Heavy Weights Bad for You?

Training Powerlifting
21

Maybe instead of weight lifting we should all become marathon runners. Um…no maybe not:

"Long distance running may actually do more harm than good. In a Real Health Breakthroughs article titled “Run for your life - away from strenuous exercise,” William Campbell Douglass II, M.D., cited several studies that back up this surprising claim: “A compelling argument can be made that distance running can cause atherosclerosis and coronary heart disease.”

According to Dr. Douglass, the leading cause of exercise-related deaths, even in well-trained athletes, is coronary heart disease. In one of the studies examined in his article, ten cases of sudden death among marathon runners were reviewed. “Nine of the 10 died of heart attacks secondary to severe coronary heart disease. The researchers’ conclusion: Severe coronary atherosclerosis is the most common cause of death in marathon runners.”

22

Two studies showing that weight training increases arterial stiffness.

Now it should be noted that in the first study they only compared19 weightlifters to 19 healthy but sedentary men. No training was involved, nor any investigation into their diets. Just having them come in and be measured. They didn’t even check to see whether they were curling in the squat racks or not.

The second also found arterial stiffening that returned to normal after detraining. This time they did train the people, and they were told not to do any training outside of the control gym. Again no aerobic training, just 3 days a week of 3 sets of 8-12 reps with 2 minute rest periods. (Cressey has referred to this study in his cardio confusion article.)

This is an abstract, (because I am to damned cheap to pay for access to the journal,) showing arterial compliance was unaltered after 12 weeks of weight training. They resistance trained 5 days a week using a 3 day rotating split body routine.

I just think you need a good diet, a workout that is not full of crap, and some energy system training, and you should be fine.

23

[quote]The Mage wrote:

Two studies showing that weight training increases arterial stiffness.

Now it should be noted that in the first study they only compared19 weightlifters to 19 healthy but sedentary men. No training was involved, nor any investigation into their diets. Just having them come in and be measured. They didn’t even check to see whether they were curling in the squat racks or not.

The second also found arterial stiffening that returned to normal after detraining. This time they did train the people, and they were told not to do any training outside of the control gym. Again no aerobic training, just 3 days a week of 3 sets of 8-12 reps with 2 minute rest periods. (Cressey has referred to this study in his cardio confusion article.)

This is an abstract, (because I am to damned cheap to pay for access to the journal,) showing arterial compliance was unaltered after 12 weeks of weight training. They resistance trained 5 days a week using a 3 day rotating split body routine.

I just think you need a good diet, a workout that is not full of crap, and some energy system training, and you should be fine. [/quote]

Bottom line, weight lifters had stronger pulses. How does this get related directly to HEART DISEASE? It makes perfect sense for the body to become more efficient at sending more blood to larger muscle groups. How could this happen without any strength of arterial walls? How is this a negative? It isn’t the same as mineral deposition in arterial walls due to injury.

24

this “study” doesn’t give you an excuse to use the stability ball and 10lbs Dumbbells. Suck it up- nothing is more manly than dying young. James Dean anyone?

quit being a pussy and slap some plates on.

25

[quote]Professor X wrote:

Bottom line, weight lifters had stronger pulses. How does this get related directly to HEART DISEASE? It makes perfect sense for the body to become more efficient at sending more blood to larger muscle groups. How could this happen without any strength of arterial walls? How is this a negative? It isn’t the same as mineral deposition in arterial walls due to injury.[/quote]

Seriously I don’t think they can make the connection at all. The arteries return to normal in one study if you quit training, and I don’t think that would happen if it was because of calcium buildup, and there were no longer term studies showing whether this is even a bad thing or not, or if this is still happening 10 years later.

26

A bunch of girls and soy boys probably wrote the article.

27

[quote]ultimatethor wrote:
I recently read in an article on strength training that lifting heavy weights has a detrimental impact on arterial compliance, thus increasing the risk of heart disease. Is this true? If so, does anyone have any ideas for good cardio that doesn’t involve running?[/quote]

Who gives a fuck? Seriously if you look around for studies you can find evidence of almost anything. Working out in the morning is good, working out in the morning is bad, NO causes crazy muscle gains, NO does nothing at all. Personally, if I was guaranteed an hour of cardio a week would add three years to my life, I still wouldn’t do it. (hour a week x 52 weeks a year x 60 years = 3120 hours. divided by 24 hours in a day = 130 days spend doing cardio, including sleep it’s more like 200)

Just trying to put it all into perspective.

28

I’d still lift even if I knew it would cut five years off my life. I’d rather have 75 good highly functional years than 80 crappy ones with me wheel chair ridden for the last dozen. Even if there is a net negative impact on life expectancy, it would be miniscule compared to the effects of other factors and certainly not enough to change a behavior I enjoy.

29

[quote]etaco wrote:
I’d still lift even if I knew it would cut five years off my life. I’d rather have 75 good highly functional years than 80 crappy ones with me wheel chair ridden for the last dozen. Even if there is a net negative impact on life expectancy, it would be miniscule compared to the effects of other factors and certainly not enough to change a behavior I enjoy.[/quote]

quality not quantity in other words… . totally agree. …

30

[quote]etaco wrote:
I’d still lift even if I knew it would cut five years off my life. I’d rather have 75 good highly functional years than 80 crappy ones… quote]

You know I feel that way too. But I have never once talked to a 75 year old who felt that way…Funny how time can change perspective.

31

[quote]ZEB wrote:
etaco wrote:
I’d still lift even if I knew it would cut five years off my life. I’d rather have 75 good highly functional years than 80 crappy ones… quote]

You know I feel that way too. But I have never once talked to a 75 year old who felt that way…Funny how time can change perspective.[/quote]

I guarantee that if you asked that 75 year old if he would trade every experience he ever had in his life that was more exciting than sitting in a chair for an extra 5 years of life, he might put that in better perspective for you. It is in our nature to want to survive. Therefore, asking the simple question of, “would you stop training to live longer” is faulty without the proper context.

32

[quote]Professor X wrote:
ZEB wrote:
etaco wrote:
I’d still lift even if I knew it would cut five years off my life. I’d rather have 75 good highly functional years than 80 crappy ones…

You know I feel that way too. But I have never once talked to a 75 year old who felt that way…Funny how time can change perspective.

I guarantee that if you asked that 75 year old if he would trade every experience he ever had in his life that was more exciting than sitting in a chair for an extra 5 years of life, he might put that in better perspective for you. [/quote]

Actually, I had the opportunity to work at a nursing home many years ago. And I got to know the folks who lived there. It was actually a great experience, but that’s another topic.

I can tell you that not one of them, no matter how bad ther condition wanted to die!

Now, does that mean that they would not have traded a better life for less years when they were younger? Perhaps they would have. But, then again that is my point!

perspective changes as you come closer to meeting the grim reaper…

33

[quote]ZEB wrote:
Professor X wrote:
ZEB wrote:
etaco wrote:
I’d still lift even if I knew it would cut five years off my life. I’d rather have 75 good highly functional years than 80 crappy ones…

You know I feel that way too. But I have never once talked to a 75 year old who felt that way…Funny how time can change perspective.

I guarantee that if you asked that 75 year old if he would trade every experience he ever had in his life that was more exciting than sitting in a chair for an extra 5 years of life, he might put that in better perspective for you.

Actually, I had the opportunity to work at a nursing home many years ago. And I got to know the folks who lived there. It was actually a great experience, but that’s another topic.

I can tell you that not one of them, no matter how bad ther condition wanted to die!

Now, does that mean that they would not have traded a better life for less years when they were younger? Perhaps they would have. But, then again that is my point!

perspective changes as you come closer to meeting the grim reaper…

[/quote]

Dude, I didn’t disagree with you. I said rephrase the question and you may get a different answer.

If you asked that same 75 year old if they would trade every experience in their life that could be labeled as being the slightest risk for an extra five years, I wonder if you would get the same response. Most people don’t exactly want to die unless they are about to commit suicide. However, to discuss quality of life is important.

How many of us would live in a bubble if it guaranteed we would live to be 100 years of age? No sex, no touch with other humans, no motorcycle riding, no swimming, no horseback riding, no skiing, and no weight lifting. If presented in those terms, do you think those 75 year olds would respond the same?

34

[quote]Professor X wrote:
ZEB wrote:
etaco wrote:
I’d still lift even if I knew it would cut five years off my life. I’d rather have 75 good highly functional years than 80 crappy ones… quote]

You know I feel that way too. But I have never once talked to a 75 year old who felt that way…Funny how time can change perspective.

I guarantee that if you asked that 75 year old if he would trade every experience he ever had in his life that was more exciting than sitting in a chair for an extra 5 years of life, he might put that in better perspective for you. It is in our nature to want to survive. Therefore, asking the simple question of, “would you stop training to live longer” is faulty without the proper context.[/quote]

I disagree… there are many other ways to lead a fit a satisfying lifestyle without lifting heavy weights. ie cardio training, sprints, BW exersises. Bottom line is that if there is substatial evidence supporting the claim the heavy weights decreases lifeexpectance than i would def. drop weightlifting.

35

[quote]IRoNStaLLion wrote:
Professor X wrote:
ZEB wrote:
etaco wrote:
I’d still lift even if I knew it would cut five years off my life. I’d rather have 75 good highly functional years than 80 crappy ones… quote]

You know I feel that way too. But I have never once talked to a 75 year old who felt that way…Funny how time can change perspective.

I guarantee that if you asked that 75 year old if he would trade every experience he ever had in his life that was more exciting than sitting in a chair for an extra 5 years of life, he might put that in better perspective for you. It is in our nature to want to survive. Therefore, asking the simple question of, “would you stop training to live longer” is faulty without the proper context.

I disagree… there are many other ways to lead a fit a satisfying lifestyle without lifting heavy weights. ie cardio training, sprints, BW exersises. Bottom line is that if there is substatial evidence supporting the claim the heavy weights decreases lifeexpectance than i would def. drop weightlifting.[/quote]

I don’t think anyone has kept this within the realm of weightlifting. It has expanded into quality of life over quantity of years. I am amazed that anyone is even concerned. Smoking shortens your life span. Weightlifting has not been proven to shorten your life span. A study is flawed if it tries to make a direct correlation between two facts as if there could be no other factors involved. Wrinkles don’t cause death. I could very well put together a study that shows that having wrinkles leads to more death, however, considering how many people die of old age. That is what this study sounds like.

36

[quote]IRoNStaLLion wrote:
Professor X wrote:
ZEB wrote:
etaco wrote:
I’d still lift even if I knew it would cut five years off my life. I’d rather have 75 good highly functional years than 80 crappy ones… quote]

You know I feel that way too. But I have never once talked to a 75 year old who felt that way…Funny how time can change perspective.

I guarantee that if you asked that 75 year old if he would trade every experience he ever had in his life that was more exciting than sitting in a chair for an extra 5 years of life, he might put that in better perspective for you. It is in our nature to want to survive. Therefore, asking the simple question of, “would you stop training to live longer” is faulty without the proper context.

I disagree… there are many other ways to lead a fit a satisfying lifestyle without lifting heavy weights. ie cardio training, sprints, BW exersises. Bottom line is that if there is substatial evidence supporting the claim the heavy weights decreases lifeexpectance than i would def. drop weightlifting.[/quote]

There may well be many ways to stay healthy and functional without the heavy weights, but satisfying? Not for me. I enjoy most of the things I do which keep me healthy, weights included. I’m not an ascetic trying to squeaze out every bit of logevity, regardless of quality. I want to enjoy life to the fullest and for me that includes lifting heavy objects. To make me consider giving up the weights I would have to be convinced by the evidence that the amount of life I was sacrificing was quite substantial and that benefit from dropping it outweighed that which could be gained through other means. Somehow I seriously doubt that will hapen though.

37

[quote]Professor X wrote:
ZEB wrote:
Professor X wrote:
ZEB wrote:
etaco wrote:
I’d still lift even if I knew it would cut five years off my life. I’d rather have 75 good highly functional years than 80 crappy ones…

You know I feel that way too. But I have never once talked to a 75 year old who felt that way…Funny how time can change perspective.

I guarantee that if you asked that 75 year old if he would trade every experience he ever had in his life that was more exciting than sitting in a chair for an extra 5 years of life, he might put that in better perspective for you.

Actually, I had the opportunity to work at a nursing home many years ago. And I got to know the folks who lived there. It was actually a great experience, but that’s another topic.

I can tell you that not one of them, no matter how bad ther condition wanted to die!

Now, does that mean that they would not have traded a better life for less years when they were younger? Perhaps they would have. But, then again that is my point!

perspective changes as you come closer to meeting the grim reaper…

Dude, I didn’t disagree with you.[/quote]

I know that, just kicking it back and forth.

38

I don’t think we need a scientific study to assure us that lifting weights is a healthy activity. We only need to look at our ancestors.

They did all sorts of lifting: Logs, rocks, etc. They climbed up mountains, large bolders and trees. They spent many hours working and hunting.

It’s sort of a natural thing. No?

39

1.) Cap’n’salty, scientific studies are VERY important in the medical field. Evidence based medicine is constantly evolving, and without the research the field does not advance.

2.) Evidently, even the results of these studies are debatable. Science ALWAYS has forefront areas that are highly debatable.

3.) Even if those outcome measures (i.e arterial compliance) do change with weight training, does this lead to pathological changes? For instance a distance runner may have a resting heart rate in the 30’s due to physiologic compensation, while a person with 2nd degree Mobitz type II may have a heart rate in the 30’s due to pathologic heart block. The outcome measure (heart rate) is the same; however, in one you have a healthy physiologic compensation, while in the other you have a pathologic (unhealthy) cardiac phenomenon.

4.) Pointing out that Jack Lalane (sp?) is still in great health is NOT valid reasoning to argue that weightlifting is healthy. I can always point out that my ‘Uncle Marty’ smoked 2 packs of cigs/day and didn’t die until he was 90. Does this mean that smoking is healthy? A single ocurrence of a phenomenon may be an outlier. That is why scientific studies are conducted with populations.

Do not let these studies deter you from lifting weights.

beef

40

[quote]ZEB wrote:
I don’t think we need a scientific study to assure us that lifting weights is a healthy activity. We only need to look at our ancestors.

They did all sorts of lifting: Logs, rocks, etc. They climbed up mountains, large bolders and trees. They spent many hours working and hunting.

It’s sort of a natural thing. No?[/quote]

Our ancestors also did a lot of eating infrequently and not concerning about macronutrient ratios.

Bad reasoning.

beef