True. If he doesn’t truly buy into a program whole hearted, any program he chooses is unlikely to work. Not disagreeing really, but op seems to have his mind made up already.
Really! The only feedback on my program that you can find above is some worries regarding the volume being too high. I tried to explain that this has not been an issue so far at least. Besides this, @believer423 asked for a clarification regarding the percentages used. Everything else above your post are people encouraging me to leave my program for some other. Which is not constructive feedback on my program and hence not what I asked for!
I’ve never claimed to be strong nor even something remotely close to this. I’m by no means a success story. But that does not mean per see that my program “sucks”. I’m sorry you felt you had to be “nice” the first time around. I can tell that you’re not trying anymore…
I will do the program or something very similar. I thought that was clear from the beginning. My question was never if I should do my program or something completely different. I was asking for constructive feedback on a particular program, the one I wrote in the first post. I understand that you were trying to help, but it was not the help that I was asking for. I was asking whether I should by a blue or orange Honda and you replied by saying that I should get a green BMW. Although having the best intentions, it was not my question to begin with…
Same here. You gave me something completely different than what I asked for. I was looking for neither criticism nor validation, but constructive feedback regarding a particular program.
I’m sorry you feel like I dissected your posts. I just replied my honest opinions regarding the comments you gave and tried to point out that you were not answering what I was asking for.
Thank you for your suggestion! Is the reason you put the “Power exercise” at the beginning of each workout to feel fresh each time you aim for power, instead of collecting them all in one workout, and maybe loose some freshness by the end? Also, do you think that when dividing the hypertrophy work over several trainings instead, that the body has an easier time when it can focus on only repairing certain muscle groups, instead of the entire body?
You’re right! Would it make more sense to start out with 8x3 and run linear progression to 5x3, before I drop down the weights slightly and start over again by 8x3? Or would you do something else? I just want the weights to be really fast on these pulls…
Do you think the following is a sensible transformation of my program into the setup you proposed?
Day 1
Deadlift - Power: Speed pulls, 8x3…
Squat - Strength: Low-bar squat, 5x5…
Bench - Hypertrophy: Overhead press, 4x(8-10)
Assistance: Ab-wheel
Day 2
Bench - Power: Bench press, 5x5…
Deadlift - Strength: Deadlifts, 2x3…
Squat - Hypertrophy: Front squats, 4x(8-10)
Assistance: Pull-ups
Day 3
Squat - Power: Low-bar squat: 2x3…
Bench - Strength: 5x5…
Deadlift - Hypertrophy: Pendlay rows: 4x(8-10)
Assistance: Leg-curls
I was thinking maybe I could do some assistance work around RPE 6-7, but nothing straining? I can skip the assistance altoghether if you think that is better.
Also, I was thinking I could do Overhead press for bench volume and Pendlay rows for Deadlift volume, to ease the transition and not suddenly bump up my frequency. Especially, for the deadlift I guess there is reason to be somewhat cautious? And then I was thinking to just progress linearly and reducing volume as described originally.
Thank you for your suggestion! I really appreciated it 
Its funny that you vehemently deny everyone else for suggesting other programs to you, then thank someone else for suggesting the Cube Method to you.
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Yes, to keep the speed up. By allocating the demands your asking of yourself in your workouts each movement better gets it own attention a little better. After squatting 10 sets of doubles and pulling 10 singles, the last thing I would want to do is bench for speed. Same with strength. Your following movements are going to suffer. With your speed work, you are going to get some needed technique work in and be primed for the strength work and finish off with your hypertrophy.
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First, figure out how long your cycle will be. With a shorter cycle your decrease in volume/increase in intensity will be more dramatic. With a longer cycle, it will be less pronounced. Reference Pipeline table and keep in mind your recovery abilities and skill level. If speed isn’t there with a prescribed intensity, lower it until it is. Your reps should get progressively faster as you progress through your sets. If your speed slows on two consecutive sets shut it down and move on to strength.
Again, you’re the only one that truly knows your recovery capability and how much you can take on. Just tread lightly when approaching it. Substituting OHP and rows or block pulls would be fine, just make sure you have a protocol for progression in place for them as well.
Week 1
Power-8x3@55%
Strength-5x5@80%
Hypertrophy-4x10@70%
Week 2
Power-7x3@60%
Strength-4x4@85%
Hypertrophy-3x10@72.5%
Week 3
Power-6x3@65%
Strength-3x3@90%
Hypertrophy-3x8@75%
This is just a quick example. I would refine my sets and rep schemes a little more, but off the top of my head this will put you in the ballpark. Work the same %'s for all movements in the span of a week, then progress up in week 2 and so on. If I get time I will search and paste a link that will explain it better.
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I’ve ran the cube and it’s a solid program, however this is not the cube method. The cube method trains one quality per movement in a 3 week span. For example, you will be training strength for deadlift in week 1, hypertrophy for deadlift in week 2 and power for deadlift in week 3, while training the other two attributes for bench and squat throughout the weeks. While both are considered undulating periodization, the cube’s undulation is cycled weekly, the example I posted is cycled daily.
Also, Google Mike Zourdos. He has some really good articles and studies on DUP.
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The reason I liked the suggestion is because I can see how I can change what I’m doing now into that program. It is not something completely different and it is a program based on DUP utilising high frequency.
@badboy69cancer: Thank you for comments and suggestions! I’ve realised that I don’t do power work for squats nor bench, but more like two strength sessions and a hypertrophy session per week. I should maybe change this up, as I see that most DUP programs do incorporate a power day for all lifts.
I would prefer my cycle to be longer than 4 weeks, more like 3 blocks of 4 weeks. I like the idea of going back the next week and do the same thing with slightly heavier weight for a couple of weeks. It gives me a feeling of progression inside the program and it feels less complicated when I execute it. Does it make sense running something along the lines of your suggested program, only that I repeat each of your weeks 4 times with linear periodization?
And thanks for the links you provided! I’ll continue my research the next weeks and settle on a program for my next cycle. I’ll post what I decide for.
You can program it just about any way you want. I wouldn’t have two strength sessions for the same movement twice in one week however. The possibilities are really endless with the combinations you can come up with. 2:1 ratio of hypertrophy/Strength, jumps and throws for speed work, muscular endurance, bodyweight movements for hypertrophy, you name it. You can absolutely run linear periodization with it.
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I highly recommend Mike Tuchscherer’s Reactive Training book.
Nothing wrong with making your programs, but you really have to do your homework.
The honest truth is that you probably won’t make any more gains than by following established programs so long as you don’t mentally burn out so i can only make the recommendations of creating your own programs for someone of your approximate experience if you love creating programs for its own sake. I myself fall into this category of program creation. Now on the other hand, if following a strict template bores you to tears then making and testing your own programs can be motivation to get in the gym and do work and that in and of itself will help you up on the gain train.
However, if you ever feel lost or find yourself never sticking to your programs it can be a very good idea to go to a tried and proven program for several to many months. You can learn a lot about how to do your own programming that way while making some gains.
I know it’s not really specific recommendations for what you asked, but there’s that saying about fish and men. Feed a big fish a man and you feed it for a day. Teach a fish to eat many men and you feed for… err… a really long time. Sage wisdom…
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I’ll grab that book immediately! I like the idea of making my own program and right now it seems to work. If I at some point is not able to make further progress and I’m not able to reprogram to push through it I’ll grab some proven program (I would probably go for 5/3/1 if I was in that situation right now) and run it for at least half a year… No doubt there are many good programs out there made by much wiser men than me, that I can still learn a lot from!
Oh, one more thing. Prilepin’s Table!!! Learn it and love it.
There’s a pdf floating in the internet that can tell you how to program with it. If you like the way Sheiko looks, but you don’t have the time you can do something similar using Prilepin’s table that doesn’t take 2 hours in the gym.
You could even pick something from the low to medium rep range for a percentage and on the last set do AMRAP for a hypertrophy day. You could do the same thing except work up to a heavy (not max) 5, triple, double, or single on a heavy day. Or you could just use compensatory acceleartion and do a speed day.
But you really don’t even have to do that with Prilepin’s table. Just plug in the numbers and do work. But that can get pretty boring.
I have some questions regarding Prilepin’s table that I hope you can help me width.
-
Is it sensible to use the table for volume training for a strength athlete? For instance, my current approach of 4x(8-10)@~70% does not fit into the table. Should I then change it or not pay that much attention to the table when doing hypertrophy work (with the end goal being to get stronger)? The following t-nation article (22 Proven Rep Schemes) says that the approach I’m taking is sensible, but should my work be more inline with the table as my end goal is strength?
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There is a difference in the versions online regarding the optimal number of repetitions for 90%+ work. Some versions say 4 and others 7. Does anyone know what the original says? Or have some thoughts regarding what they think is a good number?
One of the ideas of Prilepin’s table is that your practicing the lift to train it. So each every rep is going to be crisp, clean, and powerful. You would rarely ever strain on a lift. So I think what you have would work. But it definitely isn’t at all in line with the principles of Prilepin’s table.
Where the hard part comes in is doing the last set just as cleanly as the first set.
And definitely look up Mike Zourdos if you’re hell bent on DUP. It’s been a while since I’ve read up on him, but for hypertrophy and maybe strength days I think it’s basically following Prilepin’s table but with AMRAP for the last set.
For someone more familiar with his methods please correct if I’m wrong. If I have time I’ll look it up myself to double check.
I would never argue with Fletch. He has helped me a lot.
The chart goes in ranges. 3-4 x 8-10 with 70-80% are sort of like the far left side of the chart. If you like to think in terms of “methods” it’s a special tool, used for a special time.
I know that there are no hypertrophy ranges, but according to Verkhoshansky “this variant of the Repeat-Serial method produces a considerable increase in muscle mass.” The “work is executed until fatigue” and is “mainly used for the development of strength in slow movement conditions.”
As Fletch says, the bar doesn’t POP as much when you do so many reps in 1 set. Russian guy says “it has little effectiveness in developing explosive strength and high speed strength.” For this reason, he says to use this rep range far away from competition, and to train jump exercises at the same time for explosiveness.
I think that Eddie Hall recently used a routine where he did heavier, fast smooth singles in the Deadlift one day, and 3x10 with lighter weights another day. Kinda like almost DUP. I am having trouble finding specifics.
Here’s a good thread about DUP on our very own T-nation.
I’ve found a few templates just from google.
Sorry I can’t find any specific recommendations, but it’s really more of a training philosophy than anything.
I can tell you that what you plan for your strength days is extremely aggressive and unsustainable. I think using Prilepin’s table would help a lot there. If you really don’t think it’s enough even at the higher rep ranges of it, work up to something heavy but not max is my recommendation.
But it’s a lot easier to start too light and work up than to start too heavy and try to work back down.
I usually see DUP split up into a 3 week accumulation phase (aka volume) and a 3 week intensification phase (aka heavy).
In the accumulation phase I would do something like 4x6-10 @70% hyp, 8-6x3@60-70% resectively wave for power, and 4x3@85%. If I felt f’ing fantastic, I might go for more reps on the last set. In that phase, I would up total # of reps per week rather than weight.
In the intensity phase something like 3x5@80% hyp, 8-6x2@70-80% power, and start with 8 singles @90%, then 2x2@93-95%, then ramp up 97% for a single then 2x2 around 90% for back off work the last week. For hyp work, I’d make very modest weight jump per week.
Depending on the individual, this will be tailored to the specific ways they respond.
I think you’re right. I’ve noticed that pants that used to fit me really nicely (among others my suit) is now borderline not usable due to my legs and the same for shirts over my shoulders. So I guess it worked this time, as my movements with these rep-ranges has been front squats, overhead press and pull-ups. But the sets has been excruciating and slow at times, so maybe it is time to go lighter, better form and try to convert this into more weight on the bar now.
@Fletch1986: I’ve added some size this cycle and also some weight to the bar. But I’ve decided to stay within the table for my next cycle and see how that feels. Keeping all the reps crisp as you say..
Unfortunately, the links in the thread to the program is broken. I’ve found some versions of it at various forums. But I like the template you presented a lot, so I think I’ll give it at go! So, if I’m to build volume in the first phase, what am I to do with the strength days?
What do you think of the following layout based on your recommendations?
Volume block:
-
Power:
Start at 6x3 and work my way up to 8x3 during the 3 weeks. -
Hypertrophy:
Start at 4x6 and work my way up to 4x8 during the 3 weeks. -
Strength:
Bench and squat: Start at 4x3 and work my way up to 6x3,
Deadlifts: start at 2x3 and work my way up to 4x3.
Should I do a deload or move directly into the intensity block? The reason I lowered the deadlift volume slightly is that I’ve progressed at lower volume this time and I figured it would be better to work myself into it over a cycle then to make a big jump in volume immediately? Does this make sense?
Intensity:
- Power:
Start at 8x2 and decrease to 6x2 over the weeks, moving from 70% to 80% - Hypertrophy:
Keep it at 3x5, adding 2.5 kilos each week if last set last week was at most RPE 8.5 - Strength:
week 1: 8x1@90%, week 2: 2x2@93-95@, week 3: 1@97% + 2x2@90%
Test week:
Any suggestions for what to do at day 1 and 2? I have no idea! 3x3 at 60%?
Day 3: Hit new PR’s
And then move directly into Volume block again with new percentages, unless I feel beaten up? In that case I can do a easy transition week, like week 1 of the next volume block but half the sets or something?
I’m thinking that I’ll use front squats for squat volume, overhead press for bench volume and pendlay rows for deadlift volume. And if I’m feeling good, I’ll do some RPE 7 sets of pull-ups one day, ab-wheel one day and leg-curls one day for accessories.
Is this in line with what you had in mind or did I misunderstand anything? I’ll use the percentages you gave. Keeping the deadlifts in the lower end for power work and the squats and bench in the upper in the volume block as long as the speed and recovery is good.
It all sounds good for the main work.
As far as deloads and and test week, that’s so individual I’m very hesitant to make a suggestion other than record what you do and how you feel while doing it and assess and reassess.
If you’re training squat, bench, and deadlift in one session I doubt you’ll sustainably be able to do big compound movements afterwards for assistance. I would just be sure to always include some lat, upper back, and ab/low back work. And when I say low back, I mean things like back extensions and reverse hypers if your so luck to have one available for a pump.
Maybe some light arm work and/or calf work. Maybe something to work a particular weakness like if your glutes are holding you back add in some cable pull throughs or light hip thrusters.
I’d be wary of any sort of barbell row because of how taxing it can be and would be more inclined to use cable rows, chest supported rows, or dumbbell rows. Something that won’t tax the lower back.
Whatever you do for assistance, make sure it doesn’t take away from your main work. You may even want to omit most assistance work on main training days and save it for a 4th session where you do pump work for balance and weaknesses.
Again, start conservatively and add in slowly over the months if you even feel it’s necessary, Keep a good log.
As far as testing, you’d probably be fine testing every 7th-8th week for now, but as you progress you may start to find that too taxing. And remember, while your testing you’re not getting stronger. It might be better to go for a max triple since it’ll be a lot easier to recover from and use a max calculator.