[quote]Spikeman wrote:
Still not understanding why I should be taxed for someone else’s problems. [/quote]
Because it is the only way politicians can have total power over you.
[quote]Bill Roberts wrote:
How much do you want to bet that in Nancy Pelosi’s America, violent offenders would be released early so as to make room for those who disobeyed her?[/quote]
Obviously, I mean you know THEY will be able to pay thier insurance what with thier robbing and drug running and such. Heck you think it’s a coincidence? We are living a real life robin hood scenario, only it’s Bizzaro robin hood, instead of stealing from the rich to give to the poor, the rich steal from the middle class and poor and the robin hoods also steal from the middle class and poor. And even if they DO get caught, it’s not like it ends there. Even after the go to jail, since we pay thier room and board, AND thier protection, they continue to rob us while they are in prison. I have a whole rant about prisons now but I’ll save it or start a new thread.
V
I don’t watch TV news.
Just wondering: have the left-“leaning” (to say the least) networks considered it a major story that the CBO-estimated cost of the required insurance is $15K for a family of 4, that the fine for not paying it is $25K, and the penalty for not paying that is 5 years imprisonment?
Or is that, in their opinion, not newsworthy, with instead something involving celebrities or pets or global warming needing to take up that time in the newscast?
[quote]Vegita wrote:
Bill Roberts wrote:
How much do you want to bet that in Nancy Pelosi’s America, violent offenders would be released early so as to make room for those who disobeyed her?
Obviously, I mean you know THEY will be able to pay thier insurance what with thier robbing and drug running and such. Heck you think it’s a coincidence? We are living a real life robin hood scenario, only it’s Bizzaro robin hood, instead of stealing from the rich to give to the poor, the rich steal from the middle class and poor and the robin hoods also steal from the middle class and poor. And even if they DO get caught, it’s not like it ends there. Even after the go to jail, since we pay thier room and board, AND thier protection, they continue to rob us while they are in prison. I have a whole rant about prisons now but I’ll save it or start a new thread.
V[/quote]
I don’t have specifics of the bill to give you on this, but I highly expect that Income-Redistributin’ Nancy has a means provision in there, so that most of her natural voter base (those that do not pay income tax, illegal aliens, and felons) do not have to buy insurance but instead have it given to them on the taxpayer’s dollar.
As for the rest of her natural voter base – limousine liberals and academic effetes – in the first case they are probably already buying a policy more expensive than that (why not?) and in the second, the government is already providing them with coverage that will be accepted. So this is no issue to them either.
The question is how many violent offenders they will release to house us all.
I have no intention of obeying this law.
[quote]Bill Roberts wrote:
How much do you want to bet that in Nancy Pelosi’s America, violent offenders would be released early so as to make room for those who disobeyed her?
I cannot imagine that she found no opposition within her own party – for example, let’s say among the 39 that voted against – to this provision. But she kept this in there anyway, despite the closeness of the anticipated vote.
Clearly, she had to be rather willful and determined on this provision.
It shows the real face of the Democrat leadership anyway, and of the vast majority of their House members. Maybe people will actually wake up. But I doubt it.[/quote]
You should see the sanctuary city policy she has, you damn near need a miracle to arrest an offender, youth or adult. The city DA Kamala Harris will not seek the death penalty for an illegal alien who killed a man and his 2 sons for no reason at all. I sat there and had to wonder, what does it take to have the Death Penalty put upon you? I mean, if killing 3 people isn’t enough, I cringe at how many it does take. Her policy violates Federal Law which mayor Gavin Newsome claims he will uphold. So following city policy will violate Federal Law, and vise versa.
Oh, I was accidentally incomplete in listing her natural voter base. That also includes union members (not absolutely all of them, but the great majority.) These also do not worry about having to buy a $15K policy because they have union-negotiated health insurance that will be considered acceptable.
So she has and need have utterly no fear of her voters, or her party’s base in general, finding any problem with this.
I repeat if Nasty Pelosi were a true patriot she would commit suicide and rid us of her stupidity…This will die in the senate. Lot’s of congressmen just retired for 2010…
In any event, we must fight even harder, just in case obama goes on a dick sucking festival in the senate…You know politicians can’t resist a good blow job, so we got to fight this shit.
Gawd this bill is fucking idiotic.
Didn’t we learn anything with Clinton–you can’t completely overhaul this all at once nor does the system need to be overhauled all at once.
What would be the problem with doing some incremental steps to health care reform? Remove the anti-trust exemptions; remove the state restrictions; pass a cost transparency law; pass a right to negotiation law; pass some limited tort reform; revise the health care saving account system; then maybe provide a high-deductable public option; restructure medicare/caid; and after all this we can see where the med cost are going and think about making things manditory. Fuck, there are a lot of things you could do before manditory health care comes about.
[quote]BigJawnMize wrote:
What would be the problem with doing some incremental steps to health care reform? Remove the anti-trust exemptions; remove the state restrictions; pass a cost transparency law; pass a right to negotiation law; pass some limited tort reform; revise the health care saving account system; then maybe provide a high-deductable public option; restructure medicare/caid; and after all this we can see where the med cost are going and think about making things manditory. Fuck, there are a lot of things you could do before manditory health care comes about. [/quote]
What would be the problem with that?!?
No, what would be the point of it!
What would THAT do for the power of the Democratic Party and the Federal Government?
There would be utterly no point to doing what you describe. That is, not a point to Pelosi, Reid, Obama, or the sorts of Democrats that voted for this bill.
That is why simpler things such as you describe were not done first, and in fact there wasn’t room for them even in a 2000 page bill. Not only shouldn’t they have been done first, but they shouldn’t have been done at all in the world of the Democratic leadership.
Of course, if the purpose were to make health care more afforable and to reduce or eliminate various quite real problems, the principal solution is removing the regards in which government is CAUSING those problems.
But that clearly is not the purpose. If it were the purpose, why would the CBO be estimating that this bill will drive up the cost of health insurance to $15K/year for a family of 4?
If that were the purpose, why would the plan include massive taxes on medical services and devices and on insurance companies? Clearly that INCREASES cost, not decreases it.
Anyone who thought that decreasing cost was the purpose was not paying attention.
Along with 10% of the US population, I don’t have a job. I wonder if the government will still find a way to get their money from us.
[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
John S. wrote:
I sure as hell won’t pay a fine.
Why stop there? Don’t pay your taxes either.[/quote]
Because right now I am working in a place where taxes are taken out automatically. Trust me if I had a way not to pay I would do it.
[quote]John S. wrote:
LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
John S. wrote:
I sure as hell won’t pay a fine.
Why stop there? Don’t pay your taxes either.
Because right now I am working in a place where taxes are taken out automatically. Trust me if I had a way not to pay I would do it. [/quote]
If you are a W-4 employee you can change your deductions to the maximum and nothing will be taken out except FICA.
[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
John S. wrote:
LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
John S. wrote:
I sure as hell won’t pay a fine.
Why stop there? Don’t pay your taxes either.
Because right now I am working in a place where taxes are taken out automatically. Trust me if I had a way not to pay I would do it.
If you are a W-4 employee you can change your deductions to the maximum and nothing will be taken out except FICA.[/quote]
I will have to check that out thanks.
How would you guys feel if the tax system were used instead?
so what does that mean? Is this healthcare thing over yet?
[quote]msd0060 wrote:
Most people do not make enough money to be self-insured nor can be trusted to self-insure so as to not become a burden of the rest of society when they fuck up spectacularly. [/quote]
Ya, and the 15K they are wasting, I mean spending, on HC…is’nt going to change that. What, you think I buy insurance and then get endless beneifts?
[quote]John S. wrote:
LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
John S. wrote:
LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
John S. wrote:
I sure as hell won’t pay a fine.
Why stop there? Don’t pay your taxes either.
Because right now I am working in a place where taxes are taken out automatically. Trust me if I had a way not to pay I would do it.
If you are a W-4 employee you can change your deductions to the maximum and nothing will be taken out except FICA.
I will have to check that out thanks.[/quote]
As opposed to using the max deductions, write ‘EXEMPT’ on line 7. Sign and send to your payroll department.
[quote]JN7844 wrote:
John S. wrote:
LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
John S. wrote:
LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
John S. wrote:
I sure as hell won’t pay a fine.
Why stop there? Don’t pay your taxes either.
Because right now I am working in a place where taxes are taken out automatically. Trust me if I had a way not to pay I would do it.
If you are a W-4 employee you can change your deductions to the maximum and nothing will be taken out except FICA.
I will have to check that out thanks.
As opposed to using the max deductions, write ‘EXEMPT’ on line 7. Sign and send to your payroll department.
[/quote]
What happens if you do this? Do you just not file a federal return every year and say screw it? What if someone comes to audit you? I’m confused? Won’t the government catch on that you aren’t paying taxes and come for you? Or do you do this as a form of civil disobedience and accept the consequences if/when you get caught? I would love to keep the 15,000 out of my 40,000 salary I currently give to the government.
V
Haven’t some states recently passed language reasserting their rights, calling into question the reach of the federal government? I’d like to see some brave Governors, mayors, etc., ensure their states and cities that they do not recognize any federal power that would allow the government to fine and imprison their citizens over a decision to not purchase a healthcare package.
That all law enforcements agencies have been told to not cooperate with this. And instead, to protect their citizens from any kind of federal enforcement of these penalties. I think it’s time for a state/federal showdown.