Health Benefits of Glucose and Insulin

Nutrition
21

[quote]Proud_Virgin wrote:

[quote]jehovasfitness wrote:
Many experts would recommend keeping those #s even lower, ideally even in the low 80s.

80-100 is the general “healthy” range
101-125 pre-diabetes

125 diabetic

fasting #s of course[/quote]

How would one go about lowering fasting numbers? I tested mine as 97 the other day, which kind of surprised me. I don’t eat especially high carbs (1-2 meals a day are low carb), I’m fairly lean, and I do cardio a couple times a week.

What gives?

[/quote]

I’m right there with ya. Same reading and all. However, a fasting test has its limitations, such as if you were under stress just prior.

Basically, you would tackle it just like mentioned in the article I linked, but probably nto needed to be so drastic.

There are some minerals and other supplements that could help as well, such as ALA, fish oil, cinnamon, D3, magnesium, chromium, etc… depends on if you’re defecient in some of those minerals

22

[quote]jehovasfitness wrote:

[quote]Cr Powerlinate wrote:
Why is using Indigo OK but not Metformin? [/quote]

what are the side effects of Indigo besides price? Sides for Metformin?

BONEZ- you bring up a valid argument why supplements over drugs.

Last I checked though, ALA is also an anti-oxidant, good for the skin, protects the brain from mitochondrial damage, etc… So, in theory you have a valid argument, I just think it doesn’t fully compare.[/quote]

That’s why I was asking - there is a paucity of research concerning long term human use of C3G but plenty regarding Metformin. Most of it seems to suggest that sensible use of the drug is fairly safe and predictable. Am I missing any significant studies or cases that would indicate otherwise?

23

[quote]jehovasfitness wrote:
I just think it doesn’t fully compare.[/quote]

That’s fine. “Full comparisons” are almost impossible to come by when discussing two completely different things.

The side effects of Metformin? At the risk of providing an underinclusive list, Ill leave that for the interested individuals to figure out for themselves.

24

[quote]Med Pro wrote:

Things like: Cinnamon, Vanadium sulfate, Chromium, Gymnema Sylvestre.

[/quote]

Glucose Disposal Agents. Good stuff. I noticed positive changes in muscle fullness when I started using these.

25

[quote]Med Pro wrote:
jehovasfitness wrote: Did you copy/paste this info or write it yourself? Many experts would recommend keeping those #s even lower, ideally even in the low 80s.
80-100 is the general “healthy” range
101-125 pre-diabetes

125 diabetic
fasting #s of course

Thanks… I wrote this myself. 120 is post eating. I agree 80-100 is a good fasting range. I like 70-80 fasting range myself.

It drives me crazy talking to patients when they tell me they where taught to check sugar levels 2 hrs after eating! Why are they taught this? To see how successful their poor pancreas and cellular resisted insulin worked on lowering blood sugar?

I tell them, dont eat carbs in the 1st place unless they actually going to need them. I ask them, if they dont eat, do they need insulin? NO? Then why not avoid foods that require insulin in the 1st place if you suffer from this disease?

In a normal metabolism, eat a candy bar and check you sugar 2hrs later and your more than likely hypoglycemic. I educate that your poor pancreas had to dump massive amount insulin to deal with all that glucose. The scary thought is over time, this may not happen because of diabetes.

Not all but most diabetics have all the carbs they need around their waist partly known as the metabolic syndrome.

Metformin is a good drug and is the lesser of the evils. The benefit can outweigh most side effects. Taken to jump start your path to better health than eating better is ideal. The best policy is avoiding a sugar rise above 120. Check sugars before you eat, wait 20-30 min and recheck your sugar again to see how high they went. If it rose 20 or more points, you had better re evaluate what you just ate.

Things like: Cinnamon, Vanadium sulfate, Fish oils, Chromium, Gymnema Sylvestre, fat loss, resistance exercise, Growth Hormone, avoiding carbs all work in decreasing insulin resistance.

We truly have an education problem in America, and people are dying unnecessarily from it daily!

I got involved in research because I had a buddy die from sudden cardiac death at 33yo. Autopsy said he had no underline health issues other than a metabolic syndrome. They found blood clots in the coronary arteries.

I like to think his death saved my life and others I educate.
[/quote]

Curious, are you an M.D or trainer? unless I missed it somewhere. I assume MD since you say “patients”

good info above, thanks

26

Med Pro (guess I should ahve noted your name before lol)

my fasting was 97 ( under a little stress however), ate a high protein/fat liquid meal. 60 mins later it was 103.

I assume that is good, but at the same time it wasn’t a high carb meal in proportion to calories, maybe 20-25g tops

27

quote: How would one go about lowering fasting numbers? What gives?

Answer: Maybe you were in the glycogen curve just before you hit hypoglycemia.

I would say work out harder and use up that glucose. If stressed, glucocorticoid released by the adrenal gland in the form of cortisol and corticosterone, what better way to counter that than working out to balance your health?

Fasting glucose of 97 is ok but if anything, tells you you might be overlooking something. Start checking sugars a little more closely. Ive been know to check and log my sugars 10 times per day to establish potential pit falls.

To help avoid hyperinsulinemia, you can take fiber before eating. Fiber will slow glucose uptake.

28

Myabe I should take some Metformin :frowning:

just checked my sugar. Breakfast at 9am, 2pm it’s 95.

about to eat a large Red Baron pizza, shall report back in an hour

29

My point, Bonez, had more to do with the way Americans think. “If something is broken, put a band-aid on it”… when they should be going to the route of the problem and fixing it there.

30

[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:
My point, Bonez, had more to do with the way Americans think. “If something is broken, put a band-aid on it”… when they should be going to the route of the problem and fixing it there. [/quote]

Everyone here eats pretty well (certainly better than the average american) and lifts weights. Id say that a huge majority of PEOPLE HERE could benefit from a drug like metformin.

That was my point.

By all means, stick to diet and exercise exclusively. But dont pontificate about a right or wrong way of addressing blood sugar changes. Like I alluded to earlier, those trying to get very muscular will be required to take in far larger amounts of calories than is typically considered healthy. A drug like Metformin can make the consumption of all those calories less unhealthy.

31

jehovasfitness wrote: Are you a doctor?

ANSWER:
No Im not a doctor. I specialize in 4 different medical professions.
Respiratory therapy, vascular sonography, echocardiography and general sonography Also educated in Vo2 Max sports physiology, blood gases and metabolic blood processes and research in Nitric oxide for medical treatment. I own an ultrasound company. I educate on health and fitness and council doctors on research. I set up annual community health fairs for 10 years now and speak and work on/with patients in the doctors office daily. Many followed suggestions I present and have been able to get of meds and improve health. I see illness every day. I see why patients are sick and as stated earlier, glucose and the lack of antioxidants and exercise kills people daily and making drug companies billions. Itâ??s a sick world.

32

[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:

[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:

[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:
Wait… are you guys seriously prescribing Metformin for everyone (not just obese and pre-diabetic individuals)?

Fuck that. Unless I’m predisposed or already afflicted, I’ll go Jehovasfitness’ route of diet and exercise.[/quote]

Im not prescrbing anyhing.

If you dont see the benefits of increased insulin sensitivity for not only body composition, but also for long term health, then I dont know what to tell you other than that you should look into the topic a bit more thoroughly before writing it off as a ‘fat persons drug’.

“Pre-diabetic” is a synonym for “American”.

I understand your goal isnt to get huge. Some people have that goal. Some have the goal of dropping bodyfat while still maintaining muscle fullness (that comes with eating a fair amount of carbs) Do you have any idea how valuable this drug is for both adding clean weight and for dropping fat during a cut? Do you know anyone that uses it? I wont go into how this is a miracle drug for exogenous insulin users, as the info is irrelevant for almost everyone here, I think.

But just like any other drug or supplement, the user should be well informed before putting something into their body. This just happens to be one of the more benign drugs that actually produces tangible results. [/quote]

My goal IS to get as huge as genetically possible. But I’m not going the steroid route either.
[/quote]

lifting weights aint going to make you taller, bro

33

[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:

[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:
My point, Bonez, had more to do with the way Americans think. “If something is broken, put a band-aid on it”… when they should be going to the route of the problem and fixing it there. [/quote]

Everyone here eats pretty well (certainly better than the average american) and lifts weights. Id say that a huge majority of PEOPLE HERE could benefit from a drug like metformin.

That was my point.

By all means, stick to diet and exercise exclusively. But dont pontificate about a right or wrong way of addressing blood sugar changes. Like I alluded to earlier, those trying to get very muscular will be required to take in far larger amounts of calories than is typically considered healthy. A drug like Metformin can make the consumption of all those calories less unhealthy. [/quote]

I’ve done a bit of research on metformin myself and for side effects I keep seeing that it can be hard on your liver. Now there are numerous things we take/eat every day that can be hard on our liver, and its one of the more resilient organs. What is your take on how bad metformin is for the liver?

34

[quote]schanz_05 wrote:

[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:

[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:
My point, Bonez, had more to do with the way Americans think. “If something is broken, put a band-aid on it”… when they should be going to the route of the problem and fixing it there. [/quote]

Everyone here eats pretty well (certainly better than the average american) and lifts weights. Id say that a huge majority of PEOPLE HERE could benefit from a drug like metformin.

That was my point.

By all means, stick to diet and exercise exclusively. But dont pontificate about a right or wrong way of addressing blood sugar changes. Like I alluded to earlier, those trying to get very muscular will be required to take in far larger amounts of calories than is typically considered healthy. A drug like Metformin can make the consumption of all those calories less unhealthy. [/quote]

I’ve done a bit of research on metformin myself and for side effects I keep seeing that it can be hard on your liver. Now there are numerous things we take/eat every day that can be hard on our liver, and its one of the more resilient organs. What is your take on how bad metformin is for the liver? [/quote]

Im not a doctor and have no medical training. I dont feel comfortable giving an opinion on that.

“Hard on the liver” and “how bad is X for the liver” are very dependent on multiple variables. I assume youre talking a reasonable 1500mg/d dose in a healthy adult but the issue is that most studies done are done on people with type II diabetes. Im not qualified to interpret the results from a diabetic population and apply them to healthy weight lifters.

35

If your sick, the lesser evil is Metformin.

It is a dayum good drug though! Dayum Good!

I have seen 1st hand how it has saved lives!

I thought about taken it myself but found safer things that can help.

36

[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:

[quote]schanz_05 wrote:

[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:

[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:
My point, Bonez, had more to do with the way Americans think. “If something is broken, put a band-aid on it”… when they should be going to the route of the problem and fixing it there. [/quote]

Everyone here eats pretty well (certainly better than the average american) and lifts weights. Id say that a huge majority of PEOPLE HERE could benefit from a drug like metformin.

That was my point.

By all means, stick to diet and exercise exclusively. But dont pontificate about a right or wrong way of addressing blood sugar changes. Like I alluded to earlier, those trying to get very muscular will be required to take in far larger amounts of calories than is typically considered healthy. A drug like Metformin can make the consumption of all those calories less unhealthy. [/quote]

I’ve done a bit of research on metformin myself and for side effects I keep seeing that it can be hard on your liver. Now there are numerous things we take/eat every day that can be hard on our liver, and its one of the more resilient organs. What is your take on how bad metformin is for the liver? [/quote]

Im not a doctor and have no medical training. I dont feel comfortable giving an opinion on that.

“Hard on the liver” and “how bad is X for the liver” are very dependent on multiple variables. I assume youre talking a reasonable 1500mg/d dose in a healthy adult but the issue is that most studies done are done on people with type II diabetes. Im not qualified to interpret the results from a diabetic population and apply them to healthy weight lifters. [/quote]

Good point, there is probably very little research done on an inherently healthy population taking metformin. I would imagine though for our purposes taking a reduced dose of metformin would be effective, and also reduce the potential side effects.

37

[paging MODOK]

38

[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:
What?

This has nothing to do with steroids.

Metformin should be MORE attractive to the non-steroid user, IMO. Slightly so, but yes more attractive. [/quote]

???

Metformin effectively decreases testosterone…not sure it would be a good choice for a natural bodybuilder looking to get bigger.

39

well, glucose hit 160, 60-mins after a large pizza… tried to get a 2hr reading, but the reader keeps throwing error codes and I’m tired of pricking myself

40

[quote]Proud_Virgin wrote:

[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:
What?

This has nothing to do with steroids.

Metformin should be MORE attractive to the non-steroid user, IMO. Slightly so, but yes more attractive. [/quote]

???

Metformin effectively decreases testosterone…not sure it would be a good choice for a natural bodybuilder looking to get bigger.[/quote]

I know quite a few natties using it with no problems. Like I said, educate yourself and make a reasoned choice.

edit

Theyre using D-aspartic acid as well. Sorry, forgot about that.