[quote]FightinIrish26 wrote:
Your jab is the most important punch- it sets up everything. Your reach has nothing to do with the effectiveness of your jab- its how you time it, when you throw it, and what you follow it up with.
If you’ve got good head movement, and good combos, and know when to close and when not to, reach is eliminated. [/quote]
Absolutely.
Not only does the jab help in establishing timing, it’s what I use to help me set up distance. My lead hand has always been my recon hand, out there poking, prodding, locating, and helping to make sure I’m at the right distance. We saw this in the Faber/Pulver fight.
Fabers right hand was dominating; very heavy, and very accurate. It was a a beautiful example of a fighter using his lead hand to set up his power hand, and combos.
And yes, Tyson was a master of timing and distance. His head movement and footwork, in his prime, were amazing. I still watch his old fights (esp. the Berbick fight) to study his head movement and footwork. Tyson was one of the best pressure fighters ever IMHO.
So its a pretty complicated issue then. In boxing then it sounds like it boils down to whether you can use it and whether the other guy can counter it? And in Judo/wrestling its not an asset at all.
How about in stand-up competition that involves kicks-kyokushin, muay thai, k1 etc? Reach/height seems to me to be more clear cut as an advantage in those circumstances.
Like Shizen said, I guess the weight catagories prevent any huge mismatches. I am 6’4" and 190lbs, although not in peak condition by any stretch- from what I have seen this is not an unusual height for a boxer of around my weight (light heavyweight?). Then again I would definitely be lighter if I was in top condition.
So its a pretty complicated issue then. In boxing then it sounds like it boils down to whether you can use it and whether the other guy can counter it? And in Judo/wrestling its not an asset at all.
How about in stand-up competition that involves kicks-kyokushin, muay thai, k1 etc? Reach/height seems to me to be more clear cut as an advantage in those circumstances.
Like Shizen said, I guess the weight catagories prevent any huge mismatches. I am 6’4" and 190lbs, although not in peak condition by any stretch- from what I have seen this is not an unusual height for a boxer of around my weight (light heavyweight?). Then again I would definitely be lighter if I was in top condition.[/quote]
In styles involving kicks reach definately matters but like has already been said it boils down to what can be done with that reach. I fought some guys that were your height but they weren’t effective kickers and when you kick and suck at it… you leave yourself with mighty big holes.
At tkd tournaments I was almost always the short heavyweight (Im 5’9"). I trained my footwork, speed, and “jamming”…that allowed me to neutralize a lot of tall guys attacks. Id counter while jamming and often attack while they were trying to move back into their effective range.
Reach is just one of many attributes, that hopefully, through training you can hone and combine with other attributes to make an effective fighter.
[quote]FightinIrish26 wrote:
Olympic Failure wrote:
Reach is something you can’t control.
“Distance control” with your opponent is WAY MORE IMPORTANT and something most fighters, even really good ones, never grasp. Most “Elite” fighters have “elite” distance control.
A similar concept to that, if not practically the same thing, is positioning. Getting yourself in position to use your technique(s) is what it’s all about…and WAY MORE IMPORTANT than the technique itself. Training to put yourself in the proper position is where most of your time should be spent (once a fundamental foundation is in place). The technique(s) will come. Practice creating the opportunity.
Right on.
Tyson jabbed. He once said, I believe, that your reach didn’t matter, as long as you timed it right.
For an example of this, watch his early fights. For an example of what happens when you can’t time it right, watch the Lewis-Tyson fight.
Your jab is the most important punch- it sets up everything. Your reach has nothing to do with the effectiveness of your jab- its how you time it, when you throw it, and what you follow it up with. If you’ve got good head movement, and good combos, and know when to close and when not to, reach is eliminated.
[/quote]
And teep if you’re a thaiboxer
the dilemma you usually face is that being smaller/faster you’re used to being aggressive but tall guys it’s better to counter fight against, though most tall guys aren’t that aggressive so you have to bait them a lot.
this is where good boxing and feinting (and using your jab/teep to set up things) comes into play.
By the way- want to watch a boxer who uses reach effectively, go look at Pavlik’s last fight.
He fought a short puncher, but kept him off with the jab/double jab, and kept following with heavy rights over the top. He rarely let the guy close on him enough to get him in trouble- had the guy been more a swarmer, he would have had better luck, because closing the distance while throwing a lot of punches will knock taller guy off their game, and wouldn’t have let Pavlik land that heavy ass right hand.
[quote]FightinIrish26 wrote:
By the way- want to watch a boxer who uses reach effectively, go look at Pavlik’s last fight.
He fought a short puncher, but kept him off with the jab/double jab, and kept following with heavy rights over the top. He rarely let the guy close on him enough to get him in trouble- had the guy been more a swarmer, he would have had better luck, because closing the distance while throwing a lot of punches will knock taller guy off their game, and wouldn’t have let Pavlik land that heavy ass right hand.[/quote]
I always thought Lennox Lewis used his high very well
[quote]FightinIrish26 wrote:
By the way- want to watch a boxer who uses reach effectively, go look at Pavlik’s last fight.
He fought a short puncher, but kept him off with the jab/double jab, and kept following with heavy rights over the top. He rarely let the guy close on him enough to get him in trouble- had the guy been more a swarmer, he would have had better luck, because closing the distance while throwing a lot of punches will knock taller guy off their game, and wouldn’t have let Pavlik land that heavy ass right hand.[/quote]
That was a masterclass. On the other hand, if you happen to be 7 foot tall/300 pounds, you can always learn from Semmy Schilt.