft my country, left unpaid bank loans, got divorced, risked my health more times than I’d like to admit, and all of it because of my will to be the absolute best with no question or dispute. This is why I moved to powerlifting - I was considered a good olympic lifter, some would say great body builder (considering I placed on the biggest stage in the world - Olympia), but by no means was I the best…this literally haunted me for my career and only now that I am near to having an actual squat legacy complete and doing things that haven’t been done, I am close to having SOME peace in my mind.
This brings me to your actual question about my current motivations/inspirations…first I want to complete my squat legacy and be the first to hold a world record in 4 classes at the same time (Ed Coan did it in deadlift and Mike Mcdonald in bench), second to open a gap so big 15 years from now people will still be chasing my records and cursing me in attempt to get there…basically the same point as above - my crazy will to win. Third, I want my two sons (they are only 3 and 4) to understand what their dad did and more importantly because of how hard it was for me to get to where I am today, I want them to understand that as long as you are willing to work hard, practice, ignore negativity and opinions, they can achieve whatever the hell they put their mind to. If I could make them understand that everything is possible, then I did my job as a dad and I can be at peace that I passed my legacy to the only ones that matter.
Honestly at this point there is no one I really look up to…there are a few people in the industry I really respect and love to bounce ideas off of (John Meadows is the first I think of - he helped me to get my first break and he taught me a lot personally and professionally and I’m forever grateful) but now I feel that it’s mostly me against me and I’m chasing my own numbers.
I know it’s not politically correct to write but the way i like to motivate myself right now is to open social media and read all the negative comments people write about me…proving people wrong has always been something I easily tap into as a motivator. If I had a dollar for everyone who told me I couldn’t turn pro body building - too short, wrong country, or had things to say about not being able to make a living etc…I’d be a millionaire. Best way to piss me off is to tell me I can’t do something - I’ll prove you wrong every time.
- I actually did a few filming sessions with John and Dave back at Elite when I was with them 2 years ago (I’m sure it’s somewhere on youtube) but I should give him a shout and do something again.
Hey Amit,
I was wondering what your opinion on trying to blend both olympic lifting and bodybuilding style training together, seeing as you have so much experience in both. I am primarily a bodybuilder now but at one point dabbled in the olympic lifts, a couple years ago when I was in high school, and was wondering if I could somehow integrate them both into my training. I was thinking something along the lines of the “Strong Bodybuilder Program” you wrote, substituting some of the compound lifts there for olympic lifts. However, I was also interested in the series you wrote on how to grow muscle, that was divided into 3 phases. I am having a hard time programming the frequency usually used by olympic lifters for squatting in a bodybuilding program. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
It’s possible to incorporate both for sure, but you do need to decide which one is a priority for you (sounds like bodybuilding?). If you want to incorporate Olympic lifting into one of my existing programs, here’s how I would probably do it:
For the strong bodybuilder program, you can take out the second compound movement and add the snatch or clean/jerk to the very beginning of the program (this makes what used to be the first compound movement into the second exercise). Example: if you are doing leg day - your first exercise is snatch (5 on 5, 6 on 4, 8 on 3, 6 on 2…change every week), then squat as per the program, drop the second compound movement (front squat), then continue the giant sets as written. Example 2: deadlift day - start with clean and jerk (same rep scheme as snatch), then deadlift, remove the second compound, then continue with the program as written.
Always begin with the Olympic lift because your CNS is fresh and needs to be to do them effectively, and it will help you for the rest of the workout…the weights aren’t heavy enough to tax the muscular system and your nervous system will be awake and ready to go.
This would be a basic way to incorporate.
Does that make sense?
For the second program - I would probably do them at the beginning of every session in week 1 and week 3 (since week 2 is hypertrophy it’s not an ideal place to put them)…this program probably isn’t ideal to put them in since it’s very body building focused. Saying that, if this is the program you like, what I would do in week 2 is take out a day or two of muscle work that’s not a priority for you (example - arm and shoulder?) and just do a full olympic lift day with variations.
Thanks Amit,
Yeah the second program interested me because of the undulating volume and use of intensity techniques. I’ve never really used a cyclic program like that so it could lead to some nice gains, or so I hope.
As for my focus my current goal is to able to compete in both an olympic weightlifting competition and a bodybuilding competition. The former of which I have done before. I had a friend of mine recommend I waited till I was older, as I turned 18 a couple months ago, to compete in bodybuilding (or maybe classic physique) as he had a bad experience with a prep coach. That being said I would have no idea how close or far I am from being able to compete, and I wouldn’t want to do so unless I truly believed I would win.
Do you think high rep squatting has any place in an olympic lifting program? intuitively it doesn’t seem so to me but I may be wrong.
Thanks for the reply!
If you want to post pictures I don’t mind letting you know how far I think you are from being able to compete and what you need to improve?
Competitive Olympic lifting is all about neural efficiency, speed, technique…strength is important but far from the main factor (muscle mass is the same) - so no, high rep squats doesn’t really have a place in a Olympic lifting program (it probably wont hurt much but isn’t necessary)…if you want to compete in Body building or classic physique it definitely has a place though!!