I didn’t say the data was flawed. I said they way you are looking at it is.
You have to control for other variables such as things @Basement_Gainz mentioned
If there are more black people in areas where the incidents you are looking at happen (police shootings or crime in general) it is not surprising that more get stopped compared to other populations that are not in those areas. You need to control the variables to compare apples to apples. That is what the study did, and it concluded:
So… You replied to my post by accident? Because I didn’t speak on anything you just typed out.
I think I meant to reply to someone you replied to. I think it was actually powerpuff who posted about Saad and brought up cognitive privilege. Regardless, I was commenting on the idea of equal outcomes (which I don’t agree with) vs equal opportunity (what I do agree with).
Fair enough man. I was really confused.
I’m simply stating facts.
Black folks are killed by cops at a much higher rate than white folks. FACT.
How you attempt to explain the FACT is up for discussion, but the quantitative FACT is not.
Justified or not, I think we can all agree that the killing or harming of anyone is a bad thing. It is never good when you have to deal with cops- something bad just happened. Black people are especially affected by police use of force, justified or not, and it is more of a problem to their demographic than to white people.
If we can figure out a way to empower the socioeconomic status of the black community, and the black community rises to the occasion, everyone benefits, right?
Apparently my point is being lost, you are the second person to completely ignore it after multiple people have made the clarification. I don’t know how to say it differently.
Most of the time, agreed.
Yup, and I think a good place to start is with an accurate representation of what is really going on. Once you know what is going on you can address the issue.
There have been entire threads on how to help ruined communities and uplift minorities… some of which were pretty good, others involved a now banned white supremacist troll.
The conclusion always ends up being that unless and until the culture is fixed no outside group can “fix” the concentrated poverty, broken families, high dropout rates, drug use, gang involvement etc… That has to come from inside the community.
Then the threads move on to why the community is so screwed up and a normal right/left debate goes on for thousands of posts (personal responsibility vs external inequity). All of this leads to nowhere. This is a microcosm of the national conversation.
I’ve been stating facts without analysis. What have you been saying that I am ignoring?
I can’t think of a situation where violence is the preferred outcome. Can you?
You don’t think there are things intrinsic to our current society that negatively affect minorities? Why can’t we focus on making the playing field truly level, and once that has been done say it is up to them to seize the opportunities?
People have to be willing to take personal responsibility, and that is common in healthy and successful families. Poor areas though are full of broken families, unmarried moms, alcoholism, drug addiction, and generally shitty behavior.
That problem isn’t unique to the black population (similar issues are at play in parts of Appalachia). Making everything about race is cognitively easier, and people are generally looking for simple answers that comport with their views of themselves. “The man got me down” is a hell of a lot easier to swallow than “I’m a shitty father and I’m passing that right down to my children.” The outside world can help, but the intervention has to start young.
Someone’s read Hillbilly Elegy haha
If that’s your only exposure to that experience then you’re fortunate
Poor people everywhere are suffering the same societal decay. I grew up in Appalachia and they have all the exact same problems in trailer courts as the projects.
Except violent crime and gangs are way less common. But that makes sense. You can’t get away with anything in a township of 1500 people. Town I grew up in doesn’t have any police and never did. Sherrif is only an hour away lol.
Such as?
Not arguing (yet) genuinely curious what you specifically mean here.
Everything from social settings to job interviews. The old “which plumber would you rather leave a key to your house for, jadeveon or mark?” Who is less likely to have the cops called on him- a poor black kid walking through a rich neighborhood, or a poor white kid?
In my mind the difference is how society views them and expects them to act. Both poor kids have a shit situation growing up, but society as a whole has higher expectations for the white kid, and is much more likely to give the white kid the benefit of the doubt simply because they know more good white kids than black kids. Black kids have the added burden of preconcieved notions that come with being black, while the white kid does not.
Yup, I was truly blessed to be born a white male on the west coast :).
Did you read that book, I found it very interesting.
The issues is that the left doesn’t want to teach personal responsibility, self reliance, or even trades. Everyone must go to college to be indoctrinated so we can blame violence on guns, failure on race, and enjoy the collective pity party.
I didn’t grow up in Appalachia but I have some connections there. I still ended up with parents who are addicted to opioids, and two dead brothers. Funny enough, I’m a pretty comfortable lawyer. I’d be even more so if I knew at 30 what I know now. I chuckled reading Hillbily Eligy because what the kid wrote hit so close to home, but it’s certainly not the only discussion on issues of poverty along the lines of what has been said above. I think this also qualifies me for what some are calling a “class migrant” although my parents were technically white collar (just incredibly self defeating).
Family upbringing, zip code, availability or lack of mentors, availability or lack of exposure to good career choices, neighborhood violence, mental health, and sure race, have influence, but it’s funny how all those other factors seem to be common threads even in white families. Those factors are also why certain groups have generally been financially successful even while being discriminated against. We would do everyone who needs help much more good if we would focus on these attribute. Some do, such as Boys and Girls Clubs.
See above
The problem will be giving the government the power and obligation to parent children in these environments because it will mean taking that power from people who don’t have a sense of the obligation or the capacity to parent properly.
How does a teacher tell a student that almost all of what his mother is telling him is wrong?
The problem with politicians and those who base their views on political commentary is both sides blame issues that can’t be changed. The left will blame slavery and racism, and is right. The right will blame a lack of a father and bring up personal accountability, and be right. The problem is that we can’t go back in time and make slavery to not ever have existed. We also can’t go back in time and give that fatherless child a father. Both sides are too busy trying to be right that they ignore the present reality. Placing blame isn’t isn’t going to help that kid make good choices but I guess it makes people feel better about themselves.
You can develop personal responsibility, character and decision making skills in your own life. You can’t change society or your starting point. That’s the difference in viewpoints.
You’ve been dealt a rough hand, what are you going to do about it? Ultimately it’s up to individual people to break the cycle and make their life better than their parents’ lives. Coddling people just doesn’t work.