[quote]florin wrote:
Ask them to define “toning” and don’t quit until they provide a rational, non-self-contradictory and complete definition.
“Toning” simply does not exist, except in the foggy la-la-land of popular myth.[/quote]
Best post so far.
THERE IS NO REPETITION RANGE THAT PRODUCES TONING. Any repetition range can produce fat loss if the rest periods are short enough and the effort is there.
There’s a good number of references for that here:
Or just tell her: show me written proof from your obese father that it does lead to toning.
In common usage “toned” means low body fat with some muscle definition and development, but short of the body-builder look.
Marathon runners and Tour de France riders are not “toned.” They have very low body fat, but they avoid developing their upper bodies to keep their total body weight down.
Think of professional tennis players or swimmers. They are not huge, and would be ridiculed as too skinny on T-Nation (except for female swimmers, who are more muscular than most women).
There is nothing wrong with wanting to looked toned. It is a healthy body type. Not everyone has to aspire to Arnold’s body.
As for what exercise routine will result in “toning,” that would be any routine that burns calories and produces at least some muscle growth. bodybuilding hypertrophy requires that your routine & diet be a bit more dialed in.
Wow, some myths just won’t die. At least you keep up with current training theories and what not, I think the fact that he studied PE 30 years ago means absolutelty nothing in this argument.
I always tell people (typically women who mention ‘toning’) that a muscle either grows, or it doesn’t. It’s that f*cking simple. If you gain some muscle and are either skinny, or lose some fat, then you will appear ‘toned’. If you gain some muscle but still are basically ‘fat’, or ‘heavy’, it will look like you ‘bulking up’ -lol Sure it’s an oversimplification, but thats what most people need to hear.
-S
No one is saying there is anything wrong with being “toned.” The problem is when people spend years doing exercises that they believe will “tone” them - Low intensity, high rep sets, that barely burn fat and barely build muscle.
That is why most of the people you’ll see in an average gym are just that - average.
but people don’t know what they don’t know
forget the “toned” word forget arguments as to what they think will or won’t work.
If you are a personal trainer it’s up to you to convince them that the person with their target physique trains/eats like this
Trouble is they begin to follow your training, but then the next issue of cosmo tells them some completely random bullshit that discounts your methods
Then the whole convincing them game starts again…
Training a 39 yr old woman at the moment, she was very skeptical until her 45 yr old husband lost 16lbs and grew a v taper over 3 months of training with me
Now she does what she’s told 
Tony Gentilcore wrote an article awhile ago, but like others have said she likely has no intention of listening to you so don’t waste your time.
[quote]Jason van Wyk wrote:
No one is saying there is anything wrong with being “toned.” The problem is when people spend years doing exercises that they believe will “tone” them - Low intensity, high rep sets, that barely burn fat and barely build muscle.
[/quote]
Yes some do say there’s somthing wrong with it. There’s a group on this board that is very critical of anyone going to a gym who isn’t or doesn’t want to be a bodybuilder or powerlifter. Not everyone is and not everyone needs to be. But we’d all agree than being toned is better than being fat, flabby or scawny.
I also disagree with the statement that low intensity, high rep sets barely burn fat and barely build muscle. If the intensity is high enough to increase the respitory & heart rates, it’s burning calories and will burn fat, provded the person is eating fewer calories that are being burned.
And such routines can build muscle too, just not as much as a bodybuilding routine (just look at the female swimmers I mentioned). As someone else pointed out, high volume is good for building endurance.
It all depends on what body type you’re starting with, and where you’d like to take yourself.
from what i’m taking, the girl doesn’t really know anything, so whatever you tell her will impress her and make her believe she’s getting ‘toned.’ you could probably tell her that her car’s out of headlight fluid and she’d believe it.
that being said, high rep exercises are for endurance and burn calories during, but not after the set (for the most part). this is most easily related to running. sure, running burns calories, but when you’re done running, you go into a catabolic state and as soon as your heart slows down the calorie burining goes back to idle. lifting heavier weights burns calories during, and up to 24 hours post work-out. get her to lift heavy.
show her pictures of figure competitors off-season. personally i think the natural ones are rediculously good looking, and not many girls would mind looking like that. when you tell a girl to lift heavy, she most likely thinks she’s going to look like one of those dude-man drag-queen figure competitor ladies. get her in the right mind set and she’ll be more willing to take in what you have to say.
also, people were saying she’s just not that into it. i wasn’t ‘that into it’ when i started training, but now it’s pretty much my life. plant the seed, hopefully it’ll turn into a nice big plant and you can fuck it. (applicable movie quote)
Toning using high reps won’t work at all unless you use the Weider™ Peak Contraction Principle. Also, you’re legs won’t get toned by doing heavy exercises like squats, instead try leg extensions and squeeze at the top of every rep.
Guys,
the OP knows (obviously) that there is no such thing as what this chick is talking about.
TO the OP:
How about checking something written by a female trainer (Such as on the MWA site?)?
Just a thought.
AD
Jen Heath’s 10 keys to a lean and sexy look parts 1 and 2 cover this pretty good.
Here is a link to part 1 keys #2 and #3 cover the whole low reps heavy weights thing
http://www.musclewithattitude.com/readTopicMwa.do?id=1500416
[quote]dancar wrote:
Jason van Wyk wrote:
No one is saying there is anything wrong with being “toned.” The problem is when people spend years doing exercises that they believe will “tone” them - Low intensity, high rep sets, that barely burn fat and barely build muscle.
Yes some do say there’s somthing wrong with it. There’s a group on this board that is very critical of anyone going to a gym who isn’t or doesn’t want to be a bodybuilder or powerlifter. Not everyone is and not everyone needs to be. But we’d all agree than being toned is better than being fat, flabby or scawny.
I also disagree with the statement that low intensity, high rep sets barely burn fat and barely build muscle. If the intensity is high enough to increase the respitory & heart rates, it’s burning calories and will burn fat, provded the person is eating fewer calories that are being burned.
And such routines can build muscle too, just not as much as a bodybuilding routine (just look at the female swimmers I mentioned). As someone else pointed out, high volume is good for building endurance.
It all depends on what body type you’re starting with, and where you’d like to take yourself.[/quote]
I agree that low weight high intensity work CAN indeed burn fat and build muscle, but you’ll have your work cut out finding someone doing it right! For most people, low weight/high reps means a piss-easy weight that by doing 25 reps will magically “tone” them. With obvious (or perhaps not) consequences.
[quote]vroom wrote:
dez6485 wrote:
Her response was that she wanted me to provide written proof that it wasnt true. yup, frustrating.
Tell her to piss off until she is interested in serious training advice…
Okay, okay, maybe that isn’t a good idea.
Maybe roll your eyes and say “whatever”… then tell her to piss off until she wants serious advice.
Heh.[/quote]
Actually that’s a good idea. She’s just wasting the OP’s time. She trusted him enough to do the program he gave her, at first, but that was too hard so now she is just messing around with this toning bullshit. People are good at lying to themselves to justify doing what they want to do rather than what they know they need to do. The fact that she would extend that to lying to him when he’s just trying to help her is bullshit.
Besides, nothing he tells her is going to give her the discipline and determination that she obviously lacks. If he tells her to “piss off” she will at least respect him. I would try to find more polite terms than “piss off” though.
Train her with high reps using an upper/lower body split.
That will get a toning response.
Just make sure she’s near failure at rep 19.
Give them what they need while making them think they get what they want.
[quote]Andrew Dixon wrote:
/snip/
Give them what they need while making them think they get what they want.[/quote]
qft